we2090 compatible with altec 288?

[pde2000]

my grandad's old 2090 has a damaged voicecoil and has proved dificult to repair (aluminium wont solder). can i buy a cheap 288 replacement coil from the states as these seem to be identical. im new to this forum, but have been playing with my grandad's old stuff for years. he used to work for westrex as an engineer and has left me some 2080s a 2090 a gaumont copy (rubbish) a bth and a couple of fixed magnet 555 types, but no horns. just bought an 8 cell off ebay for £100 + £17 so im keen to have a set up.

[caladois]

Well you can off course change the diaph for altec 288. Originally they were 24 ohms. 2090a are very similar to the 288 drivers (except for some details (like "metric screw", phasis and rear part). The magnet seems to be a bit stronger too.
2090b is a different geometry of driver, but with the same driver.
I notice that you own some drivers fitting 555 diaphragrms : are they 30150 units?
If yes, I am very interesting . I owned one a few time ago, but the diaphragm was gone, so...
Do you have any data sheet concerning these WE english speakers :
30150 (horn friver)

30928 (12 inches) I have 4 of these...

Tell me if you are looking for something special.
Best regards from FRANCE

Stephane

[sa660]

PDE2000,

Many cinemas were using altec recone kit 20221 to repair the WE2090A/B.
You should be ablte to buy them from a repair shop or you can buy the equivalent from radian.

Regards,

[pde2000]

thanks for the info. yes one of the drivers is a 30150, the other is similar, ill look it up. i believe the 30150 is cross shaped (has cross shaped magnet), while the other is round. sorry but my grandad didnt keep any documents from his work and my dad and uncle were ruthless when clearing his house after he died.
my grandad's claim to fame was that he installed the first talking pictures sound system in ireland, shortly after the war.

[scott fitlin]

You may want to look into this, they make replacement diaphragms for WE drivers!http://www.tachyon.co.jp/~sichoya2/ale/we555/we555.html

More of their products, I would try to contact them, and see what they can do for you!
http://www.tachyon.co.jp/

[pde2000]

[I notice that you own some drivers fitting 555 diaphragrms : are they 30150 units?
If yes, I am very interesting . I owned one a few time ago, but the diaphragm was gone, so...

Ive just checked and they're both 30150 but one is a and the other f. the 30150a is the cross shaped and has a very powerfull sound (never had a horn though) and has little corrosion on the suspension (a couple of perforations but none on the dome itself). the little round 30150f sounds simillar but ive never had it apart and actually weighs more than the a so must have one hell of a magnet. ill get out the camera and find a way to put pictures on the forum. sorry my grandad never kept any paperwork. he loved music especially loud but was a bit of a 'grumpy old man'. he gave me his old valve oscilloscope set up when i was about 9 years old that he'd put together out of stuff he'd nicked off the navy during the war (he fitted radar in newcastle). when it stopped working (no sweep) he just wasn't interested - broke my heart.

[Steve Schell]

Pde2000, does your Gaumont Kalee compression driver have a 20 slit radial phasing plug? I have seen a picture of such a driver, which was obviously inspired by the Lansing 285 driver. I have also seen a picture of a Philips compression driver with a similar phasing plug.

[pde2000]

Pde2000, does your Gaumont Kalee compression driver have a 20 slit radial phasing plug? I have seen a picture of such a driver, which was obviously inspired by the Lansing 285 driver. I have also seen a picture of a Philips compression driver with a similar phasing plug.

yes the gaumont kalee is a type 379 (made by B.A.F. Ltd ser. no. 751) has the slotted phase plug, a 2" threaded throat and has a round-wire voicecoil reading 14.0ohms. it doesn't weigh half as much as the westex and is a very poor second to the 2090A.

other units are;

BTH type D form Y 5.2ohm cat. no. 10185, ser. no. R144749, v. narrow throat.

30150A "the property of Western Electric Co. Ltd" patented in the UK, made in England, 35.5ohm and 1" threaded throat (stripped)

30150F "the property of Westrex Co. Ltd" 10.0ohms 1" threaded throat (mint) and all hex bots (as opposed to slotted).

They all work, and my dad is interested in selling (but im rather partial to the 30150's myself)

[caladois]

So let me know for your 30150...
If either you are interested, I have 4 bass units models WESTREX 30928 with their 2 passiv we crossover (working for 2 12 inches and one 2090 at 675hz)/ I can not remenber the reference.
The stuff is in France / but I have family in Ireland...

Best regards Stephane

[pde2000]

ive just aquired another 30150f but this time with a completely destroyed diaphragm. the horn is awsome, a 805a with an adaptor for we555, now playing the 30150a and totally blowing away. i can see why they went over to fiberglass for the horns, this one is pretty heavy and a bit fragile. anyway my question is can i use a cheap klipsh k55v replacement diaphragm (the tachyon people want nearly $1000 for genuine replacement we555).

the horn came out of the cellar of 'britains oldest cinema' in brighton (the electric picturehouse or something). the seller is an architectural salvage merchant and had it up for £240 as a decorative object. he listed it as having been untested but i reckon someone had a look inside before putting up so cheap (shiny scratches inside). even so the horn is a stunner and i can scavenge the bits from the 30150f if i cant get a replacement diaphragm. maybe the tachyon (ale) one is worth it, just seems a bit rich.

[caladois]

any pics ? Thanks

[pde2000]

5226252261
oh and btw i soldered the 2090 voicecoil using tinned copper wire. it sounds tons better than the replacement from gpa.

