2231A with 2225 cone kit

[ophidite]

Hello

I am a newbie in the JBL world

I bought a DIY 4331 with this elements :

2231A
2420
2307
2308
3110

I would like to know if it is a normal set for a 4331 and is the 2231 recone in 2225 a good idea.

Here are some photos :

6521165212652136521465215

[martin2395]

No, it's not a good idea at all to put a 2225 in the 4331.

It even looks like an aftermarket recone to me, if it's a fake then the best use for it is throwing it straight to the dustbin or sell it and buy genuine 2231/2234/2235H.
I do not want to sound rude but all of those aftermaket chinese recones I've seen were dramatically bad.

The 3110 crossover is correct but the horn is not, the 4331 should have the longer 2312. The 2307 is found in the 434x systems.

You might want to check the condition of the diaphragms on the 2420 drivers, if they are aftermarket/damaged then I'd seriously start thinking about returning these DIY 4331 back to where they came from,
unless you paid like €200-300 for them and the cabs are built to JBL spec.

[ophidite]

OK, I understand but I can have the whole for 600 euros so I think i could find a good cone kit .
In France it is very hard to find good JBL speakers :D

[martin2395]

Do you have more pictures of the 'boxes' and the inside of the 2420 drivers?

I know it's almost impossible to find good JBL gear in western Europe but paying €600 for a pile of old, damaged metal isn't the best idea too ;)
Sometimes the best (and only) way to get good 223x woofers is to buy 2 broken chassis (~€50) and simply put a new C8R2235 recone in them which are around €220 each.

The diaphragms in the drivers are easily replacable with Radian (have good experience with these) which are much cheaper than genuine JBL and still sound decent.
But if there is rust inside the drivers - they are scrap metal.

For example - I sold a perfect pair of 2421B drivers with 2307 horns for €250 last year, if the cones in the woofers are aftermarket they aren't worth more than €100.
The filters are also only collector items, maybe €75?
You do the maths ;D

[ophidite]

65216

It is the only photo I got of the cabinet it's a DIY .

Do you know if it's expensive to recone the 2231 ?

[martin2395]

Please look at my previous post, I edited it and added some more info.

To be honest they look like another pair of disco-beaters :crying: they also miss the 2308 lenses which are very hard to find.
You would probably have to pay $130+shipping costs and buy Kenrick sound 2308 from Japan.

[ophidite]

There is a pair of 2308 included. I will go tomorrow to listen to them.
I will offer 500 euros for the whole.

I plan to build 4331 cabinet :bouncy:

Concerning the crossover if i understand the 3110 is connected to each speakers. Usually isn't there a 3131 inside the cabinet .

Thanks for your help

[martin2395]

Also by the way, the cabinet on the photo you showed is a 4320 cabinet.
If they have the 3110 on the back then there is no additional network inside the cab.

+++
If you want to use them in 2-way (2231+2420) you can also use an active crossover like a Behringer DCX2496.

[ophidite]

OK, so what is the difference between a 4331 2 voices 2231/2420 that come with 3131 and the same speakers with a 3110 ?

[Lee in Montreal]

2 questions.

- Shouldn't a 2231a have a foam suspension, not an accordeon one?
- Would that cabinet posted above be like a home-made version of an L200?

http://www.hifido.co.jp/photo/06/776/77627/a.jpg

Also, it would be a waste of money to recone the 2231a basket into a 2225. For the same price, it can be reconed into a 2235 which would be more enjoyable for home duty.

Overall, 600 Euros is way too much for a cab that will most likley be junked, for 15" baskets needing a recone, and considering the previous mess, I suspect even the compressors will need decent diaphragms. As for the horns, they are not the most desirable and are missing the expensive slants. Either walk away, or offer a low amount of money for parts that will collect dust in your basement.

Just my two centimes...

Lee

[Mr. Widget]

2 questions.

- Shouldn't a 2231a have a foam suspension, not an accordeon one?
- Would that cabinet posted above be like a home-made version of an L200?

Lee, I don't think you read the first post.:)

To ophidite: The 3110 network is a network that JBL sold separately and is not exactly the equivalent to the 3131 network or the subsequent variants that were more sophisticated and better sounding.

I do think you're on the right track about going and listening to the speakers… I would listen very carefully as I expect the speakers have been played hard and are far from a beautiful mint pair of 4331s. However for the right price they may get you into the game allowing you to build a speaker you'll really enjoy.


Widget

[Lee in Montreal]

Lee, I don't think you read the first post.:)

To ophidite: The 3110 network is a network that JBL sold separately and is not exactly the equivalent to the 3131 network or the subsequent variants that were more sophisticated and better sounding.

I do think you're on the right track about going and listening to the speakers… I would listen very carefully as I expect the speakers have been played hard and are far from a beautiful mint pair of 4331s. However for the right price they may get you into the game allowing you to build a speaker you'll really enjoy.


Widget

"I would like to know if it is a normal set for a 4331 and is the 2231 recone in 2225 a good idea"

I think I replied accurately. Wrong woofer. Wrong recone. Homemade repros of "something". Not worth the sum of the parts. ;-)

[Mr. Widget]

I think I replied accurately. Wrong woofer. Wrong recone. Homemade repros of "something". Not worth the sum of the parts. ;-)My confusion... I took it to be suggesting to not recone with 2225 kits. Ultimately we are in screaming agreement.


Widget

[Lee in Montreal]

My confusion... I took it to be suggesting to not recone with 2225 kits. Ultimately we are in screaming agreement.


