Phenolic 2446?

[Micke]

Hi, everybody! New member, first post. Please let me know if im posting this in the wrong section of the forum. Or if the question already has been answered elsewhere, point me in the right direction. Thanks. :) Now to my simple (and probably stupid question). Will a phenolic 2482 diapraghm fit in a 2446 driver?

[jbl4ever]

Hello and welcome to LH. The 2482 Dia. will not fit the 2446. The 2482 has a different screw clamp arrangement

[1audiohack]

Hi Micke;

Welcome to Lansing Heritage.

They wont is the short answer. The retainer screw circle is larger on the phenolics.

I always wondered if the phase plugs were also different in any way and I might be able to answer that this weekend.

All the best,
Barry.

[Micke]

Thanks for your reply, gentlemen. As I feared, then. Im guessing there is proabaly more that differs than just the diaphragm? Im very intrigued by the sharp shelf/LP at 5k......

[1audiohack]

Yes all done by 5300 Hz.

I love the way they sound but it really takes more than a super tweeter to make up the top.

What are you building?
Barry.

[Micke]

2-way for electric guitar/bass. Hence i really need/want the sharp cutoff to "simulate" a 12-15" cone. But with much better dispersion, of course. Are there any modern equivalents to the 2482 that you know of?

[1audiohack]

JBL made about 100 2450CM NeO magney drivers that use the 2482 diaphragm. There are some for sale on eBay currently, new and not cheap.

I bought a pair to see what if anything was different besides the bolt circle in a “modern” phenolic driver. I hope to get them apart this weekend.

Barry.

[Micke]

899usd. :eek: Must be one tasty driver. Cant seem to find any freq.graphs/datasheet. Which isnt strange, seeing as they only built 100pcs. About the sharp 2482 5k roll off.........I have a faint memory of reading something, somewhere about it having to do with diaphragm to phase plug distance. A compliance (sp?) thing. Could this be true?

[1audiohack]

I assume the distance from diaphragm to phase plug is larger than their HF cousins so they can play lower louder.

I have aquired the means to measure the heights of domes and diaphragms since I had my last pair of 2482’s apart but now I can see what is true and not.

I will keep you posted.

Barry.

[Micke]

Thanks, Barry. Looking forward to your findings. In the meantime im going to start searching for 2482´s in Sweden/EU. Might take a while. I have NEVER seen one up for sale.

[Earl K]

I assume the distance from diaphragm to phase plug is larger than their HF cousins so they can play lower louder.

I have aquired the means to measure the heights of domes and diaphragms since I had my last pair of 2482’s apart but now I can see what is true and not.

I will keep you posted.

Barry.

Hi Barry,

If you're taking measurements you might also see if a 2482 diaphragm will actually fit into the 2446's gap ( without binding ).

The gap in the 2482 was wider compared to the 2440 ( .043 vs .036 ).

I've never seen an official gap measurement for any of the newer ferrite/neodym. magnet type, 4" diaphragmed drivers.

:)

[sguttag]

I've never seen an official gap measurement for any of the newer ferrite/neodym. magnet type, 4" diaphragmed drivers.

:)

Which driver are you interested in?

.036: 375H, 376, 2415H, 2416H, 2416H-1, 2417H, 2440, 2441, 2445H/J, 2446H/J,2447H/J, 2450H/J, 2450SL (74114X), 2451H/J/HPL/H-1, 2490H

.038: 2430HPL (125-30000-01X), 2431H (339894-002X), 2432H (365512-001X),2435HPL, D2430K (446213-001X)


The beloved D2 is on the "Most recent" sheet which is dated October 1st, 2013.:)

[Micke]

Hm......Next stupid question. What would be the potential downsides of guiding the output of the CD to the horn throat through a tube/pipe? Im a little short on enclosure space and these 2446 are massive! Im thinking that a tube/pipe has resonances. If i damp it with foam/fiberglass will it be "ok"? Remember, this is for electric guitar/bass NOT hifi sound reproductions so I can live with a few peaks and notches. The tube/pipe would be around 1m in length and 2" dia. (duh).

[jbl4ever]

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The 2482 diaphragm is almost 1/2" in diameter larger than the 2446. Also the mounting holes due not line up. In a 3 way system the 2407 ring radiator works very well crossed over between 4.8Khz and 5 Khz. It is a great driver when you have to go low 350-400Hz on 2360 horns. Hope this helps:)

[jbl4ever]

2482 overall diameter 5.45"
2446 overall diameter 4.97"

Earl, the 2446 diaphragm will not fit into the 2482 frame as the alignment pins are set at a different distance. The diaphragms outer dimensions hits the pins and will not let it seat. Its close but no go.

[Earl K]

Which driver are you interested in?

.036: 375H, 376, 2415H, 2416H, 2416H-1, 2417H, 2440, 2441, 2445H/J, 2446H/J,2447H/J, 2450H/J, 2450SL (74114X), 2451H/J/HPL/H-1, 2490H

.038: 2430HPL (125-30000-01X), 2431H (339894-002X), 2432H (365512-001X),2435HPL, D2430K (446213-001X)


The beloved D2 is on the "Most recent" sheet which is dated October 1st, 2013.:)


Thanks very much for that!

