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View Full Version : The birth of 56 pound twins ! (L112, L166, L212, 4313 and more...)



ironman
11-03-2005, 04:11 PM
Well, at 9:30 am Thursday morning I'm getting ready for work, wondering "will this be the day they arrive ?" I'm concerned about them sitting on my porch, unattended, until I get home in the evening. I happen to glance out my kitchen window and spy the brown UPS truck directly across from me at a neighboring business. I think "nah, most likely, if he had something for me, he would of stopped here first" (my location being on the same side of the road as he heads north and all). I'm looking for my car keys, making sure the lights are all off and doing the last minute walk through before I head out to my car when I hear the distinct sound of a garage door closing -but, I don't have a garage door ! I take a quick peek out of my kitchen window . The window frames a solid patch of brown metal ! This has to be it...and I have to get to work ! I go out and great Mr. Brown - he is already heaving a large box off the stack of others. "Careful" I say "they're speakers". The box is big enough for the pair "that's easily a hundred pounds" I warn. Mr.Brown has no problem getting the box up on my porch - I realize it could only be one speaker. He heads back to the truck, not to the cab but back to the rear. EXCELLENT. Out pops #2.

I thank Mr.Brown and he's on his way. I know I have to get them inside before leaving for work - key in the door and, one, two, safe inside my kitchen. Now comes the question that no one but members of this forum could understand...do I unpack them and intentionally be late for work ?????? Hell yeah ! Damn it, I'm a red blooded JBL lover for G_ds sake ! Now comes the fretting...no obvious damage to the boxes. Good. I get a sharp knife from the drawer and very carefully start slicing the first box I can grab across the taped top. "Don't puncture a grille or a cone, keep the blade flush with the box" I tell myself. I'm wondering if this box will be the one that contains the sole grille. I quickly see it's not. I pop it out and give a quick once over. "Man, nowhere near as bad as the pic on ePay" I says to myself. In fact I'm quite pleasantly surprised. Now box 2. Ah, I see the grille. I'm amazed. It is literally mint - badge and all. "Geez, I've got to get to work ! How do I know if they work ? I'd have to disconnect my L-40's, hook these up....ah, go for it !". So I do. I've got the fever. Will my boss understand ? She probably won't....:) The seconds it takes my 8080 to get up to speed seems like an hour. I pop in the first CD I see - song #1: Glenn Millers "In The Mood" Nice. Zep and Floyd will have to wait 'til tonight ! I now realize I have to do the responsible thing and speed all the way to work.:bouncy: Visiting hours will not be until 7p.m. tonight ! I walk back out through my kitchen and think "Good L_rd, look at all the afterbirth !" There has to be 5 pounds of it ! Impressions in a day or so...

ps - this is not a commercial for Don Ramon but let me say he understated the condition of these babies,the pics did not do them justice ! He packed them to go to Mars and back safely and they were here from West Coast to East in less than a week ! Don Ramon, youz 'da man !

scott fitlin
11-03-2005, 04:28 PM
This would be a great TV commercial for a speaker company!


Glad you got your JBl,s all safe and sound!

:thmbsup:

boputnam
11-03-2005, 05:00 PM
I musta missed this... :blink:

Can you post some pics, a-new...?

ironman
11-03-2005, 06:20 PM
The only pics I have now are the originals from ePay. Most of what you see is dust - not rotted veneer. Even the grille looks
shabby in the pics - it is about as mint as you can get :barf: .

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=5820223328&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT

ironman
11-03-2005, 07:37 PM
OOOOoppps ... picked the wrong "smillie". Was suppossed to be a plain big smile - like this !:)

boputnam
11-03-2005, 08:24 PM
Cool...

Looks like someone might have done some work on them, sometime.

That does not look like the factory MF (LE5-12) to me. Looks like either a recone to, or an authentic LE5-2...? :blink:

Anyone got a clue?

http://www.lansingheritage.org/html/jbl/specs/home-speakers/1980-l112.htm (http://www.lansingheritage.org/html/jbl/specs/home-speakers/1980-l112.htm)

boputnam
11-03-2005, 08:30 PM
I'd suggest you remove those MF's and read their behinds for confirmation.

Then, make sure no mods have been made to the internal cabinet wiring, or other. Use this tech sheet for reference...

;)

ironman
11-03-2005, 09:48 PM
Well, that is interesting. If I do remove the mids is there anything I should know ? I thought I read on a previous thread something about removing 033's and then having to put them back in, retightening the screws while taking some typeof meter reading. I have no such equiptment and no clue.
Any help here ?

ps - I just realized that when I adjusted the freq. pots on these that straight up (12 O'clock) isn't the flat position !
Had them all in the minus - who would have thought ?
I did think these had some "imaging" issues until I discovered this (by turning on another room lamp). My first thoughts were that my L-40's, AR 2ax's and KLH 6's did a
better job (imaging). As I mentioned on another thread The Pink Floyd "One Of These Days" bass drum was always dead center on these other models. I still haven't had the time to play with them much.
Any thoughts on the imaging ? Thanks,

Michael Smith
11-03-2005, 09:51 PM
Hey Bo
Does it look like it could be that some one has pushed the dome in?
Michael

edgewound
11-03-2005, 09:53 PM
That dome has been pushed in. And the 128 has the surround on the front of the cone:(

boputnam
11-04-2005, 07:07 AM
Hey Bo
Does it look like it could be that some one has pushed the dome in?
MichaelWell, it sure could be - that's why I asked for other's ideas. The picture is not clear enough - and the frame doesn't look right for an LE5-2. Guess they need some refurbishing, or replacing... :(

boputnam
11-04-2005, 07:08 AM
That dome has been pushed in. And the 128 has the surround on the front of the cone:(I wondered that too - or the cone has been trimmed back and more of the surround is visible.

Hey, ironman, can you post some better pics of the MF and WF so we can see what's up...? :yes:

boputnam
11-04-2005, 07:35 AM
Well, that is interesting. If I do remove the mids is there anything I should know ? I thought I read on a previous thread something about removing 033's and then having to put them back in, retightening the screws while taking some typeof meter reading. I have no such equiptment and no clue.Hey, ironman...

First, we share your likely disappointment these aren't pristine, but we get real linear when we see damage / non-factory spec'd repairs and switch into "help" mode. We can help you restore these.

WRT the quote, there is nothing you need to know - only need a Phillips head screwdriver.

Lay the cabinet on it's back, remove the LF screws and tell us what the back of the MF sez (likely LE5-12), with the domes pushed in like Michael and edgewound suggest. For your purposes, these will require replacing.

But do post some pics so us'n here can opine about what else to do.

Don C
11-04-2005, 08:21 AM
Looks like the correct LE5-12s, but with the domes pushed in.

ironman
11-04-2005, 04:55 PM
Hi Ya'll,

Well, I did it. Just one - used a paint scraper to get it out. Sez LE5-12 toward the top and 0350 toward the bottom. On the back of the cone in what looks like white paint it sez 57077 and maybe a J ? Sort of smudged.The dust cap area is inverted and smooth, virtually the same shape (slope) as the rest of the cone. Minor dimple or lines. I get VERY nervous with screw drivers around these things - should I pop out the other ? It looks identical. Should the centers of these be popped out the other way ? I know my L-40's have the inverted (innies) caps on the woofers. Since these do have a tad of a crinkle does that indicate a pushed in cap ? Sorry about "no pics". Kodak decided not to introduce XP compatible drivers for my Kodak digital. Wasn't that FREAKIN' jolly of them ? I upgraded to XP a few years back only to find half my other gadgets are incompatible ! With 2 youngin's (one just started college, one in High School,support, visitation etc.) and with this expensive "hobby" (I've been guilt ridden all week) I won't be buying another camera soon !
More info. then you probably needed but I'm figuring you must be wondering "what's up with that ?" (no pictures etc.) So....

