JBL S1S-EX/2242HPL the "most frightening" subs out there???
Hi guys. I need your advice.
My situation: I currently have a pair of K2-9800SE (which I love) - for stereo purposes only. I use a Klipsch THX2 Ultra 7.1 System in my HT ATM. I would like to sell the Klipsch, buy a SK2-1000 Center and build up a full 7.1 Synthesis system.
My question is regarding the S1S-EX subwoofers. I would run them with matching JBL S800 monoblocks.
What do I want: The meanest, most powerful, spectacular, deepest and all around frightening bass money can buy - I think you get the point. Restrictions: I don't want to build it myself (if thats what some of you DIY guys where going to suggest), Initially I'm going to use at least 2, further down the road 4 subs, I'm not on a strict budget BUT I want the most bang for the buck - and I mean BANG!
So on to my question: How does a S1S-EX/S800 combo compare to "alternatives" like SVS Ultra/2, Velodyne DD18/DD1812, Klipsch THX Ultra2 KW120, ... ??? I like my Klipsch but want MORE. I have heard DD18 but they are too "gentle" for my liking. I want something "violent, brute". Super high potential SPL, low distortions. But it should be able to dig really deep (usable 16Hz-18Hz output) at the same time.
Where to look for something like that? Are there any subs out there that are comparable/competitive considering what I want bass to sound - "fierceful" ? Thanks in advance for your opinions.
Big Bass while you wait for Array
Welcome to the LHS. I will suggest a sub for you until those JBL's are available for you to purchase. This sub will definately fill the tall order you specified: http://www.servodrive.com/contrabass.html . Some time back, I watched a video clip of an experiment being performed by a university on the effects of different types of noises on the average city dwelling. They used a row of these subs (modified I believe for this test) lined up outside a house and then played various recorded sounds at various db levels. They used a DAT recorder for their source and stated that some of the sounds contained content as low as five hertz (5hz). They simulated the effect of a jet airplane flying directly overhead. My jaw dropped as these mighty subs were able to violently shake the outer walls of the house, I mean violently, like an earthquake!. I want to add that I would stay with JBL's new stuff when it becomes available, after all, this is the Lansing Heritage Site and I love JBL, sounds like you do too, so you know what I mean. We'd love to see some pictures of your current set up if possible. Good luck with your sub search, Steve G.
...and now back to subwoofers...
I use JBL Sub1500s which are no longer available but have been replaced with the very similar Array 1500s. I find their ability to produce extremely deep and still musical bass outstanding. I own an older HGS Velodyne and find it too artificial sounding... it does pound the house, but I am not crazy about it's sound character.
As far as the S1S subs, I recently built 4 dual versions of them and found them to be much more powerful than the Sub1500 but not quite as deep sounding... they are also huge! They will certainly pressurize the room and damage the foundation given enough power... they are actually quite efficient, but they handle gobs of power and if they are given it, they will scare you... that said I would prefer to use more Sub1500s or Array 1500s in a domestic space... I personally prefer their sound. It is very deep, clean, and surprisingly articulate. They will do sub 20Hz quite well, but you will need a few of them if you are after crazy SPLs.
I am not sure if you were seriously considering the Velodyne 1812... if so than the cost of 4 or 8 Array 1500s shouldn't be a problem... another nice thing about the Array 1500s is that they are self powered so you won't need to get extra amplification.
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Digital cameras in CA....
Here's yer JBL max intimidation sub, and we (the forum) know(s) where there's a pair of 'em available, upon receipt of a substantial donation hereto:
http://www.jblpro.com/pub/obsolete/4688.pdf
[Ain't gonna be cheap to ship to Austria, tho.... :p ]
JBL S1S-EX/2242HPL the "most frightening" subs out there???
Ok, back to the original post and this time I will elaborate because people simply don't get my subtle cues.
What do I want: The meanest, most powerful, spectacular, deepest and all around frightening bass money can buy - I think you get the point. Restrictions: I don't want to build it myself (if thats what some of you DIY guys where going to suggest), Initially I'm going to use at least 2, further down the road 4 subs, I'm not on a strict budget BUT I want the most bang for the buck - and I mean BANG!
I want something "violent, brute". Super high potential SPL, low distortions. But it should be able to dig really deep (usable 16Hz-18Hz output) at the same time.
Ok, like I posted originally - the 4645C with 6 dB bump at 25 Hz. That will get you maximum SPL with extension to 20 Hz. Extremely loud. Now I actually read every word of your post and answered to the point. I also posted that for true violence I would double the amplifier power.
Your reply:
Please allow me to repeat what I'm looking for - pretty much a turnkey solution. No DIY or dealing with non-consumer professional stuff.
Ok, so 4645C is out. My second post was with respect to the S1S. Once again, It would not be prudent for me to elaborate on why the 4645C is THE correct stock 2242H platform. Mr. Widget now knows and I'm sure he will suggest the 4645C over the S1S in all future subwoofer discussions, especially after having touted his builds for Scott.
Does any consumer subwoofer come to your mind (whatever brand) that would be a good match for my system needs?
To which I replied the 1500 Array. Again, a very specific reason why I didn't suggest the S1S.
Thank you for your thoughts, Widget.
I looked into 1500's but they are not quite appealing to me. Imagening those subs standing beside my K2's I would feel sorry for them. I want something with bragging rights included, something big, something fierce.