I don't think any of those newer drivers had their gap widths previously published ( here at LHF ).

:)

[Earl K]

2482 overall diameter 5.45"
2446 overall diameter 4.97"

Earl, the 2446 diaphragm will not fit into the 2482 frame as the alignment pins are set at a different distance. The diaphragms outer dimensions hits the pins and will not let it seat. Its close but no go.


Do the newer ( non-Alnico ) 4"-diaphragmed drivers have those same locating pins for the diaphragms ?

I only own 2440's, 2441's and 2482's which ( as you say ) have diaphragm locating pins which prevent the seating of a 2482 diaphragm into a 2440/2441 body.

If the 2446 doesn't have those pins could one duct-tape a 2482 fram in place ( as a temporary? measure ).

:)

[sguttag]

Thanks very much for that!

I don't think any of those newer drivers had their gap widths previously published ( here at LHF ).

:)

Not a problem. Here is a more complete listing of the compression drivers:

.025: 075 (all), 076, 077, 2403, 2414H-C (5000169X)

.029: LE25 (all), LE20 (all), LE26, 401-132, 035TI,-A, 2412H (125-1000-00X),2412H-1 (339013-001X),

.031: LE85, LE175, 034, 044, 066, 2402,-H, 2404H, H-1(62504-02X), 2405,-H,2410, 2420, 2421, 2425H/J, 2426H/J, 2427H/J, 2460, 2461, 2470

.032: 2406H (337213-001X), 2406H-1 (33721003X), 2407H (339150-001X), 2407J(339150-003X), 2408H (361549-001X), 2408H-1 (365011-001X), 2408J(361549-003X)

.036: 375H, 376, 2415H, 2416H, 2416H-1, 2417H, 2440, 2441, 2445H/J, 2446H/J,2447H/J, 2450H/J, 2450SL (74114X), 2451H/J/HPL/H-1, 2490H

.038: 2430HPL (125-30000-01X), 2431H (339894-002X), 2432H (365512-001X),2435HPL, D2430K (446213-001X)

.039: 2418H (315436-001X), 2418H-1

.040: LE5 (all), 2105, 2105H, 2485J,

.041: 2452H (352328-001X), 2452H-SL (352328-001X)

.043: 375AB, 375FH, 375EX, 375HP, 2480, 2482

[Micke]

Ok. So i have been playing around with the 2446 and a couple of CD horns. Sounds good but a sharp 5k LPF is definitly needed. Easy to fix in "active world" with a LPF and 5K boost to eq the CD roll of. BUT..... I would really like to keep things passive if possible. Ideas for a passive LPF with peaking response? Driver Z is 16R. Im guessing some sort of high order filter. Chebyshev or Cauer, maybe. Any thoughts on the matter are greatly appreciated.

[Micke]

Oh. Just to be clear. Passband ripple doesnt matter here. Might be a good thing, actually.

[ivica]

Ok. So i have been playing around with the 2446 and a couple of CD horns. Sounds good but a sharp 5k LPF is definitly needed. Easy to fix in "active world" with a LPF and 5K boost to eq the CD roll of. BUT..... I would really like to keep things passive if possible. Ideas for a passive LPF with peaking response? Driver Z is 16R. Im guessing some sort of high order filter. Chebyshev or Cauer, maybe. Any thoughts on the matter are greatly appreciated.

Hi Micke,

may be can help, while Z= 12 R driver impedance approximation can be used for LPF at 5kHz

http://www.mh-audio.nl/crossovernetworksforloudspeakers.asp#


(http://www.mh-audio.nl/crossovernetworksforloudspeakers.asp#)http://audiojudgement.com/passive-crossover-schematic-types/


regards
ivica

[Micke]

Hi ivica. Thanks for the links! Very usefull reading.

[more10]

I know where you can get a nice pair in Sweden. They will not be cheap though.

[Rudy Kleimann]

JBL made about 100 2450CM NeO magney drivers that use the 2482 diaphragm. There are some for sale on eBay currently, new and not cheap.

I bought a pair to see what if anything was different besides the bolt circle in a “modern” phenolic driver. I hope to get them apart this weekend.

Barry.

There are some Compact Monitor Systems (CMS Brand) 3-way monitors for sale on the bay right now. The seller states that the 2450CF (F? Typo?) are special-built for CMS by JBL, and that they can be fitted with a standard 2450 diaphragm...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/JBL-Compact-Stage-Monitors-for-sale-4-monitors-in-road-cas/311526456079?hash=item48886c7b0f%3Ag%3AJQ0AAOSwZG9 WmAKa&_sacat=0&_nkw=JBL+compact+monitors&_from=R40&rt=nc&LH_TitleDesc=0

Click on the "See full item description" button...

Barry, can you shed any light on this?

I also identified a pair of odd, wide-flare, round horns I have that fit the ferrite ring radiator magnets as the 2402CM UHF horn/driver used in these CMS triamp systems.
They look like the 2402 horn, but a little longer and with about twice the flare rate. It appears that the "bullet" is different too, but the pictures in the auction aren't good enough to be sure. I don't have the phase plugs, unfortunately.:(