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Thread: Geez, who the hell needs TAD

  1. #31
    Senior Member JoMoCo's Avatar
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    More applications?.....

    From the Truextent frontpage link - "Production shipments of 4” voice coil diameter diaphragm assemblies will begin in the second half of 2009, with 2¾” diameter, 1¾” diameter and 3” diameter shipments ramping up thereafter. These diaphragm assemblies are engineered to fit the majority of existing compression driver motors."

    http://www.truextent.com/

  2. #32
    Member djnagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scott fitlin View Post
    Yes, I hear you on this.

    And for me, the fact that I DO use tweeters, when I used the TAD drivers, it was too much VHF output, even with rolling the driver off, actively.

    I also found the drivers work better on some horns than others. This has been said in this thread too.

    In my application, and as I stated I have tweeters, the JBL has better lower end sound to me, the TAD and Be phragm more in the upper ranges.
    I am in the same boat. With my 2441 with Radian diaphragms (on Soundlab 400hz round tractrix horns) I use the Big A$$ Heil on top for high end extention. In that combo, I really like the lusher lower end of the 2441.

  3. #33
    Member djnagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1audiohack View Post
    OK, just to get this straight, you didn't just read the spec's, or measure anything, you just listened?!? What a concept! I wonder if it will catch on?

    I know, novel right? For myself, I much prefer to listen to something for quite a while before doing any measurements. I find that if I have Objective data before hand, I will only listen to the areas that I saw issues with.

    Just listening for a while allows me to evaluate the system by my ear, which is all that counts, before narrowing down issues to be addressed.

    That don't work if the speaker is way out of whack of course.

  4. #34
    Member djnagle's Avatar
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    Hey Cosmos, after all the time we spend listening, I never asked what Black Swamp is asking for the diaphragms. Is he selling them direct or is he the one that has them listed on Agon?

  5. #35
    RIP 2010 scott fitlin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djnagle View Post
    I am in the same boat. With my 2441 with Radian diaphragms (on Soundlab 400hz round tractrix horns) I use the Big A$$ Heil on top for high end extention. In that combo, I really like the lusher lower end of the 2441.
    Yeah, I use JBL 2404,s on top of the 2395/2441 lens horns, and have 2402 in clusters of four down the center of the room. The 2441, and JBL Al diaphragm give percussion, strings, keyboards, and bass notes that dynamic snap.

    I will look into acquiring a pair of the Be 'phragms for my 2441,s. I want to hear this, and what it can do.
    scottyj

  6. #36
    Member djnagle's Avatar
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    Yep, I want to do the same thing. I have three DIY projects going at the same time and not working that much so I think it will be a bit before I can afford them. That said, my system sounds great as is and I could live with it for ever....but you know how this stuff works.

  7. #37
    RIP 2010 scott fitlin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djnagle View Post
    Yep, I want to do the same thing. I have three DIY projects going at the same time and not working that much so I think it will be a bit before I can afford them. That said, my system sounds great as is and I could live with it for ever....but you know how this stuff works.
    I do know how this goes, and goes, and.... keeps going, never ending!

    I agree with much that has been said in this thread about Be. Highly resolving, of the most minute details, very smooth, and goes up very high, in comparison to other compression drivers with al diaphragms. depends on how you like to hear your music, I guess. On one hand, having the TAD,s I do hear microscopic detail, very polite sounding, and they do go up. OTOH, my TAD 2in drivers are not as dynamic sounding as my JBL 2in drivers, so to me, it just depends on the presentation one prefers.
    scottyj

  8. #38
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djnagle View Post
    I know, novel right? For myself, I much prefer to listen to something for quite a while before doing any measurements. I find that if I have Objective data before hand, I will only listen to the areas that I saw issues with.
    I usually listen first myself... if you see a plot you tend to believe in it too much and begin to hear the plot.

    That said, disregarding measurements altogether is foolish. Often I have found a polarity issue or a driver not performing quite as well as it should. My ears are certainly not good enough to pick out each and every sonic gremlin.

    Quote Originally Posted by scott fitlin View Post
    OTOH, my TAD 2in drivers are not as dynamic sounding as my JBL 2in drivers, so to me, it just depends on the presentation one prefers.
    That reminds me of an article I read years ago where John Meyer was explaining that even though his subs were significantly louder than the Altec or JBLs that he was competing against, because of the Meyer's lack of distortion and coloration, they didn't sound as loud subjectively.


