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Thread: A new Ring Radiator?

  1. #1
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    A new Ring Radiator?

    Hello All,

    I hope everyone is happy and well and looking forward to the Christmas break.

    The Scanspeak ring radiator is widely used in various high end speakers. How about a JBL version? What? Yes a JBL version. Why? Just for the heck of it- because we can. Sure we would loose considerbale efficiency, but we would also gain wider dispersion.

    Take a humble JBL 2402 (you have sitting around doing nothing- I have a few) and make a new face plate for it (or remachine the JBL front horn) and do the same for the phase plug, completely removing all the horn loading. I am not sure where this would now place the sensitivity, but I would guess it would be sub 100dB/1W/1m.

    Take a lok at the pics:
    Attached Images Attached Images   
    Have Fun - >>> Nessun Dorma - 12 years old <<<
    Best, Joe Alesi

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    I'd rather have a BMS. Scan-speak = toys.

  3. #3
    RE: Member when? subwoof's Avatar
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    old news

    JBL did it 45 *years* ago and called it the 030. It is used in the minigon and a few others.

    sub

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    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
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    JBL did it 45 *years* ago and called it the 030. It is used in the minigon and a few others.
    The 030 was not a ring radiator. It just used a common motor. It was a rather large conventional cone tweeter with an aluminum cone .

    Rob

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    Senior Member edgewound's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robh3606 View Post
    The 030 was not a ring radiator. It just used a common motor. It was a rather large conventional cone tweeter with an aluminum cone .

    Rob

    If nothing else....the 030 sure looks pretty.

    I don't remember how they sound...I've only had the chance to repair one pair about 17 years ago when parts were available.

    Wharfdale had a similar design with a purple plastic diaphragm and a huge voice coil that sounded mighty good. I think I still have it in the boneyard for reference....doesn't work though.
    Edgewound...JBL Pro Authorized...since 1988
    Upland Loudspeaker Service, Upland, CA

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    Quote Originally Posted by A9X View Post
    I'd rather have a BMS. Scan-speak = toys.
    But you can have a JBL..........

    Hello A9X
    Have Fun - >>> Nessun Dorma - 12 years old <<<
    Best, Joe Alesi

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    Senior Member John W's Avatar
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    I was trying to find any info I could on the 2408H and came accross these pictures of the diaghragm and phase plug.
    This is different from the 2407 and looks a lot like an updated ring radiator.
    Attached Images Attached Images    

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    Quote Originally Posted by John W View Post
    I was trying to find any info I could on the 2408H and came accross these pictures of the diaghragm and phase plug.
    Hello John,

    Thanks. WOW that is some phase plug.
    Have Fun - >>> Nessun Dorma - 12 years old <<<
    Best, Joe Alesi

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Alesi View Post
    But you can have a JBL..........

    Hello A9X
    Hey Joe

    JBL buy some of the newer models from BMS anyway. See DJK's posts on this at AA HiEff. The 2407 is apparently a 4540ND

    I'm not a brand 'fanboy', I'd use whatever I find best for the job.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by A9X View Post
    Hey Joe

    JBL buy some of the newer models from BMS anyway. See DJK's posts on this at AA HiEff. The 2407 is apparently a 4540ND

    I'm not a brand 'fanboy', I'd use whatever I find best for the job.
    Hello A9X,

    I have had a look at the BMS site- some very interesting high spec drivers there for sure, but they are all compression drivers.
    http://www.bmspro.info/?&show=item&usbid=10267

    What I was suggesting with the 2402 mod (just for kicks) was to remove all the horn loading turning it in to a direct radiating ring radiator similar to the Scanspeak design.

    I will do it just for fun and eventually post the before and after response.

    Thanks- I will check DJK AA posts
    Last edited by Joe Alesi; 12-19-2007 at 04:02 PM. Reason: added link for info
    Have Fun - >>> Nessun Dorma - 12 years old <<<
    Best, Joe Alesi

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Alesi View Post
    What I was suggesting with the 2402 mod (just for kicks) was to remove all the horn loading turning it in to a direct radiating ring radiator similar to the Scanspeak design.

    I will do it just for fun and eventually post the before and after response.
    Be interesting to see the results, but not sure it'll work all that well. Efficiency will be a lot lower.

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    Quote Originally Posted by A9X View Post
    Be interesting to see the results, but not sure it'll work all that well. Efficiency will be a lot lower.
    Yes A9X- I agree and I would expect to loose something like 10dB, but gain considerable dispersion and possibly increase bandwidth and lower distortion/colouration somewhat. Although the distortion would be hard for me to quantify at the moment (I have ETF and another package- I have forgotten).

    Only experiment will know for sure.
    Have Fun - >>> Nessun Dorma - 12 years old <<<
    Best, Joe Alesi

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Alesi View Post
    Yes A9X- I agree and I would expect to loose something like 10dB, but gain considerable dispersion and possibly increase bandwidth and lower distortion/colouration somewhat. Although the distortion would be hard for me to quantify at the moment (I have ETF and another package- I have forgotten).

    Only experiment will know for sure.
    Experimentation will be the test. But, I would expect distortion to increase as to get the same amount of SPL there will need to be more displacement. Compression effects in the throat should be minimal at sensible domestic levels. Dispersion is something that I prefer to be controlled and matched to the driver below so I'm not a fan of that aspect.

    I'm going to be doing a bit of testing and measuring, as I'm getting Soundeasy and ARTA in the new year as well as an IBF calbrated measurement mic.

    After my experiences with DR and CD HF drivers I could never see me going back to DRs.

    Cheers

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by A9X View Post
    Experimentation will be the test. But, I would expect distortion to increase as to get the same amount of SPL there will need to be more displacement. Compression effects in the throat should be minimal at sensible domestic levels.
    Good point
    Have Fun - >>> Nessun Dorma - 12 years old <<<
    Best, Joe Alesi

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    I'll donate an old beat up 2402 horn and phase plug to who ever wants to cut it down in the name of science. I still have a small pile of them left!

    Mike Caldwell

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