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RickL166
10-17-2003, 05:25 AM
Pick-up in California, JBL cabinets.
Thought I pass it along.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3053678634&category=14993

boputnam
10-17-2003, 06:29 AM
I bought some drivers from that guy! Man, I contributed to this lunacy! I woulda preferred intact cabinets. How likely is it these end their career as kindling...

"Like a knife..."

bookasan
10-17-2003, 04:42 PM
I knew it was just a matter of time before I saw a post here about my auction.
Although, it happened faster than I thought.
Let me explain something to those of you who feel the way you do about parting units out.

First of all, The only time I part them out is when some idiot spray paints cabinets white, drills holes in them or when some of the components need to be replaced.
Look at my auctions for the S-109's that I sold complete, or the Spica TC-50's, Both of which were in very good condition.
On the S-109's I know I could have made more $$$ by parting it out.

Second of all, When you JBL collectors need to replace a tweeter or you DIYers want 10 pairs of 077 tweeters for your new project, where do you buy them?
Where do you think they came from to begin with??
I think a lot of you thinking it's a crime to part these units out don't seem to mind buying the components off Ebay that were obviousily parted out,
as shown by the post of the guy who bought the tweeters from me. Everyone who bought the components from me gave me possitive feedback and seemed very pleased to buy them from me. I said right in my auctions that they were pulled from working speakers.
How many of you would buy a complete pair of L65's for $1,200 because your cat swallowed one of the JBL Emblems?
That's what I thought.
I think any of you preaching it is a sin to part the units out and then turning around and buying the parts off Ebay are the ones you should be posting the comments about.

boputnam
10-17-2003, 05:40 PM
Originally posted by bookasan
How many of you would buy a complete pair of L65's for $1,200 because your cat swallowed one of the JBL Emblems?
:wave:

Otherwise, it's not "what you think". We've gone around on this issue quite a lot. We're not ignorant of the points you raise. That is just a bunch of cabinets and at the distance of the photo don't appear to have been of the abused type. But, things are rarely what they appear... ;)

Audiobeer
10-17-2003, 11:04 PM
Easy Bookasan, Probably very few here haven't done what you have. We are just sentimental about these old boxes. Nobody is judging you. I remember the last time the furnace went out in my house. I had no firewood and the Paragon without drivers was in my way all the time anyway. Walnut veneer burns hot and I have never looked back!

bookasan
10-17-2003, 11:14 PM
Sorry if I came across a bit deffensive.
I do respect the concerns many of you have about this issue and am glad to see so many people who love what they love with such passion.
It is a "bunch" of cabinets at one time, because I have collected so many speakers over the last year and decided to let what empty cabinets I have go all at one time. It doesn't compare to the large collection of JBL's I have in mint condition, most of which I refuse to part with.
I have sold many complete pairs of speakers in the past and have many more I am in the process of selling. If they are in good condition, I will sell them complete.
If they are missing components or have damage to the cabinets, making them worthless to the collector, I will part them out so several collectors can find the components they need to repair their speakers.
Also, I really think the people that bid on this auction only have one plan for these cabinets and I don't think it is for firewood.

PSS AUDIO
10-18-2003, 12:36 AM
Originally posted by bookasan
It doesn't compare to the large collection of JBL's I have in mint condition...

Hello,

If you have a pair of 434x in mint condition I am ready to buy it (I will just ask you some help to pack them very properly as they must be shipped in France).

Alex Lancaster
10-18-2003, 07:09 AM
The real enemy is "shipping".

Alex.

4313B
10-18-2003, 07:36 AM
"The real enemy is "shipping"."

Very true.

locanti
10-18-2003, 07:57 AM
You'r right Alex

I stay in France and can't pay the shipping for a the complet speakers from USA or Canada when I just need a pair of LE14A or 2231A.Last time I win a pair of C53 LIBRA on ebay , the seller send me the drivers and I whish he can make money with the enclosure.I just can't pay $380 shipping cost for a $200 auction.

Boputman,RickL166 and others,I do respect you point of view, but remember that a lot of audiofans don't leave nearby JBL or ALTEC factory.Our common passion for these products can't belong only to people that "KNOW".

My personnal experience grew by trying and constructing a lot of audio product,speakers and electronics.I used a lot fo JBL drivers in differents enclosure and still want to do.How can I find parts if ugly or destroyed speakers are not dismantled ?

