JBL Hartsfield

[rugy]

First post on this forum and looking for some help please.
Building my retirement home that is off grid and looking for a high efficiency speaker to fill my music room.
Room size will be 16 x 24 x 10 feet and is going to be used for music/ vinyl only.
Had JBL L110 and also L100 but have always loved the The Hartsfield which seem to fit that bill but have been searching for impedance and efficiency numbers but cant find any.
Would like to drive them with small wattage tube gear if possible.
Second questions is what items should I look for or test as there is a local seller that has a pair of Hartsfield for sale.
Any advice is appreciated, Thanks.

[Mr. Widget]

Welcome to the forum... since I am no expert on these speakers I'll let others chime in.
Please look at these links if you haven't already found them:

http://www.lansingheritage.org/html/jbl/specs/home-speakers/1954-hartsfield.htm

http://www.lansingheritage.org/html/jbl/specs/home-speakers/1957-hartsfield.htm

http://www.lansingheritage.org/images/jbl/catalogs/1962/page16-17.jpg

Good Luck!

Mr. Widget

[Horn Fanatic]

First post on this forum and looking for some help please.
Building my retirement home that is off grid and looking for a high efficiency speaker to fill my music room.
Room size will be 16 x 24 x 10 feet and is going to be used for music/ vinyl only.
Had JBL L110 and also L100 but have always loved the The Hartsfield which seem to fit that bill but have been searching for impedance and efficiency numbers but cant find any.
Would like to drive them with small wattage tube gear if possible.
Second questions is what items should I look for or test as there is a local seller that has a pair of Hartsfield for sale.
Any advice is appreciated, Thanks.

Hi rugy -

The only retail seller of Hartsfields that I know of is Kenrick Sound, in Japan. The Hartsfields they sell, as with all the other vintage equipment they sell, are fully restored to showroom condition, including upgrades to the dividing networks and drivers.

Seriously, as far as I know the Hartsfield system has been out of production since 1964 or 1965. Your best bet to find a pair will be on Ebay, but be prepared for sticker shock. The folks who put them up for auction are seriously out of tough with reality, that they think their Hartsfields are worth $30,000, and more. On a good day they may have have gone for that price pre-9/11. Rarely will you find the first year model, as they are rare as hens teeth. I am unsure if the auction was legitimate, but around five years ago an original pair of Top Loaders with paper work and receipts from an estate sale sold for $60,100. Some believe it was a phony auction. There were over 5000 watchers on that auction. Two words; Caveat Emptor.

If you're not hung up on actual vintage gear, there are folks who will reproduce a pair of Hartsfields for a fraction of the cost. There is a forum member who has created a drawing package for the first year model C30 enclosure. That box is lovingly referred to as the, 'Top Loader', whereas the subsequent model was dubbed the, 'Coffin Back'. I have built a pair of the Coffin Back, but never got a chance to hear them. I did however, have the pleasure of listening to a pair of the Top Loaders, and I can say I was very impressed. The only thing the Hartsfield system needed was a bullet to overcome the limitations of the acoustical lens and the poor frequency range of the 375 driver.

Good luck, and be careful.

H.F.

[BMWCCA]

No affiliation:

http://www.jrsoundco.com/jbl-hartsfield.html

[rugy]

Had a local speaker repair shop look at the online photos and he gave me a thumbs up.
So I closed the deal and will have them delivered tomorrow.
Now to make room in my house so that my wife won't kill me....:eek::eek::eek:
Thanks for the help.

[rugy]

Pictures of the speakers at home.
Will clean up the years of dust that I can see in the back.
Seeking a manual for the speakers as the back has so many possible setting
Wires are rather thin. Upgrade to a Kimber or something better ? Suggestions ?
Then into my listening room, have to move thing out to be able to place them into the corners.
Any advice re set ups ?

64469

[audiomagnate]

Dayum! I am simply speechless, and that almost never happens. Wire's not important. A small 7199 based tube amp should work fine, but even small tube amps use a lot of juice compared to modern (shudder) class D amps. Those are simply jaw-droppingly gorgeous. Jealous does not describe how I feel right now. I have to go out and sell a ton of insurance. Just guessing, but sensitivity has to be at least in the high 90s for these. Wow. There is a holy grail, it comes in pairs, and it now resides in the great white north. Is that rosewood? How did you make your first billion? Does your wife know what you paid for those? I'll shut up now.

