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View Full Version : What to do about original Lans-A-Loy surrounds hardening? Can they be "softened"? or?



transducergeek
12-20-2004, 12:08 AM
Hello Kind JBL'ers..... Do I have no choice but to replace the Old Original "yellow" type of mid 60's surround "underoll" found on many types of LE series woofers? Is there any chemical "treatment" that will gently soften the ever hardening and brittle becoming, Lans-A-loy. A "crazy" friend of mine, who is otherwise intelligent, suggested useing spray silicone or something like that? I think it might ruin/wreck/destroy what is left of the surround, but I wonder..... can I keep it original and make it work correctly? Or am I Dreaming..?

I recently obtained a pair of otherwise beautiful vintage LE14A's and would like to get 'em running well again.. What are my options? Where do I purchase the best-quality and or best-price replacement 14 inch surrounds for these? I am an experienced Re-Surrounder but never on a 14 incher...

Love old JBL's


Sorry, this probably should be in Tech help section, can a moderator shift it?

Mr. Widget
12-20-2004, 01:07 AM
Do not use silicone, silicone oil, silicone glue, silicone lube, no no no.

If you have a steady hand you can treat the Lans-a-loy surround with brake fluid. DOT-3 I believe. Whichever one that is the most common is the correct type. There are two issues. One, if it gets on the white cone it will discolor it. Two, if it soaks into the backside of the cone it may make it difficult to glue a new surround on later. I have used it with great results, but a new surround will most likely be better. Frequently the spider is also tired so a complete recone may be in order.

Here is basic refoam info and recommendations for supplies.

http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=469

Welcome aboard!

Widget

Donald
12-20-2004, 07:01 AM
Widget,

Shall we break it to him gently that it is nigh impossible to get a factory recone kit for the LE14A?

transducergeek
12-20-2004, 07:29 AM
Thanks, guy's. I can tolerate a grey foam surround if it will work correctly. Who has the best ones' and if they are all generic, where is the best price? I think the spider is OK. This speaker ( I think) has been in "early retirement" for a few decades. Not much use since birth, low mileage. But has some sitting years on it. Plays well at low level now. won't turn it up till new surround. I don't think I will go the Dot 4 route, since I think eventually I will re-surround it and don't want to fight the BF... What is the technique with the black ring? Is that holding the surround to the frame? It seems to have a "split" Is that where I start working it off? What solvent is good to loosen the old adhesive? How do you handle that strange ring, I don't see that on any other woofers but those LE Lansings... Thanks...

Robh3606
12-20-2004, 07:47 AM
I had a pair of LE-14a with cracks surrounds. What I ended up doing was cutting out the lansalloy and installing with the foam on the rear like the newer drivers. What I probably should have done was remove the lanalloy from the front of the cone and install the surround upside down with the "C" facing in like the original lansalloy. What I did worked out fine and the drivers have been in use for a while with no issues but depending on how concentric the cone is it is tight doing it that way.

Rob:)

transducergeek
12-20-2004, 07:57 AM
I had a pair of LE-14a with cracks surrounds. What I ended up doing was cutting out the lansalloy and installing with the foam on the rear like the newer drivers. What I probably should have done was remove the lanalloy from the front of the cone and install the surround upside down with the "C" facing in like the original lansalloy. What I did worked out fine and the drivers have been in use for a while with no issues but depending on how concentric the cone is it is tight doing it that way.

Rob:)
Thanks, Rob. What solvent is good on the Orig. Glue? Where did you/should I obtain a new surround? I think I will remove the original Lans-A-Loy as much as I can. Even on the front of the cone.. When/if I do a new surround. I will try and get it fitted as an "underroll" configuration. As close to "original" as I can... I want to do the work myself, for me that is half the fun! Thanks so much for the suggestion about how you "should have" done it, that is at least a valuable as saying "I did it this way and was fine" Learning what others have discovered is what makes this forum so great! Thanks all..

Love old JBL!

Mr. Widget
12-20-2004, 09:42 AM
Who has the best ones' and if they are all generic, where is the best price?... What is the technique with the black ring? Is that holding the surround to the frame? It seems to have a "split" What solvent is good to loosen the old adhesive? How do you handle that strange ring, I don't see that on any other woofers but those LE Lansings... Thanks...
Look at the thread I posted and Bo so thoughtfully put together... the answers are there for you.

