M2 Master Reference Monitors Arrive in Australia

[S4700]

Hi all, I just got off the phone to the Australian importer for JBL Pro,
they have a pair of M2's in stock. They are trying to organize a time for
me to have a listen at their premises early next week. We talked about the possibility
of me bringing my S4700's to compare, I will know more on Monday, will keep you all
posted.

[Valentin]

Please let us know

[BMWCCA]

Sounds like fun!

[S4700]

Sounds like fun!
Yeah, the importer is just ten minutes from where I live. Depending on time constraints as to whether I take mine down there or not, anyways I will take some pics and upload them, I really hope they are great, the importer said they are better than anything they have brought into the country, Jands have been the sole JBL Pro importer in Australia for over 30 years, and they are also one of the biggest tour company's on the planet, www.jands.com.au (http://www.jands.com.au)

[spkrman57]

Sounds like a great comparison opportunity.

Regards, Ron

[Dave_72]

Hi all, I just got off the phone to the Australian importer for JBL Pro,
they have a pair of M2's in stock. They are trying to organize a time for
me to have a listen at their premises early next week. We talked about the possibility
of me bringing my S4700's to compare, I will know more on Monday, will keep you all
posted.

Are they letting you buy them separately or do you have to buy the electronics too like here in the US?

[S4700]

Are they letting you buy them separately or do you have to buy the electronics too like here in the US?
Hi Dave, we didn't go into that, but I'm guessing it will be the same deal as in the states.

[baldrick]

They've been for sale in Norway aprox 6 months and here the Crown amps is just on option, you don't have to buy them together: http://www.lydrommet.no/produkter/hoyttalere/studiomonitor/jbl-m2-studiomonitor-15-d2-driver/

[Dave_72]

Hi Dave, we didn't go into that, but I'm guessing it will be the same deal as in the states.

Ok, well let us know. I'm certainly curious...

[Dave_72]

They've been for sale in Norway aprox 6 months and here the Crown amps is just on option, you don't have to buy them together: http://www.lydrommet.no/produkter/hoyttalere/studiomonitor/jbl-m2-studiomonitor-15-d2-driver/

Well, that's cool for you over there. It kinda sucks for us...

[pos]

They've been for sale in Norway aprox 6 months and here the Crown amps is just on option, you don't have to buy them together: http://www.lydrommet.no/produkter/hoyttalere/studiomonitor/jbl-m2-studiomonitor-15-d2-driver/
That is approx 6500€ per speaker, right?

[martin_wu99]

Hi all, I just got off the phone to the Australian importer for JBL Pro,
they have a pair of M2's in stock. They are trying to organize a time for
me to have a listen at their premises early next week. We talked about the possibility
of me bringing my S4700's to compare, I will know more on Monday, will keep you all
posted.
Great,anxious to know the comparing result:applaud:

[martin_wu99]

That is approx 6500€ per speaker, right?
Very expensive,right?

[martin_wu99]

Are they letting you buy them separately or do you have to buy the electronics too like here in the US?
You do'nt have to buy Crown amp,but since they have DSP in it,in order to make full use of M2,you'd better buy Crown amp:D

[Dave_72]

You do'nt have to buy Crown amp,but since they have DSP in it,in order to make full use of M2,you'd better buy Crown amp:D

You can also buy it with Levinson amps.

[more10]

That is approx 6500€ per speaker, right?

Google confirms, just type "51662 nok in eur" in google search field. This is including VAT. Excluding VAT it is "only" 5100 Euros.

A bit expensive, especially since the boxes probably are made of chipboard.

[baldrick]

Nothing is cheap in Norway :) As comparison the price of S9900 is 3 times the price of M2, 4365 is 20% more expensive than M2

[S4700]

They've been for sale in Norway aprox 6 months and here the Crown amps is just on option, you don't have to buy them together: http://www.lydrommet.no/produkter/hoyttalere/studiomonitor/jbl-m2-studiomonitor-15-d2-driver/
Hi all, The guy from Jands call me this morning and confirmed that My M2 audition will be set for to day at 12 noon, unfortunately I won't be able to take my s4700's as time won't permit. We spoke about how they package the system and he said that I can purchase the speakers without the amps, but went on to say why would I consider doing that as the complete system was outstanding. I will post tonight on my findings,

[bubbleboy76]

Hi all, The guy from Jands call me this morning and confirmed that My M2 audition will be set for to day at 12 noon, unfortunately I won't be able to take my s4700's as time won't permit. We spoke about how they package the system and he said that I can purchase the speakers without the amps, but went on to say why would I consider doing that as the complete system was outstanding. I will post tonight on my findings,

Interesting!
Are the M2s brand new, or broken in?

[Mctwins]

This schould be fun, ask now what kind of setting is on those Crowns.

Play loud, they don't need break-in.:D

[Dave_72]

he said that I can purchase the speakers without the amps

60412

[1audiohack]

If you don't want the amps just go with the BSS option and use your own power amps. I for the life of me can't understand why one would not want the factory DSP. I would bet its highly unlikely that nearly anyone would get them closer to being all they can be. Its not like they're holding back.

If you really look at it, in the not so distant past, nearly every driver has EQ built in somewhere via cone mass, cone curve or shape, inductance of the coil, under hung, over hung, same gap and coil length, magnetic force in the gap and different gap lengths, spider and surround compliance,,, all of this "compromise" to "optimize" a driver for a particular purpose. It looks to me that the new generation of drivers have less of this physical tuning built in and are built with less compromise (pure from an engineering standpoint) as to utilize the incredible power of DSP shaping. When you look at the frequency and the time domain responses, the near utter lack of distortion and the polars of these new systems and then get a good listen, they can be truly amazing.

Just my two bits,
Barry.

[Mr. Widget]

Why can't I have them my way! Contact your local JBL Pro dealer and buy them without Levinson or Crown amps.

It's only through JBL Synthesis dealers in the US where you have to buy them bundled.



Widget

[Dave_72]

Contact your local JBL Pro dealer and buy them without Levinson or Crown amps.

It's only through JBL Synthesis dealers in the US where you have to buy them bundled.



Widget

Ok, thanks, I appreciate that.

[Dave_72]

If you don't want the amps just go with the BSS option and use your own power amps. I for the life of me can't understand why one would not want the factory DSP. I would bet its highly unlikely that nearly anyone would get them closer to being all they can be. Its not like they're holding back.

If you really look at it, in the not so distant past, nearly every driver has EQ built in somewhere via cone mass, cone curve or shape, inductance of the coil, under hung, over hung, same gap and coil length, magnetic force in the gap and different gap lengths, spider and surround compliance,,, all of this "compromise" to "optimize" a driver for a particular purpose. It looks to me that the new generation of drivers have less of this physical tuning built in and are built with less compromise (pure from an engineering standpoint) as to utilize the incredible power of DSP shaping. When you look at the frequency and the time domain responses, the near utter lack of distortion and the polars of these new systems and then get a good listen, they can be truly amazing.

Just my two bits,
Barry.

Hi Barry,

I was just joking around really. I wasn't being serious. No hard feelings. I thought you guys would get a laugh out of that meme.

Thanks!

[S4700]

Well I have listen to the M2, and I too am now gob smacked at the performance I received this afternoon.
imaging spectacular, dynamics and bandwidth exceptional! The overall headroom of the system was that of a live performance,
every track we played was a different experience to what I knew, every instrument was solid and we heard every harmonic and natural decay of each instrument , particularly acoustic guitar and the percussion of the drum kits, the sound stage was just solid, every breath in vocalists were there, the recording environment revealed its self,
these things are going to be hard on recordings!! Way to revealing!!
how to the S4700's compare? Thankfully very well, though we couldn't A B them, I believe the S4700 is still a very nice platform, the S4700 is a great hifi speaker and aesthetically pleasing, the M2 is on a whole different level, they are live!! I thing the commentators are correct, the M2's are a game changer!!!!

the D2 driver is a freak, how can one driver do so so much?? I think the system's strength is the fact that it is a 2 way design and the fact there is no passive crossover to soak up power, I have to be honest, I didn't feel the DSP let the system down in any way, the transition from lows to highs driver to driver was to my ears seamless!!
the 2216nd has the same carr actor as in the S4700, apart from the fact the Crown amp had a much more solid clamp on the bottom end.
The M2's were mated the the Crown 4 channel 4*3500.
Down fall of the system, none really, maybe the noise of the fan in the amp, which I believe can be attenuated, so no big problem there, the looks are a bit agricultural, but hey they are tools of the trade!

will I get a pair???? You bet I will!!!
just waiting for pricing,

[Mctwins]

Well I have listen to the M2, and I too am now gob smacked at the performance I received this afternoon.
imaging spectacular, dynamics and bandwidth exceptional! The overall headroom of the system was that of a live performance,
every track we played was a different experience to what I knew, every instrument was solid and we heard every harmonic and natural decay of each instrument , particularly acoustic guitar and the percussion of the drum kits, the sound stage was just solid, every breath in vocalists were there, the recording environment revealed its self,
these things are going to be hard on recordings!! Way to revealing!!
how to the S4700's compare? Thankfully very well, though we couldn't A B them, I believe the S4700 is still a very nice platform, the S4700 is a great hifi speaker and aesthetically pleasing, the M2 is on a whole different level, they are live!! I thing the commentators are correct, the M2's are a game changer!!!!

the D2 driver is a freak, how can one driver do so so much?? I think the system's strength is the fact that it is a 2 way design and the fact there is no passive crossover to soak up power, I have to be honest, I didn't feel the DSP let the system down in any way, the transition from lows to highs driver to driver was to my ears seamless!!
the 2216nd has the same carr actor as in the S4700, apart from the fact the Crown amp had a much more solid clamp on the bottom end.
The M2's were mated the the Crown 4 channel 4*3500.
Down fall of the system, none really, maybe the noise of the fan in the amp, which I believe can be attenuated, so no big problem there, the looks are a bit agricultural, but hey they are tools of the trade!

will I get a pair???? You bet I will!!!
just waiting for pricing,

Nice to hear,

I would choose the Crowns 4*3500 to drive this speakers, at least for home use. Better one amp regarding to the fan noise. One can put it in another room and use HighQ net to control the amp or build a isolation box to put the amp in and reduse the fan noise. There is allways a solution for this.

Any findings about the settings?

[S4700]

I think the one amp is the better option, I couldn't get to the subject of settings, the tech guy who set it all up, had to attend to something elsewhere in the building, and the guy assisting me wasn't familiar with the system, I will find out more in time,

[Mctwins]

I think the one amp is the better option, I couldn't get to the subject of settings, the tech guy who set it all up, had to attend to something elsewhere in the building, and the guy assisting me wasn't familiar with the system, I will find out more in time,

Ok, I understand.

If I where there I would sneak inside the Crowns and see how the setting was made. Maybe they didn't have any settings, who knows, but they must have for sure. I will wait for you to find out more.

Was the speaker brand new or did you notice that they needed break-in time?

[S4700]

Definately needed more break in time, third listening session for them, I was very familiar to the sound of the 2216nd, it definitely needed more break in time, I'm guessing the D2 is in the same boat!

[Mctwins]

Definately needed more break in time, third listening session for them, I was very familiar to the sound of the 2216nd, it definitely needed more break in time, I'm guessing the D2 is in the same boat!

Ok,

I have already forgotten how mine speakers sounded when they where new, either couple of hours or day's depends how loud you are playing.

Nevertheless, the most important is that it sounded great.:applaud:

[Dave_72]

Well I have listen to the M2, and I too am now gob smacked at the performance I received this afternoon.
imaging spectacular, dynamics and bandwidth exceptional! The overall headroom of the system was that of a live performance,
every track we played was a different experience to what I knew, every instrument was solid and we heard every harmonic and natural decay of each instrument , particularly acoustic guitar and the percussion of the drum kits, the sound stage was just solid, every breath in vocalists were there, the recording environment revealed its self,
these things are going to be hard on recordings!! Way to revealing!!
how to the S4700's compare? Thankfully very well, though we couldn't A B them, I believe the S4700 is still a very nice platform, the S4700 is a great hifi speaker and aesthetically pleasing, the M2 is on a whole different level, they are live!! I thing the commentators are correct, the M2's are a game changer!!!!

