which one best for jazz?

[pyonc]

Hi,

As a new comer to this forum,
I'd like to have your advice on my question.
I'm currently looking for a vintage JBL speaker unit to exclusively listen to jazz. I have 4311 system, but want to upgrade.
Some say JBL 4343 is the best for jazz, others say JBL C-40 and other C-class back-loaded horn speakers are the best. I also hear JBL Olympus or Sovereign SR8 series are the thing for jazz listening.
As those of you listening to jazz know, I'd like to feel the real sound or timbre of each instrutments of jazz such as drum, symball, bass, trumpet, piano, which represents its own peculiar sound range like high, mid or low.
Which speaker unit would you recommend to me?
I'd really apprecaite the comments or advice from someone who're jazz fans. Thanks a lot for your advice in advance.

Regards, Changsop.

[hjames]

D'yer mean REAL Jazz like Miles and 'trane and Monk,
or that ponzi Jazz like Kenny G and Sade and such?

Hey, just kidding!~
A lot of folks think the best speakers for a given kind of music are the ones that were used when the music was recorded ...
I've got 4341s (original 4 ways, which evolved into 4343s and 4345 territory) and was listening to Miles' Cellar Door sessions today
and they sounded GREAT! I think any of the horn style systems will reproduce vintage horn and reed music quite well,
and the big 4 ways are great on voice as well ...

but some of the newer heavily compressed recordings don't sound right on anything ...

Hi,

As a new comer to this forum,
I'd like to have your advice on my question.
I'm currently looking for a vintage JBL speaker unit to exclusively listen to jazz. I have 4311 system, but want to upgrade.
Some say JBL 4343 is the best for jazz, others say JBL C-40 and other C-class back-loaded horn speakers are the best. I also hear JBL Olympus or Sovereign SR8 series are the thing for jazz listening.
As those of you listening to jazz know, I'd like to feel the real sound or timbre of each instruments of jazz such as drum, cymbal, bass, trumpet, piano, which represents its own peculiar sound range like high, mid or low.
Which speaker unit would you recommend to me?
I'd really appreciate the comments or advice from someone who're jazz fans. Thanks a lot for your advice in advance.

Regards, Changsop.

[BMWCCA]

D'yer mean REAL Jazz like Miles and 'trane and Monk, or that poncey Jazz like Kenny G and Sade and such?

I was leafing through what's left of my local record shop's Jazz section yesterday and saw Norah Jones' new CD there.

Now I do own that CD but...

[jbl_daddy]

My 4340's are great on jazz, the 250ti's are ok on the material but not at home like the larger 43xx's.

[rdgrimes]

Hi,

I keep hearing from friends and some jazz critics that JBL speakers are the best for jazz listening. Currently I'm looking for the most suitable JBL speaker model, especially vintage series for jazz listening. Some say JBL 4343 is the best, others say JBL C40 or other back-loaded horn speakers are better for jazz. I've got 4311 speaker, but want to upgrade soon.
Do any of you listening to jazz have any great advice for me?
Thank you very much in advance.

Regards,
Changsop

It would be hard to go wrong with any of the 12" 3-way models made through 1990. That includes the studio monitors and consumer models too. Horn loaded 2-way models are equally fine. Add plenty of power, good quality recordings and you're set.

[pyonc]

D'yer mean REAL Jazz like Miles and 'trane and Monk,
or that ponzi Jazz like Kenny G and Sade and such?

Hey, just kidding!~
A lot of folks think the best speakers for a given kind of music are the ones that were used when the music was recorded ...
I've got 4341s (original 4 ways, which evolved into 4343s and 4345 territory) and was listening to Miles' Cellar Door sessions today
and they sounded GREAT! I think any of the horn style systems will reproduce vintage horn and reed music quite well,
and the big 4 ways are great on voice as well ...

but some of the newer heavily compressed recordings don't sound right on anything ...

Hum.... So, based on what you say, it seems to me those JBL speakers in the mid-1940s, 1950s and 1960s are the best for jazz, especially my favorite be-bop jazz. They are Paragon, C-speaker series, Olympus or Soveregin SR8 series, etc, I think. As you know, 43- series including this 4343 all came out in the 1970s, when jazz is on the wane gradually...

[hjames]

Hum.... So, based on what you say,
it seems to me those JBL speakers in the mid-1940s, 1950s and 1960s are the best for jazz,
especially my favorite be-bop jazz. They are Paragon, C-speaker series, Olympus or Sovereign SR8 series,
etc, I think. As you know, 43- series including this 4343 all came out in the 1970s, when jazz is on the wane gradually...

Well, as I said, " a lot of folks think ..." but paragons, for instance, can be grounds for arguments with JBL fans,
some love 'em, some think they are an interesting design but not for serious listening ...

Also, it depends on the recordings, doesn't it?
I think a good 70s system will play music from that era and before, but perhaps not from later.
Depends on how demanding the later recordings are, right?

Ive been going through Mahavishnu Orchestra and mid 70s Miles' recordings lately - they play pretty well on the 4341s ...

Then again, I think the David Gilmour "Live in Gdansk" multimedia recordings sound good on the 4341s too ...

[pyonc]

Well, as I said, " a lot of folks think ..." but paragons, for instance, can be grounds for arguments with JBL fans,
some love 'em, some think they are an interesting design but not for serious listening ...

Also, it depends on the recordings, doesn't it?
I think a good 70s system will play music from that era and before, but perhaps not from later.
Depends on how demanding the later recordings are, right?