The 1500 Array is quite capable of standing along side a K2 and filling in the VLF.
The 1500 is a good match for the rest of the new Array lineup, but the K2 is a different league altogether IMHO.
I disagree, and not lightly.
You are aware that the K2's go down to 45Hz (linear)... So even for a pure stereo application I would recommend a subwoofer...
I think usable response of the K2 is lower but I'll have to drag out the engineering specs tonight. The target market seems to feel the K2 is fine for pure stereo without a sub.
*****
Frequency Response (-6 dB): 50 Hz to 50 kHz (Anechoic)
f3 (-3 dB): 60 Hz
Usable response to 35 Hz.
Wow! Speaking of going OT...
Personally, as opposed to moderatorily (not a real word for the international set), I think that this subject has been beaten to death as have Todd's earnest suggestions. I agree with Rob that the intent of this thread wasn't a cool DIY project, but I think we can be a bit nicer to our fellow members who are eager to share.
I am really impressed with Giskard's post #48. I think it really explains why he gets so frustrated with so many of us... instead of just lashing out with the punch line he gave us the back story... and I can see his point(s), but really we are here to enjoy ourselves and we need to keep that in perspective. I think debate and disagreement are fine, but I don't think we should say, "geez your dumb go away..."
The fact is, I don't know a damn thing about the sound of the W15GTI and based on what I've read on the forum I doubt I'll try one, but with careful reading of technical information posted by Giskard and others and mixing in some subjective comments from forum members, we can use our own personal filters and make these decisions for ourselves. I think most people understand that if they hear a rave review or see an RTA plot of this or that, their own "mileage may very" as one poster has said... I tend to learn by trying things out for myself and by frequently screwing up, and I imagine most of you do to. For some of us getting any sound at all out of our systems is pleasure enough and for freaks like myself, anything short of the very best I've ever heard is a disappointment. We all know where we stand along this continuum and we can make these decisions for ourselves.
My hope is that through discourse we can possibly better understand where we are all coming from and reduce some of the tension that has been lurking here... we all come here with differing levels of knowledge, ability, and interest... we also have different goals. For this thread we had a new individual that was specifically asking about the JBL S1S-EX and also what off the shelf sub would best work with his system... a seemingly simple enough question. We got off on the wrong foot when Giskard took offense to Steve G's posting about a non-JBL sub... in light of Giskard's last post I can see his point, however his hostile posts were really out of line... we need to give each other more of a benefit of the doubt, we can violently disagree, but when it gets personal the strength of the argument goes to hell and we get all mixed up in drama and countless pointless posts.
With this much confusion about a simple question like this, it's no wonder we try not to talk about politics here.:D
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Servo Drive ContraBass vs S1S-EX
I have used both of the subs previously mentioned. The Servo Drive ContraBass subs were installed into a Keith Yates Designed room in Reno, NV that I provided equipment for including a Runco 5000D, Genelec 1034B across the front, Triad in the sides and rear, etc. This room is PM3 certified and the Contras are powered by Crown K2 amps on each sub. They are a very powerful sub and cost 10000.00 per pair.
The S1S-EX subs were part of a Synthesis One system that was designed and installed in Nashville for a customer. Those are powered by S800 in bridged mode providing 800W to each sub at a cost of 5800.00 per pair.
The S1S-EX provides a very powerful low extension for the money, with the proper power it should do the trick for the K2SE pair that needs the additional low extension. The SEs were designed/tuned for Asia so I understand the need for more bass in certain situations/rooms. I get a kick out of switching them to BI-Amp mode and using external Xovers. I get MUCH more reponse from them and they go like a madman. The S1S should do the trick for you.
On the Contra and EX subs, Let me know if you need a place to get either one or if you have trouble finding a dealer in your area that can help out.
Attached is a picture of the room in Reno. Its a "drooler" and the finished room sounded simply spectacular. It should though...the room design alone cost upwards of 60K-80K.
Check out the K2s on Audiogon. I was the providing dealer for those speakers so if anyone picks them up from Dan, I can get them serviced if needed and provde the buyer the remainder of the Synthesis system if required.
Thanks! Feel free to email me anytime!
Rob Patton
Sonic Advantage
Orange Park Florida
[email protected]
All that and I forgot a link
http://www.definitivetech.com/loudsp...s.html#trinity
I think all of Definitive Technology's upper end products are very fine looking as well.
Resurrection of a dead thread.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ian Mackenzie
All I can add is there is no Turnkey solution when it comes to loudspeakers and particularly subwoofers.
The problem is integration with the room and the main speakers. And even then I refuse to accept a sub that sounds really impressive is in fact for real. Maybe for HT but if that is the case you may need to look elsewhere.
My suggestion is just go buy one and try it out like the rest of us.
The only way to learn this stuff is to grow with it and that take time.
Nobody gets to dead right first time.
I'm looking at some "cheap" S1S-EX subs and have reviewed the relevant posts on this site. Ian's reply should have been first rather than near the end. Straight to the point IYAM.
To me, "turnkey" would be having enough money to pay someone to buy whatever was needed to make my room sound right, then I walk into a completed solution. Of course, that's not happening in my current reality, so it's trial, tweak, and error, trial, tweak, and error.
Always fun to romp through past threads and see everyone up to form. ;)