    Widget

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget View Post
    That reminds me of an article I read years ago where John Meyer was explaining that even though his subs were significantly louder than the Altec or JBLs that he was competing against, because of the Meyer's lack of distortion and coloration, they didn't sound as loud subjectively.


    Widget
    I have read the article myself. And IT IS TRUE!

    And for whatever reason, the ear hears two items, likes one item specifically, better than the other, and measurements suggest the opposite of the ear.
    scottyj

  10. #40
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scott fitlin View Post
    I have read the article myself. And IT IS TRUE!

    And for whatever reason, the ear hears two items, likes one item specifically, better than the other, and measurements suggest the opposite of the ear.
    I think it depends on the ear.


    Widget

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by cosmos View Post
    Here's an offer for you, if you have some big JBL bodies, I'll send you my pair of TrueXtent diaphragms.
    Ok. If you want to drop off a pair to me I'll go ahead and measure them against the D16R2441 and D16R2445 diaphragms that I have for stock network compatibility purposes. It's too late for me to measure them directly in a stock 4345 network because I have to ship the pair of 4345 networks that I have out Monday morning but I can at least get the data into LEAP. It could be interesting to also measure a pair of 2446 cores but I don't have any. I only have 2440/2441 and 2445 cores.

    Given that the 1.75 inch diaphragms are going to be available soon do you want me to hold off aquaplasing your 2425 diaphragms as well as your 2445 diaphragms? Either way, I will have them in Perrysburg for you on Monday.

  12. #42
    Senior Member herki the cat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4313B View Post
    OK. If you want to drop off a pair to me I'll go ahead and measure them against the D16R2441 and D16R2445 diaphragms that I have ... It could be interesting to also measure a pair of 2446 cores but I don't have any. I only have 2440/2441 and 2445 cores.
    4313B, I do hope you have time to measure the "Truextent Be" in the 2440 since i have 2440's with new JBL D16R2440 diaphragms which are identical to the 375 diaphragms. I think you have a pretty good ear. Many people, especially musicians trained at an early age & those speaking two more languages before age 6, do hear many things other people do not hear.

    A great deal depends on the program material heard in evaluations, especially if the music is lacking spectrum
    content to excite some disagreeable artifact in the unit under test. In my 17 by 35 ft living room, which is an awesome jungle of book cases & records, two
    electronic organs, furniture & other huge speaker systems etc, I have a special low level speaker system on my TV compensated for Fletcher Munson Effect around 70 db-C, sound pressure level.

    I hear a remarkable difference at that level in every TV microphone and the room sound used by every person speaking live or on film. You cannot fool speech; you have heard live speech all your life and the cues stand out unmistakably with out the emotional envollment with a nice recording of music.... Ca sufi com ca.

    cheers, herki the cat
    Last edited by boputnam; 05-03-2010 at 09:01 PM. Reason: Natha

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4313B View Post
    Ok. If you want to drop off a pair to me I'll go ahead and measure them against the D16R2441 and D16R2445 diaphragms that I have for stock network compatibility purposes. It's too late for me to measure them directly in a stock 4345 network because I have to ship the pair of 4345 networks that I have out Monday morning but I can at least get the data into LEAP. It could be interesting to also measure a pair of 2446 cores but I don't have any. I only have 2440/2441 and 2445 cores.

    Given that the 1.75 inch diaphragms are going to be available soon do you want me to hold off aquaplasing your 2425 diaphragms as well as your 2445 diaphragms? Either way, I will have them in Perrysburg for you on Monday.
    I have a pair of 2446's we can use for measurements.

  14. #44
    RIP 2010 scott fitlin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget View Post
    I think it depends on the ear.


    Widget
    Well, maybe, but I think everyone has things they like, that measurements would indicate otherwise.
    scottyj

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dingusboy View Post
    I have a pair of 2446's we can use for measurements.
    Well, I could swing by Monday after work and pick them up along with a pair of the 16 ohm diaphragms if you're so inclined. The intent would be to measure the impedance and frequency response on a H93/2311 horn for use in 43xx Studio Monitors. If you have a horn you'd also like measured for LEAP data I could do that at the same time. Send me a PM and let me know.

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