Ive been going through Mahavishnu Orchestra and mid 70s Miles' recordings lately - they play pretty well on the 4341s ...

Then again, I think the David Gilmour "Live in Gdansk" multimedia recordings sound good on the 4341s too ...

Actually I listen to jazz LPs, not CDs, and that's part of the reason why I'm looking for systems like 4343 or your kind of 4341, and other systems fit for jazz LPs of the era. By the way, have you heard jazz through the so-called back-loaded horn speaker system like C-37, C-40 or 4530?
Is it noticeably different from the mainstream front-loaded speakers?

[Mr. Widget]

I enjoy listening to a fair amount of Jazz recordings and many are recordings of small groups in rather intimate settings... I find these are reproduced best by really accurate speakers that can convey dynamics and nuance. I'd look at the more modern design.

Of the speakers you have listed, the 4343 would be at the top of the list.


Widget

[pyonc]

I enjoy listening to a fair amount of Jazz recordings and many are recordings of small groups in rather intimate settings... I find these are reproduced best by really accurate speakers that can convey dynamics and nuance. I'd look at the more modern design.

Of the speakers you have listed, the 4343 would be at the top of the list.


Widget

Agree. Thanks for your comment.
Have you compared this 4343 with Olympus or Sovereign SR8 in terms of the reproduction of jazz sound?

[Mr. Widget]

Agree. Thanks for your comment.
Have you compared this 4343 with Olympus or Sovereign SR8 in terms of the reproduction of jazz sound?

PM sent.


Widget

[jbl_daddy]

there are a few Paragons in my family and one thing I have always noticed is the lack of a smooth vocal mid range. Years ago I sold my L300's for the very same reason, the horn and a paper cone in the larger 43xx is the way to go if you can sell your wife on the big boxes. What are your thoughts to a smaller 4315, they have the excelent 2405 and there are two sets on ebay. I have never heard a pair but would like to some day.

[yggdrasil]

The S8R have lots of issues. One of the big 4-ways, or any modern speaker will have less issues.

The only time the S8R's shine is when you feed them with few instruments/voices to work with, in other words complicated program material makes one big mess.

I guess a complete rework of the crossovers will change this to some degree, but haven't given it priority yet.

[shaansloan]

Actually I listen to jazz LPs, not CDs, and that's part of the reason why I'm looking for systems like 4343 or your kind of 4341, and other systems fit for jazz LPs of the era. By the way, have you heard jazz through the so-called back-loaded horn speaker system like C-37, C-40 or 4530?
Is it noticeably different from the mainstream front-loaded speakers?

Hi pyonc, welcome to the LH Forum.....

I listen to my Jazz driven by a McIntosh C-22 pre-amp and MC240 amp. I sometimes switch to a different amp, an integrated NAD 2200 Power Envelope, with the same Mac C-22. I am using a Denon DP-40F turntable for my source.

I like to listen LP's with 50's, 60's, 70's Jazz....Miles, Wes Montgomery, Oscar Peterson, Bill Charlap, Nat King Cole others....

My speakers on this system are Altec Carmels 2 ways (2 - 12" and 811b horns) circa 1964, and I also have a set of Altec 605A's 2 Ways(15" with horn load) circa 1962 that are in 4 cu ft cabs. I really like the vintage sound that I get with these units. It is very warm and gives a kind of nostalgic feel for this vintage Jazz.....just marvelous......

I also have a set of JBL L101's, 2 Way (LE14A and 175 horns) in the other room.....these speakers sound fabulous with any and every kind of music including vintage Jazz.....very warm, detailed, great lows and fabulous midrange....hard to beat these, period.

On this same system (its a big room) I can switch to two sets of JBL's that I have. One set of JBL 4343B and the other 4333A's. When running all four I use (2) NAD 2200 Power envelope amps, one amp for each set, not bi-amped. The sound with these big JBL blue face beauties is absolutely stunning! Surely there is much more musical detail and all the little nuances come alive, as Mr Widget recommended using an accurate speaker for.

Also, I have a very loving and tolerant wife who lets me hook up all kinds of gear in the living room....I have been trying to learn about what I really like....fortunately she digs the tunes also, and we spend plenty of time together listening to all kinds of music....sometime I suppose I will have to make a decision about what I want to keep and find the right spot in the living room and den for these dudes...

I would say if you are after a perfect reproduction of all the detail and a full range of sound from your lows lows to high highs, the newer more accurate speakers are the way to go. But if you prefer the warmer more vintage sounding nostalgic feel of some of these beautiful older systems, then the 50's or 60's speakers are the way to go.....its all about what YOU really enjoy. I prefer to have both and be able to switch between them at any given time, if that is possible for you.

Also, for the cost of all those drivers and all that work to build your own, you may be able to find a real nice set that just needs a little TLC to restore to its original specs...especially in your neck of the woods....plenty of vintage gear up there for sale all the time....

Here's a few Pics.....happy listening..... Shaan

[Eaulive]

Forget me if I'm wrong but, isn't an ideal speaker able to reproduce any kind of music?
In theory a speaker should be the most accurate reproducer possible, if one loves that kind of music in that kind of speaker, isn't this a proof that the speaker is introducing coloration in the sound?

I can understand why a speaker with less low extension can be OK for rock music but not for classical or jazz or pipe organ, but it's a matter of frequency range, not accuracy.