Flippers and Worse

[Mr. Widget]

I brought this string over from another thread... I did so partly out of a basic curiosity, but also to try to better understand how we might be able to better welcome potential nubes and not have some of our Market Place threads spiral out of control into rude name calling rants.

My purpose is not to call out anyone positively or negatively for past events, I'm hoping we can find a way to better greet potential new members.



The OP appears to be but another hit-and-run "what's it worth" poster. Perhaps a flipper. If he comes back, maybe he'll explain. :dont-know:Why do so many of "us" care about these inquiries? There do seem to be a number of the regulars here who take offense from folks who have little or no interest in Lansing Heritage and even possibly no interest in audio, but have come across a vintage speaker and want to know what it is or what it's worth to someone else. My question is, if they are polite why do "we" care what the reason is for their inquiry?

Personally I prefer talking with like minded folks who are passionate about audio and better yet vintage Lansing gear, but it seems the right thing to do is to answer the "hit and run" crowd's questions or ignore them if you don't like their tone. Too often I see members chastise first time posters who want to know what dad left them or they found at a recent yard sale.


Widget

[Lee in Montreal]

Why do so many of "us" care about these inquiries? There do seem to be a number of the regulars here who take offense from folks who have little or no interest in Lansing Heritage and even possibly no interest in audio, but have come across a vintage speaker and want to know what it is or what it's worth to someone else. My question is, if they are polite why do "we" care what the reason is for their inquiry?

Personally I prefer talking with like minded folks who are passionate about audio and better yet vintage Lansing gear, but it seems the right thing to do is to answer the "hit and run" crowd's questions or ignore them if you don't like their tone. Too often I see members chastise first time posters who want to know what dad left them or they found at a recent yard sale.


Widget

While you are correct, there are also these people with absolutely no interest in Lansing products, or even in audio stuff, and only want to use the forum's resources for their own personal profit.

What about asking for a mandatory presentation as first post?

[Mr. Widget]

While you are correct, there are also these people with absolutely no interest in Lansing products, or even in audio stuff, and only want to use the forum's resources for their own personal profit.
Most people throughout the world have zero interest in Lansing Heritage or Audio... I would submit if it is important to you (not you individually, but to any Forum member) that a person shares your love for this stuff and isn't here solely for profit, you ask the poster before answering any questions something along the lines of, "I'll be happy to help, but only if you are asking for your own use, or only if you are not going to sell this item, or... "





What about asking for a mandatory presentation as first post?I'm not sure what this is. Do you mean post a photo?


Widget

[BMWCCA]

Too often I see members chastise first time posters who want to know what dad left them or they found at a recent yard sale.As the first responder in this thread, I'd like to say I answered his question, did some research he could have easily done himself, and even suggested that if he was a seller, he was welcome to list them here, but just let us know that that is the intent. If I was the least bit snarky, it was more toward the lack of initiative in doing his own research—not about the fact that he asked a value question on his first post.

And I even put in a winking smiley emoticon! That should count for something in the nuance-free Internet forum zone. :)

[Mr. Widget]

As the first responder in this thread, I'd like to say I answered his question, did some research he could have easily done himself, and even suggested that if he was a seller, he was welcome to list them here, but just let us know that that is the intent. If I was the least bit snarky, it was more toward the lack of initiative in doing his own research—not about the fact that he asked a value question on his first post.

And I even put in a winking smiley emoticon! That should count for something in the nuance-free Internet forum zone. :)I wasn't pointing fingers or suggesting that anyone was being rude on this thread, I simply am trying to understand why a handful of Forum members take such offense to strangers popping in wanting to know about gear.

Furthermore if they are here to help themselves become more informed sellers, what's the harm in that?


Widget

[Ian Mackenzie]

If you were a normal person ( a person with no expertise or prior knowledge in the subject matter) as in a court of law the jury might think the respondent was judgemental.

The question remains was the advice offered "good" advice?

Any one is entitled to their opinion.


My thoughts are some read far to much into a post and it suggests they have a week or so off the forums and get some fresh air.

[RedCoat23]

Personally speaking, I never respond to them at all. But my objections are this.

1. Lazy, they could (with a bit of effort) find this information by searching the internet in general or searching the site in particular.
2. They add zero, nada, zip, nothing to the conversation on here and are an annoyance to our regular business
3. They are happy to use the collective knowledge here and most cases, once the information is gleaned, disappear with nary a comment or thanks.
4. Exhibit the classic symptoms of entitlement and can be downright rude when called upon their self-serving behavior.

All of the above come wrapped in a huge IMHO; and perhaps I'm just seeing their behavior through my own selective filters. Either way, that's how I react when I see those posts.

Best Regards

RedCoat.

[Ian Mackenzie]

Perhaps he might be an innocent first time poster.

Most people become interested after they buy something.

So that gives the lurking respondent the right to be so circumspect as to be condescending and judgemental?

[RedCoat23]

Perhaps he might be an innocent first time poster.

Most people become interested after they buy something.

So that gives the lurking respondent the right to be so circumspect as to be condescending and judgemental?

