HT Pre opinions

[MJC]

If the Denon PMA... is a digital surround receiver or even a surround processor, I agree with Shane. The good ones and the moderately inexpensive units ~$1000 all sound about the same. Even if they offer a phono stage card as an option or it's included, these contemporary digital front ends are fine for movies, but they can't compete with even the fairly mediocre low end separates and mid-fi receivers of the past.

I really doubt your investment of $1200 would make much of a difference. It might have a lower noise floor and easier to use interface, but I would be shocked if it sounded any better than what you already have.


Widget

From what I've read the PMA is all analog, the specs show no DACs. My current Denon stereo receiver, in price comparision only, was $299, if I remember right.
http://usa.denon.com/ProductDetails/553.asp

[hjames]

So - should assume that high-tech Harmon Kardon AVR 7300 isn't considered real high fidelity? I think MSR is around $2400 ...

Sounds like it has all kinds of presets that auto-switch modes as you change sources - 'course I doubt it has a vinyl input ... sigh ...

Its default is 7.1 but from the manual it appears you can run it 5.1 - which is all I usually do for DVD and TV use. My current system auto-selects 2 channel mode for CD and vinyl.

Anyone have any hands on experience with that?
Anyone here own one?

[jim campbell]

back in the vhs days i used to play movies thru my l300's in stereo full range and i still have not heard an h/t setup that dynamic until mega dollars are invested.i wonder about the wisdom of 5 or 7 ok speakers as opposed to 2 really good ones.the same argument could apply to the electronica as well

[MJC]

back in the vhs days i used to play movies thru my l300's in stereo full range and i still have not heard an h/t setup that dynamic until mega dollars are invested.i wonder about the wisdom of 5 or 7 ok speakers as opposed to 2 really good ones.the same argument could apply to the electronica as well

All parts being equal, of coarse you have to spend a large amount.
Two speakers @ $X to seven speakers @ $7X. If you're going from two speakers @ $X to seven speakers @ $3X or less, you get what you pay for.
Case in point. In '79 the L212 system for $2000 / list for two channels.
At this point in time the PT800s are $1700/ea, list = 7 PT800 better than 2 L212s. If you're only spending $1500 for 7 speakers the 2 channel L212 is better.
As much as I like vinyl, listening to DVD-A or SACD thru 5 identical, quality speakers is something else.
And you still have to spend a fair amount of cash to get good quality Stereo.
As far as the AVR 7300, its still an AVR not an analog amp.

[Mr. Widget]

So - should assume that high-tech Harmon Kardon AVR 7300 isn't considered real high fidelity?

I wouldn't consider it high fidelity... but must admit, I have never heard one... I have heard quite a few multi-thousand dollar AVRs... they tend to have more useless bells and whistles and larger bad amp sections than their less expensive counterparts. I would go with a less expensive AVR and use the pre-outs to feed decent amps.


Widget

[Mr. Widget]

From what I've read the PMA is all analog...

I'd think better sounding electronics were likely available in the used market, but this Denon may be a good performer. My impression of the Denon gear I've auditioned is that it is well built and designed using solid thinking, but they aren't typically sonic standouts.


Widget

[MJC]

I wouldn't consider it high fidelity... but must admit, I have never heard one... I have heard quite a few multi-thousand dollar AVRs... they tend to have more useless bells and whistles and larger bad amp sections than their less expensive counterparts. I would go with a less expensive AVR and use the pre-outs to feed decent amps.
Widget

That's what I'm doing in my HT. But the other side of the coin is, how good is the pre-amp, compared to a real pre/pro. I keep asking myself, how much better would my HT be if I were to use a Lexicon pre/pro instead of my H/K AVR 635? At a jump of multiple $$$.
With my stereo setup it sounds fairly good, but not a lot of depth in the soundstage. Thus the thought of getting a better amp.

[Shane Shuster]

That's what I'm doing in my HT. But the other side of the coin is, how good is the pre-amp, compared to a real pre/pro. I keep asking myself, how much better would my HT be if I were to use a Lexicon pre/pro instead of my H/K AVR 635? At a jump of multiple $$$.
With my stereo setup it sounds fairly good, but not a lot of depth in the soundstage. Thus the thought of getting a better amp.

I run a receiver to separate amps. I also asked that question and came to the conclusion that most of the preamp processors sound the same as a receiver. They really shouldn't, but they do. I've never tried the over $10,000 ones, maybe they are different.

With how fast technology moves it seems they would be missing decoding formats in a few years time anyway. Most are upgradeable, but thats a
trip to the factory and a couple more grand to update the cards. It might be easier to just buy a mid-range receiver every few years.

[MJC]

I'd think better sounding electronics were likely available in the used market, but this Denon may be a good performer. My impression of the Denon gear I've auditioned is that it is well built and designed using solid thinking, but they aren't typically sonic standouts.


Widget

Ya, come to think of it, a used McIntosh intergrated amp should work well with my CC L212s.

[Mr. Widget]

I was thinking more along the lines of Audio Research, Conrad Johnson, Threshold etc., but a Mac integrated may not be a bad choice... though they tend to remain pricey and you would have to get the right one... I have heard some real stinkers from them.


Widget

[MJC]

I haven't listened to McIntosh or Mark Levinson amps since I moved up here, from LV, 21 years ago. There was a shop down there, The Upper Ear, that sold both. I read a year or two ago they closed up, they didn't want to get into multi-channel and lost their customer base.
I don't think I've ever heard Conrad Johnson, or Threshold.

[loach71]

Try to snag a used Sony TAE 9000ES home theater control center. It is only a 5.1 device, (good enough for me) but the sonic quality is quite good. They are available for about $250 - $300 on EbaY. Sony still provides service on this model too.

[Mr. Widget]

I don't think I've ever heard Conrad Johnson, or Threshold.

Threshold has been out of business for quite a few years now, but they made some very good gear and it was seriously over-built so most of it should still be up to spec. Conrad Johnson is still with us... they have and do make some wonderful gear, especially their tube stuff. Gear from GAS and Sumo are also quite good, and there is just a ton of other amazingly great '80s vintage high quality two-channel gear that is regularly available for very little cash... most of it is dumped because of the lack of a remote. Remotes are damned convenient, but most gear that sports one sounds pretty mediocre.

It is only a 5.1 device, but the sonic quality is quite good.

TiDome disagrees with me, but I think that 7.1 was created more to sell new gear than to solve any real sonic issues. I run 5.1 in both of my surround systems and they are both quite capable of total aural immersion.


Widget

[Titanium Dome]

7.1 will set you free.

[hjames]

7.1 will set you free.

7.1 will save the AV dealers of America ...