[Mr. Widget]

Congratulations!!! Those are truly stunning... especially being such a nicely matched pair. Are they actual JBL built originals?

Regarding wire choice, if it makes you happy use any fancy wire you want... if these are a true vintage pair of Hartsfields, you may want to clean the contacts, but fancy wire is hardly necessary.

Regarding location, well built and located corners are key and may or may not be available. If your room is a rectangle you should try them along both the long and short walls if possible to see which setup sounds best.

Additional pictures would be appreciated, especially from the rear.


Widget

[Oldmics]

If they are real Hartsfields they should only have an input connection coming from the amplifier and then 4 wires leading to the woofer and tweeter.
Not a variety of connections.

Also if the componets are original it will run just fine on a single ended amp.

Oldmics

Oh,and my original 1st year pair of Hartsfields will cost someone 50K since I enjoy them daily!

[spkrman57]

300B SET amp should do a great job with approx 8 wpc being avg power rating for amps using that tube.

Great find on the spkrs.

Regards, Ron

[BMWCCA]

This must be the pair: http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/details/649173892-a-pair-of-jbl-hartsfield-375/

Though that modified crossover has me confused, the rest looks original to these non-expert eyes. :applaud:

For posterity:

64474

[rugy]

Yup those are the ones that I purchased here in Vancouver. Less that a 10 minute drive across the bridge.
Saw the add on Canuckmart, phoned him on Friday night. Went to his place after dinner and left him cheque for a deposit.
He said that he posted the speakers on Craigslist all over North America which I verified.
http://losangeles.craigslist.org/wst/msg/4868234028.html (http://losangeles.craigslist.org/wst/msg/4868234028.html)

Anyways the speakers were from an estate sale. They kids kept all of the electronic gear and LPs but had no interest in the speakers.:hurray::hurray:
Trustee wanted a quick transaction and most of the interest generated was from the USA or overseas. Packing and shipping became an issue.
Happy to have the new babies at home, but they reside under my staircase as in the photo for now.........
Have to hurry up and finish my other home.

Yes my wife knows what I paid as she wrote the cheque for the deposit and she got the certified bank draft. She loved the music that was being produced and said if I didn't buy them she would. How about that !!

Yes the speakers are in a Rosewood veneer, a really nice finish but a few dings here and there which is to be expected.

[audiomagnate]

A matched pair of factory rosewood Hartsfields? Wow.

[ivica]

Yup those are the ones that I purchased here in Vancouver. Less that a 10 minute drive across the bridge.
Saw the add on Canuckmart, phoned him on Friday night. Went to his place after dinner and left him cheque for a deposit.
He said that he posted the speakers on Craigslist all over North America which I verified.
http://losangeles.craigslist.org/wst/msg/4868234028.html (http://losangeles.craigslist.org/wst/msg/4868234028.html)

Anyways the speakers were from an estate sale. They kids kept all of the electronic gear and LPs but had no interest in the speakers.:hurray::hurray:
Trustee wanted a quick transaction and most of the interest generated was from the USA or overseas. Packing and shipping became an issue.
Happy to have the new babies at home, but they reside under my staircase as in the photo for now.........
Have to hurry up and finish my other home.

Yes my wife knows what I paid as she wrote the cheque for the deposit and she got the certified bank draft. She loved the music that was being produced and said if I didn't buy them she would. How about that !!

Yes the speakers are in a Rosewood veneer, a really nice finish but a few dings here and there which is to be expected.

Hi RUGY,

Congratulations !
I believe that You and the Family will enjoy in the sound.
May be one day You will upgrade the diaphragm ( of 375/ 2440J driver) with
D16R2441-ALUMINUM (to reach 376/2441J characteristics) in order to extend
the frequency range over 10kHz, adding may be some kind of EQ over 13kHz.
From JBL Tech.Notes v1n08 can be seen.
https://www.jblpro.com/pub/technote/tn_v1n08.pdf


regards
ivica

[Maron Horonzakz]

I keep looking at the back of those cabinets,,And think of CLASSIC AUDIO REPRODUCTIONS of Brighton Mi. ,,,,They made Rosewood Hartsfield reproductions... The one piece back panels,,Do not look like ones I see here,,With ones a friend of mine has in St.Louis...