the D2 driver is a freak, how can one driver do so so much?? I think the system's strength is the fact that it is a 2 way design and the fact there is no passive crossover to soak up power, I have to be honest, I didn't feel the DSP let the system down in any way, the transition from lows to highs driver to driver was to my ears seamless!!
the 2216nd has the same carr actor as in the S4700, apart from the fact the Crown amp had a much more solid clamp on the bottom end.
The M2's were mated the the Crown 4 channel 4*3500.
Down fall of the system, none really, maybe the noise of the fan in the amp, which I believe can be attenuated, so no big problem there, the looks are a bit agricultural, but hey they are tools of the trade!

will I get a pair???? You bet I will!!!
just waiting for pricing,

Well that's cool...glad you made out. :D

[4313B]

Well I have listen to the M2, and I too am now gob smacked at the performance I received this afternoon.Yep, it takes all of three seconds to realize that they have it all.

They aren't "audiophile" loudspeakers, they're the real deal. :yes:

[fast_mick]

Hi 4700,

I am in Sydney too, I have Performance series and when they broke I bought a 2nd hand pair of Revel Gems and a Velodyne dd18.

But at this stage my finances could let me look at some M2's, which would most likely be superior to the Gems and Velodyne.

I think its time now to move on from the PS which were very good.

At the moment there is a lot of support from the forum for the M2's and adapting them for a "home" solution.

[martin_wu99]

Well I have listen to the M2, and I too am now gob smacked at the performance I received this afternoon.
imaging spectacular, dynamics and bandwidth exceptional! The overall headroom of the system was that of a live performance,
every track we played was a different experience to what I knew, every instrument was solid and we heard every harmonic and natural decay of each instrument , particularly acoustic guitar and the percussion of the drum kits, the sound stage was just solid, every breath in vocalists were there, the recording environment revealed its self,
these things are going to be hard on recordings!! Way to revealing!!
how to the S4700's compare? Thankfully very well, though we couldn't A B them, I believe the S4700 is still a very nice platform, the S4700 is a great hifi speaker and aesthetically pleasing, the M2 is on a whole different level, they are live!! I thing the commentators are correct, the M2's are a game changer!!!!

the D2 driver is a freak, how can one driver do so so much?? I think the system's strength is the fact that it is a 2 way design and the fact there is no passive crossover to soak up power, I have to be honest, I didn't feel the DSP let the system down in any way, the transition from lows to highs driver to driver was to my ears seamless!!
the 2216nd has the same carr actor as in the S4700, apart from the fact the Crown amp had a much more solid clamp on the bottom end.
The M2's were mated the the Crown 4 channel 4*3500.
Down fall of the system, none really, maybe the noise of the fan in the amp, which I believe can be attenuated, so no big problem there, the looks are a bit agricultural, but hey they are tools of the trade!

will I get a pair???? You bet I will!!!
just waiting for pricing,
Great!
But i think Crown amp is not the best choise for M2,we need soft and sweet sound in our home:D

[martin_wu99]

Nice to hear,

I would choose the Crowns 4*3500 to drive this speakers, at least for home use. Better one amp regarding to the fan noise. One can put it in another room and use HighQ net to control the amp or build a isolation box to put the amp in and reduse the fan noise. There is allways a solution for this.

Any findings about the settings?
You like Crown amp indeed,but i think Crown is not a hifi gear:crying:

[Dave_72]

You like Crown amp indeed,but i think Crown is not a hifi gear:crying:

I agree. :yes:

[Dave_72]

Ok,

I have already forgotten how mine speakers sounded when they where new, either couple of hours or day's depends how loud you are playing.

Nevertheless, the most important is that it sounded great.:applaud:

You have the M2s?

[Dave_72]

Yep, it takes all of three seconds to realize that they have it all.

They aren't "audiophile" loudspeakers, they're the real deal. :yes:

what's the "real deal."

[Mctwins]

You have the M2s?

No, I don't have the M2.

Lend me a pair and I will break-in them in just a couple of hours and call it a day.

