Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 72

Thread: Biamped L250ti Jubilee Clone

  1. #31
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    San Francisco
    Posts
    10,041
    Quote Originally Posted by Robh3606 View Post
    Hello Widget

    I don't know about Piano Black. Seems like a very unforgiving finish of the substrate. These are just a quick black spray and it shows up every thing. Have you done that finish??
    Yes it does and yes it does and yes I have... it can take a hundred hours of love, but when you are done it is quite spectacular... and if you do a half-assed job it'll look spectacularly bad.


    Widget

  2. #32
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Rocinante
    Posts
    8,001
    Hello Widget

    it can take a hundred hours of love, but when you are done it is quite spectacular...
    Hmm well that settles that. I don't have that much time to finish cabinets. I will have to find another finish that may not be as spectacular but still looks good.

    Well it's raining here big time so I was able to get a set of driver measurements mounted into the cabinet. Took them at 1M at tweeter level. I then changed them to text files and inported them into LEAP. I have found that LEAP is a good tool and is reliable for predicting the outcome. I like to use the simulations as a sanity check to make sure I am on the right track.

    This curve is from averaged measurements to see if the network, attenuation, and baffle placement look good. So far it looks good. Now I just need a week to get the networks built.

    Rob
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  3. #33
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Rocinante
    Posts
    8,001
    Just for fun I decided to see what the waterfall plots looked like for the 3 drivers measured over the frequency ranges they are used in the system. They look damn good. The 108H was a real surprise. I would say the aguaplas is certainly doing what it is supposed to be doing. The first 2 are the 108H the second are the 104H and the last is the 050 Gold tweeters.

    Rob
    Attached Images Attached Images     

  4. #34
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Rocinante
    Posts
    8,001
    050's

    Rob
    Attached Images Attached Images   

  5. #35
    Senior Member grumpy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    5,339
    Hi Rob,

    By what measure are these good plots? I.e., are these time and amplitude
    scales (and resolution) appropriate for these type of devices... That there
    appear almost no time-lingering resonances in the plots, I can see; I'm
    assuming that is the merit being judged. So my question is, would other,
    less capable devices appear any different in these plots? If you or someone
    else have particular experience with these plots and can just say that these
    are good ... well, OK

    ...or I can not be lazy and make some comparative measurements myself
    (don't have CLIO, but Mac-based FuzzMeasure which is also reasonably
    capable). I should just mount up some 104H-2's and do this.

    Really nice to see this project coming along.

  6. #36
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Rocinante
    Posts
    8,001
    Hello Grumpy

    What makes them good is how quickly they decay and how clean the plots look. The time scales are adjusted so you don't loose resolution and waterfalls can go low enough. The lower you go the longer the time window needs to be. The software will automatically limit how low the plot goes depending on the length of the time window. So if you look at the 108H the window is 13msec and they get shorter as you go up in frequency and change driver ranges.

    Here is a plot of a 2435 on a PTH1010 and a 2425 on a 2344. You can see that the plot for the 2435 combination looks better than the 2425 as an example. Same time and frequency range.

    The $64,000 question is just how audible any differences that come up in the plots really are.

    Rob
    Attached Images Attached Images     

  7. #37
    Senior Member grumpy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    5,339
    Thanks Rob, the compression driver/horn plots are closer to what I'm used to seeing.
    The direct radiator plots were so clean in comparison, it made me wonder if I was
    missing something .

    Correlating the plots to audible differences or artifacts is probably the topic of an AES
    paper or two. Whether this type of plot is useful for lower frequency, direct radiator
    measurements, is what I'll change my question to... Is it useful? or is there just typically
    nothing to see?

    I've seen cabinet resonances show up, on wide-band waterfall plots, in the lower
    frequency range, which seems like a useful enough reason to run them, including
    that range.