Don C
11-04-2005, 06:35 PM
I have never seen L40s with innie caps, even the brochure shows them pointing out.
Anyway, you will probably never be able to get those center caps on your mids to pop out, I have tried more than once. They are made of soft aluminum, painted black. Once somebody touches it it gets an annoying little dimple. Then someone gets the bright idea to push it all in, thinking that it will look better. It doesn't. I think that you can buy new caps though.

ironman
11-04-2005, 08:21 PM
Don C,

If they sound fine should I just leave 'em ? I just passed on a pair - ePay. Nothing I want to do any time soon. I couldn't help but crank the Sansui 8080 to 12 o'clock high and I heard nothing but my ears crackle ! I needed to do some vacuuming (Styro. City here) but put it off 'cause I wanted to listen. Finally said enough is enough, powered up the vacuum - couldn't even tell it was running ! Now I'll never have an excuse not to vacuum again...:uhmmmm:

soundmotor
11-05-2005, 09:22 AM
Are these essentially the same speaker?

What are the differences?

Don C
11-05-2005, 07:58 PM
Don C,

If they sound fine should I just leave 'em ?
I can't prove that the pushed in domes have audible effects. But if they were mine, I'd have to fix them. I couldn't stand to look at them that way.

boputnam
11-05-2005, 08:13 PM
Are these essentially the same speaker?Well, they are both three-ways. :yes:

Other then that, they are quite different.

The L112 ts is posted above. Here's the L166 ts...

soundmotor
11-06-2005, 06:38 AM
Well, they are both three-ways. :yes:

Other then that, they are quite different.

The L112 ts is posted above. Here's the L166 ts...

Not so fast,

;)

I am trying to gain some insight here!

I see that the L112 has a 12dB/octave midrange bandpass network vs. a 6dB on the L166. Other than that, the topologies are virtually identical as are the drivers. The L166 looks like a tweaked version of the L112 or, basically the same speaker. Is it not that?

boputnam
11-06-2005, 10:53 AM
The L166 looks like a tweaked version of the L112 or, basically the same speaker. Er, you'd have to define "tweaked".

Some might think tweaking was merely changing the crossover slope(s) while not changing the drivers. Changing networks and drivers suggests JBL were pursuing something.


...are virtually identical as are the driversDunno about that. I'd have to run some models on the two LF's to compare things, first. Of the two, I've got a preference for the 128H. But that's just me...

Are you asking what JBL might have been thinking? No clue about their consumer gear - too many of those iterations, and many were driven by (perceptions) of consumer preference (or competitor offerings). Maybe somebody else out here?

-----
Afterthought:

Hell, they had it perfect with the L100 - why even bother after that! :p

soundmotor
11-06-2005, 11:50 AM
Hell, they had it perfect with the L100 - why even bother after that! :p

You actually did the end run on me with that comment! I am just trying to figure out their motivations with so many iterations of the same thing over the years.

To the more knowledgeable users, did they really make a substantial sonic improvement over the prior 3-ways with each new version?

boputnam
11-06-2005, 12:25 PM
To the more knowledgeable users...To everybody BUT bo... :o:

mike
11-06-2005, 02:14 PM
The 12" 3way bookshelf designs went in this order: L100, L166, L112 and finally the 120Ti. There are audible improvements with each model with the 120Ti being significantly more neutral than its predecessors. Beyond that it is a matter of opinion. Each model seems to have its own following and there is no best or worst.



Mike

edgewound
11-06-2005, 02:33 PM
I believe the L166 has a 122A woofer, the L112 has a 128H woofer, LE5-9 mid, and 044 tweeter. The L112 is a more accurate speaker system....more refined, complicated crossover network...the Consumer version of the 4411 Studio monitor....shares all the same components.

I'm going by memory, so any corrections are welcome:o:

boputnam
11-06-2005, 03:35 PM
I believe the L166 has a 122A woofer, the L112 has a 128H woofer, LE5-9 mid, and 044 tweeter. The L112 is a more accurate speaker system....more refined, complicated crossover network...the Consumer version of the 4411 Studio monitor....shares all the same components.The first bit is correct, but the 4411 was quite different. It used the 2213 woof (pleated fabric compliance), LE25 tweet, and of course the splendiferous LE5-2 with it's uniquely (er, factory...) inverted dome.

But, this ain't about me... :p

edgewound
11-06-2005, 03:36 PM
The first bit is correct, but the 4411 was quite different. It used the 2213 woof (pleated fabric compliance), LE25 tweet, and of course the splendiferous LE5-2 with it's uniquely (er, factory...) inverted dome.