There are always going to be some who fit into the category you're alluding to. Just as there are going to be some who fit into the other category.
By waiting I can determine which bucket they fit into. If it really is just fishing for easy information then I'm losing nothing by ignoring them. If, however, they stay around and seem engaged in the subject then I'd be happy to be welcoming.
Remember, these are personal preferences. Widget wanted to know why so I responded. I don't need to justify my reasons to others. They are my reasons. Just as those who differ are entitled to their reasons and I don't judge them for it even if I don't agree.

[Mr. Widget]

Personally speaking, I never respond to them at all.
And I think that is the correct response. Often the original poster is looking for a quick answer and is either too ignorant or too lazy to search for answers or do their own thinking... if you (we) don't feel compelled to answer their query then so be it.

As for your 4 points, I've certainly seen the first 3 often enough. I'm not sure about the 4th, but I appreciate your approach.


Perhaps he might be an innocent first time poster.

Most people become interested after they buy something.

So that gives the lurking respondent the right to be so circumspect as to be condescending and judgemental?And occasionally we do get these and many long time Forum members were in this category at one time. I prefer to give them the benefit of the doubt. If on the other hand they turn out to be an ass, then it will become obvious to everyone and the best practice is to let them get bored talking to themselves and go away.


Widget

[1audiohack]

"2. They add zero, nada, zip, nothing to the conversation on here and are an annoyance to our regular business."

I guess this is where I get lost. What exacty is our regular business?

"...people with absolutely no interest in Lansing products, or even in audio stuff, and only want to use the forum's resources for their own personal profit."

Who, what or where does this do any harm? Is there a finite amount of something here? It's not like we "loose" information.

We have a reputation of being pretty snotty here at Lansing Heritage. Help me understand how that is of any benefit to this forum.

Sorry Mr Widget, apparently all I have are questions.

Barry.

[srm51555]

Perhaps he might be an innocent first time poster.

Most people become interested after they buy something.

So that gives the lurking respondent the right to be so circumspect as to be condescending and judgemental?

I literally lurked in the Library for about 7 years before I ever posted.



We have a reputation of being pretty snotty here at Lansing Heritage. Help me understand how that is of any benefit to this forum.


I have been to another audio site get together's and our "passion" here did come up. I just replied that we have the same standard distribution of people just like any other community and many members are very helpful.

Personally I'd like to start a continuing thread that builds community here to find out more than srm51555 has a pair of M2+'s or Barry has 125+ woofers laying around:p. Speaker safari and some others are great examples of this. There are many great stories to be told here. Some of the OT reply's here are some of the greatest. Some are not so great also.

Anyway to answer the question Mr Widget asked, I usually take it on a case by case basis.

Thanks,
Scott

[grumpy]

Found the unofficial FAQ I had worked on years ago...


For me, it's something like this:

We're here to have a good time, learn a few things, share with others ...
mostly as relates to James B. Lansing's Heritage in regard to consumer (hi-fi) and pro audio history,
knowledge, and enjoyment. There is a clear bias toward older equipment and information,
but also interest and motivation in pursuing cutting-edge products and DIY
undertakings. Poke around. Ask questions. Wear a thick skin (it's the Internet). Enjoy.

[grumpy]

With newbie questions, if I'm interested and have time, I'll usually respond and often redirect. If not... I move on.

[SEAWOLF97]

.
Flippers and Worse

OKAY , you snared us in with the title , what IS worse ?

What could possibly be WORSE ? ISIS terrorists ? DJT supporters ?
you seem to have left us hanging (pun intended :) ) there ... see, if
I include a smiley , then ...well you know....

And flippers ? Without them much of this vintage gear would be in landfills.
I know a few of them and recognize that they have usually great product
knowledge , market smarts and often rescue and rehab gear to obtain selling
condition. VAR is a better term and VALUE ADDED Reseller is often a good
description.

I'm going to restrain, but WORSE for me is the audio snake oil sellers - new or used.
Magic cables , Shun Mook cr@p , cryo conditioning . At least the flippers are selling
a REAL product that they can demo.

Flippers ? Every used book store , used CD or record store , used plumbing store, used car dealership ...etc..etc is a flipper , only difference is that they have a business license.

[rusty jefferson]

This forum was literally the first thing I discovered on the Interweb when I got access back in 08-09 and Googled B-460. Took me a long time to figure things out and I'm sure I annoyed more than a few members.

The web is a good research tool, but I'm finding it's shortening my attention span for digging deep when asking a knowledgeable person/group a question can get you quick results.



.......What about asking for a mandatory presentation as first post?
A couple forums I'm using have an introduction requirement. I assume this is what Lee is referring to. Your first post has to explain your interest in what the forum is about, and can't be items for sale.

I don't have a problem with people looking for values here (though I generally don't have the knowledge), and I think there's been a few occasions where established members have purchased items put up for valuation. If items posted here have value to a member, all the better.

[Ed Zeppeli]

I applaud the members who make an effort to welcome newbies. All that information you've accumulated and take for granted may just be the hook (if shared) for a new visitor to become the next resident expert.

IIRC my first question here was answered (by Zilch) with what seemed like genuine interest and assistance. I kept coming back.

Some people won't come back, won't follow up with results, won't offer thanks to the respondent. Oh well. We may hope to snag one in ten but we keep trying. :)

I'm still receiving great tips and suggestions here and am grateful for it. In return I like to reply to the more basic questions as accurately as possible in order to alleviate the resident experts from feeling the obligation.

Cheers,

Warren