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Robh3606
08-28-2003, 08:17 PM
Just curious about this. I do and was wondering if any of you do and how?? You use MDF or plywood or a combination?? You do butt joints, lock meiters use screws or glue of both?? What size braces 1x2 2x3 2x4?? What kind of tools??

I use MDF and plywood with butts joints held together with glue and screws, its easy. :) Braces are 1x2 flat and 2x3 on end at odd panel dimensions. No 2 braced areas are the same size. Ports are PVC pipe. Sub-enclosures are Sonotubes.

How about tools?? Table saw, Circular saw, Radial arm?? Router or plunge cutter?? Sanders??

Rob:)

luxmanlover
08-28-2003, 09:52 PM
I use a similar system, usually using 2x6's ripped in half for braces , placed on edge. I used to mortise in the braces but I think it's a lot of hassle for nothing, I just glue and screw them in with no particular spacing (the whole random panel deal). Edges are mortised in 1/8" for ease of alignment, them Liquid Nailed and screwed with 2 1/4" wood screws, not those stinking drywall screws that everyone seems to love for some reason. Also If you can find them in the States, try and find Robertson head screws they are the square ones that work a ton better than Philips head screws. I've seen them in Home Depot advertized as "Loxon", makes me laugh. As far as tools, I really only use my routers and drills, I get the local Mom and Pop lumber yard to whack down the MDF to size + 1/8" which gets flush cut off with a router. Their 6' X 10' table saw is way faster and accurate than my rig at home.
Kelly

boputnam
08-29-2003, 08:11 AM
Hey, Kelly, and robh...

I do the same:
I get the local Mom and Pop lumber yard to whack down the MDF to size... - it's worked really well. I have a funky kinda table saw that is not as precise as that at the Yard - their cuts have been very realiable, but they often get real confused on my pedantic focus on grain and grain direction. Ha!

Otherwise, plunge router is tops. Bosch 2.25 hp model, at great price now on Amazon: Bosch 2-1/4 hp router combo pack - Link (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B00005RHPD/qid=1062166050/sr=1-3/ref=sr_1_3/102-8297473-7012143?v=glance&s=hi)

Grab the Jasper Circle Jig - Link (http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&User_ID=14100107&St=4028&St2=84577990&St3=-29218610&DS_ID=3&Product_ID=10577&DID=7) from PartsExpress, and you'll be in baffle heaven.

I end up using plywood more frequently - not as desperate to work with.

Oh, and I pick-up that Sono tube today (Thanks, GordonW!!) - I'll post some pics of the LE5 subenclosure scheme, this weekend.

:scoot:

audio9
08-29-2003, 08:13 AM
Great Thread!

What kind of wood do you use over the MDF or plywood? Do you use thin veneer the kind that comes rolled up? Or what about the 1/4" plywood with real wood top like oak or birch? What about the finish? Use tung oil? Urethane or no urethane? etc.

Being a rather beginner at building and finishing enclosures the link below always impressed me on how he finished his cabinets.

Alfredo

http://www.wmeckle.com/

boputnam
08-29-2003, 01:37 PM
What kind of wood do you use over the MDF or plywood? For a current project, I've taken to using oak plywood. Looks good, and works fine - just watch the router!! :biting:

4313B
08-29-2003, 01:39 PM
"not those stinking drywall screws that everyone seems to love for some reason."

Because I'm an idiot? :spin: They are cheaper and they do the intended job of keeping the bracing in place until the glue dries. They certainly aren't intended to hold an enclosure together. Many years ago I too used 2-1/4" #8 wood screws. After busting a half-dozen or so enclosures apart I realized that once the glue was dry the screws were superfluous as intended. ;)

"I get the local Mom and Pop lumber yard to whack down the MDF to size"

Yeah, I've taken to doing that as well. I'm sick of dragging 4 x 8 slabs around :coolness:

"Grab the Jasper Circle Jig - Link from PartsExpress, and you'll be in baffle heaven."

I've gone through three of those things and it's been well worth it :p

"Do you use thin veneer the kind that comes rolled up?"

Yeah

luxmanlover
08-29-2003, 01:54 PM
I hear what your saying about the glue....100% correct. My beef with drywall screws is that they brittle, which means they break all too often as you tighten them, leaving you with a potential mess to fix, but the main reason I hate them and all Philips head screws for that matter is that they fall off the driver 90% of the time. Robertson on the other hand are a positive fit on the driver and won't strip out unless wildly off axis. You can stick a robertson screw on the driver hold it at any angle and it will stay, with out so much as a magnetic driver tip.
Kelly

luxmanlover
08-29-2003, 01:56 PM
And no... I didn't glue the screw in!!!
Kelly

boputnam
08-29-2003, 02:00 PM
You can stick a robertson screw on the driver hold it at any angle and it will stay, with out so much as a magnetic driver tip. Yea, but look-out Kelly - while you were posing, somebody stole your door! Ha!

