2206H for hifi without sub

[baldrick]

I have a pair of Infinity Kappa 9.2i that needs need woofers, the original dual 12s Inifinty/IMG is not very good but otherwise it's an OK speaker. Org x-over for bass is bypassed and it's now biamped With active x-over.

http://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/vennetra-der-hifimerker/368833d1456839761-infinity-s-venner-kappa9.jpg

So I was wandering if a pair of JBL 2206H could work in these speakers? I know 2206 is mainly used as midbass, but will it also work well fullrange? What would be the lower limit for 2206?

A pair for 1200FE would also be Nice, but hard to find :(

[Mr. Widget]

I can't imagine you would be happy with the bass extension. Even with 2 cu ft per woofer you can see from this JBL document, the bass extension is limited.

https://www.jblpro.com/pub/components/2206.pdf


Widget

[Earl K]

One wants a woofers EBP ( Energy Bandwidth Product ) to be less than 100hz ( to get reasonable bass extension ) .

EBP = ( woofers ) Fs / Qes

These models of ( JBL's older hifi ) 12" woofers would be better suited ( than the pro 2206H ) as retrofits.

ie; 128H-1, 2214H, le120h

You could collect these ( from eBay ) over time & restore their surrounds at your convenience .

One way or another, they are all good sounding ( & well built ) project woofers .

:)

[baldrick]

OK thanx, I'll better give up the thought about useing 2206, I imagined it would be simmilar as 2226 but Guess I was wrong. 1200FE is the prefered Choice but hard to find. I have/had both 128h-1 and le120h and they are OK, but not exactly what I'm looking for :)

I use Morel Ultimate (http://www.parts-express.com/morel-ultimate-uw-1258-12-subwoofer--297-132) 12s in the speakers today, but they are more of a subwoofer than bass and therefore I would like to replace them.

[Earl K]

So far all the JBL woofers mentioned here would need to have those Infinity cabinets re-tuned ( or ported, if they are currently sealed ) to optimize the woofers performance ( & that's assuming the internal volume of the cabinets is large enough ) .

I suspect that nothing of that sort has been done to date.

None of this is as simplistic as you'd like it to be.

:)

[gasfan]

I have a set of four C-1200 used in the Century Gold that I've tried in my Kappa 9s a few years ago. They are brand new so not loosened up. I remember them being more articulate with better definition. Now that you've brought up the issue, I think I'll pop them in tomorrow and let them settle in for a while :)

[pos]

A pair for 1200FE would also be Nice, but hard to find :(Don't you need 4 woofers?

[baldrick]

Don't you need 4 woofers?

A pair for each speaker :)

The cabinet is aprox 6cu ft tuned to 30hz so it's pretty nice for the right woofer

[pos]

I see the crossover frequency is 180Hz :
http://www.infinity-classics.de/models/Kappa-x.1i-x.2i-series1993/Kappa-9.2i/body_kappa_9_2i.html
That would be a waste for the 1200Fe, or you would have to bypass the midbass driver and let the top woofer reach the mid dome at 750Hz.

If you keep that 180Hz crossover frequency then my vote would go to the 128H, pretty damn good in the lower range.

[baldrick]

I have 128h in my 4412 and unfortunatly I don't think they are that good. They sound OK but nothing more and will not take very much power. My Morel woofer are WAY better than the 128h but I would like more punch than the Morel gives, therefore this thread :)

1200FE is really not that expensive if one can get them. I ordered a pair of 1500FE a while ago and they were aprox half the price of i.e. 2216ND, but unfortunatly the dealer can't get any more JBL drivers.

THere really should be a 12" Version of 2216ND :)

[pos]

1500fe less expensive than 2216nd?
Not from the sames sources I suppose, albeit JBL princing can be a bit weird and inconsistent...

What is it you don't like about the 128H?
In the 4412 it clearly has some "paper" coloration in the upper part of its range, most likely caused by cone breakups, but these are unlikely to happen in your situation as the cone will stay mostly pistonic in that < 180Hz range.

Another candidate would be the 252F from the LSR(63)32.

[baldrick]

1500fe were almost half the price of 2216nd and 1501fe.

128h is ok but not powerful and punchy enough, so Not exaxtly what looking for, le120 or 252f might be better, I liked le120 in TI5000 I had many years ago

[gasfan]

2203?

[sebackman]

Hi Baldrick,

One option would be to use a 2206 for bass and mid and add a 1200GTI 12" for extended bass and create a 2,5-way system. The 1200GTI uses the same basket as the 2206 but a heavy cone that gives more bass and lower Fs. They have similar sound pattern in the bass area.

You can just run them in parallel and put a >3mH coil in series with the 1200GTI so it rolls off at around 200-300Hz (or lower with a bigger coil). They sound very good up to about there. That means that only the 2206 will run all the way and meet the rest of the drivers.

The 2206 is 95db sensitivity and the 1200GTI is 92db but 4ohms so that is about the same. And both can take 600w RMS so it’s really no problem as the 2206 has a rather stiff surround. I feed mine with a 900W RMS amp. No problem so far albeit they are very very loud when using all that Power :-) .

Port the cabinet to about 30-40Hz. That is a bit too low for the 2206 and a bit high for the 1200GTI but in reality it works very well with both drivers working together.

I have done this a few times and it will give you the crisp mids of the 2206 but with extended bass. I have such a system up and running now, albeit with 2450SL/VTX above. It sound very good and with good bass. The 1200GTI and the 2206 blends seamless even if the combination may look odd at a first glance J

Or you can sell your empty cabinets to me as I have a second set of drivers laying around. :-)

Kind regards
//RoB

[baldrick]

Funny you should mention 1200GTI, I used them in another "hybrid" many years ago.

I had a pair of Cerwin Vega 1215 MK2, replaced the 3-way at top with speaker parts from JBL 120TI, and the 15 at the bottom was replaced With JBL 1200GTI, sounded pretty good :)

For Reference, org CV 1215 MK2 speaker:

http://www.minhembio.com/bilder/bild/?pic_id=254886.jpg


I also used a bunch of 1200, 1500 and 1800 GTI in my cars 15-20 years ago, they were hard to beat back in the days :)

[sebackman]

70358

[WilliO]

alternative should be the Beyma 12B100R, a beautiful speaker, very familiar to the well known JBL 2203H but with a much better QTS > bass response in a BR-cabinet.
Try to get a pair but it is not easy because Beyma has stopped the production last year. I have 3 of them in my front cabinets and can recomend them without any doubt. All you wish they do deliver!

Good luck
Willi

[speakerdave]

SB Acoustics might have something for you:
http://www.sbacoustics.com/index.php/products/woofers/nrx/12-sb34nrxl75-8/

[speakerdave]

I think the JBL 252G as noted by an earlier poster could well be the optimum choice if: 1) You can actually get hold of 4 of them; 2) They are not too expensive now; 3) Since they are a four ohm speaker you would need to be able to drive two ohms safely or dedicate a stereo power amp to the LF section of each speaker. However, I use singles in LSR32's for watching movies. They could possibly be a little bass-heavy in pairs. The voice coil is only 2 inch diameter, which, like the 3-inch in the 2216nd, may send some legacy JBL users running for the exits, but there are two drive coils plus a braking coil in a field using neodymium magnets. That puts as much wire in the gap, other things being equal, and with modern cone materials perhaps the other advantage of large-diameter coils is mooted.

An archived thread shows comparative simulations with the 2203:

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?2772-JBL-12-quot-Woofer

[sebackman]

Hi Baldrick

Attached is a picture of Franken Speakers I run in the work shop.

I have no idea why the system turns this picture 90 degrees because the original is not. Sorry for that.

Kind regards
//RoB

[grumpy]

70764

[baldrick]

Hi Baldrick

Attached is a picture of Franken Speakers I run in the work shop.

I have no idea why the system turns this picture 90 degrees because the original is not. Sorry for that.

Kind regards
//RoB

Those look pretty cool :) Those GTIs work well as subs, have had many of them :D

There seems to be a bug in vBulletin, that's why many pictures are rotated 90 degrees, especially when uploading Pictures from phone.