Violence in the Recording Studio

[majick47]

Last week in Boston MA four young men were murdered in a home recording studio. Have any members felt physically threatened while working in the studio? I always considered this field to be creative not destructive, I guess times and the music have changed for the worse.

[4313B]

It's everywhere... a world gone mad.

[Audiobeer]

I'm sure it was one of those Rock or country & western recording studios that are and have always been associated with violence in both in real life and in the lyrics! :blink:

[majick47]

I'm sure rock and country contribute their fair share of violent lyrics, the disceased young men were budding rapp performers.

[mikebake]

the disceased young men were budding rapp performers.
NOOOO! :jawdrop: Really? Hard to believe. I mean, think of all those rock and country artists shot dead in their car, barber shop, nightclub...........

[Audiobeer]

I'm sure rock and country contribute their fair share of violent lyrics, the disceased young men were budding rapp performers.

Which was the point I was making. Rapp music in itself celebrates gangs, violence, bitches & hoes. I have 3 daughters who brought that crap in the house. I listened to the lyrics and banned it from my listening area.

[sonofagun]

Whatsa matta man,

can'tcha dig this stuff? :mad:

Sumovus jes' can't git enuff! :applaud:

Take your tired mind,

an' stick it up yer :moon: !

Don't tell me my song is crass!,

Bitches & hoes,

is what we like,

so go away man,

an' have a nice life! :die:






BURMA SHAVE (couldn't resist!)

[scott fitlin]

Which was the point I was making. Rapp music in itself celebrates gangs, violence, bitches & hoes. I have 3 daughters who brought that crap in the house. I listened to the lyrics and banned it from my listening area.It is exactly this, why I threw Rap out of my place altogether! Whoever chooses not to ride my cars because i dont play Hip Hop, oh well!

Rap promotes violence, and use of extreme profanity, and the kids really do follow the musics words and act out on them! And the music itself isnt even good! Its so negative, whatever happened to music that made you feel better?

This is not the first incident like this, either, two years ago a very famous rapper from the 80,s was shot dead in his studio here in NY!

Our society has always been image driven, and youth likes to emulate the pop stars and media icons of the moment, but it really has reached new levels of scariness! In the world of Hip Hop, you can catch death quicker than the common cold!

Sad.

[Titanium Dome]

rap, hip hop, and urban performers who try to spin a positive message, but in order to sell their stuff they end up spicing it up, grunging it up, and selling out to the negtive images and actions that make so much of this music a form of musical trash.

The context of these musical genres is so destructive that so-called "good" artists are only fooling themselves if they think they can "clean up" this musical mess. So much of it is driven by gangs (and their "organized crime") that it's just a money machine for gangs to get stupid kids to buy into the self-indulgent, irresponsible, parasitic lifestyle.

First, it's music, then it's music videos, then fashion, then movies, then stylin', and TV glorification, then tatoos, then "don't snitch" marketing, then booze, then drugs, then crime, then death.

You gotta get your kids away from all this corruption. It starts by not permitting them to contribute to the success of these despicable people.

[mikebake]

Amen.

[scott fitlin]

rap, hip hop, and urban performers who try to spin a positive message, but in order to sell their stuff they end up spicing it up, grunging it up, and selling out to the negtive images and actions that make so much of this music a form of musical trash.

The context of these musical genres is so destructive that so-called "good" artists are only fooling themselves if they think they can "clean up" this musical mess. So much of it is driven by gangs (and their "organized crime") that it's just a money machine for gangs to get stupid kids to buy into the self-indulgent, irresponsible, parasitic lifestyle.

First, it's music, then it's music videos, then fashion, then movies, then stylin', and TV glorification, then tatoos, then "don't snitch" marketing, then booze, then drugs, then crime, then death.

You gotta get your kids away from all this corruption. It starts by not letting them contribute to the success of these despicable people.Actually, its gone WAY beyond this! It is Hollywood and the music mass media and corporations! Hollywood is making movies, the fashion industry glorified Hip Hop, and because of this, more than anything else, is what brought it into mainstream Americas front yard!

Gangster rap, and Hip Hop have been around since the 80,s! It wasnt popular, it was ghetto music! Hollywood glamorized the ghetto gangster image, it sells really well, and this is when it became ultra popular! It coincided at a time when dance music like House, Disco, etc, became almost totally instrumental, leaving a gaping hole in the pop music scene. Rap had lyrics, dance music had none, so Hip Hop became the POP music of the late 90,s and 21st century!

Remember Madonna in the 80,s? Every young woman dressed like the " Material Girl " ! Now they want to look like Lil Kim!

Hip Hop had all the ingredients neccesary to become what it has, artist images, lyrics, and Hollywood back up, and this all happened at the right time, and so Hip Hop took over!

The problem is corporate America is making billions off the genre and they wont give it up, till its done with, and no longer sells!

[Charlie4350]

Educate your children - My #1 JOB!

[norealtalent]

Partial
The problem is corporate America...

"You can't close the door when the walls caved in" Weir, Hunter, Hart

[louped garouv]

As you guys know, I grew up in NOLA -- Ghetto sounds used to be the norm down there (don't know what it is like post Katrina, but I hear that most of the population is not there, so I figure most of the labels may have moved to Houston or Baton Rouge)

I actually like some of it; even though most that I like, I like for exactly the reasons you guys here dislike it -- to me it reminds me that the soundtrack to ghetto life is very different than that of suburbia.

and about the peeps that seem determined to kill each other, as sad as it is... that appears to be the way fo the world nowadays -- all you can do is pay attention to your surroundings and be prepared for the worst. Everything happens for a reason, right?

[majick47]

A few weeks ago I posted re my reluctance to go ahead with a HT setup due to the few new movies that I felt were even worth watching, a quick tour of your local video store should prove my point. As Scott just said todays pop music scene is a toilet. Another recent post by Ken re Westlake and the demise of the large professional recording studios and monitors in favor of basement recording studios and cheap speakers to pump out the excrement leaves someone like me and I suspect many other LH members grateful that we have our JBLs and a collection of records/cds that can be played without offending our friends/family/neighbors.

[louped garouv]

...grateful that we have our JBLs and a collection of records/cds that can be played without offending our friends/family/neighbors.


I seem to recall reading accounts of ppl being offended at Elvis when he first appeared on the Ed Sullivan (or was it another show?????) show....

same with all of the other "jungle" music of the time -- richie valens, jerry lewis, yada yada yada


and I don't think that the grown-ups were exactly *thrilled* to hear Iron Butterfly, Black Sabbath, Uriah Heap or any of the other "new" contemporary music in the late 60s/70s

what about the hub bub about Madonna in the early 80s -- everythings offensive when new.... it takes some skill to create something that can be offensive 30 years later

[Titanium Dome]

Actually, its gone WAY beyond this! It is Hollywood and the music mass media and corporations! Hollywood is making movies, the fashion industry glorified Hip Hop, and because of this, more than anything else, is what brought it into mainstream Americas front yard!

Gangster rap, and Hip Hop have been around since the 80,s! It wasnt popular, it was ghetto music! Hollywood glamorized the ghetto gangster image, it sells really well, and this is when it became ultra popular! It coincided at a time when dance music like House, Disco, etc, became almost totally instrumental, leaving a gaping hole in the pop music scene. Rap had lyrics, dance music had none, so Hip Hop became the POP music of the late 90,s and 21st century!

Remember Madonna in the 80,s? Every young woman dressed like the " Material Girl " ! Now they want to look like Lil Kim!

Hip Hop had all the ingredients neccesary to become what it has, artist images, lyrics, and Hollywood back up, and this all happened at the right time, and so Hip Hop took over!

The problem is corporate America is making billions off the genre and they wont give it up, till its done with, and no longer sells!


Hollywood is the same monster it's always been:

It's a dream where anyone can become rich and famous, usually at the price of their soul; it's a refuge of the artiste where artistic freedom and unfettered expression can be used and abused; it's a pandering street punk who's selling fake merchandise and false promises to gullible people; it's a whore who'll get in bed with anyone who can promise it what it wants and will leave that partner for another at the first opportunity.

The problem is that the whore is currently in bed with a particularly nasty person.

