I've been Ju..Jub..Jubalized

[SEAWOLF97]

.
Got an email from one of those storage places ... they had a pair of JBL's..was I interested ?
couple of exchanges and found they were original L65 Jubals .. the woman said "you won't believe their
condition" ..well, that was to be seen. We agreed on a price, so the little boss and I drove up to Vancouver, Wa ...first impression ?? smaller than I'd envisioned...( had been storing a pair of 4671's and that was my frame of reference.)

Second impression ?? She was right abt the condition.

So I forked over some green, loaded them up and set course for Oregon.

They are all there ... grills, glass tops, black mats, binding posts , no scrapes/gouges etc ....just needed
refoaming ..in fact it was the easiest re-foam job on a 12 that I've ever done.

So I'd never heard an 077/2405 before ...I can see why you all like them so much ...good mids , but waayyy too bassy. Sitting on the floor, they may qualify for the "fun, but fake" label.

turned out nice...may keep them a while...looking for stands to get them up a bit.

[hjames]

Those look great
Kudos to you!

Maybe try getting them a bit up off the floor -
couple of 2x4s or 4 ...
that should tone down the bass.
I've got a small 2x4 plinth with furniture wheels under my L200 and it helps a lot.
Also easier to move it around for house cleaning & finding the best sound position ...




. They are all there ... grills, glass tops, black mats, binding posts , no scrapes/gouges etc ....
just needed refoaming ..in fact it was the easiest re-foam job on a 12 that I've ever done.

So I'd never heard an 077/2405 before ...I can see why you all like them so much ...
good mids , but waayyy too bassy. Sitting on the floor, they may qualify for the "fun, but fake" label.

turned out nice...may keep them a while...looking for stands to get them up a bit.

[4313B]

Yeah JBL tried to get the bass right on that model three different times. It never really worked out. It's unrealistic to expect a driver with that kind of bottom end to sound very good with that much boundary reinforcement (close to the floor).

Like others have said, get them up off the floor so the slot is near ear level and they start to sound more normal.

Coupled with the grille I think it is a very nice looking box. The boxes make great subwoofer boxes with the right drivers.

[speakerdave]

They are a very handsome speaker for sure. Sadly that only works when they are sitting on the floor, for me anyway, because everything that has been said about getting the woofers off the floor is true. Toed in so the axes cross in front of the listening position the treble may not drive you out of the room. In the end they were for me quite adequate stands for a pair of LSR32's. I agree that the slot tweeter may be the key attraction. It makes them seem like a gateway to large format, which they may have been for many as they were for me. Once you've listened to a good horn tweeter it's not easy to go back to a generic titanium dome.

[edgewound]

Let's not forget the L65 Jubal was meant to be a piece of furniture....an end table. In a loving room with a low boy comfy couch and deliver RICH results.

Jazz sounds heavenly on them. Too much bass? Turn down the bass....or plug the port with some foam to start a quicker roll-off.

One my all time favs is the L65.

[Audiobeer]

I always like the L-65s in the room I had. Concrete floor that was carpeted. Sounded great. Let me know if you ever let these go. I'm always fond of speakers that are on the west coast and costly to ship. :eek:

[SEAWOLF97]

Like others have said, get them up off the floor so the slot is near ear level and they start to sound more normal.

Coupled with the grille I think it is a very nice looking box. The boxes make great subwoofer boxes with the right drivers.

I found a pair of Brit Avon (?) stands that put them up abt 6 inches and angle them approx 15 degrees ...seems to have cured the issues somewhat ...sound very acceptable now.

the nice looking boxes are very similar to the nice looking UB212 box.


I always like the L-65s in the room I had. Concrete floor that was carpeted. Sounded great. Let me know if you ever let these go. I'm always fond of speakers that are on the west coast and costly to ship. :eek:

the living room already has the 250Ti's, UB212 , Walsh F's and the little Logik's, so the L65's are kinda overkill ...they are sitting where we stack firewood, so will prolly need to move abt September.

[BMWCCA]

the livingr oom already has the 250Ti's, UB212 , Walsh F's and the little Logik's, so the L65's are kinda overkill ...they are sitting where we stack firewood, so will prolly need to move abt September.

:) I'm pretty sure you'll find a buyer for them.

I suspect they're worth more toward the purchase of firewood than they'd gain you in just burning the cabinets. On second thought, the L65 does have a history of bringing more parted than whole on occasion. How many BTUs in particle board?

[SEAWOLF97]

:) I'm pretty sure you'll find a buyer for them.

I suspect they're worth more toward the purchase of firewood than they'd gain you in just burning the cabinets. On second thought, the L65 does have a history of bringing more parted than whole on occasion. How many BTUs in particle board?

Interesting sentiment. I NEVER part out decent speakers that have a reasonable chance of living again.. NEVER , let me repeat to be clear ... NEVER.

On cursory inspection, these could pass as NEW. I would like to keep them, but I made a promise (in a moment of weakness) that no more speakers would permanently reside here. I TRY to keep my promises.

I have parted out speaker carcases and the particle board does burn very hot. The woodstove normally loafs along at abt 300 degrees, but I throw in an 8x10 sized piece of PB and the temp jumps to 500-600.

So are you planning to part out your old Beemers, Phil ?? they may be worth a lot more that way.

[BMWCCA]

So are you planning to part out your old Beemers, Phil ?? they may be worth a lot more that way.

Nope, just like you I can't bear the thought of parting. Much of what I have is worth ten-times parted as whole and I just won't do it. Let someone else do that after I'm gone.

That goes for JBLs, too, though that is interesting to know about particle board. I may have a new use for all the old Ikea junk!

And your Jubals look to be in super shape. I knew you wouldn't part them. Great find!

[hjames]

Nope, just like you I can't bear the thought of parting. Much of what I have is worth ten-times parted as whole and I just won't do it. Let someone else do that after I'm gone.

That goes for JBLs, too, though that is interesting to know about particle board. I may have a new use for all the old Ikea junk!

And your Jubals look to be in super shape. I knew you wouldn't part them. Great find!

Burn MDF if you like - but thought the badness of that was from the burning glue ...

[SEAWOLF97]

Okay ...today I finished up the refoams on the AMT 10B's ...they were a reverse process like the LE14H-1's
(ie: foam to the basket first and then to the cone) ....also fabbed 1 new 12 inch passive radiator ...the veneer still needs some TLC..

and then you the reader says "I thot this thread was abt Jubals" ??

well. I put the ESS's next to the L65's and swapped leads over ...and guess what ? I prefer the sounds of
the Heils.
Did get the L65's up abt 6 inches and tilted maybe 15 degrees. Am sure the components are
right & working correctly, but still , must be my ears, but the AMTs are friendlier* sounding.

had never planned to keep the Jubals, but certainly may do so with the 10B's.

(ok...now waiting for snarky comments, Phil & Mr.W)



*I'm not an audio writer who can wax poetic and describe in detail everything I hear ... but, to me
friendlier=more inviting, more involving , more satisfying

[grumpy]

That Heil AMT mid/tweet is a nice unit. It does have a "right" sound.
I liked the open arrangement on the floor model.

[SEAWOLF97]

That Heil AMT mid/tweet is a nice unit. It does have a "right" sound.
I liked the open arrangement on the floor model.

you are dead right Grumpy, the Heil unit is very sweet ...would love to hear their floor speaker.
hard to believe that I'd not experienced one b4 as they are from the mid/late 70's ...there was
a lot of innovation going on then ...was ESS a much smaller, low production company ?

I seem to have a thang for 2 ways. have a bud here in PDX (also a LHF member) who bought
L65's new , back in the day ...He doesn't like the mids and thinks the crossover points are wrong.

LATER: I went wiki'ng and found this tidbit.... "Nelson Pass, currently of Passlabs (an amplifier builder) was employed by ESS during the production of the early amt-loaded speaker designs incorporating 10-inch woofers."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ESS_speakers

[grumpy]

http://www.audioreview.com/cat/speakers/floorstanding-speakers/ess/amt-1b/prd_119461_1594crx.aspx

They sold quite a few speakers at the time, and had some really wild/unusual technologies (in essentially made-to-order
type quantities, vs the more normal bookshelf and floorstander models).

Google essspeakersusa.com ... the folks there are trying to make a go of it again.

Other mfgs are using tweeters similar (or licensed/lifted/?) to the AMT, including in some pretty high-end monitors
with good reputations.

I don't think the AMT1b and Jubal buyer would be the same person (different audio flavors).

[SEAWOLF97]

One thing that I did notice..the Heil projects a very large image ..no pinpoint sourcing here.

which is all kinda funny, as my prior exposure to electrostats showed an incredibly narrow image.

[edgewound]

One thing that I did notice..the Heil projects a very large image ..no pinpoint sourcing here.

which is all kinda funny, as my prior exposure to electrostats showed an incredibly narrow image.

It's a different topology.

The AMT diaphragm is pleated, whereas electrostats and planar diaphragms are flat and radiate dead forward.

[SEAWOLF97]

It's a different topology.

The AMT diaphragm is pleated, whereas electrostats and planar diaphragms are flat and radiate dead forward.

sure, that makes sense ..thx

finished the refoam on the 10 ...surprised at the bass that it and the 12 PR make.
(it did take a lot of TDee-um)

[SEAWOLF97]

That Heil AMT mid/tweet is a nice unit. It does have a "right" sound.
.

Had a return buyer come over yesterday for foams & belts.

He was telling me abt his newly purchased Hersey's (I've never heard any)

then he stopped and looked over at the ESS's that were playing ... "Could I turn them up ??"

sure

he asks "what ARE those ?" ..."the HF & MF are soo clear, and the bass is very tight"

guy listens for a while and asks if I've like to trade them for a pair of Heresy's ???

I guess dollar wise it would have made sense, but I think these are gonna stay here. ;)

[SEAWOLF97]

Twice this last week I've had buyers come over for foam surrounds .... Both times they come in and run over to the 250Ti's , exclaiming how beautiful they are ;)

"Can we listen to them ?" yeah, OK, can do another demo


eventually they notice the AMT 10b's on the floor ... "So what are those ?" ESS "never heard of them"

"as long as we are here, can we hear them too ?"

well they aren't on any hirsute gear , just a Denon receiver.

after abt 10 seconds of demo, the question has come both times "How much ?"

confused, I've reply "how much what ?"

PRICE. people who 1 minute ago never heard of ESS ,now want to buy speakers from a company they never knew existed.

I have declined to sell them, they are just too enjoyable. :D




relayed this story to a LHF friend who has 10b's also ....he was telling me about an ESS marketing campaign in the 1970's where they went around to many colleges and did blind testing with the students, pitting L100's vs. AMT 10b's. Said the vast majority preferred the ESS although it has a 10 instead of a 12.

Mebbe I can coax him to post that story.