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Thread: Need help building a 4343/4350 or 4435(newbie-ish)

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    Need help building a 4343/4350 or 4435(newbie-ish)

    Looking to build a set of studio mid-field monitors and have fallen in love with the 4300/4400 series by JBL. (Also I love the Everest/Olympus/K2/paragons as well) Complexity of the horns and systems in the non-4300/4400 series put me in the wheelhouse of the 43/44s, to say that those speakers seem more doable. The 4400s I think are going to be difficult because of the bi-radial horn but I could possibly buy the horns... I am not new to DIY but new to studio monitors and specifically JBL. Kendrick Sound has peaked my interest for years and I finally have the tools and knowledge I believe to embark on a project like this.

    So in my research the two things that are going to be a challenge are obtaining drivers and developing or sourcing a crossover. I was hoping someone would have a matrix that compared JBL pro drivers to Eminence/TAD/BMS drivers as substitutes but I haven't seen that yet Does that exist? I would love to use JBL Pro drivers but not sure A) If they would be discontinued and if there is then a matrix for Old JBL Pro to New? and B) Where to buy them, USSPEAKER and some others have a very limited line for JBL Pro, I am guessing I could go direct but maybe you guys know of better options.

    I am having the same issue with TAD drivers, I have heard them in the Rey Audio monitors and they are beautiful, lush even but I am having a hard time finding a TAD Pro rep...everyone stateside seems to be consumer line only. And did JBL use TAD drivers in their setups at all? Or did I misread that someplace?

    It looks like there is a decent documentation of enclosure and port design but thats the easy part, at least to me. Crossovers...well thats the hard part that I haven't seen a lot of threads or documentation on. Do I just need to keep looking or is there a place where most of them are and I am just not seeing it? Also would it be better to go active/electronic? I feel like I would lose a lot of the tone or magic that these speakers had by doing that but whatever I will do what I have to.

    Lastly, I was also looking at the near-field monitors like the 4310,11,12 and the 4430s for my parents. Is there documentation on them and is driver selection a little easier? And where would I find it? I see a lot of threads on the L100/4310s but I haven't been able to get the level of detail I need at the moment.

  2. #2
    Senior Member quindecima's Avatar
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    You can find all the JBL drivers you need on Ebay and maybe some here. You can search the plans you need here and on the internet. You can search here for Network information for the speakers you choose.

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    Senior Member Ed Zeppeli's Avatar
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    For a monitor like the 4430 you should be able to obtain most of the drivers fairly easily. 2235s are widely available or similar baskets which could be re-coned into 2235s using JBL OEM cone kits which are still available at last check. 2426 or 2425 compression drivers were used all over the place and should also be widely available. I believe replacement diaphragms are also still around. I bought some new about a year and a half ago.

    I think the tricky part may be finding the 2344 horns but I think with patience you should be able to get them.

    Crossover would be duplicated if not found. I'm sure a few members here could do it for you if you cannot. Check out (search) the Quick & Dirty thread for more info.



    Good luck,

    Warren
    DIY Array, 2242 sub, 4408, 4208, Control 8SR, E120 Guitar cab, Control 1, LSR305.

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    Quote Originally Posted by quindecima View Post
    You can find all the JBL drivers you need on Ebay and maybe some here. You can search the plans you need here and on the internet. You can search here for Network information for the speakers you choose.
    So most people just try and find NOS or refurb old drivers?

    Guessing the enclosure and crossover schematics are here as well? I'll dig a little deeper. I saw the technical discussion on the lansing stuff, but nothing about crossovers but I need to search so more I guess.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Zeppeli View Post
    For a monitor like the 4430 you should be able to obtain most of the drivers fairly easily. 2235s are widely available or similar baskets which could be re-coned into 2235s using JBL OEM cone kits which are still available at last check. 2426 or 2425 compression drivers were used all over the place and should also be widely available. I believe replacement diaphragms are also still around. I bought some new about a year and a half ago.

    I think the tricky part may be finding the 2344 horns but I think with patience you should be able to get them.

    Crossover would be duplicated if not found. I'm sure a few members here could do it for you if you cannot. Check out (search) the Quick & Dirty thread for more info.



    Good luck,

    Warren
    Roger that! thanks I am still learning some of the model naming structures...

    I was looking at the horns and they definitely make bi-radial horns just in a smaller size, haven't seen too many of the larger ones but it looks like I need to lock down what specific drivers and model numbers I need and start a search. I had this silly hope that these would still be sold by JBL or that there were pretty similar replacements.

    I'll look for the quick and dirty thread as well,

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    Senior Member Ed Zeppeli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aculous View Post
    I had this silly hope that these would still be sold by JBL or that there were pretty similar replacements.

    I'll look for the quick and dirty thread as well,

    None of these drivers are still available new as far as I know. Remember, most of the models you referred to came out forty years ago. Luckily they're still around on the used market and occasionally JBL supports these products by doing a run of cone kits or diaphragms. Some of the woofers just need re-foaming which is certainly a viable option and much cheaper than a re-cone.

    Narrow down a bit what you want to build and we can point you in the right direction for parts etc...
    DIY Array, 2242 sub, 4408, 4208, Control 8SR, E120 Guitar cab, Control 1, LSR305.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aculous View Post
    Roger that! thanks I am still learning some of the model naming structures...

    I was looking at the horns and they definitely make bi-radial horns just in a smaller size, haven't seen too many of the larger ones but it looks like I need to lock down what specific drivers and model numbers I need and start a search. I had this silly hope that these would still be sold by JBL or that there were pretty similar replacements.

    I'll look for the quick and dirty thread as well,
    Hi there!
    I would go with 4355 instead of the 4350.
    I can lead you to very good 2235h's.
    I have the crossover schematic that you need unless you want to go with the scamy coupled (LOL).
    Also, try to find a 5234A or 5235. (Often on Ebay). You will need to make the cards or change the components of an existing cards for the 4355. Easy to make!
    Have fun!
    C

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Zeppeli View Post
    None of these drivers are still available new as far as I know. Remember, most of the models you referred to came out forty years ago. Luckily they're still around on the used market and occasionally JBL supports these products by doing a run of cone kits or diaphragms. Some of the woofers just need re-foaming which is certainly a viable option and much cheaper than a re-cone.

    Narrow down a bit what you want to build and we can point you in the right direction for parts etc...
    Absolutely fair,

    I believe the JBL 4312B would be a good start, then I can move to mid-field or larger monitor. All advice appreciated! I apologize if this is painful. I will be doing much more research as I plod along.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Challenger604 View Post
    Hi there!
    I would go with 4355 instead of the 4350.
    I can lead you to very good 2235h's.
    I have the crossover schematic that you need unless you want to go with the scamy coupled (LOL).
    Also, try to find a 5234A or 5235. (Often on Ebay). You will need to make the cards or change the components of an existing cards for the 4355. Easy to make!
    Have fun!
    C
    I am guessing the 55 has a little bit better sound? And I would love to see the crossover schematic if you have it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aculous View Post
    I am guessing the 55 has a little bit better sound? And I would love to see the crossover schematic if you have it.
    Huge better sound! Due to better components!
    C

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    Senior Member Odd's Avatar
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    JBL's large monitors 43xx is old and it is possible with new technology to make them better.

    Especially when it comes to crossover there is a potential for audible improvement.

    When built copies today should these innovations come into use.

    Charge Coupled crossover provides a clear improvement.

    Newer electronic crossover is far better than the old JBL.

    There is a lot of info about this on the forum.
    43XX (2235-2123-2450-2405-CC 3155)5235-4412-4406-4401-L250-18Ti-L40-S109 Aquarius lV-C38 (030) 305P MkII

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    Quote Originally Posted by Odd View Post
    JBL's large monitors 43xx is old and it is possible with new technology to make them better.

    Especially when it comes to crossover there is a potential for audible improvement.

    When built copies today should these innovations come into use.

    Charge Coupled crossover provides a clear improvement.

    Newer electronic crossover is far better than the old JBL.

    There is a lot of info about this on the forum.
    No doubt, I think what I may do is just focus on the components and the enclosure and run a active crossover. I believe it will be easier in the long run. I have yet to find a solution other then MiniDSP where I can run FIR filters or something like that though. But a simple active crossover should work just as well. Also I have a nice tool that allows me to calibrate a electronic crossover, by frequency, even if it only has knobs and a 3--5--12 type of marking on it. (wish they would just include digital readouts)

    I try and stay away from Behringer because of the output stage and MiniDSP because of noise and gain issues.

    But it looks like I will just have to do a lot more research, I was kinda hoping I could get a little help with that, maybe a well-known thread on the 4312b or a L100/L300 post. No free lunch though, I'll do some digging.

  13. #13
    Senior Member Odd's Avatar
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    Member "pos" might help with FIR filters.
    rePhase
    43XX (2235-2123-2450-2405-CC 3155)5235-4412-4406-4401-L250-18Ti-L40-S109 Aquarius lV-C38 (030) 305P MkII

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    Quote Originally Posted by Odd View Post
    Member "pos" might help with FIR filters.
    rePhase
    I stumbled on rePhase when I was looking at a article on prosoundweb that detailed the issues with MiniDSP units and the ultimate move to a symetrix zone 760 for crossover duties.

    I am still looking for a better implementation for rePhase without MiniDSP, maybe najda but thats a good chunk of change. My hope is that I can make something would with a mini-itx based pc solution with windows CE or something. I would love to do a rasberryPi setup but don't really have any experience with it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aculous View Post
    Absolutely fair,

    I believe the JBL 4312B would be a good start, then I can move to mid-field or larger monitor. All advice appreciated! I apologize if this is painful. I will be doing much more research as I plod along.
    I see below (and above after a re-read), from L100 to L300s? That's a LOT of ground in between?!

    BIG shift from what this thread's subject, model(s) wise was, in general terms, to the 4312B as a prime candidate for consideration (I realize you're at the formulation/thinking out loud part of it, as well as the "for the parents" part of it) Still........

    Unless you already have the raw material lying around, or just want a smaller scale project to do as a rehearsal, it would probably be a heck of a lot cheaper just to buy a nice condition pair of 4312Bs than to build them from scratch

    Especially if you are going to have to buy all of your drivers loose

    DIY versions of the large format monitors is an excellent way to go, assuming you are able, especially when considering costs versus excellent originals (and scarcity of nice examples if any examples of some models at all), but as for any of the small format L100 derivatives/evolutions (L112, 4312B etc) I think you'd be better off just buying a pair

    There are some who have built the smaller models from scratch but primarily to address the "too small a box" issues that plague more than a few of the consumer versions, in other words, they ain't stock boxes (I'm thinking about your search for plans) and they seldom wind up with stock networks either

    If objective is, as mentioned, a rehearsal type project then disregard my comments

    Best of luck
    Thomas

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