[norealtalent]

Hollywood is the same monster it's always been:

It's a dream where anyone can become rich and famous, usually at the price of their soul; it's a refuge of the artiste where artistic freedom and unfettered expression can be used and abused; it's a pandering street punk who's selling fake merchandise and false promises to gullible people; it's a whore who'll get in bed with anyone who can promise it what it wants and will leave that partner for another at the first opportunity.

The problem is that the whore is currently in bed with a particularly nasty person.

The whore is still there because we (society as a whole) keep paying her to be there. The solution is in recognizing what we find attractive about that whore and then finding a way to achieve that beauty without defecating on the rest of the world in the process...

[scott fitlin]

I seem to recall reading accounts of ppl being offended at Elvis when he first appeared on the Ed Sullivan (or was it another show?????) show....

same with all of the other "jungle" music of the time -- richie valens, jerry lewis, yada yada yada


and I don't think that the grown-ups were exactly *thrilled* to hear Iron Butterfly, Black Sabbath, Uriah Heap or any of the other "new" contemporary music in the late 60s/70s

what about the hub bub about Madonna in the early 80s -- everythings offensive when new.... it takes some skill to create something that can be offensive 30 years laterWith one big exception! From Elvis, thru the stones and beatles, into Black Sabbath, and AC/DC and Zeppelin, into the 80,s thru the 90,s, the music wasnt preaching violence!

Listen to the Hip Hop VERY carefully! They openly sing about robbing and stealing, shooting a Muufucka, then you hear gunshots in the recording, or one cuts words going " You can kisss your ass goodbye, E Block, E Block, E Block"! WHO sings songs to celebrate doing time? Not me! It seems to be a thing to be proud of these days, goin away for life is something to celebrate?

Whats scarier, is the youth, just as we did twenty years ago, or better, emulate their musical star figures and the Hollywood images portrayed on the big screens!

I see it all the time! Kids willing to fight to the death, and I mean this literally, for something that doesnt really exist to begin with! Its all Hollywood image, but, sadly, the Icons and pop stars these kids are trying to be just like, well, once these rappers have made it, they get the HELL out of the streets, and they do not live the life their commercially saleable image portrays!

I have a big problem with alot of what the media machine puts out today! Images of gun toting rappers, hardcore, and bad to the bone, and every kid is looking for a gun to wave around like its a rolex watch or something! Its not! Sadly, I have eyewitnessed too many kids die on the street, crying as they are goin out, Ma, ma, I dont wanna die!

The even more screwed up thing to me, is now that mainstream suburban kids have taken to the ghetto image, and they act like something they are not, and 99% of the time, know even less about the people they are trying to emulate, than the look they sport! If you really know the inner city neighborhoods, then you would know, MOST people shun the corner drug dealers and pimps, they dont want any part of these misfits, most people in the hood are trying to better themselves, and arent the crack dealing, and store robbing, and gang member types that Hip Hop and Hollywood glamorizes these people to be! Most people anywhere have kids, and the fear of their kids dying in the streets over something as trivial as looking at someone the wrong way is EVERY parents fear!

Here in NYC, police have been doing a better job of keeping the streets safer. Maybe they are actually doing the job, that they werent really actually doing 20 years ago, but, from what I see, inner city streets are much safer than they once were! Most people living in these areas are happy for this!

Totady, many young youth from the hood, they dont want to be drug dealers. They want to be rappers, and portray an artificial Hollywood image, and make millions! Its ironic, cause they arent the gang banging, gun toting thugs the media image builds them up to be! And yet, every day, some young person who has never even been to the Bronx, or Brooklyns inner city neighborhoods wants to be just like the kids he knows nothing about, and wants a gun! But, the kids who do get caught up in street life, they are the losers, the underachievers, the kids who drop out of school, the kids who are looking for everything for nothing! They arent the pillars of the communities they come from, and most people would rather not know them! Most of the losers end up in prison, or worse! The Cemetary!

Again, the whole Hip Hop thing is a Hollywood image. Its not real, not even in the neighborhoods it originated in.

But, if you listen to the Hip Hop of the 80,s, its much different! Party music it was. Not the brutal singing of reality, and the hardcore lifestyles of the thug gangster! Gangster rap is really an invention of the 90,s!