  8. #38
    Senior Member pos's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Paris, France
    Posts
    2,556
    These graphs are really interesting, thanks for sharing Rob!
    Where those diaphramgs aquaplassed?
    Another question is how much of these time delays come from the horn itself. The 2344 is said to have ripples between 1k and 2k (can be call them HOMs?). http://www.audioheritage.org/html/pr...bl/4430-35.htm
    That would also be interesting to see the same graph for a H9800!

  9. #39
    Unabashed Speakerholic cosmos's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    297
    Rob,

    The plots you posted look really promising. I was a little surprised by the dip from 7K-10K on the 050Ti, but as far as controlled decay, they look great. I never saw one before on the 108H.. very nice!

    You don't happen to have a 095Ti/093Ti or 046Ti from a XPL200 that you can run, do you?

  10. #40
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Rocinante
    Posts
    8,001
    Got the crossover parts laid put just have to figure out how to fit them on to the pcb's. Lot's of caps going CC and the bandpass for the 108H has large values.

    You don't happen to have a 095Ti/093Ti or 046Ti from a XPL200 that you can run, do you?
    One of these days I will measure them and post the plots.

    Rob
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  11. #41
    Unabashed Speakerholic cosmos's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    297
    Rob, have you got them running yet?

  12. #42
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Rocinante
    Posts
    8,001
    Hello Cosmos

    Not yet I am slowly moving along. Combined with a CC network in Solens and the low dcr values for the larger coils the networks are quite a bit bulkier and down right heavier than I imagined. Basicaly I need to get more cabinet work finished to see how the networks will load in. It won't fit on 3 double sided PCB's as it is now so the 160uf capacitor bank and one of the 2 largest coils will have to be off the boards mounted to the enclosure.

    I am also going to spike and mass load the upper cabinet so it is isolated from the bass cabinet and may be using neoprene on the baffle like in the XPL series. I think I found a local source for the "correct" material. I have to get a sample and see what it looks like.

    I have a couple of the boards finished so once I figure out how it will all go together I should be able to get them up fast once it all comes together.

    Thanks for your interest

    Rob

  13. #43
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Rocinante
    Posts
    8,001
    I managed to get all the network boards built and ended up using 4 seperate PCB's as their size is a real surprise. They have to be measured to see if the voltage drives are correct. Still need to add the DC bias but I can see if they are correct without it. Have to make the new boards for the DX-1 next. Slowly it's finaly starting to come together. At the rate I am going maybe by X-Mas I will have them actually working

    Rob
    Attached Images Attached Images   
    "I could be arguing in my spare time"

  14. #44
    Unabashed Speakerholic cosmos's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    297
    Quote Originally Posted by Robh3606 View Post
    I managed to get all the network boards built and ended up using 4 seperate PCB's as their size is a real surprise. They have to be measured to see if the voltage drives are correct. Still need to add the DC bias but I can see if they are correct without it. Have to make the new boards for the DX-1 next. Slowly it's finaly starting to come together. At the rate I am going maybe by X-Mas I will have them actually working

    Rob
    Good Lord! When you look at the schematic you can see there are a lot of components, but it just takes on a new dimension seeing pictures. The layout and detail work looks superb.

    Best of luck..

  15. #45
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Wash DC suburbs
    Posts
    1,206
    When Guido made my XO , he used the "new" style TIBQ. I have a an additional board which sits in the bottom of each speaker w/many Caps on it. Since yours are from scratch I would guess all of your componets are larger than originals , it is large for a XO !

    I enjoy following this thread

    Mark
    Think center channel for 250TIs; (2) 108s, a 104 and a 44ti, now what?

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. L250 Vs L250Ti
    By mesudman in forum Miscellaneous Gear
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 06-09-2007, 03:17 PM
  2. Question about L220 and L250Ti
    By mesudman in forum Miscellaneous Gear
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 06-06-2007, 05:41 PM
  3. 250Ti Jubilee happy unhappy
    By filigran in forum Lansing Product Technical Help
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 01-23-2006, 02:22 PM
  4. L250Ti clone
    By buzzandrox in forum Lansing Product Technical Help
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 06-03-2004, 02:46 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •