Yes, I was late to the 2435/PT game. As such, I didn't expect much response. It has been very helpful and much appreciated! I've ordered the "Gauntlet" parts and will get the networks assembled, then experiment with some variables. A good starting platform really helps! It looks like the ball is rolling a bit again on the 2435's/PT waveguides/filters and I look forward to anymore refinement that evolves. Thanks again!
Jerrod
With Timbers and "Gauntlet" HF compensation filters:
Thanks for showing everyone that one size doesn't fit all. We can tell them that but a picture works better.Originally Posted by Zilch
I think Rob likes his 1010's and it looks like that waveguide might be the best bet with the 2431/435Al/2435/435Be phasing plug.
Like I've said before, the 2452H-SL is arguably the better bang for the buck at roughly the same price and JBL sure likes them.
Not that what I like counts for anything in the bigger picture, but I sure like them too. It's clear that 2435HPL plays nicely on some of these PTs, as well.
It's now over three years ago that Widget and I first looked at these. It took me about a year to get that NOT pushing them hard to 20 kHz was sonically the better approach to using them successfully....
The best bet seems to be to try and get them ~ 6 to 8 dB down at 20 kHz. Of course that's on the larger consumer horns. The 1010 waveguide looks good enough for a 2344A/2425H replacement.It took me about a year to get that NOT pushing them hard to 20 kHz was sonically the better approach to using them successfully....
Yes that's what I used my first pair for and they worked out very well.The 1010 waveguide looks good enough for a 2344A/2425H replacement.
When I originally set them up I was Conservative with the amount of level I had out there. I ended up running them towards the -4/-6 side as anything below -6 just didn't sound right to me. Figure about -6 in my HT and -4 in my passive version using the 2108's.The best bet seems to be to try and get them ~ 6 to 8 dB down at 20 kHz. Of course that's on the larger consumer horns.
I found setting them up, I was looking right on axis about 2 feet out. When you back things up to 2 meters and move off the throat they roll off so if are already 6 of more down in the "hot spot" by the time you get where you sit they tend to sound bit too dull. Well to me anyway.
I think that's really where the difference Widget brings up comes about. They sound a bit dry and analytical compared to a nice TI tweeter like an 050 Gold. They are different for sure but you can decide for yourself it you think it's worth adding a tweeter or not. Same with the attenuation you can play with the level and see what works for you.
Rob
"I could be arguing in my spare time"
True.
The 045's are quite nice (need to find someone to model a decent horn though). I don't have any idea what the Pro equivalents are, I never asked.
I don't think there are any. Certainly no horns with a small enough throat. I think all the 2407/8/12 are all 1 3/8 screw on's with 1" throats. Would be great if I was wrong though.I don't have any idea what the Pro equivalents are, I never asked.
Rob
"I could be arguing in my spare time"
This horn Zilch showed us looks quite promising in this regard:
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/s...php?t=24280#11
It seems to keep its 90° pattern up to at least 15khz !
The 045 horn is said to be 60°x30° in the S9800, so that should be the directivity of the H9800 at 10khz?...
I am planning to try these little horns with my 2407, used as tweeters above a pair of 2435 on H9800
Here's my little contribution :
1srt picture : 2435HPL + Westlake horns + PC-5038 P audio 2" to 1"5 adapter - Frequency response (unequalized, unsmoothed)
2nd picture : same above impedance + phase
3rd picture : 2431H + Westlake horns + PC-5038 P audio 2" to 1"5 adapter - Frequency response (unequalized, unsmoothed)
The frequency response is a little physiological, but I like it (easy to correct in high frequency is needed). The impedance vary only from 5 to 8 ohms.
The usable band is 600-130000 Hz with very low distorsion (take care about power limitation). Unfortunately, I don't know how to equalize the lack in 400-600Hz (help welcome).
The 2431H frequency response is even more regular. The Westlake dispersion is similar to the 2397 horn : 140°x60° but can go a bit lower in low frequency (but a bit lower in high frequency).
I've received all my parts to make the filters. I have started laying out the circuits, but they are not looking so clean as Zilch's. More to do later. Zilch, you don't by chance have any pics of the bottom sides of your boards?
No, but I may have a layout drawing. If so, I'll fire up the scanner....
Edit: The board is 6" square:
Zilch,
Thanks for the scan. My layout came out similar. I tried a few different configurations to minimize the jumper wires, but it seems unavoidable with point to point wiring. I just finished up some mods to my eXtended Foreplay III preamp last night, so now I need to sling some solder! Thanks again!
Jerrod
HA! No jumpers allowed on MY boards....
The "?" resistor is there so we can adjust the "Q" of the tank filter as precisely as desired using a parallel pair....
Networks together and flawless thanks to the great info and schematics. The sonic result is very promising! I'm tri-amped with 2a3 triodes on the 2435's, push-pull KT-88's on 2123J's, and a Crown K2 driving the 2226's. A Driverack 260 DSP does processing duty and a pair of Rythmik DS15's fill out the response below 35 cycles. I will break out the RTA tomorrow for fine tuning, but really enjoying the speakers right now. A few pics before long.....
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