But, this ain't about me... :p

Sorry to point out your error Bo...but that was the 4311, which is basically an L100.....4411 used the 128H et.al:o:

But, this ain't about you...:o:

Zilch
11-06-2005, 04:13 PM
Y'all got me wondering if 4411 was actually a "Studio" or "Control" monitor, meaningful designations with respect to voicing with JBL.

Indeed, it's a Studio Monitor, and, in addition to the different woofer, it took considerable "doing" in the crossover to make it play neutral:

http://www.jblpro.com/pub/obsolete/4411.pdf

http://www.jblproservice.com/pdf/Studio%20Monitor%20Series/4411LR.pdf

boputnam
11-06-2005, 04:36 PM
Sorry to point out your error Bo...but that was the 4311, which is basically an L100.....4411 used the 128H et.al:o:

But, this ain't about you...:o:Doh!! That's what I get for multi-tasking! Shoulda stayed in the attic.

Hilarious, actually edgewound. I wondered why you would have posted that (what I saw as 4311). I guessed you knew better, but... :rotfl:

Never mind...

edgewound
11-06-2005, 04:43 PM
Doh!! That's what I get for multi-tasking! Shoulda stayed in the attic.

Hilarious, actually edgewound. I wondered why you would have posted that (what I saw as 4311). I guessed you knew better, but... :rotfl:

Never mind...

I was just watchin' yer back, Bo:D

soundmotor
11-07-2005, 04:13 AM
The 12" 3way bookshelf designs went in this order: L100, L166, L112 and finally the 120Ti. There are audible improvements with each model with the 120Ti being significantly more neutral than its predecessors. Beyond that it is a matter of opinion. Each model seems to have its own following and there is no best or worst.
Mike

I was under the impression (wrongly) that the L166 followed the L112. I appreciate the clarification. One could develop quite the collection of nothing but JBL 3-ways!

:bouncy:

Michael Smith
11-07-2005, 02:03 PM
Hey Guys
What about the L90? Shouldn't it be in the mix?
Michael

Miss Orchid
11-07-2005, 08:18 PM
The 033 and 066 put the planet on notice that JBL could actually make a fairly decent high frequency direct radiator (~ 1975). The 033 was cheaper to build and had the soft phenolic dome. The 066 was more expensive to build and had the hard aluminum coated phenolic dome. The 033 was used in the L40, L110, and L150. The 066 was used in the L166, L212 and 4313 (considered at the time to be the flatest, most accurate loudspeaker JBL had ever made).

The 034 and 044 came next and used a heavier copper coil to handle more juice and hopefully suffer less power compression (~ 1981). The domes were hard aluminum coated phenolic. Top end response suffered a bit with the copper coil but they were decent enough. The 034 was used in the L15, L46, L56, L86 and 4401. The 044 was used in the new L112 Century II and then in the L96, L150A, L250 and 4411.

Next up was the legendary 044Ti (~ 1985). This is the high frequency direct radiator that defined JBL's future in high frequency transducer design. It spawned the much cheaper to manufacture 035Ti that became the most consistent unit to unit high frequency transducer JBL had ever made. The 044Ti was used in the 18Ti, 120Ti, 240Ti, and 250Ti. The 035Ti was used in pretty much everything else.

Greg Timbers designed most of these systems. Mark Gander designed the L40 (along with the L50 at that time). David Smith used the 128H and 044 out of the L112 to build the 4411. He had a very nice frequency dividing network design and used the slightly more expensive edgewound ribbon voice coiled LE5-9 instead of the round wire voice coiled LE5-12 from the L112. The sound character of the 4411 was quite a bit different from that of the L112.

Mrs Lansing
11-07-2005, 09:11 PM
Excuse me Miss Orchid but you speak like a Woman on steriods!

Quote:

It spawned the much cheaper to manufacture 035Ti that became the most consistent unit to unit high frequency transducer JBL had ever made.

Do you mean to say the earlier designs such as the 077 Slot were inconsistent as illuminated by Mr Widget on other threads?...so much for precision engineering.


I find our darling and sexy Mr Widget tells the truth with his Clio mean machine and not all buzz word JBL self talk.

Well if that is the case my kitchen carving set (from the U.K) has been more consistent over the last 15 years and probably better made.

Anyways, I heard all these system with the 035Ti tweeter and just don't care for them, they always sounded tinny and bright compared my AR3A's.

Back to my cooking...rice pudding for dinner....you should try it..!
Mrs Lansing

Michael Smith
11-07-2005, 10:23 PM
Miss Orchid
I think you may have made a typo when getting up a head of steam,and a very good head it was!
I think it was infact a LE5-12 in the L112 not LE5-10.
I enjoy your posts
With veneration
Michael

Don C
11-08-2005, 06:44 AM
Am I the only one offended by Mrs Lansing's post? Let's put a stop to the name calling right now.

boputnam
11-08-2005, 07:04 AM
Am I the only one offended by Mrs Lansing's post? :dont-know

I believe he intended to offend. That's what they call fun down there...

Miss Orchid
11-08-2005, 08:42 AM
Miss Orchid
I think you may have made a typo when getting up a head of steam,and a very good head it was!
I think it was infact a LE5-12 in the L112 not LE5-10.

Yes, I should have taken more time with my post. The only difference between the LE5-10 and LE5-12 is the black face on the LE5-10 versus the silver face on the LE5-12. Thank you for the correction.

Miss Orchid
11-08-2005, 08:43 AM
:rotfl:

Excuse me Miss Chop Sticks but you speak like a Woman on steriods!

Not only am I better looking than you, I also know Kung Fu. ;)

Do you mean to say the earlier designs such as the 077 Slot were inconsistent as illuminated by Mr Widget on other threads?...so much for precision engineering.

Compare them against the products of many other manufacturers at the time and you will see JBL was significantly superior in their precision. Also keep in mind that there was a whole group of people who thought JBL was crazy for manufacturing such expensive, high tolerance transducers.

I find our darling and sexy Mr Widget tells the truth with his Clio mean machine and not all buzz word JBL self talk.

With all due respect, Mr. Widget doesn't have nearly the R & D hours under his belt that say, Drew Daniels, D.B. Keele Jr, Mark Gander, Greg Timbers, etc. have.

Anyways, I heard all these system with the 035Ti tweeter and just don't care for them, they always sounded tinny and bright compared my AR3A's.

Plenty of people don't care for the zing of titanium. :p

Back to my cooking...rice pudding for dinner....you should try it..Chop Sticks!

Are you inviting me over? :p

Rolf
11-08-2005, 08:52 AM
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/images/smilies/rotfl.gif


Also keep in mind that there was a whole group of people who thought JBL was crazy for manufacturing such expensive, high tolerance transducers.

Yes, and they still sounds good compared to many other
so-called hi-end tweetershttp://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/images/smilies/wink.gif

Rolf

Miss Orchid
11-08-2005, 08:59 AM
Am I the only one offended by Mrs Lansing's post?

I suspect not.

Miss Orchid
11-08-2005, 09:03 AM
Yes, and they still sounds good compared to many other
so-called hi-end tweeters

Rolf, I am very happy for you that you were able to get another great pair of JBL's, and 4343's to boot! I was appalled when your 4333's were stolen.

Rolf
11-08-2005, 09:10 AM
Rolf, I am very happy for you that you were able to get another great pair of JBL's, and 4343's to boot! I was appalled when your 4333's were stolen.

Thanks for your concern. The only good thing witch came out of this is that I now have a even better sounding system.http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/images/icons/icon10.gif

Rolf

soundmotor
11-08-2005, 09:13 AM
The 033 and 066 put the planet on notice that JBL could actually make a fairly decent high frequency direct radiator (~ 1975). The 033 was cheaper to build and had the soft phenolic dome. The 066 was more expensive to build and had the hard aluminum coated phenolic dome. The 033 was used in the L40, L110, and L150. The 066 was used in the L166, L212 and 4313 (considered at the time to be the flatest, most accurate loudspeaker JBL had ever made).

The 034 and 044 came next and used a heavier copper coil to handle more juice and hopefully suffer less power compression (~ 1981). The domes were hard aluminum coated phenolic. Top end response suffered a bit with the copper coil but they were decent enough. The 034 was used in the L15, L46, L56, L86 and 4401. The 044 was used in the new L112 Century II and then in the L96, L150A, L250 and 4411.