[Mr. Widget]

I keep looking at the back of those cabinets,,And think of CLASSIC AUDIO REPRODUCTIONS of Brighton Mi. ,,,,They made Rosewood Hartsfield reproductions... The one piece back panels,,Do not look like ones I see here,,With ones a friend of mine has in St.Louis...I am no Hartsfield expert, but unless Audio Reproductions was building them before the '90s or managed to secure a stash of Brazilian Rosewood, this type of Rosewood hasn't been available since it became illegal to trade in 1992 due to the trees becoming an endangered species.


Widget

[Maron Horonzakz]

Apparently John Wolf has a stash of rosewood,,And has been using them on his version of the hartsfields,,, Might not be from Brazil though... He has been showing them that a various shows,,,I,l Have to call him,,

[Maron Horonzakz]

Sources are still available of Rosewood from WOODCRAFT and AMAZON...$575 for a 4'x8' sheet...WOW..

[Mr. Widget]

Apparently John Wolf has a stash of rosewood,,And has been using them on his version of the hartsfields,,, Might not be from Brazil though... He has been showing them that a various shows,,,I,l Have to call him,,You will need to phone him... I just tried looking at their website to see examples of their "rosewood", but their site seems to be broken.

Many companies are still offering "rosewood" speakers and furniture but it is typically pau ferro which is commonly called rosewood these days. Dalbergia nigra is the name of true rosewood... the Hartsfields pictured in this thread are definitely true rosewood... and quite magnificent.


Widget

[Mr. Widget]

Sources are still available of Rosewood from WOODCRAFT and AMAZON...$575 for a 4'x8' sheet...WOW..They appear to have several species that they are marketing as rosewood, but no true Brazilian Rosewood.


Widget

[Maron Horonzakz]

True,,, some coming from India,,, But the back of the (pictured) unit is not quite right....I,ll have to check the St.Lois Hartsfieds.

[rusty jefferson]

Rugy,

I don't know if they're originals or reproductions, or if that matters to you, but they are beautiful. The matched veneer work is excellent, not to mention the condition if they are 50+ years old. Congratulations. Post a picture when you get them set up!

[Mr. Widget]

Rugy,

I don't know if they're originals or reproductions, or if that matters to you, but they are beautiful. The matched veneer work is excellent, not to mention the condition if they are 50+ years old. Congratulations. Post a picture when you get them set up!+1

Personally I wouldn't care either way... they are truly amazing looking.



Widget

[SEAWOLF97]

Many companies are still offering "rosewood" speakers and furniture but it is typically pau ferro which is commonly called rosewood these days. Dalbergia nigra is the name of true rosewood... the Hartsfields pictured in this thread are definitely true rosewood... and quite magnificent.


Widget

Out LR furniture is carved/inlaid Chinese and the retailer called it Rosewood , but others said it was stained Teak.

Last week a pro woodworking guy came over and thought it wasn't teak after all , said teak is much lighter weight. Now I don't know what it is, tho it is sourced from China.

[BMWCCA]

I don't know if they're originals or reproductions, or if that matters to you, but they are beautiful. The matched veneer work is excellent, not to mention the condition if they are 50+ years old. Congratulations. Post a picture when you get them set up!

They are truly beautiful and a work of art. If they sound as good as they look, it really won't matter. Certainly looks like the drivers are original pieces. As the owner of a pair of reproduction 4345s, I can tell you it wouldn't make much difference to me as long as they made the music sing the way I like it! :)

[rugy]

Hey Guys
Going to set them up this weekend either in the living room which would be relatively easy but not ideal.
Or will move them into my listening room which is way more work, plus my main speakers will be just behind the Harts.
We have a 3 day weekend, Family day here in BC.

I am not overly concerned on being an original Hartsfield as the sound is quite nice and I didn't buy them to resell.

