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Thread: Home Theatre systems?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Doc Mark's Avatar
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    Home Theatre systems?

    Greetings, Friends,

    I have a question about HT systems. Of what would a basic system consist? Would there be main speakers, rear speakers, and a side-fill for right and left? How about a center channel speaker? Necessary, or not?

    Once I get my 4333's up and running, I'd like to play around with adding more to my system. Our Harman/Kardon is setup with separate amps for the rears, center, and side-fill stuff, and I believe they are all about 45WPC. Enough?

    I have quite a few JBL 12 transducers, having play music for almost 30 years, and I was wondering if, say, a pair of 2130's with, or without a tweeter, in smallish boxes, would be good side-fill speakers? They are extended range, even without the tweeter.

    I also have a pair of Altec 902-16HF drivers (basically a regular 902-16, but without the horn that was added to make it a "HF"). Those, with a small horn and JBL 12" woofer, could be the rear speakers.

    Thoughts, comments, suggestions? We mainly listen to music on our system, but do like to run movies through it, when we take the time to watch such entertainments. Thanks for any suggestions you can offer. Take care, and God Bless!

    Every Good Wish,
    Doc
    The only thing that can never be taken away from you, is your honor. Cherish it, in yourself, and in others.

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    Remember the "pod race?"

    Think of how much less spectacular it would be if you didn't hear the turbines spooling up all around you. You've got to have some high frequency back there for those effects.

    Furthermore, when you do get in to surround music, you want your rear speakers to have a similar response as your fronts. While the sub can help with the rear's lows, your highs will sound muffled in surround pans and even discreet instruments without a tweeter.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Doc Mark's Avatar
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    Hi, Todd,

    Many thanks for your comments, as always! Upon reflection, I do think you bring up a very valid point, and one I'll keep in mind, when I finally get this project underway. I'm not sure how many large cabinets can fit into our listening/viewing environment, as our room is big, but not "huge". Plus, I want Sweet Bride to be happy with whatever we end up doing, and we'll have to see how it turns out, as we go along, adding things as we go!

    Yes, that pod race, which we watched at your place, was thrilling, indeed!! As I wrote back when we had listened to your fantastic system, I'm not sure our's will ever be up to the coverage of your's. But, I'm pretty sure that, no matter how it turns out, we're going to be very happy with it. All the best to you and Linda, and we wish we were going to be here to come visit during your open house! Sounds like a real blast and quite a bit of fun!! Take care, and God Bless!

    Every Good Wish,
    Doc
    The only thing that can never be taken away from you, is your honor. Cherish it, in yourself, and in others.

  4. #4
    RIP 2021 SEAWOLF97's Avatar
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    A good center is moe importand than the sides/rears/surrounds. Dialogue and much sound comes from center...dont skimp there.
    Some kind of happiness is measured out in miles

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    Senior Member BMWCCA's Avatar
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    I'm thinking of using L7 in the front, L5 in the rear, L1 for side fill, and two L20Ts butt-to-butt as centers——mostly since that's what I own. Though I'm waiting for the price of HT pre-amps to come down to a reasonable price. I'm not interested in using an off-shore integrated amp since I have eight Crown amps already. Does this make sense? Any suggestions? I've never set up a HT. I'm only a two-channel guy but thought I'd try HT for my kids.

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    RIP 2021 SEAWOLF97's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BMWCCA View Post
    I'm thinking of using L7 in the front, L5 in the rear, L1 for side fill, and two L20Ts butt-to-butt as centers——mostly since that's what I own. Though I'm waiting for the price of HT pre-amps to come down to a reasonable price. I'm not interested in using an off-shore integrated amp since I have eight Crown amps already. Does this make sense? Any suggestions? I've never set up a HT. I'm only a two-channel guy but thought I'd try HT for my kids.
    OK, but......L1 side really isnt needed. center is MONO, 2 L20's may drop to an impediance mismatch. rears/surrounds are overrated, many (not all) flix have little to NO content there.
    Some kind of happiness is measured out in miles

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    Quote Originally Posted by SEAWOLF97 View Post
    rears/surrounds are overrated, many (not all) flix have little to NO content there.
    Can't agree with that..., but even if it were true, why sell yourself short in the rear when there are so many nice SACD/DVD-Audio disks that can come with the HT territory.

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    Senior Member Tom Brennan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SEAWOLF97 View Post
    A good center is moe importand than the sides/rears/surrounds. Dialogue and much sound comes from center...dont skimp there.
    Boy, I strongly disagree with that. I think that using good side speakers (left and right fronts I mean, just to make sure we're talking about the same thing) with the center channel in phantom mode works fine. In my setup the stereo image across the front is wide and properly placed side to side without a center speaker and clarity is first rate.

    That said, I'd rather listen to movies mono with a single really good speaker than have a surround system with mediocre speakers.


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    Moderator hjames's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BMWCCA View Post
    I'm thinking of using L7 in the front, L5 in the rear, L1 for side fill, and two L20Ts butt-to-butt as centers——mostly since that's what I own. Though I'm waiting for the price of HT pre-amps to come down to a reasonable price. I'm not interested in using an off-shore integrated amp since I have eight Crown amps already. Does this make sense? Any suggestions? I've never set up a HT. I'm only a two-channel guy but thought I'd try HT for my kids.
    First Phil, what are you planning to setup?
    A 5.1 system or a 7.1 system? Or maybe 5.0 mode? Tho your L7s don't need a sub for music, you'll no doubt appreciate a sub for films!
    You WILL need a center in films/TV for dialog ...
    I run 5.1 in my system these days - 7.1 didn't add enough fill to make it worthwhile for me ...
    in 5.1 I run the rears off the side signal. But I what some folks are calling "sides" I think they mean the front L/R speakers ...

    I think otherwise - you've already got all the pieces to try it so there's nothing really to loose.
    2ch: WiiM Pro; Topping E30 II DAC; Oppo, Acurus RL-11, Acurus A200, JBL Dynamics Project - Offline: L212-TwinStack, VonSchweikert VR-4
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  10. #10
    Senior Member BMWCCA's Avatar
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    I guess I was thinking 7.1 without the sub (7.0?), but if there's little to be gained by it perhaps 5.1 (5.0) is enough. I'm open to suggestions!

    We're so used to watching DVDs with just the 030's (D130, 075) and actually enjoy the bass response (yeah, it's all in what you get used to, apparently), that I don't think a sub is worth the trouble since I don't already own one. And we're really two-channel people. The only surround-sound systems I've heard around here are done with those little setups in the box. Two 030's kick butt compared to those. I think Tom figured that one out already. But it seems a shame not to try with the L1, L5, and L7 already in the house.

    Thanks.

  11. #11
    Moderator hjames's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BMWCCA View Post
    I guess I was thinking 7.1 without the sub (7.0?), but if there's little to be gained by it perhaps 5.1 (5.0) is enough. I'm open to suggestions!

    We're so used to watching DVDs with just the 030's (D130, 075) and actually enjoy the bass response (yeah, it's all in what you get used to, apparently), that I don't think a sub is worth the trouble since I don't already own one. And we're really two-channel people. The only surround-sound systems I've heard around here are done with those little setups in the box. Two 030's kick butt compared to those. I think Tom figured that one out already. But it seems a shame not to try with the L1, L5, and L7 already in the house.

    Thanks.
    Yeah, but - how big is your room - what kind of dimensions?
    Also, what are you going to use to get the multichannel/surround outs?
    before you feed the Crown amps ...
    2ch: WiiM Pro; Topping E30 II DAC; Oppo, Acurus RL-11, Acurus A200, JBL Dynamics Project - Offline: L212-TwinStack, VonSchweikert VR-4
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  12. #12
    Senior Member BMWCCA's Avatar
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    Current room is a small 22x16. That's why the two-channel fills it so well. The larger room HT setup, as I mentioned, will use a HT pre-amp once I deem them to have reached the affordable range. And that's affordable for someone paying two (and soon three) college tuitions! I'd like not to waste time or money on a receiver but I might try one just for the experimentation value as long as it had pre-outs. More conjecture at this point than a high priority! It takes a long while to drag a Luddite into the future!

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    In my old place a few years back, we had an HT system set up in room that was 16x20. At first, it was L7 (LF & RF), LX300 (LS & RS) and a home-brewed center with JBL components. Then the LX300s were replaced by L5s, Then I added another pair of L7s, and put an L3 in place as the center for a 7.0 system (no sub).

    Eventually I added a JBL LE120H-1-based sub, and despite the fact that there were already four 12" woofers in the room, the sub make quite a difference.

    At high volume, this L Series system shook everything in the room and was definitely too much, but at reasonable volumes, it was a delight and brought many things to light that were not evident in the mismatches of the system in its infancy. L Series speakers are not the ideal HT set as they were not designed with HT in mind, but they will do a very representative job of what a good HT can deliver, even 7.1 with the right pre/pro or receiver--something with Logic7. PLIIx, DD EX, or DTS ES.
    Out.

  14. #14
    JBL 4645
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    Quote Originally Posted by SEAWOLF97 View Post
    A good center is moe importand than the sides/rears/surrounds. Dialogue and much sound comes from center...dont skimp there.
    Unless its one of many rare films that has crazy dialogue panning moving from left to centre or centre to left and centre to right with excellent timbre matching.

    But that doesn’t make it so if "Luke Skywalker’s" "lightsaber" is heard as dull whizzing sparkle when it’s started up just moments after been thrown from the speeder-bike "Return of the Jedi" (1983-1993-1997-2004) and the gets ready for attack with its sparkling with transparency from centre to right. So sound effects are just as critical to film sound art.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Brennan View Post
    Boy, I strongly disagree with that. I think that using good side speakers (left and right fronts I mean, just to make sure we're talking about the same thing) with the center channel in phantom mode works fine. In my setup the stereo image across the front is wide and properly placed side to side without a center speaker and clarity is first rate.

    That said, I'd rather listen to movies mono with a single really good speaker than have a surround system with mediocre speakers.

    I recognize that film that’s “South Pacific” and that what I’m talking about this as crazy use of dialogue panning Ping-Pong over the LCR, wonderful film and musical tracks use it a lot.

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    Senior Member Tom Brennan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBL 4645 View Post



    I recognize that film that’s “South Pacific” and that what I’m talking about this as crazy use of dialogue panning Ping-Pong over the LCR, wonderful film and musical tracks use it a lot.
    Yeah, lots of multi-track pictures from the 50s and early 60s had the voice following the actor's on screen position, this is especially noticeable in Fox pictures like Demetrius and the Gladiators and Cleopatra.

    One of the beefs some had with the DVD of My Fair Lady is that the sound was remixed to the modern style of placing dialogue in the center.

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