Next up was the legendary 044Ti (~ 1985). This is the high frequency direct radiator that defined JBL's future in high frequency transducer design. It spawned the much cheaper to manufacture 035Ti that became the most consistent unit to unit high frequency transducer JBL had ever made. The 044Ti was used in the 18Ti, 120Ti, 240Ti, and 250Ti. The 035Ti was used in pretty much everything else.

Greg Timbers designed most of these systems. Mark Gander designed the L40 (along with the L50 at that time). David Smith used the 128H and 044 out of the L112 to build the 4411. He had a very nice frequency dividing network design and used the slightly more expensive edgewound ribbon voice coiled LE5-9 instead of the round wire voice coiled LE5-12 from the L112. The sound character of the 4411 was quite a bit different from that of the L112.

Very informative post.

Thank you!

boputnam
11-08-2005, 10:14 AM
YRolf, I am very happy for you that you were able to get another great pair of JBL's, and 4343's to boot! I was appalled when your 4333's were stolen.All he lacks now, is a pair of 4313B's and the venerable 4345's and he's :dancin:

louped garouv
11-08-2005, 10:22 AM
:dont-know

I believe he intended to offend. That's what they call fun down there...

He???? did i miss the unveiling or something..... :eek: :jawdrop: :no: :shock: :spchless: :uhmmmm:

boputnam
11-08-2005, 11:12 AM
He???? did i miss the unveiling or something..... The clue lies in the avatar... ;)

Lancer
11-08-2005, 11:17 AM
The clue lies in the avatar... ;)Who got their veil ripped off?

louped garouv
11-08-2005, 11:24 AM
The clue lies in the avatar... ;)

they look so real.... and no visible adam's apple.... bummer, had all these bad thoughts...:(

Titanium Dome
11-08-2005, 11:32 AM
:rotfl:

Excuse me Miss Chop Sticks but you speak like a Woman on steriods!

Not only am I better looking than you, I also know Kung Fu. ;)

Agreed, you are much better looking.


Do you mean to say the earlier designs such as the 077 Slot were inconsistent as illuminated by Mr Widget on other threads?...so much for precision engineering.

Compare them against the products of many other manufacturers at the time and you will see JBL was significantly superior in their precision. Also keep in mind that there was a whole group of people who thought JBL was crazy for manufacturing such expensive, high tolerance transducers.

Ah, the importance of context, so often lost on the simple-minded and the naive.


I find our darling and sexy Mr Widget tells the truth with his Clio mean machine and not all buzz word JBL self talk.

With all due respect, Mr. Widget doesn't have nearly the R & D hours under his belt that say, Drew Daniels, D.B. Keele Jr, Mark Gander, Greg Timbers, etc. have.

Anyways, I heard all these system with the 035Ti tweeter and just don't care for them, they always sounded tinny and bright compared my AR3A's.

Plenty of people don't care for the zing of titanium. :p

Almost anything sounds bright compared to an AR3A, sort of like anyone seems bright compared to an unpopular President or governor. (Except of course, for those who are supporters. ;) ) Better to zing than to whizzle.


Back to my cooking...rice pudding for dinner....you should try it..Chop Sticks!

Are you inviting me over? :p

If not, the invitation is always open here, Miss Orchid. My skill with chop sticks is formidable and correct (see below), and I have zing in more than my tweeters.

Mrs Lansing
11-08-2005, 12:15 PM
:rotfl:

Excuse me Miss Orchid but you speak like a Woman on steriods!

Not only am I better looking than you, I also know Kung Fu. ;)



Well your entilted to your opinion. Yes you must come over for dinner.

As to the other response try and lighten up..it was a joke.

Mrs Lansing

DavidF
11-08-2005, 05:28 PM
The only pics I have now are the originals from ePay. Most of what you see is dust - not rotted veneer. Even the grille looks
shabby in the pics - it is about as mint as you can get :barf: .

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=5820223328&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT

I’d say that looks like a good deal, indeed. Functional speakers discounted for appearance issues only. The mids sound like they belong there. There is no big mystery about removing any of the drivers, unless someone installed them with some form of hardening sealant. That makes things a drag trying to remove the drivers. The reference to the tweeters and care in installing the screws is dealing with the screws that hold the faceplate to the magnet assembly, not those securing the driver to the cabinet.