Have to figure out the crossover which means I will have to remove it and will bring it to the Audio Clinic in Vancouver.
Will post a pic when speakers are in temporary location.

But if the rain stops will head to the Island to commence the stripping of the forms that we poured last Saturday. Our retirement home.
I only work on the Islands on weekends. Either way it's a win win situation.

64500
64501

[rugy]

Decided to try to clean up the years of dust on the speakers.
Removed the top of the Hartsfield where I found lots of dust and on odd grey wire leading to the one side of the speaker. Hmm.
Figured out how to remove the front cloth and what have we got. A JBL driver that says 075.

64502
64503
64504
64505
64506

So that makes this a three way which I didn't know when I purchased them.:eek:
Knowing that tweeters are directional should it be sitting above the 375 driver ?
Opened up a can of worms/speakers as my knowledge is limited with the Hartsfield/JBL's.

Now to figure out how to get to the crossover.

Thanks for reading.

[baldrick]

VERY Nice speakers!!

The later Hartsfield were 3-way With 075 tweeter: http://www.audioheritage.org/html/profiles/jbl/hartsfield.htm

Here's a nice page on original vs replica, also with lots of pictures that might help you: http://www.hifido.co.jp/merumaga/kaitai/050617/indexe.html

[rugy]

Hi Baldrick

Thank you for your kind words and for sharing the links.
The Japanese link shows the original Hartsfield with my crossover which gives me a sigh of relief.
I thought that I had an oddball crossover with my previous searching and comments.

After opening up the back it shows that the woofer is a 150-4c serial#11810
Crossover is the N500 serial# 3898
Haven't opened the second speaker. I can only take up so much room in my living room.
Below is are pictures of the crossover removed from the back of the box.
Is there an online manual for the crossover settings as the bus bar is movable for the HF Attenuation D.B.
Also what up with the resistor ?? Keep it or remove it ??

Now to put it all back together.

64512

64513

64514

64515

[ivica]

......
Removed the top of the Hartsfield where I found lots of dust and on odd grey wire leading to the one side of the speaker. Hmm.
Figured out how to remove the front cloth and what have we got. A JBL driver that says 075.
........

Hi RUGY,

Lucky You are !!!! :bouncy:

I wish You enjoy the listening your speakers...

Reagrds
Ivica

[Mr. Widget]

Is there an online manual for the crossover settings as the bus bar is movable for the HF Attenuation D.B.
From this link N500 (http://www.lansingheritage.org/images/jbl/specs/home-comp/networks/page1.jpg) it appears you can move the bus bar around to see what you like best. There is not a lot of info, but it might be helpful. I would try it with and without the resistors. Also try various positions of the N7000 Lpad... I assume there is an N7000.



Widget

[ivica]

From this link N500 (http://www.lansingheritage.org/images/jbl/specs/home-comp/networks/page1.jpg) it appears you can move the bus bar around to see what you like best. There is not a lot of info, but it might be helpful. I would try it with and without the resistors. Also try various positions of the N7000 Lpad... I assume there is an N7000.



Widget

Hi

may be can help :
http://www.300b.net.cn/bbs/ShowPost.asp?PostID=14486
http://www.300b.net.cn/bbs/UpFile/UpAttachment/2008-12/2008121982557.jpg
http://www.jblpro.com/pages/pub/obsolete/3105-3115A.pdf

regards
ivica

[rugy]

Thank you, thank you, thank you!!
Searching for this info has been frustrating and consuming a lot of time.
The links are extremely helpful. At some point I will rewire the speakers but for now I want to listen to them
in a proper set up with my vinyl as a source instead of my iPhone...........
When I do rewire has anyone mounted the crossover externally from the speaker ??
Just thinking that the 150-4C must excite the cabinet which can't be good for the crossover.
Waiting till the rest of the household wakes up so I can reassemble the speaker. Then move them into
my listening room and listen to some music.
Again thank you for all the help, it is much appreciated.

[Maron Horonzakz]

YES that's. the way the 075 tweeter is mounted,,To one side,,After checking the Hartsfield in St.Louis.. Yours matches construction exactly......ENOY your new found Harstfields.

[Maron Horonzakz]

One more thing,,, The level control at the bottom back..Might have been a later modifacaion... The ones in St.Louis definitely had a N7000 xover.

[Steve Schell]

Congratulations rugy! You've got some lifetime keepers there.

At the JBL History exhibit in Northridge, 2006-2007 (at least) there were two Hartsfields on display, one early, one late. The late one had an 075 visible through the grille cloth.

I first heard the Hartsfields at Hal Cox's home in Mill Valley, CA in 2002 or so. Hal cranked the volume on symphonic material and performed as virtual conductor with arms swinging! The reproduction of orchestral tympani was as good as I have ever heard, before or since.

I fondly remember my phone conversations with the late Margaret Thomas, widow of longtime JBL owner William Thomas, in the early 2000s. She told me that the Hartsfield "put JBL on the map," and that it established JBL's reputation as the "best you could own." Margaret was Thomas's secretary at the time, and she appeared as the model in some of the early Hartsfield literature. Hal Cox told me that the Hartsfield was introduced to compete head to head with the Klipschorn, and was priced a bit higher intentionally to gain prestige.

[rugy]

Update.
Have moved the speakers into my listening room. Boy these demand a lot of real estate in the room which is 14.5 x 9 x 21.3 feet.
Unfortunately I cannot move my main speakers out of my room so I have the Harts directly in from of my main speakers.
Have them separated as much as I can and the results are ok but too close really to my listening chair.
My room is also a "movie room" which is shared with my music so I have a rear elevated platform with a sofa, the viewing gallery.
Anyhow have tried two amplifiers (Classe DR3, Wyetech Topaz ) with them and two make a hum that is just too loud for listening.:eek:
These two amps are dead quiet with my main speakers so what gives ?????
Used cheater plugs, moved power cords, moved speaker cables etc to see if this would help but same result.
Being frustrated I brought in a little Naim Nait 5i which is used in the family area and no hum at all......
So my go to amps are too noisy for the 16 ohm Harts but are fabulous on my main speakers.
Does this mean the Harts are like an electric microscope which brings forth any amplifiers misgivings ?
I know that vintage amps of the Hartsfield era may have had 16 ohm taps available on the amps.
Should I be looking for vintage amps/gear ??
Thanks for reading.
Mike

[rusty jefferson]

Update......
......Anyhow have tried two amplifiers (Classe DR3, Wyetech Topaz ) with them and two make a hum that is just too loud for listening.:eek:
These two amps are dead quiet with my main speakers so what gives ?????......
.
Mike

If the Hartsfield speakers are in the 100db efficiency range, the noise from the Wyetech 211 amp is probably a combination of the directly heated filaments, and the fact it's a no feedback design. I've seen that issue many times with 100+db speakers. If your other speakers are below 92db, you probably could hear it if you were close to one of them, but not at the listening position. If they're below 87db, you'd never notice the noise. No idea why the Classe would be making noise, but again, I'd bet you could hear some noise from your other speakers if close to them.

[Mannermusic]

Update.
Have moved the speakers into my listening room. Boy these demand a lot of real estate in the room which is 14.5 x 9 x 21.3 feet.
Unfortunately I cannot move my main speakers out of my room so I have the Harts directly in from of my main speakers.
Have them separated as much as I can and the results are ok but too close really to my listening chair.
My room is also a "movie room" which is shared with my music so I have a rear elevated platform with a sofa, the viewing gallery.
Anyhow have tried two amplifiers (Classe DR3, Wyetech Topaz ) with them and two make a hum that is just too loud for listening.:eek:
These two amps are dead quiet with my main speakers so what gives ?????
Used cheater plugs, moved power cords, moved speaker cables etc to see if this would help but same result.
Being frustrated I brought in a little Naim Nait 5i which is used in the family area and no hum at all......
So my go to amps are too noisy for the 16 ohm Harts but are fabulous on my main speakers.
Does this mean the Harts are like an electric microscope which brings forth any amplifiers misgivings ?
I know that vintage amps of the Hartsfield era may have had 16 ohm taps available on the amps.
Should I be looking for vintage amps/gear ??
Thanks for reading.
Mike

Hi Mike. No, I'd say something has got to be "out of kilter." I'd just go through the usual one-by-one elimination process. But, it sounds like either a failed cap/short/wiring in a crosssover or similar. Is it both sides? Have any alternate crossovers to clip in temporarily? Is it 60 Hz from woofers only? Clues. My rig uses a 3155 crossover (4-way) with the Hartfield horn as the treble driver. It is dead quiet with any of my old or newer amps. It is approx. 95 db spl efficiency (bass reflex) so is sensitive to noise and I use a tube preamp as well. A detective episode. Old gear is always a challenge! I'd check, wiggle, etc. all the basic wiring. Thinking out loud here. Curious to know what you find. Also Mike

[ivica]

Update.
.......
Anyhow have tried two amplifiers (Classe DR3, Wyetech Topaz ) with them and two make a hum that is just too loud for listening.:eek:
These two amps are dead quiet with my main speakers so what gives ?????
Used cheater plugs, moved power cords, moved speaker cables etc to see if this would help but same result.

Being frustrated I brought in a little Naim Nait 5i which is used in the family area and no hum at all......
So my go to amps are too noisy for the 16 ohm Harts but are fabulous on my main speakers.

Does this mean the Harts are like an electric microscope which brings forth any amplifiers misgivings ?
I know that vintage amps of the Hartsfield era may have had 16 ohm taps available on the amps.
Should I be looking for vintage amps/gear ??
Thanks for reading.
Mike

Hi Mike,

As You know, your Hart-speakers are high efficiency speakers, so You have to use very, very low-noise power amps, to drive them. A fiend of mine has Rotel RB-990BX amp, and on 2242 & 2202 & 2450SL-1.5 ( sensitivity about 98dB/1W/1m) hum and hiss noise can be heard when putting ears near them.
Here I want to emphasis that RB-990BX is rated noise figure of 120dB (A).
In order to reduce the problem, I can see two possibilities:
one to use very high quality "step-dow" transformer or
resistor network that would reduce the voltage on the speakers connection.

regards
Ivica

[Mannermusic]

Hi Mike,

As You know, your Hart-speakers are high efficiency speakers, so You have to use very, very low-noise power amps, to drive them. A fiend of mine has Rotel RB-990BX amp, and on 2242 & 2202 & 2450SL-1.5 ( sensitivity about 98dB/1W/1m) hum and hiss noise can be heard when putting ears near them.
Here I want to emphasis that RB-990BX is rated noise figure of 120dB (A).
In order to reduce the problem, I can see two possibilities:
one to use very high quality "step-dow" transformer or
resistor network that would reduce the voltage on the speakers connection.

regards
Ivica

Hi Ivica. But he says, "Just too loud for listening." ie, very loud - as though there is a major failure / glitch somewhere. Not an irritating background hum. I'd be hesitant to jump to conclusions until the origin of the noise was certain. Detective story. Mike

P.S. I used to run the old 030 stuff (100db?) back in the 60s with all tube gear of the day - Marantz - and was always able to get the system quiet enough that you couldn't hear any noise while listening. Always a bit of hiss at idle, etc. But generally quiet enough.

[Mr. Widget]

Two points.

1. As has been pointed out, with high sensitivity speakers any ground issues or other noise issues which may be perfectly acceptable with average sensitivity speakers may become painfully obvious... but there may also be something amiss with the electronics in this case if the noise is more than simply distracting.

2. If the Hartsfields are not fully back into corners of the room your bass extension will be diminished.


Widget

[grumpy]

If it's in a home theater system and there is a coax cable connected to
any of the components from outside, try temporarily disconnecting it.

Also could try shorting the inputs to the amp driving the Hartsfields
(preamp disconnected first) and see if the noise persists ... working
your way backward if that stage is acceptable.

[rugy]

Detective Mike reporting.

My listening room is shared with a projector and a screen but only use Blue Ray as a source and use no coax cable in my room.
Have an Audience AR6T for "line conditioning" which I have used with great results. Lifted the ground on this and no difference re the hum.
So on to the amps in my room. Have one more amp to try which I will take out of another system. Report on this later.
Testing was done with amp on and preamp off using the same power cable plugged in the AR6T and speaker cables switched from amp to amp. Ear to the speaker inches away from driver.
Wish that the speaker main terminals were larger and not up so high on the speaker.

1. Tried the Wyetech Topaz through my main speakers and there is a small hum with my ear up against the speakers.
Noticeable but barely from my listening position which is 11' away from speaker. Cannot hear it when playing music on my main speakers but with the Harts its very noticeable. So much so it's too annoying to use with the Harts.

2. Classe DR3 has a minute hum with my main speaker which I cannot hear at all from my listening seat.
But again loud enough that I cannot use it the Harts.

3. The Naim Nait 5i has no noise what so ever with my main speakers.
With the Harts also no noise.

This means that the Harts are like a electron microscope which magnify all good and bad.
The Wyetech with my main speakers ( 93 DB ) are my fav but with the Harts are a no go.
Love the sound of tubes so I will contact Roger from Wyetech for help on the hum/noise issue.

Last night we had a long listening session which lasted till the wee hours.

Moved my dusty CD player close to the Naim so we could listen to some redbook instead of my iPhone and Naim combo. My CD player has not seen any action in over two years due to my listening preference of vinyl.
None the less we were listening to great music in our room coming from the big Harts last night.
This speaker does so many things right that I can hardly wait to get them optimized and up to the Island.
Monday I will bring my last remaining amp into my room and will keep my fingers crossed for no noise/hum.
Picture of my temporary set up. Messy I know but this is an experiment right now.
Thanks for reading.

64596

[Mr. Widget]

This means that the Harts are like a electron microscope which magnify all good and bad.Well... it at least confirms their sensitivity. ;)


Widget

[Mannermusic]

Hey detective Mike - Way to go. One additional thing I thought of to check is the connection posts on the LX5. I assume they are similar to all those "crossover in a box" designs and as a result are prone to loosen with age; the plastic insulators under the posts shrink and the post assembly loosens. As a result, the cute little connector wire eyelets inside the box don't clamp properly and can cause all nature of weird problems. If so, you will have to open the back covers and tighten the screws (small Philips). But, if the posts feel solid/tight don't bother. On the amps, just be certain all the grounds are perfect including the RCA connectors. I used to find internal grounding problems with old Marantz and Crown stuff - particularly with age. Also Mike

[jw5115]

Classic Audio uses Bolivian Rosewood for their "Rosewood" Hartsfield Reproductions
The true specie name is Pau Ferro and can be purchased in paperback 4x8' sheets
but we use unbacked book matches flithes so we can match all panels.
$575 is way to much=$18.00/sq/ft.
Good Luck

[jw5115]

A little late to the thread but in case you are interested.
The Vancouver Hartsfields are not Classic Audio or factory JBL.
3 obvious observations.
1- The N-500 is wrong, should be a N-500H N-400 was for early Paragon and other 150-4c systems.It looks completely different,like an early LX-5.
2-The space that the gold lense is in looks to tall, should be 7-5/8" to 7-3/4" tall. Look at the 1/4" acorn nuts that hold the lenseplates together.JBL used a black acorn, Classic uses a brass acorn nut.
3- The coffin cover should only have 10-screws 5/side, attaching it to the main cabinet.
Over the past 40+ years I have talked to many people who have built these cabinets
Whether JBL's or ? they look great and depending on what you are looking for, are an impresive sounding speaker and can only get better with a few changes.
Use Watco natural to oil the cabinets and rub out with 3M Pads (fine)
Good Luck
jw5115

[Maron Horonzakz]

I never seen a N500H... The N500 was was nominal 12ohm on the low side & i6 ohm on the high side

[tomee]

I'm no Hartsfield expert, but 10 minutes of google searching shows both crossover types, with a pic of the 'H' version on the early cabinets (?)

some other pics here :
http://www.hifido.co.jp/KWHartsfield/G1/E/0-50/

show 3,5, and 7 screws per side on the backs, and some as 'Japanese made'. Could these have come from Japan to Canada???

The ones the OP bought are a beautiful matched pair in fantastic condition, and look to have real vintage JBL drivers. What's not to like!

