Making progress.

[bldozier]

Comming along with my project.
However my le14 surrounds were severly damaged in shipping
They are lansaloy, an irreplaceable, far as I know. Kinda bummed however I may have had to re surround
The le14s incidentally regardless,
The project is 4315a, using
2405
Le5-2 until I find 2105a
Le8t/le10/2018 cones
Le14a

Here is some of the damage, how simple is the removal of lansaloy, I have red threads I may way to use it if I can find some on this project. Any use an exacto to separate it from the cone as described in the re surround sticky...

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[bldozier]

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?36068-JBL-LE14-new-surrounds-assistance-needed&highlight=Lansaloy

I was offered a partial refund, all is not lost.

[BMWCCA]

Seriously, you would have wanted to re-surround them, anyway. Get the proper foam surrounds from Rick Cobb and this is one JBL application where you want to glue the new surrounds to the front. It will cover most of the damage from removing the Lansaloy and will be just what the factory would have done under their warranty or repair service.

Any refund you get should cover most of your repair, if not your time!

Good luck.

[Wagner]

However my le14 surrounds were severly damaged in shipping
They are lansaloy, an irreplaceable, far as I know. Kinda bummed however I may have had to re surround
No need to be bummed, the surrounds you show in your photos are NO GOOD to begin with and are not serviceable in any way
They need to be/should be replaced whether they became cracked in shipping or not

The brake fluid "fix" is bull shit in every regard (if that's what you were contemplating or using as a basis for your shipping complaint); if a driver is going to be relegated as a collectible or "shelf queen" them why put that shit anywhere near a cone? On the other hand, if you plan to actually use any of these drivers still in possession of those surrounds, in any sort of meaningful way (operating anywhere close to spec), then the Lansalloy needs to be replaced. You are intending to use these drivers, at least that is what you state.

JBL eventually considered it a defect

[Wagner]

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?36068-JBL-LE14-new-surrounds-assistance-needed&highlight=Lansaloy

I was offered a partial refund, all is not lost.
That's one hell of a "good" seller
Consider yourself very fortunate...............
.............and also consider doing the right thing and NOT accepting his offer

Thomas

[Wagner]

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?36068-JBL-LE14-new-surrounds-assistance-needed&highlight=Lansaloy

I was offered a partial refund, all is not lost.
Don't know why you posted this old thread link here?

BUT, the answer to the question just posed in your PM is right there

Photos not required:
NO SHARP TOOLS ON CONE - SLICE THE INTACT LANSALLOY CONCENTRICALLY USING A FRESH RAZOR BLADE OR RAZOR KNIFE
Adequately ventilated work area
Turntable (lazy Susan is not required but makes for a better time of things)
Cotton swabs
MEK
Patience

That's all it takes to get it off the cone

Thomas

[bldozier]

Thanks thomas, they ebay offered a full reimbursement for the cost of the sale, an I keep the driver, as a consolation. I refused an after msg the seller we were in agreement on a partial for this amount.

Since the item was damaged in SHIPPING. my liability in the matter is moot, if the seller used the free $200.00 insurance from his choice of shipping this woulda coved my end and the seller since I paid under $100.00 for the le14. Shipped.

Im now way stating it would have been used in its original condition as what thomas an other people have stated on lansing, reconditioned vintage willlay close if not better then og.

I will use the mek or 3m solvent remover as stated in the threads or leave this article to, a refoamer,

Thanks all for the kind words.
Brian

[bldozier]

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So, I was frantically searching for a 2105/le5-2 enclose for this 4315 project, the tube online are almost all 4"od a few
Rare 4" id tubes are around. I called a place yazoomills, which have a capability to custom mill cardboard tobes in id/od an wall thickness. The specified 4.5/4.18 od id combination was just over $150.00 for a 12" cardboard tube. YIKES. I was last night wondering where the tube was going to come from. And saw a l100t that used I think the fiberglass enclosure for the le5. I had did a deal a ways back for the 4" cardboard port from it, and the buyer gave me the le5 enclosures as well. I dug the the out and for sure they all fit. The cardboard is 4" id exactly, for those whom prefer to use it over other sources. I have the 2 3/4 id / 2 7/8 port in cardboard I bought specifically for this project already.