PSS AUDIO
10-18-2003, 09:01 AM
Originally posted by locanti
I just can't pay $380 shipping cost for a $200 auction.

You can fly directly to the states, pick up the goods, and back in Europe for quite the same price!

Oldmics
10-18-2003, 09:28 AM
Audiobeer,Please tell me that you really did not heat your home with a Paragon?As John Belushi said in Animal House"They took the whole fuc-in bar!!!!!!!! AAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"Oldmics

Audiobeer
10-18-2003, 10:06 AM
No way!

thevott
10-18-2003, 03:54 PM
It does seem a bit sacrilegious to dismantle working systems but from a business perspective it makes absolute sense in many instances. The obvious reason is freight shipping cost. Certain items will yield much more bid activity if shipping costs are within reason. Most, if not all, Ebay purchasers reading this know what I'm saying. Another reason is that custom speaker builders are not necessarily interested in the enclosures anyway, especially some big plywood theatre or utility PA box as is often the case. Personally, I am always happy to to see drivers in the hands of end users worldwide---not just the ones in driving distance. Also, The enclosures are almost always purchased eventually.

thevott

Mr. Widget
10-18-2003, 08:00 PM
Originally posted by bookasan

How many of you would buy a complete pair of L65's for $1,200 because your cat swallowed one of the JBL Emblems?
[/B]

I'd be more concerned about the cat.:D

I have asked eBay sellers to part out a system because the cabinets were water damaged... I'd like to see Audiobeer try to save 3/4" walnut veneered cabinets that have swollen up to over an inch and a half!

As far as this auction is concerned the only true crime is that those Radio Shacks are commingling with the fine stable of JBLs.

Mr. Widget

GordonW
10-18-2003, 09:06 PM
Hey now. I've heard a cleaned-up pair of Realistic Mach 1s just recently... and realistically, there's things they do, better than an L100 of the same era would do... :D Especially in the bass, and the upper highs. With the right period amp, on a set of very short, angled stands, they can be pretty impressive!

Don't knock those, without hearing them set up right... yeah, nobody claims Radio Shack didn't sell SOME junk. But not ALL of it was junk...

Regards,
Gordon.

thevott
10-19-2003, 08:28 AM
Radio Shack has sold lots and lots of junk. They do occasionally sell decent consumer grade items here and there. Remember those great sounding little slot tweeters. Of course they discontinued those!

thevott

BigBusa
10-19-2003, 10:27 AM
I am in favor of parting out Altec speakers VS selling them as a whole. Especially on ebay!

Case in point ...

I bought a relatively ratty pair of Altec Malibu speakers locally for $200. One speaker grill and 414Z woofer directly behind it had been ruined by a cat using it as a scratching post. The ruined woofer was thrown out years ago. :confused:

I parted this pair of malibus out on ebay and made $1400 profit. Remember that price included only 3 of the 414z woofers.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

A couple months later I hear about a pair of identical malibus for sale 500 miles away. I rent a truck, drive 7 hours one way to maryland and purchase an absolutely mint pair of malibus for $600. I assume that because these are no nice that they'll sell for more than the parted out malibus.

WRONG! On the 2nd try they finally sold for $1000 on ebay. :mad: Had I parted them out I would have made $500-$600 more. :banghead:

To those folks against parting out Altecs I say ...wait until you try to sell yours and see how quick your opinion changes. Plus, parting out units ultimately makes the remaining complete speakers worth more.

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/92143/2.jpg

BigBusa
10-19-2003, 10:31 AM
Originally posted by boputnam
I bought some drivers from that guy! Man, I contributed to this lunacy! I woulda preferred intact cabinets. How likely is it these end their career as kindling...

"Like a knife..."


How hypocritical ...It's not ok to part them out but it's ok to buy the parts you need on ebay? :confused:

boputnam
10-19-2003, 11:26 AM
Originally posted by BigBusa
How hypocritical ...It's not ok to part them out but it's ok to buy the parts you need on ebay? :confused: Hey, thanks for the nice note! :wave:

The parts I buy have been put into JBL cabinets to restore to factory and then I sell them to appreciative JBL fans for fair price. Sometimes I don't even recover my full cost.

Different from you I haven't once made a "profit", nor is that in my mind. But I have allowed well restored and "freshened-up" vintage JBL to find appreciative homes - homes where the buyers either couldn't or chose not to do the work themselves.


