Building furniture grade cabs

[robertbartsch]

A few years ago I had some custom cabs made at an unfinished furniture store and these were reasonably priced and of high quality. Unfortunately, these guys are now out of business.

Fast forward:

I would like to build a pair of Model 19 or Valencia cabs and I have gone to a few cabinet makers in my area who have given me quotes ranging from $1,900 to $3200 for a pair of cabs. These quotes don't include grill frames or cab finishing.

Frankly, I think these quotes are excessive but I realize there is a fair amount of labor involved and quality is not cheap.

Consequently, I'm looking for alternatives. Any ideas would be helpful.

Thx...

[Mr. Widget]

I would like to build a pair of Model 19 or Valencia cabs and I have gone to a few cabinet makers in my area who have given me quotes ranging from $1,900 to $3200 for a pair of cabs. These quotes don't include grill frames or cab finishing.

For unfinished cabs using preveneered shop grade oak plywood that is steep... then again, you could easily spend $1900 in high quality veneer alone with no cabs at all... what exactly do you want?


Widget

[robertbartsch]

...looking to have built Model 19 or Valencia cabs in factory hardwood veneer unfinished - no grills. I was hoping to spend no more then $1,200 for the cabs.

Considering I could by a Model 19 pair or Valencia pair with cabs in good condition for $1500 or so, its not very economicial to buy components and have cabs built.

I live in the northeast and my options Vs. California are limited; there is just not much vintage stuff available on the east coast. Shipping big cabs is expensive.

[macaroonie]

Maybe ask one of the talented builders here .............. Saeman for example

[Krunchy]

you could easily spend $1900 in high quality veneer alone with no cabs at all... what exactly do you want?
Widget

While exotic veneers can get pretty expensive (true ebony, crotch mahogany & burls in particular) most exotic species are very reasonable (walnut even more so) unless you are planing to have the walls veneered as well

One could also have the panels made with whatever veneer you like and have a shop cut them to your specs. There is are a few companies that will manufacture them.

I would also consider macaroonies suggestion & contact Saeman, couldnt hurt.

For that $3,200.00 Id want them built, finished & served a complimentary cocktail

[robertbartsch]

...yeh, for $3200 I could buy four vintage Valencias in great shape or a slightly used car.

Skilled workmen in Westchester NY think everyone is rich here and that they should be rich too.

....I'm not cheap but these cost estimates seem out of line.

Thx...

[rdgrimes]

For that price you could buy all the materials AND the power tools needed for the job. More than anything, the cabinet shop is telling you they don't really want the job.

[Krunchy]

More than anything, the cabinet shop is telling you they don't really want the job.

I agree, they dont want to bother, its too small a job & if they are going to do so they're going to make it worth their while$. This type of mentality is very pervasive these days, I personally do not understand it, seems very shortsighted IMO. Oftentimes small jobs lead to larger ones but most people dont have time to hear that kind of rationale.

Keep looking around though, I'm sure you'll be able to find someone to build them but it might take a little more effort than it used to.

[cosmos]

What is your objective?

If you are trying to beat the cost of buying nice Altec 19s by buying components (or furnishing your own) and having cabinets custom built, I think you are going to have a very difficult time. From what I see, typically they sell for between $500 and $1200 /pair. Components are going to be around half of that. With at least a couple hundred dollars in materials for a quality cabinet, there isn't much left.

However, if your goal is to get nice cabinets, then I'd guess you could find someone that would likely do common materials (Not Exotic) veneers in the $900 to $1500 range for a pair of cabinets. This won't beat what you can buy nice ones for, but you should have a nice pair of speakers when you're done. Finishing can add several hundred dollars and a fair amount of time to the project...

As an aside, the low cost from the guys that are out of business might be part of the reason they aren't in business any longer.

I know cabinet makers here that are very slow and would likely take work at a lower than normal cost, but by the time you added shipping, I'd guess they'd be back in the same range as you can find there anyway. Hopefully, they'll be here in a few years..

[Mr. Widget]

While exotic veneers can get pretty expensive (true ebony, crotch mahogany & burls in particular) most exotic species are very reasonable (walnut even more so) unless you are planing to have the walls veneered as well

You don't have to cover the walls... but yes, there are some fairly reasonable exotics... it just seems the ones I always pick cost a ton... $500+ per 4X8 panel. I like using wood on wood pre made up sheets of veneer. While considerably more expensive than simple veneer and a bit more than paper backed rolls, the results are consistently excellent, and it is fairly easy to work with.