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[JeffW]

I'm not 100% sure about PVC pipe, but 4" steel pipe is 4.5" OD, and standard wall thickness is .237". That ends up at 4.026" ID. If PVC has the same wall thickness, that'd be close and cheap. I doubt there is much of a sonic difference between cardboard and PVC in this application.

[bldozier]

Found aluminum as well but I did not want to use that, thanks for your recommendation Jeff:)

[bldozier]

Its works nice, just not enough control without clamping, I will try and think of an alternative to cutting a rebate, w/o having to go buy a expensive tool. The stanley 45 again is nice to use and works as intended.

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[bldozier]

Works nicer then before, the stanley 45 requires some skill to use with enough control to plane the dado on the mdf, im only going in 1/4 so I wanted to give this another chance, I moved the fence to the right side, and this provided more then enough control ( im right handed working on my carpet ) I then removed the fence, and finished my 101 woodshop.
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[bldozier]

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Top & bottoms are cut and fitted one side, I was a bit adventures with the plane an will need some wood filler to be flush, they are not perfect but will be square and producing sweet sound.
Thanks saeman for the great write ups.
Hope to be finished cutting by the weekend.

These will be black on black or studio gray & black, I dont feel comfortable veenering them maybe after glue up I will change my mind, time will tell.

[bldozier]

So, iam cutting the rebates by hand, I dont have power tools. The first one was a complete disasters. It was long and wayward. It frustrated me. I decided I need clamps, and found a deal on ebay for four f clamps. Cutting my fustrations a bit.
The edges also a not very true, and to progress with the sides I need true edges front to back not top to bottom.
The clamps allowed me the use of the straightest edge I had to sand the other sides. I feel much happier about the project now an iam thinking about veneer.

Just clamping my level to my board as a fence as removing material little by little this has another 1/8 to have my rebate in there.

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Its level. It needs fine tuning, and the baffel dado obviously, iam a happy camper.
The second will be crisper, hopefully less sanding.

[berga12]

Suggestion...

As you are not machining, but hand milling/sanding, for final assembly insthead of using Vinilic wooden glue, you can think to use the "poliuretanic" Wood glue of brand "Wuerth"(the famous one...U with 2 dot on top), maybe other brand are existing...

the advantage, beside the fact that became strong like Iron, is that It expand with humidity/moisture, so you can spry a bit of water on the gluing place before applying, then glue together.

this will be helping you to fill-in the "not precise cutting/milling".

[bldozier]

O good tip I was thinking of something from the local ace,
I will definitely look into it. Was not sure with the water tip but again a complete novice.
Thanks for taking your time to educate me.
I have cut the baffle its short so I need to attach a piece to bring it to 37" tall.
Iam thinking of using a 2nd sheet of bb for thr rears.

A integral part of my system also arrived today just ow matter of fact. My sansui au7500.
What a beast 2nd to last piece looking for a crown eq 2 to finish it. Maybe a d23 and bluetooth receiver, down the line.

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[grumpy]

I believe what Berga is referring to would be likely available at Ace Hardware (or elsewhere in the US) as Gorilla Glue.

[berga12]

I believe what Berga is referring to would be likely available at Ace Hardware (or elsewhere in the US) as Gorilla Glue.


maybe :)

"polyurethane wood glue"

below the product I experienced many times in Speaker box building since I was 16.
Of course any other good quality wooden glue it's fine, but the Polyurethane one Expand and fill the existing gap, like I can see in the box picture.

