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Thread: ;y little naive friend and 4341 drivers

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4313B View Post
    Well, the LE10A is a very smooth performer but it won't have the same impact as the 2121 or 2122. That aquaplas coating kills efficiency. The 2121 and 2122 recone kits are still available so you might just want to recone those LE10A's as 2121's or 2122's.
    Yes, that was recomanded on the start of the thread. I sent a PM to Guido, and in the same time I`m looking for a recone kits. Where the h... can I found a pair if Guido does not have it? You say that those are avaliable. Can you point me in wright direction, please.

    Someone mentioned that on the newer kits the dome will not fit and that the old le10a domes can be used. If a friend have a pair of le10a that will be reconed, those domes can be used when reconing to 2121, correct?

    Marijan

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by marijan View Post
    Where the h... can I found a pair if Guido does not have it?
    Guido can get them.
    Quote Originally Posted by marijan View Post
    Someone mentioned that on the newer kits the dome will not fit and that the old le10a domes can be used. If a friend have a pair of le10a that will be reconed, those domes can be used when reconing to 2121, correct?
    I'll try to check the latest kits this weekend and see how the domes are fitting these days. And yes, the LE10A domes were the same as the 2121 domes (at one time).

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4313B View Post
    Guido can get them.I'll try to check the latest kits this weekend and see how the domes are fitting these days. And yes, the LE10A domes were the same as the 2121 domes (at one time).
    I hope that Guido will answer positivly. So, if I do understand you corectly 4313 if he get a 2121 or 2122 kit, and send LE10A to Guido for example, Guido will not have a problem to make out farly god 2121/2122 drivers out of those LE`s? (dont take me to hard for my (un)undestanding and bad use of your language)

    Thanks for readynes to check out those fittings!

    Marijan

    P.S.
    What about the photos of 2231 LF`s I sent. Do those look OK. Like I said the baskets are suppoused to be 2231 Alnico but reconed with 2235H (at least that is the number writen on the back of the membrane with a chalk).

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by marijan View Post
    Marijan

    P.S.
    What about the photos of 2231 LF`s I sent. Do those look OK. Like I said the baskets are suppoused to be 2231 Alnico but reconed with 2235H (at least that is the number writen on the back of the membrane with a chalk).
    Thats what I have in my 4341s downstairs. I found them (used) with 2234s but I got a pair of 2231s reconed to 2235s from a forum member last summer.

    Here are 2 threads on the 4341s:
    The 4340/4341 Technical reference thread -
    http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/s...ad.php?t=16493

    Thread about the pair that I found
    http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/s...=16263&page=10
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  5. #20
    Senior Member Fangio's Avatar
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    2231 cone kits are no longer available, but 2235H kits still are, Marijan.

    These are the only proper way to recone 2231 A or H's nowadays, recommended by JBL.

    So what you have are 2235's with original alnico motors. Nice, and certainly adequate for your 4341 project – don't worry.

  6. #21
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    hjames, yes that one on the left is the right one. Thanks.

    I will not bother you anymore guys (at least not all the time), and will do some moore search on my own. It`s just... so much to read, that I`lm begining to regret that I said yes to a friend of mine. I don`t like to do work negligent, flimsy and just on half. What about my violin buisnis?

    Thanks again.

    Marijan

  7. #22
    RE: Member when? subwoof's Avatar
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    not quite right

    It looks like the "rusty" 15" is a later version "K" magnet ( note the recess on the magnet casting ) and has an "E" frame ( note the terminal flange ). This will still result in the correct alignment but it makes me wonder if there are any other shortcuts in it's construction..??

    4313: I didn't know all of the older alnico consumer equivalents so thanks for the 108 info. I have a pair of 4315 cabs that need those 8's if I decide to return them to original..:o)

    sub

    ps the link I was referring to is Hjames / *heathers* ( please check your spelling )

  8. #23
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    "2231 cone kits are no longer available, but 2235H kits still are, Marijan."

    I hope this "still" is not synonymous with "yet"


  9. #24
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    Not quite right, how much to care?

    Quote Originally Posted by subwoof View Post
    It looks like the "rusty" 15" is a later version "K" magnet ( note the recess on the magnet casting ) and has an "E" frame ( note the terminal flange ). This will still result in the correct alignment but it makes me wonder if there are any other shortcuts in it's construction..??

    sub

    ps the link I was referring to is Hjames / *heathers* ( please check your spelling )
    Sub, if I did my quick homework corectly, and if that 2231 has K magnet, it could be only from K130 or K 140. 145 would be to havy, with magnet structure weight at 9,0 kg. Asuming that recone was done properly the woice cole even if it was aluminium one from 130 was replaced with coper one when reconing with 2235H kit. All other data from 130 and 140 relating to magnet, not membrane and voice coile structure, are the same with exception of alnico magnet structure weight (5,9 in 2231 and 5,4 kg in K`s) I could onl see the K driver structure on "heretage" pages, but I supouse that there can not be much diference when membr./V.Coil, basket structures are excluded. What would be the downsides of K magnet in that basket if 2235 recone was done? What other structural shortcuts coud be there?

    Anyhowe, I cant do much here about it. Drivers was tested for functionality in temporary cabinets with x-o, that was not for sale unfortunately, and the drivers did performe their work. How corect or how good, I don`t know i did not hear it. When i finish the cabinets, I`ll know better I hope. Still, if any of the members know about 3141 x-o to buy, PM info will be most appreshiated. Still waiting for Guido but 2121 or 2122 recone original kits info would be welcome allso for reserve case.

