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Thread: AV Component Front-ends

  1. #91
    Heather [Senorita member] hjames's Avatar
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    Well, got it in the rack, got things working. Gone through many set up screens - whew!

    The sound is really good - but - there are a few image related things ...
    I have had a glitch/pixelation on the TIVOHD (been kind of an ongoing problem with COX CATV - its heavily compressed to fit more channels in).
    It seems sensitive to any small glitch/drop-out in the image - I think that's an HDMI handshaking thing

    And at one point yesterday I was scrolling through input sources and - and - the emotiva just hung/froze when it hit APPLETV -
    I had to reach around to the rear of the unit and do a hard power cycle to restart it.

    I suspect it's also related to the HDMI handshaking - seems a lot of folks have problems with that -

    Honestly, I think this HDMI crap isn't ready for the general public - its a MESS!
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    2ch: Oppo, JoLida 502CRC, JBL L212, 18ti,240ti; Heath AS101, Von Schweikert VR4
    7.1: Oppo BDP103D, B&K, UREI 809A, JBL B460

  2. #92
    Heather [Senorita member] hjames's Avatar
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    Just went back and re-read TiDome's JBL AV-2 thread.
    http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/s...nce-Series-AV2

    The AV2 only has 2 HDMI ports and it sounds like he skipped that signal buss.
    It looks like he ran Composite in and out only - tho it appears his only video source is from the OPPO BR.
    He seemed dismissive of the current state of HDMI ... a point I'm considering as well.

    Perhaps that's a winning strategy for me as well -
    sounds like its time to pull the rack out (again) and switch out HDMI to component for my (3) video sources (TIVOHD, OPPO DVD, APPLETV).

    From what I've read, video source quality from low to high is in this order - Composite (single RCA); S-video (Y, C); Component (Y, Cr, Cb or Y, Pb, Pr); then HDMI.

    Component sounds like the best compromise for me, just below the DRM-ladden HDMI mess ...
    2ch: Oppo, JoLida 502CRC, JBL L212, 18ti,240ti; Heath AS101, Von Schweikert VR4
    7.1: Oppo BDP103D, B&K, UREI 809A, JBL B460

  3. #93
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    Looks like it's time for me to update that thread a little.

    But you are correct that HDMI is a mess, and a new spec is right around the corner: HDMI 1.4! It'd be great to have all the bugs worked out of 1.3 first, eh?


    Quote Originally Posted by hjames View Post
    Just went back and re-read TiDome's JBL AV-2 thread.
    http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/s...nce-Series-AV2

    The AV2 only has 2 HDMI ports and it sounds like he skipped that signal buss.
    It looks like he ran Composite in and out only - tho it appears his only video source is from the OPPO BR.
    He seemed dismissive of the current state of HDMI ... a point I'm considering as well.

    Perhaps that's a winning strategy for me as well -
    sounds like its time to pull the rack out (again) and switch out HDMI to component for my (3) video sources (TIVOHD, OPPO DVD, APPLETV).

    From what I've read, video source quality from low to high is in this order - Composite (single RCA); S-video (Y, C); Component (Y, Cr, Cb or Y, Pb, Pr); then HDMI.

    Component sounds like the best compromise for me, just below the DRM-ladden HDMI mess ...
    Out.

  4. #94
    Heather [Senorita member] hjames's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Titanium Dome View Post
    Looks like it's time for me to update that thread a little.

    But you are correct that HDMI is a mess, and a new spec is right around the corner: HDMI 1.4! It'd be great to have all the bugs worked out of 1.3 first, eh?
    Yep - I'm really getting hesitant about this computer driven audio gear - seems the HDMI stuff does hang it sometimes, and that's just flat annoying. Also has the potential to push signals outside the range you might want to your audio outputs, and that's a bit frightening!

    Anyway, thanks for updating your notes ...
    I'm going back downstairs now to switch the Emotiva vids to component cables and remove the HDMI wiring -
    and see if that's enough to make this thing a keeper.

    Edit - 1 hour later.
    yep, that did it! Picture quality on the TIVOHD through the Emotiva to the Philips TV is still very good - found the Star Trek (reboot) movie on a channel called EPIX and its working good, full 5.1 audio (from optical source) plus video is nice with Component cables ...

    I left the OPPO 981HD on HDMI - but ran it direct to the TV to avoid glitching through the Emotiva.
    2ch: Oppo, JoLida 502CRC, JBL L212, 18ti,240ti; Heath AS101, Von Schweikert VR4
    7.1: Oppo BDP103D, B&K, UREI 809A, JBL B460

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by hjames View Post
    Honestly, I think this HDMI crap isn't ready for the general public - its a MESS!
    You got that right!

  6. #96
    Senior Member Hoerninger's Avatar
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    s I'm mainly an Audio-Man the display is only necessary for the DVD menues.

    The DVD player is connected via S-Video to a (cheap chinese) video/VGA converter which feeds a 21 inch monitor.
    An additional TV set up box (DVBT) uses a second converter's video in, which will be switched just there.

    The receiver switches only audio: DVD (digital, analog), TV (digital), TT with built in equalizer (anlog ).

