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Thread: JBL M552 or BRYSTON B10 sub?

  1. #1
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    JBL M552 or BRYSTON B10 sub?

    I use a M552 for my 4350. Iwant buy a Bryston B10 sub.
    Do you have same experiece?
    Bryston B10 is really better than JBL M552? It cost really very much and first to buy I want an opinion from the expert
    Thanks

    Paky33

  2. #2
    Senior Member glen's Avatar
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    Bryston 10B

    I'm no expert, but for what it's worth, the handful of recording studios I've visited were all using Bryston crossovers, and the guys who purchased them probably were experts.
    They seem to be the workhorse choice for recording studio crossovers that JBL once was.
    glen

    "Make it sound like dinosaurs eating cars"
    - Nick Lowe, while producing Elvis Costello

  3. #3
    RIP 2010 scott fitlin's Avatar
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    I had the Bryston 10B crossovers, and they are very clean, and very well made. But, I find Bryston a bright sound.

    The 10B sub will work flawlessly, but there is one minor thing I dont like about them. On the LF ouput there is NO ouput level attenuator, and this means you have to use the amps input level control to adjust for level.
    scottyj

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    Senior Señor boputnam's Avatar
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    I've tried the following:

    JBL 5234A
    JBL M552
    Ashly XR1001

    In that order, each has been an improvement over the former.

    A custom Bryston is shipping, as we speak. I will post my impressions if favorable, or you will see it on eBay...
    bo

    "Indeed, not!!"

  5. #5
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    I have bought the Bryston.
    It is fantastic!
    The sound is very improved in comparison to the JBL M552.
    I am really satisfied of the purchase apart the cost. It in Italy it costs € 3.300!

    Pasquale Lenza

  6. #6
    Senior Señor boputnam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paky33
    I have bought the Bryston.
    It is fantastic!
    The sound is very improved in comparison to the JBL M552.
    I am really satisfied of the purchase apart the cost. It in Italy it costs € 3.300!

    Pasquale Lenza
    Yea, Pasquale, I think your post sums it up. Bryston beats others, hands-down. And, that quality is costly...
    bo

    "Indeed, not!!"

  7. #7
    pumache
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    Bi amp on a JBL 4333 B and JBL M552

    Hello
    I want to test a Bi amp configuration using the passive filter of my JBL 4333 B pair and an active filter such as the JBL M552. The 4333 B is already ready with 2 pairs of cable connections in the back and the rotactor to switch betwen mono or Bi amp.
    The hi/med amplifier will be a Mc intosh MC 7300 and the bass will be through a Harman Kardon Citation 16 B
    Have you tested the JBL M552 and do you think I will have a better result than using my louspeakers with only one amp in mono ampp configuration ?
    Thanks for help
    Eric (Paris France)

  8. #8
    Senior Señor boputnam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pumache View Post
    Have you tested the JBL M552 and do you think I will have a better result than using my louspeakers with only one amp in mono amp configuration ?
    Biamp is always the preferred method. It gives better control on the woofer (removes that big inductor from the signal path). The 552 is a good active crossover.

  9. #9
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boputnam View Post
    Biamp is always the preferred method.
    Yes, but there are trade offs... if you have a really top drawer front end and quality amps, adding a crappy electronic crossover will really ruin the sound. If you have average electronics, then there is little sonic damage one of these lesser units will do and you will gain the benefits of biamping even with a PA grade device since the hard glare and thin transistory sound will be masked by the same sort of sound already present.

    Not to beat this to death, but if you have, say a vintage Mark Levinson or other high quality preamp and amp and you pop a Rane, Ashly, JBL, etc. PA crossover in the system, the noise and harsh veiled sound will be quite a disappointment.


    Widget

  10. #10
    Senior Member Ian Mackenzie's Avatar
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    Hi Eric,

    I dont thave time to look at the biamp require for the 4333 right now but perhaps more important priority than anything else is getting the biamp crossover point right.

    More often than not people assume its all just plug and play and by luck get it working or get a less then positive outcome attempting to biamp.

    JBL usually provide some data on this ....12 db slope (butterworth) will provide the closest approximation to the JBL filter card used 52-5123.

    The M series JBL crossovers are all LR 24 db slopes as I recall. I dont know what the Bryston stock settings are.

    The crossover point is 800 hertz and way JBL setup the horn in those systems is relatively critical to obtaining a smooth transition at the crossover point. That will make or break this design in terms of the way its sounds.

    Previously we have had people come along looking for the world trying to biamp with some of these old vintage systems only to get themselves into one hell of a mess.

    Anyway, I would first carefully try the JBL crossover and test if you have measurement capability. The Bryston is a huge step to take before sorting this out.

    All things considered the Marchland crossovers would be a better fit for the purpose in your situation. You can order the crossover parameters and they make a good product. The M7300 is massive amp by the way, you will only need a few watts!