And, on the breaking of drywall screws - I finally wised-up and started drilling larger holes. But it took me a while to get it... :banghead:

4313B
08-29-2003, 02:07 PM
"My beef with drywall screws is that they brittle, which means they break all too often as you tighten them, leaving you with a potential mess to fix, but the main reason I hate them and all Philips head screws for that matter is that they fall off the driver 90% of the time. Robertson on the other hand are a positive fit on the driver and won't strip out unless wildly off axis. You can stick a robertson screw on the driver hold it at any angle and it will stay, with out so much as a magnetic driver tip."

Ah! :p And I thought slotted was evil :D

"And no... I didn't glue the screw in!!!"

Huh? You didn't screw the glue in??? :p

P.S. My drywall screws don't break :hmm: I think they are made at the one remaining steel plant still in the U.S.A.

Mr. Widget
08-29-2003, 03:31 PM
Originally posted by Robh3606
Just curious about this. I do and was wondering if any of you do and how?? You use MDF or plywood or a combination?? You do butt joints, lock meiters use screws or glue of both?? What size braces 1x2 2x3 2x4?? What kind of tools??

I use MDF and plywood with butts joints held together with glue and screws, its easy. :) Braces are 1x2 flat and 2x3 on end at odd panel dimensions. No 2 braced areas are the same size. Ports are PVC pipe. Sub-enclosures are Sonotubes.

How about tools?? Table saw, Circular saw, Radial arm?? Router or plunge cutter?? Sanders??

Rob:)

At one time or another I have used virtually all of the techniques and materials you have mentioned. I am spoiled as I have a complete shop for my business with a better selection and far better quality tools at my disposal than any Home Despot.

I would like to make a few recommendations to anyone about to purchase tools for speaker or furniture building.

If you use veneered MDF or plywood and miter the corners you will need several band clamps and probably a few bar or pipe clamps as well.

Instead of screwing cabinets together, which is fine, I use a narrow crown stapler. You need one that can fire 1.5" long staples. Most of the inexpensive imports won't take the longer staples. Unfortunately the good ones cost $200-$300 but once you've shot a box together in a couple of seconds you'll never want to use screws again. Of course screws or staples are only used if you will be veneering the cabinet. If you do use screws and then veneer the cabinet I would recommend that once the cabinet is fully dry you remove the screws and fill the holes prior to veneering as the screws can back out with time. As far as breaking screws goes, pre drilling is good for harder woods, and there are different grades and sizes of screws available.

For sanders I would recommend that you not get a belt sander unless you are experienced with them. If you do get one, get a 4" wide model. I would highly recommend that you get a random orbital sander preferably one with some sort of dust collection feature that you can hook up to your shop vac. Finally you will need a jitter bug style finishing sander. The Makita is ok but noisy, I prefer the Porter Cable.

I would not buy a radial arm saw as they are not very accurate, but if you have one they do work.

If you don't have the room or budget for a proper table saw, you can get a self clamping straight edge to use with a circular saw. The one I have is an aluminum extrusion that is a little over 8 feet long with a pocket underneath to except two clamps that slide along under it so that you clamp it down to your plywood and ride along the edge with your saw. I bought it 25 years ago before I had a table saw but I still use it on occasion for cutting odd angles or as a router jig. You can accomplish the same thing with a straight piece of wood and two C clamps but they are not very convenient.

Ah, the table saw. I have a 5 horsepower Powermatic. It is a joy to use but it requires a 25 amp 240V circuit, costs over $2,000, and isn't particularly useful without extension tables. For speaker building I wouldn't recommend any table saw without extension tables. If you don't have the room for the extension tables you will probably have better results with a good circular saw and the cutting guide I mentioned earlier. If you do have the room, buy the most powerful saw you can afford. My first saw was the classic Sears 1 horse contractor style saw. I quickly found I had to buy a bigger motor or use thin kerf blades. There are many saws from companies like JET that are acceptable. Make sure you get the fence upgrade. I like the Biesemeyer T-Square, but there are copies that will probably work well also.

Here are two links. The first is a decent place to find power tools and the other is the best hardware source on earth.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/browse/-/228013/ref%3Drd%5Ftoolcrib%5Famazon%5Fcom/002-8182689-4504024

http://www.mcmaster.com/

luxmanlover
08-29-2003, 07:50 PM
"P.S. My drywall screws don't break I think they are made at the one remaining steel plant still in the U.S.A."
Ain't that the truth......you get what you pay for with everything!!!!!!!!

As far as my DOOR goes....2 things come to mind...
A) You noticed? LOL
B) When I first moved in here a few years ago, I took the doors off the family room to get furniture in thru the non-standard door opening. I put the doors outside and they did get swiped!!!!!

Kelly

boputnam
08-29-2003, 08:26 PM
You noticed? LOL Yea, and you're a Leftie! THAT is cool... :coolness: