Does wire "get old" ?

[Zilch]

Copper oxide is brown.

Copper sulfide is black.

Copper sulfate is green.

It is also protective.

Once the green forms, the process stops....

[johnaec]

Copper sulfate is green.

It is also protective.

Once the green forms, the process stops....

So all my cables are good to go now?

John

[Zilch]

So all my cables are good to go now?

John

Only if there's still any actual copper left.

The film is 0.002" to 0.003" thick. Nothing left of 34 Ga. strands, and 2/3 of 30 Ga. is gone.

[Just running the numbers here for ya.... ]

[Mr. Widget]

Copper wire is over rated... from now on, I am only listening to copper sulfate!

Zilch, from your little patination discussion, I'd guess the reason that some of the clear jacketed speaker wire turns green is that there is sulfur in the clear vinyl they are using... I doubt it has anything to do with more oxygen getting through that cable jacket compared to any other... and using OFC certainly has nothing to do with it. OFC and 9 nines copper will still oxidize. Oh, I'm sorry... patinate.


Widget

[Robh3606]

I'd guess the reason that some of the clear jacketed speaker wire turns green

If it's been soldered in a clear jacket look up copper abiate. Nice blue green under the sleeving

http://www.smtinfo.net/docs/Electron...duction/25.htm

http://books.google.com/books?id=raO...Iwdqb_YuY76SrY

Rob

[Zilch]

I'm startin' to think tinned is better over the long haul, from the standpoint of corrosion.

I've certainly seen fine-stranded bare wire ends that have deteriorated to nothing over time with exposure.

Also, strip back the fabric insulation on old knob-and-tube wires, and it's clear the conductor is oxidized on the surface.

Seems with copper stranded, the integrity of the insulator seal at the terminations matters. Melting-core heat-shrink may be one good option....

[Zilch]

If it's been soldered in a clear jacket look up copper abiate. Nice blue green under the sleeving.

Thanks, Rob.

Back to the "Tin Before Crimping" thread, then....

[Steve Schell]

Hi Widget,

I have long suspected that the additional impedance might be lowering the damping factor a tad, to good effect. I didn't explain this as my post was long enough already .

I'll have to try this experiment with my tube amps. I often add quite a bit of resistance in series with transistor amps to lower their death grip on the speakers, and have found that it works well.

[SEAWOLF97]

I didn't say it makes no difference... I said I doubted it did. Since there is the possibility it may make a difference, and I have to use something, why not use 12 ga.?

I am currently building some speakers for a client and he is ordering magic wire for all of the internal wiring... I doubt that will make a difference either, but it is his money and what he wants. I am happy to do it for him.


Widget

3 days ago I wud have agreed 100 percent. I wud have done the same poo-pooing that I read here.

I have listened seriously to decent audio since 1966 and can certainly detect changes especially when only half a set of speakers has been changed and I can stand in between them. To eliminate differences in ears, I even reversed and turned my back to them , so as to be switching ears. There IS a difference now.

besides the wire , only the loop connector has changed and the new ones dont really appear better than the old. The new ones are crimped and the old were soldered. On the other end, the banana plugs have remained the same.

I was asking for opinions on WHY and really dont need comments about it being better because I wanted it to be better. I have exceptional hearing for my age and DO detect a difference - mainly in the HF response.

[scott fitlin]

Also, keep this in mind, todays copper wire is not the same exact copper as yesteryears copper.

Just to say that a difference in manufacturing processes, a variation in the alloys used, could also cause a difference you hear.

Before anyone says Im crazy, think about it! If we can hear a difference from ordinary West Penn, or Radio Shack wire to exotic cables made of hyper pure copper from Kimber, or Siltech, then in fact, wouldnt we also hear a difference from copper wire made 25 years ago to todays copper wire if it is in fact a different production process, or different alloys, or amounts of certain alloys used?

[SEAWOLF97]

did the 2nd speaker today, same result.

was a little dismayed to find the factory speaker wire had been short and they soldered 2 pieces together to make a long enough run.

[SEAWOLF97]

whilest I had it open today, checked out the underside of the driver. Someone had commented (coherent guy ?) that it looked like a 3 inch voice coil. I measured it and he was correct.

this is the view from the underside. Obviously has been refoamed.

[Mr. Widget]

I have listened seriously to decent audio since 1966 and can certainly detect changes especially when only half a set of speakers has been changed and I can stand in between them.

I have been seriously listening since the late '70s... your extra decade plus of experience most likely explains the difference.

But seriously, I'm glad you've been able to improve your speakers.


Widget


FWIW: I haven't found A/Bing left and right speakers to be a very useful technique for me. This may be due to the fact that I grew up listening to stereo... I also have a heck of a time evaluating systems in surround mode. For me, I have the most success listening to stereo pairs of loudspeakers set up in a proper equilateral triangle... in a decent room. As the conditions deviate from that my ability to really know what I am hearing is significantly reduced.

[jim3860]

3 days ago I wud have agreed 100 percent. I wud have done the same poo-pooing that I read here.

I have listened seriously to decent audio since 1966 and can certainly detect changes especially when only half a set of speakers has been changed and I can stand in between them. To eliminate differences in ears, I even reversed and turned my back to them , so as to be switching ears. There IS a difference now.

besides the wire , only the loop connector has changed and the new ones dont really appear better than the old. The new ones are crimped and the old were soldered. On the other end, the banana plugs have remained the same.

I was asking for opinions on WHY and really dont need comments about it being better because I wanted it to be better. I have exceptional hearing for my age and DO detect a difference - mainly in the HF response.

Actually most people here in this thread dont disagree with you that you it sounds better. Most people seem to have different ideas why it sounds better. older wire, thinner wire, oxidized connections, etc. And I certainly agree with you due to my own experince. my hearing is superb even at my age now. I can hear both lower and higher frequencies than most people. I think it is due to the fact that i am almost blind and detect sounds that are impossible for lots of people. No matter the reason it sounds better to you and thats all that matters. REGARDS JIM

[coherent_guy]

whilest I had it open today, checked out the underside of the driver. Someone had commented (coherent guy ?) that it looked like a 3 inch voice coil. I measured it and he was correct.

this is the view from the underside. Obviously has been refoamed.

Yes, 'twas I, thanks but that was a guess from your pic of all the cones in the factory. That is one unique driver, curious that no one else ever used the idea or is it still patented or protected somehow? Did you say how big the cone is across it's "bottom"? Looks to be at least 12".

One run of the internal wires was spliced together? Seems like they were rationing wire on the assembly line. Maybe that lead was cut accidently and the worker didn't want to bother replacing it. Geez, what are the chances that you'd get that one? Lucky you!

I don't understand why the wire naysayers must run down any use of different wire, even when it's not at all weird like in your case. I use silver plated, teflon insulated wire from a surplus store called Skycraft (in Orlando, Florida, worth a visit if you ever go there) in runs from crossover to LE85's and it sounds mighty fine to me. So enjoy your improved speakers and I certainly believe that going from 20 gauge to 12 is audible, I hate micro wire!!