The domes on the mids can have an effect on the response. Not sure though that you will notice it now, but not sure that you won’t over time. Right now maybe it is just an appearance preference but the domes can be easily replaced by a JBL tech for not a lot cash. Likewise, the new foam surrounds mounted on the face of the woofer. Some object to the real or potential effect on response (not me). Some object to the aesthetic difference (me), some it just does not matter.

A good starting point with these is to rework the cabinet finish and find a way to scrub the grill cloth, maybe repaint the satin black finish or give it a good cleaning. This will get you immediate “improvement”.

The L112s were a special design for the company. The L166 perhaps started the move away from the legacy sound of the L100 but the L110, L112 etc left the L100 behind by a long shot. Good, solid, low-distortion woofer, proven mid design, and a rugged tweeter that sounds good, takes a lot of power, and looks just right on the black baffle. The crossover design allows for great balance with heft at the low end (can be too much unless the boxes are well away from walls and floor), clear open midrange, and highs that are brilliant without being harsh and overbearing. Compared to soft domes of that era, they will seem to some to be too brilliant. Hell, just turn that little tweeter nob thing down, if you need the sound of the big hall/lost highs. The driver layout is mirrored and flexible in terms of horizontal or vertical positioning.

So clean them up, set them up on stands so you look right at the tweeters, pull them out from the front wall if you can, put your self in the middle, and enjoy.

David F

bigstereo
11-09-2005, 08:32 PM
I just read this post from Ironman, about the day his speakers got delivered to him. I have to say that he has written it in a way that the reader can tell exactly the way he felt that day. And to think I'm going to get to experience the same feeling next week when my 4311's arrive. There's only one difference though. I work night shift and I'll be here all day, on that day to wallow in JBL pleasure. Can't hardly wait!

duaneage
11-09-2005, 10:32 PM
Are these essentially the same speaker?

What are the differences?

L112 and 4411 are essentially the same. Differnet crossover network mainly due to driver placement and the need to keep the drivers in band as much as possible for a studio monitor. The 4411 has steep 18db/oct 3rd order networks.

Miss Orchid
11-10-2005, 04:16 AM
L112 and 4411 are essentially the same. Differnet crossover network mainly due to driver placement and the need to keep the drivers in band as much as possible for a studio monitor. The 4411 has steep 18db/oct 3rd order networks.

Which makes them quite a bit different. Posted previously in this thread -

"David Smith used the 128H and 044 out of the L112 to build the 4411. He had a very nice frequency dividing network design and used the slightly more expensive edgewound ribbon voice coiled LE5-9 instead of the round wire voice coiled LE5-12 from the L112. The sound character of the 4411 was quite a bit different from that of the L112."

The L112 shares the same crossover network design with the L96 and L150A. That design is a modified version of the 4313 crossover network design.

jpevrard92
06-30-2007, 02:28 PM
Would it be wrong to fix a 044 KO coil with a 8R 034 JBL repair kit ? Is it physically possible ?
Thanks for helping.

duaneage
07-01-2007, 07:51 PM
That repair would not work, Sorry.

SEAWOLF97
04-25-2008, 01:15 PM
I believe the L166 has a 122A woofer, the L112 has a 128H woofer, LE5-9 mid, and 044 tweeter. The L112 is a more accurate speaker system....more refined, complicated crossover network...the Consumer version of the 4411 Studio monitor....shares all the same components.


I'm thinking "shares all the same components" isnt always the whole story. I love my 4410's . Purchased some L80t's. those 2 systems share all the same components (except cab and network), and I dislike the L80t's. Maybe the L80 is too much box for those compts, dunno, but there is a huge difference.

demon
04-25-2008, 02:45 PM
ok, sorry, im entering another thread.
now:
i own a pair of 441oA and seeing bunches of bunches of monitor-kinda-3way-speakers from jbl...on so many pictures...i got myself confused A LOT.

so thanks miss orchid, and the others, for your posts.
veneration -me too.

but can someone please tell me where the 441oA is in all this play of the 3way?

(because i got an L112 offer lately...)

i would very much appreaciate your knowledge-
thanks,

mikey