[louped garouv]

Listen to the Hip Hop VERY carefully! They openly sing about robbing and stealing, shooting a Muufucka, then you hear gunshots in the recording, or one cuts words going....WHO sings songs to celebrate doing time? Not me! It seems to be a thing to be proud of these days, goin away for life is something to celebrate?

Whats scarier, is the youth, just as we did twenty years ago, or better, emulate their musical star figures and the Hollywood images portrayed on the big screens!

I see it all the time! Kids willing to fight to the death, and I mean this literally, for something that doesnt really exist to begin with! Its all Hollywood image, but, sadly, the Icons and pop stars these kids are trying to be just like, well, once these rappers have made it, they get the HELL out of the streets, and they do not live the life their commercially saleable image portrays!

I have a big problem with alot of what the media machine puts out today! Images of gun toting rappers, hardcore, and bad to the bone, and every kid is looking for a gun to wave around like its a rolex watch or something! Its not! Sadly, I have eyewitnessed too many kids die on the street...

I hear ya Scott -- it is sad that the kids today will just as soon pop a cap as look at you. I had numerous aquaintances shot for stuff like the new air jordans, an 8ball jacket, or just looking at someone the wrong way... back in the day.

And typically you are right -- it is the younger kids, not the late 20s or older crowd.... but i don't know that all of the superstars getting out of the life -- yeah they may not be the street level dealers anymore, but part of that lifestyle is to stay true to your krewe and sometimes that involves some of the darker sides of life....




Again, the whole Hip Hop thing is a Hollywood image. Its not real, not even in the neighborhoods it originated in.


I think that depends on where you are from... in NOLA at least, the rap labels, CashMoney and NoLimit in particular, were known to be a way for the street thugs to "go legit," (despite the fact that the authorities couldn't prove it in court) -- most of the artists on those labels came from magnolia, fisher, iberville. st bernard or other housing projects where dealing and shootings were commonplace -- it wasn't just an image thing; c-murder is currently incarcerated for murder and alot of the guys I grew up with that were in that scene were bad dudes from rough 'hoods -- not all of them made it. (on a historical note -- the oldest operating hospital in the US before Katrina, Charity, was THE place (in the world) to learn emergency room care for gunshots wounds and other high trauma human inflicted wounds)




But, if you listen to the Hip Hop of the 80,s, its much different! Party music it was. Not the brutal singing of reality, and the hardcore lifestyles of the thug gangster! Gangster rap is really an invention of the 90,s!

I totally agree with you on that -- early hip hop was party music -- it wasn't until the early 90s that the gangsta rap really took hold outside of the 'hood -- I miss the vibe of early nyc hip hop

[kingjames]

"Again, the whole Hip Hop thing is a Hollywood image. Its not real, not even in the neighborhoods it originated in".Quoted from scottyj

Tupac Shakur, Notorius B.I.G. Suge Knight, and 50 Cent ,this is no image my friend this is real. Tupac and Notorious B.I.G grew up together as best friends only to be hated by one another in later life, and in my opinion the cause of both of their deaths, 50 cent surviving 9 gunshot wounds and then glamorizing it in his new movie"Get Rich Or Die Trying". East Coast, West Coast is real in the eyes of the rapper's. Hollywood is making big money off these guys death's. Look at the music video's, look at the cars with the rims,the jewelry,the babe's.etc;.This is why it appeals to the young,money,money,money.My two grandson's love 50 Cent,why I haven't the faintest idea.Ja Rule no longer records because of his career being destroyed by 50 cent. This is all too real this is not an image,hollywood is the image and the monster for making boo coo bucks off the lives of other people.Rap music is about the times,it sells well because the lyric's are real,this is what is really happening in their world.This is the music of the young today like Rock was the music of the young in my day.The lyric's I believe speak of the current attitude most young people have.There has been death and much violence in the rap world,and for some unfortunate reason's our young kids are subscribing to it.:( :( :(

[scott fitlin]

Yes it is an image! Yes, at one time, many of the artists, if you can call them artists, did do all the street shit, but then when they have made it, they get the hell out of the streets. yeah, a couple stay around therir hoods and such, keeping it real or true to the krew, but mostly, they go where there new found riches allow them to go, places they havent been before! But the fact is Hollywood blew it up and made it mainstream!


But, truthfrully, the guy getting shot 9 times, and surviving, and becoming the next big thing, is less than you think!

