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Thread: AQUAPLAS

  1. #31
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    Seemed like it would have made pretty good sandpaper. The weight of it on the cone seemed to make the low efficiency of the LE 10 even worse. Those rubbery Lans-alloy surrounds would be flexed to the limit while the cones would bring forth barely audible low notes.

  2. #32
    Senior Member Guido's Avatar
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    So you apply it with a paint brush, right?
    What is the ratio aquaplas to water?

  3. #33
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
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    Hello Guido

    Just a dash of water and yes this was brushed on. It's more common sense than anything else. You add just enough to make it more spreadable than it already is. You can get it too act just like a thick no drip ceiling paint. You just have to be careful thinning it. It's a suspension and if you go too far the bulk material will settle out. I added more water for what I used on the tweeter. That was more like normal indoor house paint. At that consistency I think I can actually apply it with my airbrush. They didn't have the largest nozzle at the art supply store so I have to wait till they get them in again to see. Have to see what happens when I get that and I still want to see what happens with the diaphragms. Have you done anything with your sample??

    Rob

  4. #34
    Senior Member Don C's Avatar
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    If you're going to do the mids on your XPL clones, I'd love to see the measurements on them afterwards. I like the effect of the aquaplas on mine. But they have the aquaplas on the inside, where you can't see it.

  5. #35
    RIP 2011 neanderthal's Avatar
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    AQUAPLAS

    I just had two LE14A's and two 128H's reconed by JBLPRO and I was talking to him about the white cones and he told me the white is real fine ground up coral...how he knows I do not know but that is what he told me the white is real finely ground up coral that JBL uses on the cones

  6. #36
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
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    Here are the Impedance curves for with and without. There is a shift in the 2 peaks.

    Rob
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  7. #37
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
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    Here's Impulse and Step response.

    Rob
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  8. #38
    Senior Member lgvenable's Avatar
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    Aquaplas revisited

    I got samples of what they had, in the post previously mentioned.
    Sorry, but I run a high speed coating line, and there isn't always a lot of time to fart around. I'll spend the time doing this if I can get help from folks who'll make measurements.

    However, one more time I'll try and get the energy to do this. First, this material needs to go into a suitable binder. Folks were using Zinnser 1-2-3 to coat their 12" woofers to get them white correct?

    You cant just cut with water, as that will screw up the binder to filler ratio; and you need to bring the viscosity up after making the dispersion with a suitable viscosity modifier to keep the filler from settling out.

    At any rate, you need to add the Zinnser at the correct ratio to the Aquaplas, and then use hi speed dispersion (..> cowels dissolver at 3000 rpm type B blade). By dispersing the materials you might be able to get a paintable version; using a coarse spray head to apply it, or even careful brushing.

    Personally I vote for spraying, since the idea would be to add as little mass as possible while maintaining the driver specs (kinda like maintaining lightweight wheels on a car you want to go fast --> large heavy wheels make the engine rev slower). Too much applied..> gotta be bad.

    Gordon and others had some interest, and I'm back up building my home theater. If there's enough interest, I'll work with some folks with the right test equipment to complete a successful dispersion. If necessary, I'll order a5 gallon pail, if there's interest from enough folks--> assuming I cant duplicate it. Since I've been at stuff like this for 30 years, it shouldn't be too hard; as I'm sure Blanchard did it for JBL-> you can bet JBL didn't invent the dispersion, they just worked with JBL till they had something that worked.

    (Any interest anyone Gordon? (you'd voiced interest in the last pass )
    Integra DHC80.1,3x 4636LF, 2360-2446J 2404H,12 x 8340 Surrounds, 2 x4645B, BGW 250D's,250E's,& 750B's 16 amps...7600 watts

  9. #39
    Senior Member macaroonie's Avatar
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    Since I started this alls I can do is encourage you to pursue the 'truth'. If you are in the game and have the knowledge it is your duty to share

  10. #40
    Senior Member lgvenable's Avatar
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    aquaplas revisited

    making a aquaplas that woks will depend on some folks making measurements after we determine the applied dry weight. I suspect that there is both a target add-on weight and a stiffness target. We also need to enlist some other folks to make sure the electrical characteristics don't go to hell in a handbasket on application of a aquaplas variant. I'm tempted just to purchase 5 gallons, and then start farming out small samples so we can test it, then sell it at a reasonable amount to re-coop my cost for buying and shipping it.

    Discus96 could help by sending me the pieces of the cone with the busted aquaplas to determine a coating weight.
    Last edited by lgvenable; 08-06-2007 at 06:13 PM. Reason: add discus96 comment
    Integra DHC80.1,3x 4636LF, 2360-2446J 2404H,12 x 8340 Surrounds, 2 x4645B, BGW 250D's,250E's,& 750B's 16 amps...7600 watts

  11. #41
    Senior Member Guido's Avatar
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    I have a factory coated 275ND dia as well as several 2425 dias. They are the same except the coating.
    I'll weigh them all tonight to find out the weight of the coating.
    I'm afraid that the serial production spread is more than the coating.
    We'll see.

    Does the attached file helps you?
    Antivibe = Aquaplas
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  12. #42
    Senior Member lgvenable's Avatar
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    Guido
    I need to know the area the coating is applied onto, to determine a add-on weight per unit area. I'm sure the coating is applied to the paper in-line, using knife over roll or air knife, such that a conformal coating is applied. I"d be really surprised if it applied after the cone is formed
    Larry
    Integra DHC80.1,3x 4636LF, 2360-2446J 2404H,12 x 8340 Surrounds, 2 x4645B, BGW 250D's,250E's,& 750B's 16 amps...7600 watts

  13. #43
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
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    I"d be really surprised if it applied after the cone is formed
    Hello Larry

    It would be easier to use a precoated paper but that does not look to be how they do it. Have you ever seen a seam in a JBL cone???? Same thing with the Ti/Al/Be diaphrams. I doubt the aquaplas coating could survive the die forming process for the diaphrams.

    Here are a couple of shots of a 129H recone kit. The front is absolutely seamless. More importantly the back clearly shows the Aquaplas on the surrounds. So it had to be added after they were attached to the cone.

    Rob
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  14. #44
    Senior Member lgvenable's Avatar
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    sprayed on

    it would definitively appear to be sprayed on, clearly the cone ribbing would be clearly defined in the aquaplas if it was formed after coating.

    I'm calling Blanchard, and will get some DL-10 (the spackle type) and see if by high speed dispersion and a little Zinsser 1-2-3 we can't make our own version of the DL-30.

    I'm sure they'll deny me the lDL-30 version as they have in the past; but let me first go see what we can do with the free stuff (sample that is).
    Integra DHC80.1,3x 4636LF, 2360-2446J 2404H,12 x 8340 Surrounds, 2 x4645B, BGW 250D's,250E's,& 750B's 16 amps...7600 watts

  15. #45
    Senior Member Hoerninger's Avatar
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    A Google search for Aquaplas guided me to Audiokarma, from there to
    http://www.blachford.ca/products/index2.html
    who pointed from Aquaplas to Antivibe.

    Blachford has a strategic partnership with Stanciewics GmbH, who is only 50 km apart from me.
    http://www.stankiewicz.de/e/index.html

    They do not offer Antivibe but BaryVibro:
    http://www.stankiewicz.de/e/produkte...yvibro192.html

    Would this be an equivalent to Aquaplas?
    I am not so much in chemistry.
    __________
    Peter

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