Widget

Steve Gonzales
12-20-2004, 02:06 PM
Hey Trans-G,

I wonder if M.E.K would dissolve that old surround ?. Methyl Ethyl Ketone -NASTY STUFF!!!!! BUT, It will MELT away normal foam, I'm not sure about "old yeller" though. CAUTION: Use the proper gloves and mask (filtered) and/or use in a well ventilated area. As you probably already know, start SLOW and test an area. This information is just about dissolving the "old yeller", I do not claim that it will work but I know that M.E.K. works on other types of surrounds. The link to refoaming is an EXCELLENT one, Kudos Mr Widget & Bo !.
:smthsail:

pelly3s
12-20-2004, 08:05 PM
Steve is right. MEK will work. I am yet to try it on the yellow foams but I do know its worked on every color of foam i've ever put it on. I have also found that the new Moyen cement that JBL is using will be reactivated with MEK if you use enough. Although the Locktite and L1300 have no activents (just a little info for all of you). The older JBL's use Bostik cement which MEK works on. If the spiders are worn out you can replace them too as long as you dont damage the cone or coil while lifting the spider. Where to get the foams try calling Making Waves.

transducergeek
12-20-2004, 10:18 PM
Steve is right. MEK will work. I am yet to try it on the yellow foams but I do know its worked on every color of foam i've ever put it on. I have also found that the new Moyen cement that JBL is using will be reactivated with MEK if you use enough. Although the Locktite and L1300 have no activents (just a little info for all of you). The older JBL's use Bostik cement which MEK works on. If the spiders are worn out you can replace them too as long as you dont damage the cone or coil while lifting the spider. Where to get the foams try calling Making Waves.
Thanks, Who is Making Waves and what is their number?
Rolf Erickson.

pelly3s
12-21-2004, 04:09 PM
they are a supply center for recone centers. I have a number for them at the shop i just keep forgetting to grab it. I'm not sure on their deal with sales to non coperate accounts or anything but I can find out for everyone.

pelly3s
12-22-2004, 12:15 PM
www.mwaspeakerparts.com that is the website for makin waves.

transducergeek
12-23-2004, 10:39 AM
www.mwaspeakerparts.com that is the website for makin waves.

Thanks, but these guys won't sell to "civilians", I have tried. Anyone else? Where do I get good prices on surrounds (generic), or of good quality? I need a pair of 14 inchers, and they are rare. What is your favorite glue/adhesive? I can use advise.. Thanks, Rolf Erickson.

4313B
12-23-2004, 10:56 AM
Rick Cobb has been posted about more times than I care to count.

Look up Bo's thread on surrounds.

Bo? Hook this guy up ok? Thanks! ;)

*****

Here - I had Outlook open anyway -

rcobb@tampabay.rr.com

Ask him to send you some LE14A surrounds. Get rid of that @%&*^!@ Lansaloy crap once and for all. :banghead:

Mr. Widget
12-23-2004, 11:07 AM
"Look up Bo's thread on surrounds."

Rolf, I pointed you to Rick via Bo's thread in the first reply to your beginning this thread. Along with the surrounds he will send you info and the glue etc.

Widget

transducergeek
12-23-2004, 12:11 PM
"Look up Bo's thread on surrounds."

Rolf, I pointed you to Rick via Bo's thread in the first reply to your beginning this thread. Along with the surrounds he will send you info and the glue etc.

Widget


Thanks for all the help Guy's. It's the 14 inchers, and the special JBL "12" inchers (9.75") (which are a little larger than "generic" 12's) that are peculiar and odd and hard to get from the cheap generic sales guy's. So I wanted to see if anyone had a source for cheap AND special parts. I think I am dreaming the dream of a dissapointed fool... I already have a good supply of generic "standard" size surrounds, I am seeking a supply of the other kind now.. Thanks again.. Let me know about any other sources than what you have done already, I may want to Liquidate some of my own Overstock of 8", 10" and 12", 15" standard size surrounds soon, too many to use myself, most of my woofers are now with new "edges" and are happy. Does anyone want 8" or 10" standard grey foam generic surrounds for $10/pair? (These fit most JBL) ------ Or 12", 15" for $13/pair? (These 12" don't fit most JBL,.. the 15" I don't know)... Let me know..

I love to "Re-Surround" things...

Rolf "Edgey" Erickson.

pelly3s
12-23-2004, 03:31 PM
my favorite glue is the Bostik that JBL used to send with a lot of their kits, but now it's the Moyen Cement that they use although it sets up really fast which makes it hard to work on foams. i didn't know makin waves wouldn't sell to the general public.

transducergeek
12-24-2004, 07:59 AM
Moyen cement. OK, I'll look for it. Thanks. For others' info, currently, I like DAP contact cement so far. Sets slowly, so is forgiving while working if you don't wait too long. And If you let it set before "contact" it is fairly instant if you need that property in working your stuff. But you have to use extremly small amounts or it will make quite a mess of your work..


Rolf Erickson.