    Whatever ....biamping is a lot more wires and complexity.

    The other thing you could do is look at re building the passive crossover using the JBL Charge-coupling topology. That would certainly give your 4333b a new lease of life.

    Good luck.

    Ian

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget View Post
    ...since the hard glare and thin transistory sound will be masked by the same sort of sound already present.
    Tell us how you really feel...

    John

  12. #12
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnaec View Post
    Tell us how you really feel...
    That was the polite way of saying, "If you really care about how this stuff sounds you don't want some half-assed piece of crap F'ing up your system."


    Widget

    BTW: Ian makes a good point... in general you will likely screw up the sound with any active crossover if you don't approach with a great deal of caution and care.

  13. #13
    Senior Member Ian Mackenzie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget View Post
    That was the polite way of saying, "If you really care about how this stuff sounds you don't want some half-assed piece of crap F'ing up your system."


    Widget

    BTW: Ian makes a good point... in general you will likely screw up the sound with any active crossover if you don't approach with a great deal of caution and care.
    Ageed.

    For a long time people were sceptical about the impact of electronic (active crossovers), terms like veiling and sibilance were the words of audio buffs.

    But if you are fortunate enough to have a grand prized bit of gear you will sound like the Pope preaching to the hoards for they will not understand.

    As they say what you don't know you won't miss and that seems to be the way in this business.

    "About 2 years ago I asked porchedpm to take out the Ashly active crossover and just passively crossover the loudspeakers to his Pass Labs X250 power / X1 pre amp because I felt there was potential for subjective impovement.

    It took bit of convincing for porchedpm to try this but after he removed the active crossover he was glued to his system till the wee hours and sent a glowing email...to the effect that his system came alive and it sounded lik real music with only some loss in bass firmess in passive mode. Then I arranged a Pass Labs diy active crossover and he has the best of both worlds."


    I dont think there is any secret that mixing real quality and with plain crap and you end up with vanilla but the point about getting the crossover point right cannot be understated!

    Frankly day the I can build or find a loudspeaker I like that does not require the extra amps and filters will be a blessing.

    Edit. About the only people biamping at the recent CES were Pass labs ....demonstrating their new loudspeaker.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Ducatista47's Avatar
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    What Ian said! I couldn't agree more.

    "But if you are fortunate enough to have a grand prized bit of gear you will sound like the Pope preaching to the hoards for they will not understand."

    I know this one personally. If you have some great gear and sources, don't dare mention how much better it sounds or you will be accused of being an audiophile instead of a music lover. And being full of crap.

    The thing that makes it possible for me, and most so called audiophiles, is luckily preferring not to listen at really high SPL's. That is, for instance, why "single driver" type speakers and the lower power electronics they can use are a quest that may yield results for me. Small amps with really good sound and speakers with almost no crossover and a (nearly) point source. Low damping factors and smaller currents and wire for a smooth, natural and relaxed yet detailed sound.

    By audiophiles I am not talking about fools with power conditioners and $2000 interconnects. Few of those have ever enjoyed being blown out of the room by two clean watts and having to turn it down. It makes a believer out of a guy.

    I have not yet heard or heard of gear that can do that at high SPL's. Single driver type cones have a low xmax and cannot produce a ton of sound. Large SET's are neither fish nor foul and lose the advantages of their smaller brethren. You lose a trainload of cash, turn your listening room into a sauna and don't get what you were after.

    So once you decide you need to turn it up, your possible solutions become fewer and less satisfying. One approach that might work is an all horn system. Ask Steve Schell. And maybe Nelson Pass has the high powered amp thing solved, I don't know from personal experience.

    In a way we are all on the right track, because efficient speakers manufactured to high standards are a necessary ingredient to any really successful solution. Jim Lansing did us all a huge favor. With a tip of the hat to Western Electric, of course.

    Sorry if I drifted off topic, but this resonates with me: (Ian again): "Frankly (the) day I can build or find a loudspeaker I like that does not require the extra amps and filters will be a blessing."

    Want to cheat? Forget loudspeakers and look into Stax Omega II headphones. Not very social though!


    Clark
    Information is not Knowledge; Knowledge is not Wisdom
    Too many audiophiles listen with their eyes instead of their ears


  15. #15
    Senior Señor boputnam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget View Post
    ... in general you will likely screw up the sound with any active crossover if you don't approach with a great deal of caution and care.
    'zactly.

    My hope (expectation) was, Eric would approach this via JBL recommended crossover points and slopes (as per my pm's to him), and he would solicit specific experience, here (as per my pm's to him).

    Having said that, in-spite of all the posts to the contrary, I think even if using active crossovers of modest cost, proper implementation with careful EQ results in superior sound to the passive route. JMO (and personal experience)...

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