Discussion of the various 4412 models

[SteveJewels]

I am interested in knowing more about the various 4412 models. Please help me assemble a comprehensive list of all of the variants of the 4412 series. Please also post your reviews, critiques and observations for any model with which you are familiar. Links to threads on LH and outer sites would be much appreciated. Comparisons of one version to another would be particularly helpful.


I have seen;

4412
4412a
4412AL-1
4412AR-1

Thanks.

[BMWCCA]

I am interested in knowing more about the various 4412 models. Please help me assemble a comprehensive list of all of the variants of the 4412 series. Please also post your reviews, critiques and observations for any model with which you are familiar. Links to threads on LH and outer sites would be much appreciated. Comparisons of one version to another would be particularly helpful.


I have seen;

4412
4412a
4412AL-1
4412AR-1

Thanks.I'm only aware of two versions. I think your L and R designations may be simply right and left. The original 4412 has a nice wood veneer and adjustable L-pads with an incorporated bass duct. The 4412A comes only in a Formica-ish gray/black veneer, has no L-pad, and uses the later 052ti tweeter (which has also been listed as a replacement for the 035ti in the 4412, I believe). The PDF for the -1 version says:

NOTE: DIFFERENCE ON THE-1 VERSION IS A NEW DARKER/SHINY VINYL USED ON THE BAFFLE ASSEMBLY

The components and crossover seem to be identical to the others. :dont-know:

[rusty jefferson]

Here's one about the 035 tweeters in the 4412.

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?28026-Are-my-tweeters-OK

[BMWCCA]

Here's one about the 035 tweeters in the 4412.

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?28026-Are-my-tweeters-OK
Thanks for that trip down "Thomas Wagner" memory lane! ;)

[SEAWOLF97]

Thanks for that trip down "Thomas Wager" memory lane! ;)

I preferred the "Joseph Smith Jr." memory lane! (no, not the LDS guy)

Back to topic. 035 HF's . Haven't done foam replacement on these, but 044's not too difficult.

(or mebbe it was The Tony ML ) :dont-know:

LATER: on the subject of titanium hf's .... many of my 035 speakers for some reason just
didn't get retained, but i seem to like the slightly mellower (to me) 044Ti's sound more.


I'm only aware of two versions. I think your L and R designations may be simply right and left.

beat me to that one. :( (or left & right)

[martin_wu99]

I am interested in knowing more about the various 4412 models. Please help me assemble a comprehensive list of all of the variants of the 4412 series. Please also post your reviews, critiques and observations for any model with which you are familiar. Links to threads on LH and outer sites would be much appreciated. Comparisons of one version to another would be particularly helpful.


I have seen;

4412
4412a
4412AL-1
4412AR-1

Thanks.
Another post?:crying:
There are no secrets and stories behind 4412,just using searching function.
But you think too muchf:confused:from 2123 to 4430,from 2392 to 4412?:dont-know:
There are many many informations in this forum,i believe your English is better than me:D

[macaroonie]

Then of course there is the L90 , Danish made ( Boxes only ? ) and mostly sold in Europe.

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?8694-JBL-L-90

The only reason I mention it is that it uses an 050 tweet ie. not the 035ti.

I noticed in that thread there was mention of them being bass shy , IMO rear firing ports need careful positioning of the speaker or the port output becomes choked.

[SteveJewels]

Another post?:crying:
But you think too muchf:confused:from 2123 to 4430,from 2392 to 4412?:dont-know:
There are many many informations in this forum,i believe your English is better than me:D

Quite simple Martin, two different things.

The big 4 way speaker project, 2235/2123/2445/2405 (I have several different horns to try and if things go well, will get some Truextent Be diaphragms.) will take a while to complete. In the mean time I want to have some decent smaller speakers to listen with, hence the search for a studio monitor with a 12" woofer. I like JBLs but I am not particularly familiar with many of the models or their performance so I ask for information here.

I gave up on the big horns. I had 3 of them but they were stolen.

The 2123 is still in the plan, for the big speaker project. The 4412 is the top candidate to hold me over until the big speaker project is completed.

[Ian Mackenzie]

Why not arrange a forum working group and knock over the main project?

[richluvsound]

Why not arrange a forum working group and knock over the main project?

:dont-know:Why not build something with Piezo tweeter in it ... ?

[grumpy]

https://youtu.be/rkUkVxM6R8o

[brutal]

Thanks for that trip down "Thomas Wagner" memory lane! ;)

That's what I was thinking. The only person I've ever put on my ignore list.

[martin_wu99]

Quite simple Martin, two different things.

The big 4 way speaker project, 2235/2123/2445/2405 (I have several different horns to try and if things go well, will get some Truextent Be diaphragms.) will take a while to complete. In the mean time I want to have some decent smaller speakers to listen with, hence the search for a studio monitor with a 12" woofer. I like JBLs but I am not particularly familiar with many of the models or there performance so I ask for information here.

I gave up on the big horns. I had 3 of them but they were stolen.

The 2123 is still in the plan, for the big speaker project. The 4412 is the top candidate to hold me over until the big speaker project is completed.
Really?who had stolen your big horns:eek:?the fact is that 4412 is not so superior,if you really like big horn,go find S2600,it is a 12'' big horn speaker,if you insist on monitor speaker,LSR6312 is the best choise,it will give you more
details than any other 12'' monitor speakers,George Lucas Studio use it to produce big movie.

[SEAWOLF97]

I've gone thru a number of JBL bookshelves in the last 10 years
==>> L7,L15,L16,L19*,L26,L36,L40,L56,L65,L80t,L88,L100, L166, 4310b,4312,
4406,4410,4412,18ti**,120ti***,250ti****,radiances ,bolivars,cl505,pb subs*..etc.

and most likely more that I can't remember. (yes phil, not all are bookshelves)

I judge a set by how much they are missed when gone. Out of the above list, the
only that I shouldn't have sold were the L166 Horizons.

*=still have.
** still in box, only kept for 044ti insurance
***listening to right now
****rarely used, but saving for son

[Doctor_Electron]

I've gone thru a number of JBL bookshelves in the last 10 years
==>> L7,L15,L16,L19*,L26,L36,L40,L56,L65,L80t,L88,L100, L166, 4310b,4312,
4406,4410,4412,18ti**,120ti***,250ti****,radiances ,bolivars,cl505,pb subs*..etc.

and most likely more that I can't remember. (yes phil, not all are bookshelves)

I judge a set by how much they are missed when gone. Out of the above list, the
only that I shouldn't have sold were the L166 Horizons.

*=still have.
** still in box, only kept for 044ti insurance
***listening to right now
****rarely used, but saving for son
SEAWOLF, I have not heard of a 4310B. Is that one of the recent reissue series?
Regards, D_E

[SteveJewels]

Thanks to everyone that contributed to this thread, it was very helpful.

[SEAWOLF97]

SEAWOLF, I have not heard of a 4310B. Is that one of the recent reissue series?
Regards, D_E

4311b .... (worn out fingers :crying:)

[martin_wu99]

Thanks to everyone that contributed to this thread, it was very helpful.
Do you have the idea?

[SteveJewels]

I am looking for some 4412's. 🙂

[martin_wu99]

I am looking for some 4412's. ��
Not bad,get them and enjoy them,my first JBL speaker is 4208:D

[Doctor_Electron]

4311b .... (worn out fingers :crying:)

Thanks Seawolf. I thought that I had missed a variation.

I worked with the first generation 4310's at a place called Schafer Electronics who built the audio portions of radio station equipment from the mixer to the transmitter input. Also NAB cart machines and http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAABkAAAAUCAMAAAB PqWaPAAAAHlBMVEUAAADGIQD/QgD/ayH/hEL/lGP////8A/sAAAD////zCMULAAAACHRSTlP/////////AN6DvVkAAACISURBVHicfdBJFoAgDAPQ0Ba8/42NHXiiYpZ O4HjHUS xEzaRqRt5K8bZs3yE7uVAMrI/I3zQ6DGuK1zCL2zNYrm1iCQxsAUcfGS3gcDOHFOSzEvoYyQnBP zzSnawZDdkrS2Y8 S3JpjQnhO7KYRXLbeI0kqj3tIEt/rDfIeL5crt3drm7f2nMs1B76IPWuoAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC automation systems.


Schafer had a demo room where they could show off how their gear sounded. The room was built to all current (1976) NAB and AES standards and produced a very good sound. If I located myself further forward than the "audience" section and went nearfield, it was apparent that the 4310's could produce very fine details on well produced music product. Maybe it was "cheating" to have early generation (from the master tapes) 15 ips reel to reel tapes played on Scully and other similar quality machines to showcase Schafer electronics, but the setup served its purpose. One could only be impressed with what was heard during those playbacks.

As far as I know the only thing different about those very early production 4310's was the foilcal art and knobs used which bordered on being ugly.

I am sure that any of the speakers you mentioned in your post would sound very satisfactory to you if located in that room, pointing out the severity of the limitations of our home listening areas and how much these limitations drive our quests for having the perfect JBL's. You most likely have had them.

[SEAWOLF97]

Maybe it was "cheating" to have early generation (from the master tapes) 15 ips reel to reel tapes played on Scully and other similar quality machines to showcase Schafer electronics, but the setup served its purpose. One could only be impressed with what was heard during those playbacks.


DE

I picked up a Sansui cassette deck (later verified to be made by Nak) at the Subic PX. It included a demo tape. Physical tape seemed liked nothing special, but it was the best sound I ever got from that deck . It even rivaled my 7 1/2 ips tapes from the Teac 4010s.

Always wondered how they made those demos sound so nice. :dont-know:

[SteveJewels]

I 'accidentally' bought a pair of 4412a's. They were listed on eBay at a price that I thought was too high. Then one day the listed changed from 'Buy it now' to adding 'Make an offer'. I made what I thought was a lowish offer and it was accepted within minutes.

They will arrive next week but my pre-amp and amp will not be here until the week after. That will give me time to find some stands.

Thanks again for all the information.

[martin_wu99]

I 'accidentally' bought a pair of 4412a's. They were listed on eBay at a price that I thought was too high. Then one day the listed changed from 'Buy it now' to adding 'Make an offer'. I made what I thought was a lowish offer and it was accepted within minutes.

They will arrive next week but my pre-amp and amp will not be here until the week after. That will give me time to find some stands.

Thanks again for all the information.
Congrats,so you can begin your JBL journey from now

[Doctor_Electron]

:dont-know:Why not build something with Piezo tweeter in it ... ?

Masochist!:barf:

[Doctor_Electron]

DE

I picked up a Sansui cassette deck (later verified to be made by Nak) at the Subic PX. It included a demo tape. Physical tape seemed liked nothing special, but it was the best sound I ever got from that deck . It even rivaled my 7 1/2 ips tapes from the Teac 4010s.

Always wondered how they made those demos sound so nice. :dont-know:

The demos were not produced on mass duplication equipment. Some cassette duplicators I've seen ran at up to 60 ips for the source and duplicator tapes. It is specially formulated tape, but only as such to make it work in those conditions.

The early cassette machines and tapes leaned heavily on Dolby noise reduction as well. Club blow-fi.

Pioneer made some reel to reel quality cassette machines that "weighed a ton" and were top performers.

If you can enter the hi-fi mindset of well to do Japanese music lovers at the time when the quality of Japanese gear was at its apex, you will know that such discriminating equipment owners would accept no compromise in their gear. This drove the TOTL equipments' over the top research and build qualities that were as much art as they were copper, silicon, and brushed aluminum machinery.

At the time you picked up the cassette machine at the "Main 'Change", "Cubi Cubi Cubi!" 'change, or the B-6 Annex, your purchase fell right in that time frame.