I used Wuerth product code: Cod. art.: 0892100170
https://eshop.wuerth.it/PUR-glue-polyurethane-PUR-GLUE-1KG/0892100170.sku/en/US/EUR/?VisibleSearchTerm=0892100170



Contents

0.01 ml



Container

PET bottle



Chemical basis

Polyurethane



Density

1.45 g/cm³



Colour

Brown



Min. proportion of solids

95 %



Min. film forming temperature

10 °C



Viscosity

5000 mPas



Min./max. wood moisture

0-12 %



Conditions for open time

at 20°C and 65% humidity



Min. pressing pressure

0.01 bar



Min./max. temperature resistance of the hardened material

-30 bis 100 °C



Min./max. processing temperature

5 bis 40 °C



Max. application quantity in surface bonding

200 g/m²



Shelf life from production

12 Month




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[bldozier]

P9Im starting the seconf 4315a I have the sides cut, on is shorter then the other from a miscalculation, so I will need to graft a mdf piece to bring it to specification.
Now I have a system down its going much smoother.

These a a top/botto with the 3/8 dado cut im going in 1/4 " deep. I find my system now to mark my width 20 3/8 1/8" waist on either side, 20 1/8 finished. Mark 3/8 from the 20 1/8 draw my edge line. Mark another 3/8 for my dado cut total is 3/4 (3/8+3/8) I start the cut with my backsaw, to have a guide for the 45, although the fence is sufficient, my mdf desperately needs to be edge planed, this can be done before hand to allow a smooth surface for the plane to run on. I had a hill on one end of the mdf which bent out a 1/4, once it was removed smoth sailing for the fenced 45. Then I removed the fence and continued to mill the piece. I hace a 1/4 depth gauge to check my work.
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[Wagner]

"Gorilla Glue" the type which expands is worthless for filling gaps from a strength standpoint, wood putty will work just as well and won't leave all the 'foam" bubbles behind I know this from experience

It adds NO strength to the joint above or beyond what it offers in a no gap joint

It is also ridiculously overpriced for the mediocre product that it is

There are several excellent glue strength/comparison test videos on-line which demonstrate this objectively with actual lab tests, just google it

The only luck I have had with it personally was using it as a reinforcing/filler agent for deep screw holes (long ones) in a 100 year old Oak chair I had a hell of a time repairing. It wasn't the glue's adhesive strength that solved my problem, rather the wedge it formed (think loose chair legs, that wasn't my exact issue but similar) On that repair squeeze out and mess weren't a concern, I just needed to fill gaps in a hole around a screw: filled the hole with Gorilla Glue and then sunk the screw

It also expands while curing which can cause splits and joint deformities

I'd still stick with Titebond or even the new formula from Elmer's "Carpenter's Wood Glue Max", the on-line reviews are mixed but I took those with a grain of salt and tried it, it is an excellent product. It also contains real wood fibers so it fills small voids well, will readily take paint or stain and really is sandable (they all claim to be, but unless paper clog is your idea of fun not so much)

From the photos it appears that the joinery you have going is not that bad (in fact it look just fine) and should provide enough surface contact to result in a strong joint. The joints will swell as well with a heavy bead so I think you'll be just fine. I'd coat both pieces

It is also much easier to clean up wood glue squeeze out with a damp rag followed by a scrapper after set up than it is to clean up the mess that Gorilla glue promises (and I promise you it is the shits as for making a mess with any sort of bead)

Traditional carpenter's glue and maybe a few strategically placed glue blocks set with screws, and or your cabinet bracing if you're using any and I think you will be fine

Avoid polyurethane glues, aliphatic resin/PVA glues specifically formulated for wood are still the best all around choice despite what the marketing says

As for filling joints with gaps and making things any stronger? Gorilla glue REALLY sucks

[berga12]

Thanks Wagner for your experience, this is really helpful also for me.