    (For the moment addionally a PC is connected to the receiver for record and playback of sound alone.
    ____________
    Peter

  7. #97
    Heather [Senorita member] hjames's Avatar
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    Final prognosis - we still get some overload/blue-screen effect when there are overly bright flashes on screen, even using Component video instead of the previous HDMI ... something gets overloaded and - the image just goes away for a bit ...

    So, I'm not quite comfortable with it as beta gear for $700 ... I wrote Emotiva this morning for an RMA number so I could ship this thing back. I just got the number - but - I have to decide if I'll give it another week/weekend before I return it ...

    The bottom line is - if not this, then what??




    Quote Originally Posted by hjames View Post
    Yep - I'm really getting hesitant about this computer driven audio gear - seems the HDMI stuff does hang it sometimes, and that's just flat annoying. Also has the potential to push signals outside the range you might want to your audio outputs, and that's a bit frightening!

    Anyway, thanks for updating your notes ...
    I'm going back downstairs now to switch the Emotiva vids to component cables and remove the HDMI wiring -
    and see if that's enough to make this thing a keeper.

    Edit - 1 hour later.
    yep, that did it! Picture quality on the TIVOHD through the Emotiva to the Philips TV is still very good - found the Star Trek (reboot) movie on a channel called EPIX and its working good, full 5.1 audio (from optical source) plus video is nice with Component cables ...

    I left the OPPO 981HD on HDMI - but ran it direct to the TV to avoid glitching through the Emotiva.
    2ch: Oppo, JoLida 502CRC, JBL L212, 18ti,240ti; Heath AS101, Von Schweikert VR4
    7.1: Oppo BDP103D, B&K, UREI 809A, JBL B460

  8. #98
    Senior Member grumpy's Avatar
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    3x the price, but...

    http://www.hometheatermag.com/preamp...sor/index.html

    It's one of a few separate HT processors I'd consider... problem being the price goes up from there.

    I have a lower-end/older Onkyo receiver with many of the same features (same mfg),
    but it was at a price I couldn't pass up, and does well enough for now (HT-RC180, <$600...
    separate amp used for subs). No HDMI glitches with Sony source and display.

    Widget might have some suggestions

    (I see a Marantz AV8003 refurb is $1500...)

  9. #99
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    Isn't two-channel grand!

    So, I'm not quite comfortable with it as beta gear for $700 ... I wrote Emotiva this morning for an RMA number so I could ship this thing back. I just got the number - but - I have to decide if I'll give it another week/weekend before I return it ...
    Well that's too bad. It's amazing how much junk is out there anymore. And the counterfeit stuff is even more hilarious.

  10. #100
    Senior Member grumpy's Avatar
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    yep. at least you can pick from 75 year old to yesterday's equipment and it will still work
    just fine... the only handshaking required is to close "the deal"

  11. #101
    Senior Member BMWCCA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4313B View Post
    Isn't two-channel grand!


    Though I am sorry to hear about Heather's problems with this system. A long-while back I was asking about controller/pre-amp front-ends that would handle two-channel and surround for TV. The addition of the 4345s into our family room has our old CRT as the limit to the video experience, not the audio. My kids can fill the room with the feed from the (old technology) DVD player to the 4345s and rattle the window easily, if the soundtrack has that material. I guess all I really miss is a remote control for volume control, and we all need the exercise.
    ". . . as you have no doubt noticed, no one told the 4345 that it can't work correctly so it does anyway."—Greg Timbers

  12. #102
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    If HDMI is off the table, there's no better deal than this right now. There are three ATI models to choose from: 6700, 7700, 8700. All are NIB at 80%+ discounts.

    http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/sear...ic_audio_parts

    With my current set up running HDMI from the Oppo BDP83-SE direct to the projector, and running 7.1 analog out from the Oppo to the JBL AV2, I easily could have used one of these units and played Bluray discs all day long.

    Uh, did I mention Made in USA?

    http://www.ati-amp.com/atp8700.html
    Out.

  13. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Titanium Dome View Post
    Uh, did I mention Made in USA?
    Weird... I wonder what their problem is...

  14. #104
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    Just to keep everyone honest, this isn't a stereo vs. surround issue. It's an interface issue.

    Okay, men, carry on.
    Last edited by Titanium Dome; 06-15-2010 at 09:22 AM. Reason: rethink
    Out.

  15. #105
    Senior Member HCSGuy's Avatar
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    I think that HDMI is killing the A/V pre/pro market. The rate at which it is changing requires re-engineering your product every year, and the mid/high end separate manufacturers (B&K, Parasound, etc) can't keep up. If they try, they are left with vaporware and if they release something it is already outdated.

    If you need Balanced outputs, I don't know what to recommend in a front end - I've used the Marantz AV8003 several times, but have not been impressed - It acts like a $750 receiver with a different back panel. However, when we've used it it has been understood to be the best compromise available until something better comes. Again, if you need Balanced and don't have a Lexicon Budget, I don't know what else to do (B&K Ref70, maybe).

    We do use a lot of receivers as front end to Parasound or B&K Amplifiers, though, as the Japanese companies are really fast at keeping their products current. Yamaha's high end receivers have always had front ends I like, and the current RX-Z9 is an amazingly good sounding receiver. Unfortunately, as it's HDMI 1.3a, it's outdated, but if you don't need 3D or the other 1.4 features and are OK with RCA outputs, look for one used.

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