As an aside, the low cost from the guys that are out of business might be part of the reason they aren't in business any longer.

The cost of running a legitimate cabinet shop with employees who do furniture grade work is considerably more than a guy in his garage.


As others have said, if you want flat cut walnut or are OK with Oak... buying the real deal will likely be far less expensive than having them built and sourcing all of the bits... unless you can find a hobbyist who is wiling to work with you.


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[eso]

If I were to build a pair of 19s, I'd be using baltic birch at least, and if I wanted a furniture grade finish I'd veneer that in my vacuum using flitches so I could set the veneer pattern. We're at ~$500-600 already and we haven't cut anything. Laying up the veneers is couple of days...

Mr Widget Says:
You don't have to cover the walls... but yes, there are some fairly reasonable exotics... it just seems the ones I always pick cost a ton... $500+ per 4X8 panel. I like using wood on wood pre made up sheets of veneer while considerably more expensive than simple veneer and a bit more than paper backed rolls, the results are more consistent, and it is easy to work with.

I like starting from raw so I can control the pattern and seam locations. Also, for proper composite panels the both side need to have the same treatment to maintain balanced tension. I use cheaper backers on interior faces, but I do both sides...


Even using fir core shop grade birch ply is going to be nearly $200 in materials alone. That would made a good paint grade cabinet, but I'd probably opt for MDO as a better base for paint. Having said that I'm a snob and don't like quality home audio equipment built from materials other than the Baltic (exception: prototyping and quick builts for development)

Essentially I'm saying the initial request doesn't ask clearly enough what is being priced to come up with an apples/apples comparison.


eso

[Mr. Widget]

Essentially I'm saying the initial request doesn't ask clearly enough what is being priced to come up with an apples/apples comparison.

Agreed... that is what I was suggesting in my original veneer comment.

On an aside...

I have a vacuum bag and occasionally will still tape up veneer joints and make my own panels, but life is short and you need to decide where you want to invest your time... these days I usually pay others to do that for me. There is a firm near by that make custom veneered panels for architects specing high rises... you know the ones, where the lobby on every floor has identical looking quartered Sapele or shimmering ribbon mahogany floor to ceiling.

On the birch core plywood front... I only use hardwood core plywood myself, sometimes appleply, sometimes baltic birch or marine grade Finn-ply, but frequently I use a Russian product that is entirely birch, and comes in 60" by 60" panels. It is not quite marine grade, but in speaker work that will be painted or veneered, it works equally well, is similarly stout, and is half the price per square foot. I don't know if it is available everywhere.


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[Krunchy]

You don't have to cover the walls... but yes, there are some fairly reasonable exotics... it just seems the ones I always pick cost a ton... $500+ per 4X8 panel. I like using wood on wood pre made up sheets of veneer. While considerably more expensive than simple veneer and a bit more than paper backed rolls, the results are consistently excellent, and it is fairly easy to work with.

I know exactly what you mean I thought you were talking about raw (ie:unbacked) veneer. Yeah, once you start applying it to a substrate then all bets are off and then the price of the veneer winds up being a small fraction of the finished panel price. But you do end up with a beautiful finished product so to that extent you get what you pay for.

I have a vacuum bag and occasionally will still tape up veneer joints and make my own panels, but life is short and you need to decide where you want to invest your time... these days I usually pay others to do that for me.

Couldnt agree more! Splicing, taping and glueing your own veneer panels is not that easy and can be very time consuming even if you know what you are doing, at this tage of the game I'd probably go the panel route unless I had lots of disposable time....like we all do these days

[rdgrimes]

I agree, they dont want to bother, its too small a job & if they are going to do so they're going to make it worth their while$. This type of mentality is very pervasive these days, I personally do not understand it, seems very shortsighted IMO. Oftentimes small jobs lead to larger ones but most people dont have time to hear that kind of rationale.

I work with contractors and craftsmen a lot. As a rule, they are not business people who make sensible business decisions. Repeat business is not part of their "plan".

[Krunchy]

I work with contractors and craftsmen a lot. As a rule, they are not business people who make sensible business decisions. Repeat business is not part of their "plan".

Exactly! I find it amazing so many have that kind of attitude :dont-know makes me kinda wonder when they start bitching about how slow things are?