HDCD

[Guido]

OK, for most of you HDCD is an old old thing.
I tried my first HDCD on my first HDCD Player (Harman HD760) yesterday and was completely stunned by the sound. It's a real improvement!
The soundstage is amazing!

Any similar or different experience from other forum members?

[Rolf]

OK, for most of you HDCD is an old old thing.


You said it! Seriously, the HDCD's is a lot better than "normal" cd's, but if you try SACD or DVD Audio you will be even more amazed. The trouble is that they are hard to find (In Norway anyway), and most of the ones I have heard is not recorded for music reproduction, but for show.:(

Rolf

[jim3860]

You said it! Seriously, the HDCD's is a lot better than "normal" cd's, but if you try SACD or DVD Audio you will be even more amazed. The trouble is that they are hard to find (In Norway anyway), and most of the ones I have heard is not recorded for music reproduction, but for show.:(

Rolf YES you are correct, SACD and DVD AUDIO sound even better. The sad thing is the recording industry has been so afraid of people making copies and selling them that until recently there wasnt a single digital connection available. You had to use your multi channel inputs on your preamp or receiver. Even now there are only a few companys offering propritery digital connections. From what i understand though the newer high bandwith HDMI cables will be able to do that. Now we have to wait until they make the new players that offer that connection, Probablly the New BLUE RAY high def dvd players.:applaud:

[Ducatista47]

HDCD had great potential, but it was derailed by fate and the market. Chips - readers, converters, whatever HDCD called them - never climbed to the quality the better CD player manufactures needed. So they stuck with the redbook standard.

Then fate stepped in. Usually, when a deep pocket company buys a technology the resources necessary to put it over the top are provided. But...not when the company is Microsoft and it purchases the entire company to obtain an unrelated technology. As far as I can tell, Microsoft's contribution amounted to a web page that was never updated. They couldn't care less about HDCD.

Many of my favorite cds from Europe are HDCD, but I had already aquired my player when I discovered the technology.

At least the imprint means the disc won't be lo-fi compressed for an Ipod.:)

Clark in Peoria

[Nightbrace]

The technology is good and in my opinion fully utilized with the right op amps and certain processing can be perfect sound reproduction, any better than this level would not be noticable. I guess thats what they said about the CD when it first came out, but up-scaling the audio at the recording studio is what really makes the difference. Many 24-bit 192 Khz master recordings have found their way onto regular recordings if you know where to look,.

The problem with HDCD, DVD-audio and SACD's. is the lack of adequate ways to have it decoded properly in 2 channel stereo. The end result is a sound in 2 channel mode, using the DAC's in from moderately priced DVD players and SACD players, is a result actually a bit worse than a 16-bit 44.1 Khz on a player of the same price. I have heard systems in which this technology can be utilized, but the price is enormous. The upside is that the 16-bit recordings can be up-converted to 24-bit using these systems giving a more transparent background and just overall improved audio.

The unfortuate problem, at least for now, is that older recordings have, for the most part, been already digitally remastered using 16-bit 44.1 Khz as the standard, so there is little hope for these to get the All-Star treatment unless the market calls for it, and I really don't see that happening too soon. Newer recordings when originally mastered at the SACD level and transposed onto a normal CD with the proper equipment, is still very good. To get to the next level, its just not worth it given the lack of interest and limited number of recordings, more worthwhile is using an external 24-bit, 192 KHz compatible DAC to greatly improve the quality of the normal 16-bit CD's. But again thats very expensive too, but at least all formats will exhibit their full potential this way.

[jim3860]

The technology is good and in my opinion fully utilized with the right op amps and certain processing can be perfect sound reproduction, any better than this level would not be noticable. I guess thats what they said about the CD when it first came out, but up-scaling the audio at the recording studio is what really makes the difference. Many 24-bit 192 Khz master recordings have found their way onto regular recordings if you know where to look,.

The problem with HDCD, DVD-audio and SACD's. is the lack of adequate ways to have it decoded properly in 2 channel stereo. The end result is a sound in 2 channel mode, using the DAC's in from moderately priced DVD players and SACD players, is a result actually a bit worse than a 16-bit 44.1 Khz on a player of the same price. I have heard systems in which this technology can be utilized, but the price is enormous. The upside is that the 16-bit recordings can be up-converted to 24-bit using these systems giving a more transparent background and just overall improved audio.

The unfortuate problem, at least for now, is that older recordings have, for the most part, been already digitally remastered using 16-bit 44.1 Khz as the standard, so there is little hope for these to get the All-Star treatment unless the market calls for it, and I really don't see that happening too soon. Newer recordings when originally mastered at the SACD level and transposed onto a normal CD with the proper equipment, is still very good. To get to the next level, its just not worth it given the lack of interest and limited number of recordings, more worthwhile is using an external 24-bit, 192 KHz compatible DAC to greatly improve the quality of the normal 16-bit CD's. But again thats very expensive too, but at least all formats will exhibit their full potential this way. HUH? I must be missing something here, its been my experience anways that at least 80% maybe 90% of all the sacds and dvd audio albums were in 2 channel until recently sony has put out very few multi channel sacds even there flagship player isonly 2 channel. as far as hdcd goes ive never seen amulti channel hdcd only 2 channel. i do have one very rare cd that has a 5.1 dolby digital track. eric claptons 461 ocean boluevard. it does sound better than the regular cd version. but not even close to a 2 channel sacd or dvd audio album. they play at a much higher bit rate even in 2 channel. Which in my humble opinion accounts for the better sound. Actually recently sony has been using a new 8 track 32 bit dsd conversion versus on some of there newer albums versus the older 6 track 24 bit conversion. I think probably the best we are going to actually hear quality wise from a cd is the xrcd and xrcd24 renderings even better than hdcd recordings. horribly overpriced though in my opinion. REGARDS JIM:)

[Nightbrace]

all the players I have are inteded to utilize 5.1, not so much 2 channel.

[jim3860]

Here is a the best website that i know of for sacds it list all 3500 or so available sacds www.sa-cd.net (http://www.sa-cd.net/) at least this way for those who are intrested in sacds you can see what is available. regards jim:) P.S you can also do a search to see if your favorite alubm or band is avilable rather than look at 700 or so pages.:rotfl:

[Titanium Dome]

I can tell you the Deep Purple Machine Head album in DVD-A is killer. It was recorded in an era when technology was inferior to today's but sound engineering was more of an art.

I have a number of DVD-A and DTS discs, and like anything else, it's not the technology alone but the use of the technology that matters. I'd say about half of them--maybe more--sound better in stereo.

[jim3860]

I can tell you the Deep Purple Machine Head album in DVD-A is killer. It was recorded in an era when technology was inferior to today's but sound engineering was more of an art.

I have a number of DVD-A and DTS discs, and like anything else, it's not the technology alone but the use of the technology that matters. I'd say about half of them--maybe more--sound better in stereo. Agreed both DVD-A and DTS sound great whether in 2 or multi channel. Why DTS and DTS-ES AND dTS-ES DISCRETE never took over dolby digital is a testament to marketing and power. DTS sounds so much better. For those who havent listened to SACD or DVD AUDIO I say go to ebay get a cheap pioneer multi player they can be had for 50 -75 dollar range all day long. If you have multi channel inputs on your preamp or receiver of course. I can barely wait till a single acceptable digital connection is widely available for these formats. and a player that offers it.:applaud: