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View Full Version : EQ/XO/DSP help for 2x2226 and 2447BE/2352



baldrick
11-12-2013, 05:30 AM
My main speakers consists of 2x2226H and 2447 with Truextent BE on 2352 horns, as XO/EQ/DSP I use MiniDSP.

The problem is that it does not sound very good so if anyone have input on what XO/EQ I should begin With it would be really appricated.

Pr now I crossover 24dB@630hz and I use a 6dB high shelf filter on the top, and 6dB low shelf on the bottom. (If I use my surroundprocessor with Audyssey MultEQXT32 room correction it sounds better but still not very good)

pos
11-12-2013, 06:14 AM
What measurement tools do you have?
Could you post you measurements along with context information? (distance from speaker and nearby surfaces, gating, smoothing, filter settings applied, etc.)
If you have impulse responses as wav or txt files that would be better still.

4313B
11-12-2013, 06:16 AM
Have you tried REW with the miniDSP?

Once you get it all dialed in you can then start looking for a world class DSP processor.

Lee in Montreal
11-12-2013, 10:55 AM
Hey Baldrick

The 2226 is rich in midbass and mids, and lean on lower bass (below 50Hz). If you want more proeminent lower bass, you will need to tame anything above 100Hz most likely with a 6db slope low pass filter.

The 2352 horn is more a 800Hz/1KHz horn than a 600Hz one.

Also, try a L-R 24db crossover between both ranges

DSP will help you

more10
11-12-2013, 12:44 PM
as XO/EQ/DSP I use MiniDSP

Which model?

baldrick
11-12-2013, 03:24 PM
Thanx for all input!

First of all, I have a very difficult room and it is really too small for these speakers, but that's what I've got to deal with :( I've played aroud much this evening and the only way to get decent bass is in front or almost in the back of the room, if I move 30cm it gets from OK to really bad. (For fun I also tried my 250TI into the same room now and all the same bass problem with them.)


Have you tried REW with the miniDSP?

Once you get it all dialed in you can then start looking for a world class DSP processor.

I'm not that good with measurements (and reading them) but I'll see if I can take some measurements with REW tomorrow. Unfortunately with my MiniDSP model I don't think I can use the REW/MiniDSP AutoEQ function (http://www.minidsp.com/applications/auto-eq-with-rew), I have MiniDSP PWR-DSP3, it basically is a 4x10HD paired with a 3 channel Pascal amp, but unfortunately the SW is not the same as for 4x10HD so the AutoEQ part is not present.


Hey Baldrick

The 2226 is rich in midbass and mids, and lean on lower bass (below 50Hz). If you want more proeminent lower bass, you will need to tame anything above 100Hz most likely with a 6db slope low pass filter.

The 2352 horn is more a 800Hz/1KHz horn than a 600Hz one.

Also, try a L-R 24db crossover between both ranges

DSP will help you

The low shelf filter from <100hz really helps with bass, without it I totally agree it's very lean. I do have some subwoofers but I really prefer to have fullrange frontspeakers and only use subs when needed. The biggest problem with bass is my room and placement but when I now have placed the sweetspot in the only position that sound OK the bass is also OK..

So the most difficult part for me is to get the horn sound as good as it should. I've tried adjustnig the crossover but I do in fact think the recomended 630hz sounds best, if I go up to 800-1khz the 2226 doesn't sound very good. Without high shelf it sounds quite bad, with a 6dB high shelf from 3khz->20 it sound much better but still I really hope there are much more too the 2447BE/2352 so that's mainly were I need advice.

I have in mind that the 2352 might not be the best choice for my setup and maybe that's a cause? Maybe a JMLC, Iwata or something else is what I need instead? Any inputs on that?

Lee in Montreal
11-12-2013, 06:33 PM
The big Iwatas will do 500Hz but you'll need a tweeter on top

JBL 2360 will do 350Hz and up. ;-)

And there'S a 2226 underneath


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v668/Lee_Vuong/JBL parts factory/DSCN2484_zps49a9db1b.jpg

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=58299&d=1362490176

Why I like LR

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=58652&stc=1&d=1365892150

baldrick
11-12-2013, 11:34 PM
Right now I'm useing an analog DBX filter and AudioNote 300b and a Sony MU-A400 to power the speakers but when I hook up the MiniDSP again I'll try LR.

I have previous had 2446/2360 but did in fact never like the sound very much, I really do prefer the 2447/2352 even though I miss the lower output from the 2360. I guess it would be fun to try other woofers instead of 2226, maybe a pair of 2235, 2227, ME150 or PRO1400 would be better suited alternative than 2226 (2227 and maybe PRO1400 will need subs)

Mostlydiy
11-13-2013, 04:31 AM
I myself is a bit fascinated by the filter in the Everest where only one woofer meets up with the horn and the otherone only helps at the bottom. Might be something to try out? This will lower the mid somewhat and at the same time increasing the bottom end if Im not mistaken. Some says it might also increase the imaging but that might just be the case with horisontal woofers. Other woofers might sound better but the 2226 is very good. The 2227 might be even harder to xo properly since it has highter output where you want to cross over to the horn.

/Mostly

baldrick
11-22-2013, 12:35 AM
I've played with REW and the MinidDSP lately and the highs really needs a lot of EQ to get decent curves and still doesn't sound like i want so I consider other options.

- Do someone have any "start recomendations" for EQ for 2447/2352? I understand that there has to be measurements to get best result, but I would really appreciate if someone have any start help since I struggle to get results of the measurements :) (I guess there are some kind of standard recomended EQ for this combination but can't find it..)

- Would a JBL N4648TH passive filter be an OK alternative to MiniDSP or is this really not a good idea? (this is mainly because of my lack of knowledge with REW/DSP) Or maybe can someone identify what EQ the N4648TH filter do so I can put it into MiniDSP? (schemantics (http://www.jblproservice.com/pdf/Theatre%20Series/4648TH.pdf))

- Would another horn than 2352 be an better alternative, I'm mainly thinking SEOS24 but there are also other alternatives.

Lee in Montreal
11-22-2013, 03:38 AM
Hi Baldrick

If the JBL 2352 works like a CD horn, maybe you could try a high pass filter on the 2447 : 12db boost - 6db/octave slope at around 4KHz/5KHz or whatever knee you find appropriate