    One more question. Plywood was used for cabinets as I can see. MDF, plywood, hardwood... what is generaly the prefered choice in terms of structural and frequency response functionality ... sonic benefits? The cabinets will be veenered.

    Thanks!

    Marijan

    Readswift, thanks for mail, but the tubeguru frum hungary can not help me, he has onl 4331 x-o.

  10. #25
    Senior Member richluvsound's Avatar
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    materials !

    this topic has been covered in depth - use the search function.

    Widget has some interesting ideas. I have had some very good results following his suggestions.
    I have been working on some boxes using resin , slate powder,mdf and ply.

    The front and back are 18mm mdf internal and 18mm birch ply external with a resin and slate powder 4mm mix between. The bracing is sapele . the sides top and bottom are 25mm mdf . They sound wonderful when I stick my head inside and whistle.

    Anyway, I think you are probably the best qualified in the acoustic qualities of timber. I hope you stick around and share some of your unique knowledge on the subject.


    Rich

  11. #26
    RE: Member when? subwoof's Avatar
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    oh....K

    It could be a K120, 130 or 140 as all of them had the same magnet. The early K's used the SAME magnet and casting as the 136A so there is no problem.

    Later in the K evolution JBL made a newer magnet casting that allowed the rear decal to be recessed ( they get scratched very easy ) when the improved surrounds came out.

    JBL kept the original magnets for the home stuff since they were always mounted inside cabinets and wouldn't get scratched right???

    When the "E" series magnets came out the magnet's diameter was too large to fit into the recess that the alnico did so a new frame was designed but the top plate-to-rim depth was the same.

    Even later "E" and pro speakers had the plastic push terminals that replaced the ( superior ) individual push terminals. A step backwards.

    Sometimes in the shop we would put together a "frankenstein" speaker for a guitar rig, drum monitor or such when one was needed right away...

    sub

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by richluvsound View Post
    this topic has been covered in depth - use the search function.

    Widget has some interesting ideas. I have had some very good results following his suggestions.
    I have been working on some boxes using resin , slate powder,mdf and ply.

    The front and back are 18mm mdf internal and 18mm birch ply external with a resin and slate powder 4mm mix between. The bracing is sapele . the sides top and bottom are 25mm mdf . They sound wonderful when I stick my head inside and whistle.

    Anyway, I think you are probably the best qualified in the acoustic qualities of timber. I hope you stick around and share some of your unique knowledge on the subject.


    Rich
    I`m not sure that the goal from thos two, violin and speaker box is the same. In violins you try to make highly acustical and resonant enclosure and in combination with all influential factors (post, arching, varnish...) linear response from a completed product. The violin box works as a driver in your JBL, generating sound waves.
    Speaker disigners usualy try to remoove the influence of the box which could, in combination with driver generated frequences, produce unwanted freq. crossings, resonances and responses, destroying natural balance of a driver, enclosure, X-o structure.

    In string instruments, you can control in certain way, some of the freq. ranges with careful use of varnish/ground combination. Extension of high freq. range in particulary is something that is quite easely achived for example, but linearity is something that will need some more work than just use apropriate finish.

    Adition of frequency ranges created with speaker cabinet, will add some kind of coloration to natural output of the driver, and that may be wanted or may be not. As allways, it is all a matter of sinergy betwen design, materias used, drivers and X-O parameters, and finaly, unfortunatly to many times it will be a mater of subjective valuation.

    About cabinet materials, a I did some reading, and I did form an opinion, but as allways it is nice to get some confirmation, that is generaly accepted as the most confident and reliable one.

    Marijan

    Subwoofer, thans for clarification. Bad homework I see. I`ll let an owner to dewal with it. I hope that there will not be to many downs becouse of that driver. On the other hand that frankenstein monster was wild but sensytive creature...

  13. #28
    RE: Member when? subwoof's Avatar
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    just fine

    The woofer(s) will work just fine. It's nice that JBL did keep many of the designs based on a "standard" gap depth to allow interchangeability.

    The reason we gave it some scrutiny is to make sure that it is compatible - many are sold on ebay with the wrong kits installed and require reconing ( if possible ) at extra expense.

    My L200's that are in the living room have the exact same cones and frames as yours and work just fine.

    As far as the enclosure, there are numerous threads on that subject that will help you decide. It is correct that the cabinet should be as rigid and non-resonant as possible so 6" of concrete or 1" of lead should work well..

    Most builders use particle board since it doesn't have grain, is very inexpensive and is easy to find. The cabinets I build for clubs, SR companies and other portable use have a myriad of requirements so they have to be high quality plywood.

    good luck and when you get these done, sit back and enjoy them before they leave...

    sub

  14. #29
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    Edge angle?

    Intermediate question.

    I borowed a photo from the forum... thanks!

    Can any of 4341 4343 ovners mesure the angle, that front edge of the sides is taking when coming towards the iner (front side) edge of the sides (contact betwen color blue and veener). It looks to me that that angle is stoped before reaching actual edge. How mush of narov part there is on the front look of the edge....... I hope it makes at least some sense.

    Se the photo please. I marked the edge with light red line.

    Thank you!

    marijan
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  15. #30
    RE: Member when? subwoof's Avatar
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