[Steve Schell]

Just a minor point... I am not sure that "genuine" is the correct term for the ALE replacement diaphragm for the Western Electric 555. It is no doubt the finest replacement they have been able to make, and it certainly looks good, but it is a modern replica. It must perform well as there are thousands of original functioning W.E. 555s in Japan and a markedly inferior replacement diaphragm would be quickly found out.

[pde2000]

have just got a replacement k55v diaphragm for the westrex 30150f from bob crites (he sent me a 'bad' one for free, to see if it fits, and it dont sound half bad). the voice coil is wire and the suspension is stiff, but it works and is a near perfect fit. i like the price:). side by side the original alloy one is a few dbs louder and wider range. the 30150f was used on multicells so was never intended to deliver the fullrange of the 30150a which was for the big old 13' we15a. thanks bob.

[pde2000]

having a 2090 on one horn and a 30150 on the other has been unsatisfactory, so I have bought a 288c for £300 from an ebay seller, who it turns out has a collection of old we equipment salvaged from cinemas, including amplifiers and full range horns. he sent me some great pictures, of 16a's and baffle mounted 18" fieldcoil bass. he is keen on valves, particularly the british western electric designs. if anyone is interested in seeing I will ask his permission to post the pics. it is strange that the 288c costs so much less than the 2090, the main difference being the logo (altec versus western electric). must be rarity I suppose. sounds pretty good:D

[Steve Schell]

Yes, if he doesn't mind please post the pictures.

[pde2000]

sorry steve, i should have asked his permission first, as he doesnt want to reveal his finds just yet - fair enough as he went to a lot of trouble finding them. he has put me to thinking i should ask to look around the backstage area of our bingo hall, that used to be an odeon. never know might be something waiting to be discovered. there is a lot more interest in old cinema equipment now. i regret my granddad's disregard for the vintage equipment as it would have a lot of value today.

[pde2000]

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i kept some pictures of the gaumont 379, hope that's some interest.

[Steve Schell]

Thanks for the pictures, pde2000. It is curious that in some of these European drivers we see many elements "borrowed" from the Lansing and Altec Lansing products, though sometimes in combinations that never occurred in the U.S. built gear. The Gaumont 379 uses the half roll surround type diaphragm of all Lansing compression drivers preceeding the Altec 288, which used a tangential surround. It also appears to use the threaded attachment to the horn of the early Lansings. The radial slit phasing plug is a close copy of the Lansing 285 of 1937/38. The Gaumont uses an interior ring permanent magnet though, which didn't appear here until the Altec 288 of 1945.

Here is a picture of a Lansing 285 with diaphragm removed. The phasing plug was originally plated, but had become corroded and bumpy, endangering the diaphragm. I removed the plating, revealing a beautiful brass machined phasing plug. Interested parties can read Dr. John Blackburn's U.S. Patent on this phasing plug here:

https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/pdfs/US2183528.pdf (https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/pdfs/US2183528.pdf)

Sorry, but I tried and tried and could not load the image from my backup disc. As I recall, loading images into a post on this site used to be so simple even I could do it, but no more with the current vexing "file upload manager." Sheesh.

[pde2000]

the permanent magnet in my copy was rather weak and I was able to pull the assembly apart to remove the phase plug and get a closer look, but didn't have the camera with me at the time (I was at work:blink:) when I tried doing the same with the we2090 the plate snapped shut and took the tip off my colleagues finger so I gave up (one hell of a magnet). also the gaumonts voice coil was just round enamel wire and the output sounded weak compared to the we2090. the round threaded throat fits the vitavox horns and there is a demand for the 379's because of rarity. give me an altec 288 anyday.:D

regards, paul

[Earl K]

the permanent magnet in my copy was rather weak and I was able to pull the assembly apart to remove the phase plug and get a closer look, but didn't have the camera with me at the time (I was at work:blink:) when I tried doing the same with the we2090 the plate snapped shut and took the tip off my colleagues finger so I gave up (one hell of a magnet). also the gaumonts voice coil was just round enamel wire and the output sounded weak compared to the we2090. the round threaded throat fits the vitavox horns and there is a demand for the 379's because of rarity. give me an altec 288 anyday.:D

regards, paul

It's been stated ( quite a few times here at LHF, as well as at other web-sites ) that one should never break the magnetic circuit ( of the typical alnico assembly ) because once broken ( as example, by removing the top-plate ) the whole assembly then needs to be re-magnetized .

Just Saying ( & passing it on )

:)

[pde2000]

thanks for the advice earl. I wont do it again:o:. even being remagnetised wouldn't make the gaumont magnet powerful, but replacting with a field coil would work. making a ribbon voice coil isn't out of the question, or rather transplanting one if they fit, but I sold the gaumont and the bth. using the 288c satisfies my needs, in some ways it exceeds them. its playing the cheap diamond suspension diaphragm (16r) and is a very good match to the 2090 with the gpa 16r. the 2090 has a much heavier pressure cap which doesn't come with a felt damper or a rubber gasket, but I have put a thick felt disc in. the 288c seems a bit flimsy in comparison to the 2090, the terminals particularly. western electric London must have been contemporaries of altec before Litton industries got it. british audio industries all seem to be connected back then, so collaboration rather than competition lead to innovation. western electric paid their staff well too, because pop wanted to work for decca to develop radar when he was demobbed but they couldn't match we's salary.

[pde2000]

hopefully these will attach
. its getting complicated posting images. the first is a repaired xo (the others are inside the cabinets), the next two are the 555 to 805 adaptor, which I only have one of unfortunately. then the 288c, compared to the we2090.