I do buisiness in NY,s Coney Island, and I have been here forever! So, I know what Im talking about. Many kids want to get good jobs, many kids want to make sports their careers! I`d have to say more young men want to play ball then anything else I come across! And you know what? Coney Island has produced some really good NBA players! Most do not want anything to do with thug life! Its been going on since time, but you also gotta know, alot of these kids also know, its the one way trip down a dead end street!

So, yes, what your grandchildren idolize, is an Image, a Hollywood image! Because your grandchildren dont know the reality behind the glorified bullshit of Hollywood! But kids in this neighborhood, the same age as your grandkids may not be thinking like the image on the screen shows you. How many guys that work for me, over the years, and they will tell you, after a certain hour, stay off such and such street! If you not doin something, then you lookin for something, and if you aint about buyin or sellin, dont be there! So, not everyone is doin something, or looking for something, some are actually home, or at the movies, or whatever. But they arent all on such and such street!

But truthfully, theres more young guys on the basketball courts in Kaiser Pk in the afternoon, than on the streets dealing drugs in the wee hours! Not everyone wants to be DOA before they are 25!

Its the losers that aspire to the Thug life!

[scott fitlin]

Of course, now that they know they can sell the image for mega bucks.......

[scott fitlin]

The lyric's I believe speak of the current attitude most young people have.There has been death and much violence in the rap world,and for some unfortunate reason's our young kids are subscribing to it.:( :( :(I do agree with this! I feel todays youth is angry. This is what the music tells me, this is what I feel when they talk to or at me. This is what their actions show me!

But, again, I still blame Hollywood for blowing up an image and glamorizing crime and death!

And prior to Hip Hops revolution, we had movies like Natural Born Killers glamorizing ultra violence, because the fact is, violence, like sex, SELLS!

[louped garouv]

all the guys I knew that hung out on the public basketball courts all the time when I was growing up were the drug dealers -- everyone else had to go to work....

besides it was way less obvious than hanging on the block dealing...

[scott fitlin]

all the guys I knew that hung out on the public basketball courts all the time when I was growing up were the drug dealers -- everyone else had to go to work....

besides it was way less obvious than hanging on the block dealing...You know it will always be there! I know this, but, I also see good, too! And I see the " better " that is around as well!

See Louped, not ALL Basket Ball courts are the same. Some actually have guys playing ball. Especially here in Coney Island, alot of guys aspire to play in the NBA, they go to school, cause without school you cant get in!

Things have been bad, things have been good, and things can get better and change too!

[sonofagun]

Hey youse guys,

ya better kool this :blah: thread,

or me and my homey,

gonna make you dead :die:

bullets is cheapa,

then words you know,

we'll plant you deep,

so the flowers'll grow,

so mark my words,

givea lissen now,

or the last thing you'll hear,

is

POW! POW! POW!

:blink:

[johnaec]

or the last thing you'll hear,

is

POW! POW! POW!

http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/images/smilies/blink.gifDid you compose that? 'Sounds like you're on your way - forget the foam grilles! http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/images/smilies/band.gif

J/K - John

[jim campbell]

Rap is a really good alternative to... say, learning how to play an instrument or singing.Yell into a mic and sample someone elses work.Turntables are not musical instrumentshttp://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/images/smilies/banghead.gif

[John]

Did you compose that? 'Sounds like you're on your way - forget the foam grilles! http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/images/smilies/band.gif

J/K - John

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

[Jakeisuseless]

Turntables are not musical instrumentshttp://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/images/smilies/banghead.gif

Now that is flat-out ignorance.... The turntable is an instrument these days, as versitile as the guitar.

There is good natured hip-hop and rap. There is a lot that is along the lines of most rock that isn't 'good-natured' as much as it isn't 'bad-natured.' (If that makes sense.) I strongly urge everyone here to open their minds a bit and download a few songs. My favorite rap group is Jurrasic 5.... (If nothing else, check these guys out just to push those woofers of yours.)

Jurras Finish First - Jurrasic 5
High Fidelity - Jurrasic 5
Sum Of Us - Jurrasic 5
Remember His Name - Jurrasic 5

Also, A Tribe Called Quest....

Scenero - A Tribe Called Quest
Can I kick it - A Tribe Called Quest
Vibrant Thing - A Tribe Called Quest

There are a bunch of others, but these are the two really artist really appericatable to a 'rocker.'

[jim campbell]

Sorry if I upset you dude.I do try to keep an open mind musically,and on any given day I can be found listening to anything from Monk to madrigals,Hank to hard rock,Hazel Dickens to heavy metal,Barbeque Bob to Beethoven......well you get the idea.And I do agree that the rap beats will excercise a woofer,but frankly there is more to it than that.Back in the day guys would play sound effects and railroad sounds thru their stereos and though it sounded good it wasnt Coltrane.I believe that there is or should be more to music than beats and scratch.Most of the bands I have seen with dj's probably would have sounded as good or better without or with another instrument.Composers like Brian Eno have used non instuments to make some fine music and in the hands of skilled composers almost anything will work.I know that the Killer (I know that he didnt mean Jerry Lewis)and Ritchie Valens upset America back in the day but that was the fifties.Todays soccer moms do aerobics to music that would have made my parents convulse.The bitches and ho's and bustin caps stuff,well that may offend some parents but most kids outgrow that stage eventually.Gil Scott Heron, Marvin Gaye and many others have articulated the street stuff and made some great music in the bargain.But who knows maybe I just havnt heard the real stuff yet.

[JonathanKeehn]

If Satan wanted to corrupt our children today, he would get them hooked on drugs and make them listen to Rap music all day long. Rap music started out innocently enought with works of social commentary like "the message" by Grandmaster Flash, but has descended into the abyss of the most vile stuff that perverts can imagine. Rap music's mesmerizing influence, constantly pounded into the subconscious thoughts of our youth, is turning too many of them into social and criminal outcasts. Our whole society and culture is being being deadened and desensetized to evil while many media moguls are getting rich selling our kids this crap. Additionally, budget restrictions are forcing our high schools to abandon traditional music education, which compounds this problem. Albert Einstien once wrote: It is essential that the student acquire an understanding of and a lively feeling for values. He must acquire a vivid sense of the beautiful and of the morally good. Otherwise he - with his specialized knowledge - more closely resembles a well-trained dog than a harmoniously developed person." I think the crass commercialization of the music industry in the Rap music genre has hurt our country. I think parents have to get off their butts on this issue and show some leaderhip and take more responsibility for their kid's musical education, because music has such a profound impact on people today. It is everywhere. Take some control over those I-Pods. If you want to know where society is heading, listen to your children's music.

[louped garouv]

and Prussian Blue is any better?


www.prussianblue.net/ (http://www.prussianblue.net/)


point being that all types of music can have a negative influence on anyone...

[JonathanKeehn]

Hate music is hate music - black, white, classical, rock, country - whatever form of music hate may be expressed through. It's not the musical genre, it's the motivation of the artist that can be offensive and destructive. There have been lots of books written that depict the emotional and physical destructive effects of certain types of music on a person - how it can affect blood pressure, stress hormone levels, immune system deficiencies, cause disease and produce anti-social behavior. The media moguls just want to take your money by addicting the major buying demographic to junk entertainment - electronic junk food. If our kids aren't well-guided by parents, they often get sucked in because "everybody's doing it.", Look up Eric Holmberg's The Power of Music on Google. Some interesting ideas.

[4313B]

Now that is flat-out ignorance.... The turntable is an instrument these days, as versitile as the guitar.Now that is flat out ludicrous... Watch a video of SRV and witness first hand the versatility of the guitar.

BTW, everyone knows that Afternoon Delight, specifically the "Anchorman version", is the only song that is still worth listening to. I'm not sure of the musical genre, and more importantly, don't care; All I know is it's the only song to listen to.

[louped garouv]

hate music is hate music; and yet if Satan gets involved...




If Satan wanted to corrupt our children today, he would get them hooked on drugs and make them listen to Rap music all day long.


and about the drug thing, does caffine count? how about refined sugar?

[invstbiker]

Opinions are like :moon: Most everybody has one :D Having said that IMHO RAP SUCKS, HIP HOP SUCKS. I listen to only classic rock and new country. THANK GOD my children haven't been sucked into this "hate, angry" :barf: music!