Widget

Well. If the goal is to emulate a 4331, then indeed perhaps the 2225 is the wrong choice, hence my suggestion to go for a 2234/2235 recone, which will be the same price. Also, the 4331 is a 3-way, right? So, the OP will still be missing a 2405. I understand the rarity of JBL stuff in Europe, but I think that if it were in North America, the components would be considered as simple core. Pair of woofer baskets ($70.00), pair of horns ($60.00), pair of compressors with unknown diaphragms and in unknown condition ($100 if not rusted). Cab goes to garbage. ;-)

Lee

[grumpy]

You are thinking of the 4333. The shorter horn may be fine for 4331 also.

[macaroonie]

At this point it might be a good idea for Ophidite to look on the back of the bass driver cone to see if there is a cone serial #.
If it is a genuine 2225 cone kit to the best of my knowledge it is an OK on the ' goes into list'.
It surely would not be the end of the world to run with this , similar in fact to 2226 + 2426 / 23xx and those have been worked up many many times.

Lee you do have to be aware that over here anything JBL is at least 50% over what you guys pay so that equates to 400 US bux, less if he gets a slice off the top.
= 200 per box , so 100 for the ' 2225' and 100 for the 2420 and the x/o plus box for free.

Now in my money ( ££££ ) thats 60 quid for a fairly clean 2225 and the same for a CD with admittedly unknown diaphragm. You would pay £60 for either core here all day long.

I think he needs to check the recone for the JBL part # ( anyone have it to hand ? ) and check the diaphragm for being JBL.

Other than that there is no reason why that bag o bones cannot be made to sound old school but good.

M

[martin2395]

Exactly.
I would never buy these without checking if the cones and the diaphragms in the drivers are genuine JBL.

The best option is to find a carpenter who will build you a pair of 4331/4333 cabs and then take your time to find separate units, you can still find them in good condition but it takes time.

Don't look too much at original, old JBL crossovers because you are better off running them active or by building new networks.

[macaroonie]

Just to put things into perspective here's an AD on Le Bon Coin. Have a seat before you read.

http://www.leboncoin.fr/image_son/792914926.htm?ca=7_s

[martin2395]

I wasn't even seating comfortably and I already had to stand up again when I saw the price :bouncy: Pure madness.

Makes me wonder if these have genuine 2235H cones, they look OK.

[macaroonie]

and in the US

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/JBL-4320-studio-monitor-speakers-excellent-sound-guaranteed-/221657190062?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item339bcc4eae

[martin2395]

Much better but still, for around $2500 I'd most probably get myself a pair of 4430's (or 4435 I had enough space).

[ophidite]

Yes in France JBL is out of my budget.

But I Have the possibility to buy 3 of the speaker of my first post for 500 euros, so now it becomes interessting :)

[macaroonie]

Ophidite , you need to verify that the 2225 recones are JBL original , also verify that the diaphragms in the compression driver are original JBL.
500 euro is better.

There should be a number stamped on the back of the bass driver cone , can you find that please and we will help you verify it as JBL or not

Also if you can take a picture of the Diaphragm in the HF unit we will tell you immediately if it is JBL

Basically if all the components are genuine JBL then you have a good start. :)

[martin2395]

I'd say fake cones, the VC wires near the dustcap are very thin.

Also don't buy the story that he doesn't have time for you to remove and take a close look at the units.

[macaroonie]

Spotted


65240

[ivica]

I'd say fake cones, the VC wires near the dustcap are very thin.

.

Hi
May be VC has been changed ("only")

regards
ivica

[macaroonie]

It may also be that the recone was not a pre assembled item but a kit of parts.

The cone and dust cap look pretty good to me , 12 ribs , proper texture on dust cap etc.

Still looking for that number on the back

[ivica]

It may also be that the recone was not a pre assembled item but a kit of parts.

The cone and dust cap look pretty good to me , 12 ribs , proper texture on dust cap etc.

Still looking for that number on the back

Hi,
I have not seen JBL recon-kit not pre assembled.
Only dust cap is not glued.


regards
ivica

[martin2395]

Exactly, the dustcap is not glued to allow alignment with shims.

[ophidite]

Great all those details will help me.

I have to find a bigger car than mine to bring back the 3 cabinet.

I will look for the part number on the cone and open the 2420 to see if it's all original.

The seller is fine guy and it would probably not be a problem.

I have to wait for next sunday.


Keep in touch

[martin2395]

The diaphragm in the 2420's should look like this:

65246

Or like this (2421 diaphragm, notice the diamond pattern suspension)

65247

[ophidite]

One more question.

Is it possible to build a crossover to use the HF to 20 Khz ?

[Lee in Montreal]

One more question.

Is it possible to build a crossover to use the HF to 20 Khz ?

All crossovers go to 20KHz +

[martin2395]

Just add a 2405H and you're good to 21.5KHz.

[ophidite]

Here are my fake 4320 but finally they look quite good :)

For the price I even came back with a Marantz 250 M with one dead channel, another DIY marantz based one 240, and a Fostex A8.

It was a very good day.

Speaking about the JBL, they sound quite good . I tested it with a Crown 460 and everything sound fine to my ears .

Ok the only speakers i know are my KRK Rokit PR6.

The woofer are 2225. And the compression are not original but seems to be from JBL.

65312

[macaroonie]

A good day indeed. Well done. So you got proper 2225 cones , that's great. :applaud:

Maybe some better pictures of all your boxes .:)

[martin2395]

A working 250M should go for €300+ so you got yourself a nice score :)

Maybe selling the other gear could pay for the restoration of your 4320 :)
The cabinets look like original 4320's.

[ophidite]

Yes I will start to test them and then I am gonna try to find 2235 recone kit .:bouncy:

I have to improve the filter and the connectors too.

I gonna try to restore the marantz so i will have a nice setup to start with.

I will post some new photos of woofer and compression soon.