Originally posted by BigBusa
...absolutely mint pair of malibus for $600. I assume that because these are no nice that they'll sell for more than the parted out malibus. WRONG! On the 2nd try they finally sold for $1000 on ebay. :mad: Had I parted them out I would have made $500-$600 more. :banghead: No, it's not OK to part them out, IMO, particularly when the objective is "profit". JMO.

scott fitlin
10-19-2003, 12:33 PM
Its a sad fact that some vintage JBL cabinets get cannabalised and sold as parts!

Most of these parts wind up with owners of vintage JBL speakers who need the parts!

Sometimes it is a shame when someone buys a vintage JBL speaker just for the purpose of parting them out, it is one less example of the art, thats left! But sometimes one persons greed yeilds another person a part they really need that cant be sourced via normal means; like JBL themselves!

This is done all the time with electronics, automobiles, etc! I have had to find a beat up preamp that was no longer in manufacture, that uses parts no longer made, to use it as a parts can to keep mine going!

Its a fact of life!

Alex Lancaster
10-19-2003, 12:46 PM
I sometimes feel that people buy and sell like in the stock exchange, You know, OJ concentrate, pork bellies, stocks, bonds, JBL parts; You never see or use the stuff, just buy & sell.

That, makes some items more desirable and expensive, specially with the retro fad We are going thru, possibly they sound good, but for the price (Hartsfields, Paragons, etc.), You can get something a lot better.

Whaddayathin?

Oldmics
10-19-2003, 01:32 PM
Quote "That, makes some items more desirable and expensive, specially with the retro fad We are going thru, possibly they sound good, but for the price (Hartsfields, Paragons, etc.), You can get something a lot better.

Whaddayathin?" I think that the first question to ask is "Have you listened to either of the two systems that you are mentioning"?The reason I ask is because even though I have listened to and owned many different speaker systems,both consumer and pro applications.It is my opinion that use of the term "better" is not related to anything except the end listeners or owners opinion.What may sound great to me may not be your cup of tea (so to say).Its all based upon the condition of the sense of hearing.For example if I have a deficiency in my hearing due to old age,high SPL exposure or some disease and this hearing imparement requires me to have a frequency boost at 2K thru 8K for my listening enjoyment you can understand why a system setup with this exagerated hi freq fashion would not be pleasent to people with a normal hearing curve to experience.In my listening perception it would sound superb,however it would surely annoy other listeners.This is also where measurement and analysis tools come into play.First make sure that ones own hearing (the most important measurement tool) is in good shape before commenting on systems.Second all listening critiques without measurement specs are opinions that can be wildly subjective due to room acoustics and about a million other reasons.Its all of matter of listening taste coupled with speaker,amplifier,signal and signal source hardware for a specific application.No one system does it all.You are right about about the fad thing regarding older Paragons and Hartsfields.The Paragons are not my personal favorite for what and the fashion I usually listen to.On the other hand after trying many,many different systems(some many times more expensive) I always come back to the Hartsfields for my listening satisfaction.In my opinion you can get something "different" than a Hartsfield at more money but nothing finer for my money.Best regards and listen to everything,Oldmics

Audiobeer
10-19-2003, 01:59 PM
Originally posted by boputnam
Hey, thanks for the nice note! :wave:

The parts I buy have been put into JBL cabinets to restore to factory and then I sell them to appreciative JBL fans for fair price. Sometimes I don't even recover my full cost.

Different from you I haven't once made a "profit", nor is that in my mind. But I have allowed well restored and "freshened-up" vintage JBL to find appreciative homes - homes where the buyers either couldn't or chose not to do the work themselves.

No, it's not OK to part them out, IMO, particularly when the objective is "profit". JMO.

I buy. fix up amd sell on Ebay all the time. I rarely make a profit if ever. I love the hobby and it keeps Me out of trouble. I have never sold anything to anybody that I feel didn't get a good deal and went out of my way to make sure they came out of it feeling like they benefited from the transaction or else I wouldn't show my lack of avator around here. Buying and selling is the only thing that allows Me to keep trying out the JBL speakers. That's the joy of this hobby to Me is hearing the differences. Too date there are only 2 JBL sets that I have hung on to and won't sell. I have a boat load yet to try! :smthsail:

Audiobeer
10-19-2003, 02:17 PM
Originally posted by Alex Lancaster
I sometimes feel that people buy and sell like in the stock exchange, You know, OJ concentrate, pork bellies, stocks, bonds, JBL parts; You never see or use the stuff, just buy & sell.