"Gorilla" glue is the only one I had in mind, but good to know much more valid alternatives! ;)

[bldozier]

Titebond II or III,

I had a dado blow out on me fitting the tops and bottoms. They just need to be glued backup. Im feeling working with bb would stop that. Mdf edges when cut close will blow out if pressure is applied to them as mine have with the dado.
:(

The second cab sides had a few imperfections I needed to section out a bad spot the swerved when cut to12". Its just a rough spot so I cut a 1/4 section I will remove the bad section and glue that in. The second problem is the side piece was 1 1/2 insches short. So I've spent time cutting and sanding a piece to join it. Whenever I sand the side piece its always bowed to one side so just taking my time, to get it flat. My saw needs to be sharpend I may not try and cut the second bb piece untill then. As the first was failry taxing.
709017090270903

I have received the koa wood from Hawaii to make bowties from for my live edge corner desk. Cool guy sent my four pieces when I only bought one. I was looking at purple heart, but this will work fine.

[bldozier]

The second cabinet fell toghter much eaiser then the first. The mdf was high and low some extra care had to be taken with the rear panel, for some reason it was 1/2 to wide when I went to fit it. Idk, but the three panes slid into place as intended much easier the the first. With minimal to no gap. I saved some mdf shavings incase I need to level the first cabinet before glueing up, and wood the sealing.
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I havent cut the baffle yet, I will in a few.

[badman]

"Gorilla Glue" the type which expands is worthless for filling gaps from a strength standpoint, wood putty will work just as well and won't leave all the 'foam" bubbles behind I know this from experience

It adds NO strength to the joint above or beyond what it offers in a no gap joint

It is also ridiculously overpriced for the mediocre product that it is

There are several excellent glue strength/comparison test videos on-line which demonstrate this objectively with actual lab tests, just google it

The only luck I have had with it personally was using it as a reinforcing/filler agent for deep screw holes (long ones) in a 100 year old Oak chair I had a hell of a time repairing. It wasn't the glue's adhesive strength that solved my problem, rather the wedge it formed (think loose chair legs, that wasn't my exact issue but similar) On that repair squeeze out and mess weren't a concern, I just needed to fill gaps in a hole around a screw: filled the hole with Gorilla Glue and then sunk the screw

It also expands while curing which can cause splits and joint deformities

I'd still stick with Titebond or even the new formula from Elmer's "Carpenter's Wood Glue Max", the on-line reviews are mixed but I took those with a grain of salt and tried it, it is an excellent product. It also contains real wood fibers so it fills small voids well, will readily take paint or stain and really is sandable (they all claim to be, but unless paper clog is your idea of fun not so much)

From the photos it appears that the joinery you have going is not that bad (in fact it look just fine) and should provide enough surface contact to result in a strong joint. The joints will swell as well with a heavy bead so I think you'll be just fine. I'd coat both pieces

It is also much easier to clean up wood glue squeeze out with a damp rag followed by a scrapper after set up than it is to clean up the mess that Gorilla glue promises (and I promise you it is the shits as for making a mess with any sort of bead)

Traditional carpenter's glue and maybe a few strategically placed glue blocks set with screws, and or your cabinet bracing if you're using any and I think you will be fine

Avoid polyurethane glues, aliphatic resin/PVA glues specifically formulated for wood are still the best all around choice despite what the marketing says

As for filling joints with gaps and making things any stronger? Gorilla glue REALLY sucks

Really nice summary of why "wood glue" is the best glue for wood :D I agree with everything you said except the Elmer's- I haven't tried it! I'll give it a shot when my current gallon of titebond 2 runs out. Water solubility is also really handy with these glues- there are many times I find a diluted coating of woodglue to be a perfect solution for things. I use flakeboard/OSB for shelves in my garage storage. Coating it with slightly thinned woodglue makes it nice, sturdy, moisture resistant. Most inexpensive engineered wood products use far too little resin, you can often make up for it (at least somewhat) with liberal use of PVA.

[boputnam]

...the advantage, beside the fact that became strong like Iron, is that It expand with humidity/moisture, so you can spry a bit of water on the gluing place before applying, then glue together.
And, if pipe woodclamps aren't available, you might consider some rope clamps (or even ratchet straps) which encompass the entire wood frame, holding it tight while drying. Tight is good - it builds integrity into the frame and also helps ensure airtight bonds...