Don't need six month....:D

[Mctwins]

You like Crown amp indeed,but i think Crown is not a hifi gear:crying:

Thank God that Crowns is not a hif gear.:bouncy:

Yes, I like Crown amps.:applaud:

I also like the damping factor in I-tech at 8 Ohm; 20Hz to 100Hz >5000

[4313B]

what's the "real deal."Outstanding audio reproduction based on real science and dedicated R&D. No idiotic looking enclosures. No asinine price tags. No need for a whole bunch of transducers arranged in such a way as to win the "clusterfuck of the day" award.

[Mr. Widget]

Outstanding audio reproduction based on real science and dedicated R&D. No idiotic looking enclosures. No asinine price tags. No need for a whole bunch of transducers arranged in such a way as to win the "clusterfuck of the day" award.How do you really feel? :D

I think you just described a studio monitor. Oh, that is what JBL has offered isn't it? ;)


Widget

[1audiohack]

...I think you just described a studio monitor... Widget

Exactly! The sonic equivalent of an Oscope.

I think it's hilarious how the buzz of new technology makes so many people rabid with the desire to own them, yet at once they want them to be something else.


Barry.

[4313B]

How do you really feel? :D

I think you just described a studio monitor. Oh, that is what JBL has offered isn't it? ;)


WidgetYou got me! :rotfl:

I am a bit biased towards JBL Studio Monitors for home theater as well, so it makes complete sense to me that Luxury would want to offer them in a Synthesis package. I'm really glad it happened, and so quickly too.

I guess I am kind of fixated on the 4430/4435 to M2 upgrade path. It's a really nice upgrade. I'm impressed. It has been just over thirty years between models but the wait is well worth it.

[Odd]

You got me! :rotfl:

I am a bit biased towards JBL Studio Monitors for home theater as well, so it makes complete sense to me that Luxury would want to offer them in a Synthesis package. I'm really glad it happened, and so quickly too.

I guess I am kind of fixated on the 4430/4435 to M2 upgrade path. It's a really nice upgrade. I'm impressed. It has been just over thirty years between models but the wait is well worth it.


You seem very enthusiastic.

It soon comes an in house report from 4313B of the M2?

[Mostlydiy]

You seem very enthusiastic.

It soon comes an in house report from 4313B of the M2?

How about a to the K2s9900 as well?

/Mostly

[Dave_72]

Outstanding audio reproduction based on real science and dedicated R&D. No idiotic looking enclosures. No asinine price tags. No need for a whole bunch of transducers arranged in such a way as to win the "clusterfuck of the day" award.

Thanks for the clarification! I agree! I'm not big on your typical audiophile speakers either.

[Dave_72]

No, I don't have the M2.

Lend me a pair and I will break-in them in just a couple of hours and call it a day.

Don't need six month....:D

Ok, thanks. I don't have a pair either! :D

[Dave_72]

Thank God that Crowns is not a hif gear.:bouncy:

Yes, I like Crown amps.:applaud:

I also like the damping factor in I-tech at 8 Ohm; 20Hz to 100Hz >5000

They certainly have their merits. I'll give you that.

[S4700]

They certainly have their merits. I'll give you that.
Yes they do, and they do the M2's a lot of justice! It's just that bloody fan noise that detracts from using them in a home environment. I like the silence between tracks, especially when listening to orchestral music.
I have to say I have never been so exited in all my adult years, this system is epic, and I haven't heard anyone comment on the headroom and shear SPL this system is capable of, I listened to the M2's at over 100 db, and they barely tickled the level meters on the Crown!!

And just a side note on the beryllium thing, it ain't that exotic, the automotive race industry has chewed this stuff up for years, just one valve seat in an alloy race head would yield enough beryllium to make a 100 beryllium diaphragms!, after hearing the 4365's with all the so called high end materials as used in the Arrays and K2s, they don't even seem in the same league as the D2 & waveguide combo. This new system is by fare the most revealing deal I have ever listened to, I'm just pissed I didn't know they were coming!