Man, If I knew then what I know now, I would have bought every AU-9900 I could afford and a matching tuner there. I had no clue whatsoever that some of that Japanese gear was so darned good.:banghead:

[Doctor_Electron]

stevejewels, I could accidentally buy a pair of 4412A's as well.

Only it would not have been an accident !:D

[martin_wu99]

stevejewels, I could accidentally buy a pair of 4412A's as well.

Only it would not have been an accident !:D
Yes,4412A is very common,and Steve will accidentally buy his pre-amp and amp again:D:applaud:

[SteveJewels]

Yes,4412A is very common,and Steve will accidentally buy his pre-amp and amp again:D:applaud:

Well, now that you mention it, there is a pre-amp that popped up for sale the other day.............

[martin_wu99]

Well, now that you mention it, there is a pre-amp that popped up for sale the other day.............
BTW,I think tube amp is more suitable for JBL speakers:)

[SEAWOLF97]

BTW,I think tube amp is more suitable for JBL speakers:)

My 4412's responded well to lots of power.

[SteveJewels]

My 4412's responded well to lots of power.

I expect to find that you are right. The efficiency on these is not particularly high, only 89dB for 1 Watt in.

Besides, I just sold an MC225 and MX110. 🙂🙂🙂

[martin_wu99]

My 4412's responded well to lots of power.

No need of lots of power,only single-ended tube could make 4412A happy:D

[martin_wu99]

I expect to find that you are right. The efficiency on these is not particularly high, only 89dB for 1 Watt in.

Besides, I just sold an MC225 and MX110. ������

Efficiency is not so important,the key is how to match it,try as many gears as you can.

BTW,Don't forget the 4 things you have promised me:D

[SteveJewels]

Efficiency is not so important,the key is how to match it,try as many gears as you can.

BTW,Don't forget the 4 things you have promised me:D

It was only two things. Each time you tell it you add one. LOL

[SEAWOLF97]

I 'accidentally' bought a pair of 4412a's.

Be careful with the grilles (and their pegs) , they are made from gonnabreakium.

[Doctor_Electron]

Well, now that you mention it, there is a pre-amp that popped up for sale the other day.............

Is there a way to choose exactly which components that one is accidentally buying? :spin:

[SteveJewels]

Is there a way to choose exactly which components that one is accidentally buying? :spin:

Yeah. LOL

Search patiently for something you would like to have and make an offer at a price that would please you greatly. If you get it, you get it, if not wait for the next one.

You miss some but the ones you get are sweet and are a very pleasant surprise.

Sometimes I will make an offer on something I don't really intent to buy but if I get it at the price I will enjoy it for a while and maybe keep it or maybe sell it.

I get to experience some equipment that I might not otherwise get to hear for an extended period.

I came back to this thread to say that I finally got the 4412a's up on stands and I am VERY pleased with them.

They have some 3/8" holes left over from where they had mounting plates bolted on the top. I haven't decided whether I will fill them of use them for jacks and tri-amp the speakers.

82646

[SEAWOLF97]

Are you going to repair/replace the mashed 052 ? are they both that way ?

looks like someone unfamiliar with JBL put the foam on the front ?

[SteveJewels]

Are you going to repair/replace the mashed 052 ? are they both that way ?

looks like someone unfamiliar with JBL put the foam on the front ?

I am going to contact the seller first.

The left is ok.

Why do you comment on the foam?

[martin_wu99]

I am going to contact the seller first.

The left is ok.

Why do you comment on the foam?
Congratulations!seems you'v got a real bargain accidently again :D
Most of these speakers have replaced foam surround,check them carefully.
No necessary to tri-amp it, a tube amp will make it sing :applaud:

[SteveJewels]

Are you going to repair/replace the mashed 052 ?

My understanding is that the 052Ti is not repairable. The seller has offered to credit me the cost of a replacement.

The foam is behind the cone.