[Maron Horonzakz]

That's really odd...Usually the N500 will have the level strapping bars....That one has a rotary switch... H for 8ohms Mine had strapping bars

[tomee]

http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NTExWDkwMA==/z/yKgAAOSwNSxU-kCi/$_57.JPG

pic from a recent auction: N500H, with rotary switch. Compare with the OP crossovers, which are as Maron describes, with level bars. Looking at the different pics out there...it would take some digging to figure out what came when and was installed on what... I see N500, N500H and then there's a JBL brochure listing N400/N7000 as installed in these!! :confused:

anyhoo... If the OP Hartsfields are repro's, they certainly look like they used period appropriate internals, in great looking cabinets.

[tomee]

....

[rugy]

Hey Guys

Been working like crazy.
The acorn nuts are black and the lens measures 7-1/2".
Coffin cover has 16 screws .
If they are real McCoy or not is no issue to me. The speakers have given me endless hours of
great music.
My toes are a tapping am just having fun.
To my eyes the speakers are gorgeous to boot.

jw5115 what changes do you recommend or suggest please ??

One friend whose opinion I value highly suggested old vintage McIntosh tube amps.
Anyone here tried or heard these with Hartsfields ?

[LowPhreak]

One friend whose opinion I value highly suggested old vintage McIntosh tube amps.
Anyone here tried or heard these with Hartsfields ?


I don't think vintage Macs are the only thing in town for those. One that first came to mind is the ARC Classic 30 with upgraded caps.

[Mannermusic]

Yes, agree with LowPhreak. Are you aware of Mike Hawthorn's Quicksilver Audio in Calif? Specialize in hi efficiency tube gear. Point-to-point hand wired, KIS (Keep It Simple). See web site. Good customer service contact, extremely helpful. Many ideas - too many! I use his line pre amp with good results. Dead quiet. Simple.

[rugy]

Heard of Quicksilver years ago but they weren't on my radar. Affordable too.
Classic 30 looks interesting as well and a good write ups on the amp as well.
Thank you for the suggestions.

[Mannermusic]

Yes, agree with LowPhreak. Are you aware of Mike Hawthorn's Quicksilver Audio in Calif? Specialize in hi efficiency tube gear. Point-to-point hand wired, KIS (Keep It Simple). See web site. Good customer service contact, extremely helpful. Many ideas - too many! I use his line pre amp with good results. Dead quiet. Simple.

Mike Sanders is the Quicksilver founder/owner, not Mike Hawthorne (British racing driver of yore). Sorry. Perhaps we should keep the edit software available a few days longer?

[rugy]

Local person had a mint MC 225 for sale which he happily brought over to my place to try with my Harts.
Had an awesome time listening to tunes for over three hours. Quite a nice amp.
Bought the amp two days later and have it playing as I'm writing.
The amp doesn't generate heat the way my Topaz does and it doesn't light up the room either.
Nice for when I bring the set up to the Island.
Will make some custom termination for the speaker leads so that I can use different speaker wires that have spades or bananas terminations. Those .12 diameter are wee bit small.
Thanks for all the help guys.

[rugy]

Well here we are many moons later and wanted to share my findings.
Been using a Mc 225 along with a MX110x which has been working very well.
Had an itch for for a headphone amp so I committed to a MicroZotl-2.
Received the Zotl last week Friday and have been running it to allow for break in of unit.
The Zotl is actually like a Swiss knife. Meant to be a headphone amp but it can be used as a pre amp as well.
The little amp has an output of 1.5 watts, speaker connectors on the rear, so I tried it on my Harts.
Yesterday I moved it into my music room. Still early on but holly macaroni, loving what I'm hearing..

[Mr. Widget]

The little amp has an output of 1.5 watts, speaker connectors on the rear, so I tried it on my Harts.
Yesterday I moved it into my music room. Still early on but holly macaroni, loving what I'm hearing..I have owned a couple of MX110s and the MC30s as well as MC240, and while I love this vintage stuff it will color the sound a bit and can be considered a limiting factor. For many the rounded over sound with a fattened up bottom end is what they're looking for, but I think you should always try a contemporary design or two to get a better understanding of what your speakers and the rest of your system are capable of.


Widget