4 way system poll

[Mr. Widget]

It sounds like the ideal combination might be the 12" 2206H, (basically a smaller version of the 2226H). 4" voice coil for control, and right in between the 2226 and 2123 in size...

I've never heard them, but it does make sense. I will say that the 2202 of the 4350/55 has much more slam than the 2122 of the 4345, however the 2122's added detail and ability to showcase subtle tonal nuance more than makeup for this loss to my ears.


It is all compromises. Decide what is most important to you and follow that path.


Widget

[Robh3606]

You are basically doing a version of Drew Daniels system. That was my original inspiration. I ended up with a 4 way active set-up using smaller subs. I simply didn't have the room for the boxes required.

I would use the 18's as true subs and use a 15 tuned up high and tight for max transient response and low group delay. The 2123 is a great driver from 300 to 1.5K and then the horn and compression driver of your choice. If you can match the directivity of the horn and 10" at the crossover point. Also try to use a horn that has at least an octave lower cut-off than your crossover point. You want good loading and a good DI match through the crossover point. Get the 10" mid and horn as close as possible.

http://www.audioheritage.org/html/pe...s/1-intro.html

Rob

[Joe Alesi]

They were a dog to find. I lucked onto one pair from another 'phile in Melb, and the other pair are in transit from the US. All are NOS/NIB.
Still looking for a single 2220H and have been for over a year.

Hello A9X,

There was (as I recall) a 2220H or 2220 pair on eBay Australia- I didn't follow it though. I may have another contact for you- BS Sound in Victoria, but i can't recall if he had a 2220 reconed to 2225 or straight 2220. I will ask.

EDIT:
I checked with him- Sorry it is a 2220 fitted with a 2225 cone. PM sent.

[Joe Alesi]

Joe,

There are some good ideas in Drew's Clue's in the Library.

If you plan to use it indoors it will be important to work out your minimum workable listening distance.

As a rule the 4 ways need a mimum of 3 metres to integrate properly and time displacement with deep horns will be an issue if you intent to have good depth and a smooth vertical power response. Otherwise it will be nothing more than a nice sounding PA.

Ian

(Melb)

Hello Ian,

Yes I take your point about driver integration. I would try to maintain minimum vertical spacings. But my listening room to be (still building) is largish: approx 9.5m x 6.5m, with an added smaller area to one side- so I should be able to get a typical 4-5m + listening distance.

Ian I see "Melb" there- Melbourne??. It would be good to get togther for a coffee to chew the audio fat - I am in the SE suburbs.

[Joe Alesi]

You are basically doing a version of Drew Daniels system. That was my original inspiration. I ended up with a 4 way active set-up using smaller subs. I simply didn't have the room for the boxes required.

I would use the 18's as true subs and use a 15 tuned up high and tight for max transient response and low group delay. The 2123 is a great driver from 300 to 1.5K and then the horn and compression driver of your choice. If you can match the directivity of the horn and 10" at the crossover point. Also try to use a horn that has at least an octave lower cut-off than your crossover point. You want good loading and a good DI match through the crossover point. Get the 10" mid and horn as close as possible.

http://www.audioheritage.org/html/pe...s/1-intro.html

Rob

Thanks for the input Rob.

Even though I haven't tried it yet, I really would want to take maximum advantage of the 2440 down to 800-1K for that wonderful horn bite??, but perhaps the 2123 is better in that area- not sure if it is black and white or matter of taste issue. I suppose an easy enough test with an electronic crossover.

Thinking out aloud- I wonder how well the 2123 goes if we push it lower to around 200Hz- again trial/error.

Thanks for reminding me on the Drew Daniels system- I had read it in part some time ago, but now will have to read it through in detail.

[Joe Alesi]

It sounds like the ideal combination might be the 12" 2206H, (basically a smaller version of the 2226H). 4" voice coil for control, and right in between the 2226 and 2123 in size...

John

Hello John,

Yes the 12" could be a beautiful thing, but they are very hard to find 2nd Hand in Australia (except for the odd E120- recone or redustcap perhaps???) There seem to be lots of 15" and some 10", but you rarely see 12". Just out of curiousity I will check their new price.

[Joe Alesi]

Yes, and it sounds even better crossed over at 1200Hz... hence the 2123... if slam is paramount and 2226s are your thing, look for a much, much bigger horn. Using the 2226s is a pretty big compromise if crossed above 500Hz.


Widget

Hello Widget,

Thanks for the input- sounds like the 2123/2397 combo is the way to go for reasonable size (WAFish) result. Re the 2226 - yes I have heard them higher up and tend to agree. I could always use some EV 90x40 theatre horns I have- 2360 sort of size and cross down low....a bit on the crazy side size wise. Are we allowed to say Electrovoice here?

http://www.electrovoice.com/products/294.html

It will all be a great experiment, when I get all the gear arranged/time.

[Rolf]

Hello Rolf,

It's of value to me to ask people who may have experienced some of these which they would prefer, if they HAD to choose and also to stimulate discussion on all things JBL. So......... which option did you vote for?

Best
Joe

"None of the above."

[Chas]

I went with the majority, it could be a fine system...although based on my own experience, I would upgrade the 2440's to 2441's. Makes a big difference.

[Joe Alesi]

I went with the majority, it could be a fine system...although based on my own experience, I would upgrade the 2440's to 2441's. Makes a big difference.

Hello Chas,

I have some 2441 drivers (not in my list- one has a non genuine JBL diaphragm -I Think and the other has none.)

I hear that the 2440/Aluminum is preferred in its operating band compared with the 2441/titanium (at least from some of my Australian connections) compared with the 2441 operating in the same band (say up to say 8-10kHz), but then there is no substitute for trial. I will try them (or atleast one of them). Of course the 2441 opens the oppourtunity for it to run right up to 16k (with eq etc), but I really want to use the 2405 (since I was little and saw my first JBL- which was a large 3 or 4 way monitor- I will have to search the forum pics to be sure which one)

[boputnam]

...I'd use the horns/drivers in red... get an additional 2123 and try both horns to see which you prefer....

Widget pinged the ones I was eye'ing.

Get 'er done...!!

[Chas]

Hello Chas,

I have some 2441 drivers (not in my list- one has a non genuine JBL diaphragm -I Think and the other has none.)

I hear that the 2440/Aluminum is preferred in its operating band compared with the 2441/titanium (at least from some of my Australian connections) compared with the 2441 operating in the same band (say up to say 8-10kHz), but then there is no substitute for trial. I will try them (or atleast one of them). Of course the 2441 opens the oppourtunity for it to run right up to 16k (with eq etc), but I really want to use the 2405 (since I was little and saw my first JBL- which was a large 3 or 4 way monitor- I will have to search the forum pics to be sure which one)

Please don't misunderstand me, I actually was responding within the context of your parameters. I.E. with a 2405, I WOULD use a 2441 (with an aluminum, diamond surround diaphragm) over a 2440 in conjunction with a 2405. It just works better. I don't know where a titanium diaphragm material comes into play here....

Even at my advanced age and hearing, I most certainly wouldn't run a system like this without a 2405!

[Joe Alesi]

Widget pinged the ones I was eye'ing.

Get 'er done...!!

Thanks Boputnam,

Following the discussions in this thread I have now searched far and wide and have some 2123 drivers in my crosshairs at the moment, unfortunately with slightly aged/faded cones compared with my other (virtually new) grey cone, but I should go for it so I can ...... Get 'er done...!!

[Joe Alesi]

Please don't misunderstand me, I actually was responding within the context of your parameters. I.E. with a 2405, I WOULD use a 2441 (with an aluminum, diamond surround diaphragm) over a 2440 in conjunction with a 2405. It just works better. I don't know where a titanium diaphragm material comes into play here....

Even at my advanced age and hearing, I most certainly wouldn't run a system like this without a 2405!

Hello Chas,

Sorry about my misunderstanding. I immediately thought the inclusion of the 2441 (over the 2440) implied the exclusion of the 2405- my mistake.

Now I am curious and will have to carefully check my 2441 to see what it really has inside- Maybe I will get lucky with an Aluminium Diamond Pattern? I recall it being a diamond pattern, what type or whether it is genuine I am not sure.