[bldozier]

Thanks bo. I was interested in using ratcheting straps along with tight bond glue. This is how iam going to do the final joinery.

Its been a while since ive posted, I had really missed on cutting the hole for the le14 the hole was first to small after I recut it it wasn't usable so I have to buy a second piece of baltic. Using the coping saw to cut the baltic was not working I used my key hole saw, as a last resort which to hours. I was given a jig saw after imcut the baffel so I will be using it to tje 4315s. I am trying to print templates as guides this time around. Finding a suitable program has proven difficult, asided from contacting graphics shopts for cut outs at the cost of $50.00 for 8 cut outs.

I have located and have given a down payment for the 3114s. Super excited about this, now I need the 2405a pair and the le8t to 2108 conversions. I have the le8ts and le10s for the magnet swap. The 3114s are recaps with original caps include. 7199071991
Brian.

[bldozier]

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Soooo, so sorry, the dely was so long. Here the 3114b networks are. Im excited to be resuming this project. Thanks all who stuck by.
I thought the backplates were 1/8 but they are 1/4" shows you how much I know.
Brb in a few.

[JeffW]

Good to see you sticking to it, take however long you need - we'll be here!

[1audiohack]

Good to see you sticking to it, take however long you need - we'll be here!

Ditto!

Barry.

[mech986]

Boy, those shipping boxes were overstuffed. Did that cause the chipped back panel?

[4343]

Just want to say +1 on the Carpenter's Wood Glue Max. It's the best I've used.

Oh, and for filling I use auto body filler. Currently sanding the 1" round-overs on some 1.25" particle board. The bit pulls chunks out during cutting, (Particle board, duh...) that means little pits when sanding. So out comes the bondo to fill those up, it's almost all sanded off again, leaving little pink spots...

[bldozier]

I cut the baffle this afternoon, its a wee small just the thickness of the rear oring
should it fit lush or use a tiny gap

[bldozier]

75363
Waiting for the 2405 I have some bindi work and those seals alle good

[1audiohack]

Good work there!

Barry.

[bubbleboy76]

Good work there!

Barry.

FYI Barry, your Inbox is full. It is not possible to send PM to you.

[Flodstroem]

75363
Waiting for the 2405 I have some bindi work and those seals alle good

Wow nice work Brian.

Maybe I also should build something like that. Have the drivers lack the filters unfortunately :crying:

[srm51555]

Nice work, good to see your project coming together.

[bldozier]

Does anyone know the deal with the o rings does the speaker sit raised on the baffle a bit or flush against the baffle I have taken the o rings off and they are now sitting flush

[JeffW]

Is there a very slight groove in the rear mounting face of the driver for the o-ring to fit half way in? Then when it's tightened, the o-ring only has to compress by half. I might be imagining things, seems like the LE14A had a groove. You can just make it out in this pic

http://www.speakerrepair.com/repairpicshtml/jbl-le14a-back.jpg

[1audiohack]

Also note that the O rings supplied by JBL are hollow and will compress far more than a standard O ring.

I also use a bevel blade in my router and cut a smalll edge break on top of the hole in the baffle for the O ring to nest in.

Barry.

[bldozier]

O ok it compresses. That's good news. Yeas I believe the inductors from this era
Have the o ring space
those baffles with the length I add Remind me of
l100 anniversary models it will be fix after paint work

[bldozier]

So, I did not have much faith in the MDF and decided to use bb instead
just to wavy I did not feel the edge veneer would settle right with out
extensive sanding which is not going to happen in my apt bathtoom
😐

I will pick up a 5x5 this week sometime and have it cut to size and dado an
reebate it myself

the one baffle I've done needed some bondo which was my first ever attempt used
way to much hardener the 1st time it turned to a soft rubber after a attempt or
two got the consistency down & filled the port an uhf cut outs

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[bldozier]

Ok.
78552
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�� Making progress bought this pair from eBay,
just need a sole 2105a ( I've got a 2105h and le5-9 )

an iam off no I gotta drop off the peanuts at ups