That, makes some items more desirable and expensive, specially with the retro fad We are going thru, possibly they sound good, but for the price (Hartsfields, Paragons, etc.), You can get something a lot better.

Whaddayathin?

I think you can find something that will sound more dynamic, have more punch, crisper highs perhaps.....but for day after day listening I don't know if I could find something that is as easy to live with the sound. I had a buddy in High school whose Dad was a musician at night and a piano tuner during the day. Very rarely saw him. He had a Paragon setup that was custom made and cost thousands. It was even highlighted in one of the audio mags. I thought about them 30 years later and even called the guy to see if his Dad would let go of them. He had since passed on and the Son also had inherited the audio bug. There was no way He was going to sell. These folks lived in a house that cost 1/2 of the audio equipment He had in it. HE HAD HIS PRIORITIES set right! The point I guess I'm meant to state was that day in and day out you would never get tired of listening to it!

Alex Lancaster
10-19-2003, 02:30 PM
Oldmics:

You are right, it is subjective, and if You add hearing loss, which of course I have some, well, more so.

I have listened to both, but personally I like the big monitors.

I have also listened to live organ, the most spectacular, Karl Richter playing at the local cathedralīs silberman organ, Bach, and none of the mentioned speakers can get near the low notes.

Alex.

BigBusa
10-19-2003, 03:18 PM
If Altecs sounded decent maybe I wouldn't want to part them out all the time. Damn, those things are all midrange. No bass to speak of and no highs at all.

If I keep unearthing vintage Altec speakers I'm gonna have to buy a woodstove just to get rid of the cabinets after I've stripped them! The city sanitation crew won't even take em.

Alex Lancaster
10-19-2003, 04:21 PM
Now, on my retro rant; Make a 1950's movie house, You have the speakers, I can get You a Westrex projector, You get the popcorn machine.

Alex.

scott fitlin
10-19-2003, 05:30 PM
See those A7,s you have? They were NEVER known for DEEP SUB BASS! They are for Mid bass and midrange! Now, if youve got the right drivers in those cabinets, the lower mids and mid bass they make is incredible! And they throw! Vocal and instrument articulation is incredible! can be very lifelike! Thats what it was designed for!

So, you add a great subwoofer to your system and then you got the best of both worlds, great bass and great full range!

Of course to be truthful with you, those A7,s need a fairly large room to sound the way they should! And you ( IMHO ) might need a bit of HIGH QUALITY 1/3 octave EQing to tame some peaks in the mids! It was Altecs small theatre horn, and is designed for small auditoriums!

Out of curiosity, the woofers in your A7,s, are they ORIGINAL cones or were they reconed in the last couple of years?

Of course if you DONT want those A7,s any more, let me know! I might want to have them! But in their " WHOLE " state, not parted out!!

:cool:

scott fitlin
10-19-2003, 05:34 PM
Those Altec horns! I had those years ago! Went to JBL horns! But we always rolled the horn off at 7K where the tweeters take over! If you have an active crossover you could get two JBL 2405,s, a samll 25wpc amp, and then you would have highs!

Wardsweb
10-19-2003, 05:51 PM
Or you can veneer then in walnut, make some grills and you have furniture. That is if you have the 825 cabinets and run them ala Magnificents (flipped with the horn inside).

BigBusa
10-19-2003, 06:21 PM
I sold those A-7's a while back on ebay. My room is indeed small. 13 x 13.

I've got some Klipschorns coming soon. Those should be my last speaker.

Wardsweb I like those. You did an awesome job on those! Your veneering skills are top notch.

Audiobeer
10-19-2003, 06:36 PM
Absolutely beautiful my Friend!

scott fitlin
10-19-2003, 07:35 PM
Originally posted by BigBusa
I sold those A-7's a while back on ebay. My room is indeed small. 13 x 13.

I've got some Klipschorns coming soon. Those should be my last speaker.

Wardsweb I like those. You did an awesome job on those! Your veneering skills are top notch. 13 x 13 was like having those A7,s operating in your closet with you sitting inside! LOL!

Wardsweb those cabinets look beautiful!

Wardsweb
10-19-2003, 08:05 PM
Thanks for the compliments guys. I really love these speakers. Here is a small pic of the business end of these:

scott fitlin
10-19-2003, 08:50 PM
Those cabs really do look sweet! I like em with the grills off, personally! They look great!