[ivica]

Thank God that Crowns is not a hif gear.:bouncy:

Yes, I like Crown amps.:applaud:

I also like the damping factor in I-tech at 8 Ohm; 20Hz to 100Hz >5000

May be I am wrong but some easy calculations:
8/5000= 1.6 mOhm (pow-amp impedance)
cables
1m of wire 1mm2 has 16.8 mOhm/m
1m of wire 2mm2 has 8.4 mOhm/m so if using this wire You will have 5 (five) TIMES larger resistivity per ONE meter then pow-amp output impedance, or damping factor 5 times LESS, so using 5 m of this wire would reduce damping factor 25 times.

Not to mention that the drivers internal resistance is 3-to-6 ohms what would totally reduce damping factor to the value of SEVERAL but less the 10.

Regards
ivica

[4313B]

And just a side note on the beryllium thing, it ain't that exotic, the automotive race industry has chewed this stuff up for years, just one valve seat in an alloy race head would yield enough beryllium to make a 100 beryllium diaphragms!, after hearing the 4365's with all the so called high end materials as used in the Arrays and K2s, they don't even seem in the same league as the D2 & waveguide combo.They aren't. The 4365 is targeted at a different market segment.

The "so called" high end materials are called that because they are. No one is blowing smoke up your rear end. It isn't a scam. JBL really did do the proper R&D to arrive at their conclusions. If you personally prefer the D2430K to the 476Mg or 476Be more power to you. I know a few guys that are completely convinced that compression driver technology went nowhere post LE175.

This new system is by fare the most revealing deal I have ever listened toIt's mighty impressive.

I laughed at that statement in that article stating that the M2 "had potential". Clueless much?

[bubbleboy76]

I would like to get BSS BLU dsp-settings for my 4365s! It would be very nice if JBL could provide it for them as well, as they do for the M2.
I think, maybe, the network in the 4365 is somewhat downgraded to not make it sound too close to s9900. It has diodes and stuff. I know Goophy is going active with his 4365s, with very big sound improvements, he says.

[JeffW]

And just a side note on the beryllium thing, it ain't that exotic, the automotive race industry has chewed this stuff up for years, just one valve seat in an alloy race head would yield enough beryllium to make a 100 beryllium diaphragms!

Those beryllium valve seats are a beryllium/copper alloy that contain a really small amount of beryllium, like a couple of percent. I think the beryllium diaphragms are pure or nearly pure beryllium. So maybe make 100 valve seats from a single diaphragm.

[Mr. Widget]

I think, maybe, the network in the 4365 is somewhat downgraded to not make it sound too close to s9900. It has diodes and stuff. .:skeptical:

I can't see them intentionally torpedoing a product.


Widget

[S4700]

Those beryllium valve seats are a beryllium/copper alloy that contain a really small amount of beryllium, like a couple of percent. I think the beryllium diaphragms are pure or nearly pure beryllium. So maybe make 100 valve seats from a single diaphragm.
You are correct, My point was it ain't that exotic and there is a bunch of Be about, anyway I am just pointing out that the D2 for my mind seems to be a milestone for JBL, after all, it did revolutionize the Vertec system,
I'm just exited to be in position that in a short period of time I will be lucky enough to own a pair of the M2s! I am just undecided about the amplification side of it, I think I may go down the Hd5000 path, as in time I would like to get a third box for a theatre arrangement , That keeps everything the same, I can't imagine how good an M2 theatre setup would sound, especially adding a bank of 4645cs.:):)

[Dave_72]

Yes they do, and they do the M2's a lot of justice! It's just that bloody fan noise that detracts from using them in a home environment. I like the silence between tracks, especially when listening to orchestral music.
I have to say I have never been so exited in all my adult years, this system is epic, and I haven't heard anyone comment on the headroom and shear SPL this system is capable of, I listened to the M2's at over 100 db, and they barely tickled the level meters on the Crown!!

And just a side note on the beryllium thing, it ain't that exotic, the automotive race industry has chewed this stuff up for years, just one valve seat in an alloy race head would yield enough beryllium to make a 100 beryllium diaphragms!, after hearing the 4365's with all the so called high end materials as used in the Arrays and K2s, they don't even seem in the same league as the D2 & waveguide combo. This new system is by fare the most revealing deal I have ever listened to, I'm just pissed I didn't know they were coming!

Wow, sounds exciting. Maybe you can hear them with all Levinson electronics?