4406 ... Info needed

[gdwrench]

Hello folks,got a couple of questions on these as I am going to do some resto work and get these back into quality shape'

Is there any source I can go too for the Grille grommets that are installed into the cabinets ? While getting these out a few of them came apart and I will be needing some.They are 1/2" diameter holes that they go in......

I will also be replacing the surrounds on the 115-1's.These are the rubber/plastic type,do you see any problem with these going to foam surround's ??

These baby's are a little rough but with alittle TLC and experienced hands :D,I think they will be quite nice little jewels..... Thanks for any help


GD

[Wagner]

Hello folks,got a couple of questions on these as I am going to do some resto work and get these back into quality shape'

Is there any source I can go too for the Grille grommets that are installed into the cabinets ? While getting these out a few of them came apart and I will be needing some.They are 1/2" diameter holes that they go in......

I will also be replacing the surrounds on the 115-1's.These are the rubber/plastic type,do you see any problem with these going to foam surround's ??

These baby's are a little rough but with alittle TLC and experienced hands :D,I think they will be quite nice little jewels..... Thanks for any help


GD

It is odd that the rubber inserts for the grille pegs came apart? They are usually quite tough.
I would not replace the rubber compliance with foam, you will change the way the driver behaves.
If the surrounds were Lansalloy you would have no choice except for a complete re-cone, but that's not the case here.
Are they torn or ripped? If not, leave them alone.
I also find that a bit puzzling. What is wrong with the surrounds?

[gdwrench]

Well Wagner what has happened is that when I went too pull the Inserts out,I was using a rather sharp blade type tool too pry them out,I suppose when a little slice began the more I pryed' the worse they got.....think I need 4 or 5 of them.

The surrounds.....It's not that they are ripped or deteriorated,the adhesive that has held them to the baskets has gone bad ??The adhesive is like a slimey type goo and will not hold the surrounds in position for any period of time.Plus,over time the surrounds have somewhat warped and shrank from not being in position.I'm affraid if I try to clean all the old goo off I will damage the voicecoil or the spider from all the handleing and probably will not fit again anyway.
There is no issues to where they attach to the cone though,perfect at that aspect

[hjames]

Well Wagner what has happened is that when I went too pull the Inserts out,I was using a rather sharp blade type tool too pry them out,I suppose when a little slice began the more I pryed, the worse they got.....think I need 4 or 5 of them.



My L100T speakers have a similar "grommet" thats sits in holes drilled into the face of the baffle - 6 per cabinet if memory serves. A couple had gotten rammed down into the hole under the previous owner by the grill pins.
I managed to pull them back out with needle-nose pliers, but if I had to replace some of them, and I suspect they are unavailable now, I'd spread the good ones around between the two cabinets to support the outer pins, and worst case I'd cut some rubber tubing and slip it into the hole to hold the grill pins ... something like auto vacuum hose should work just fine ...

[rdgrimes]

The surrounds.....It's not that they are ripped or deteriorated,the adhesive that has held them to the baskets has gone bad ??The adhesive is like a slimey type goo and will not hold the surrounds in position for any period of time.Plus,over time the surrounds have somewhat warped and shrank from not being in position.I'm affraid if I try to clean all the old goo off I will damage the voicecoil or the spider from all the handleing and probably will not fit again anyway.
There is no issues to where they attach to the cone though,perfect at that aspect
Chances are good that the VCs are already damaged if the speakers were being used in this condition. The 115-1 is pretty easy to find on eBay. Replacement might be the path of least resistance.

http://cgi.ebay.com/JBl-115H-1-6-5-Mid-Bass-drivers-L20T-L20T3-4406-XLP200-/130557739797?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item1e65d90315

[gdwrench]

My L100T speakers have a similar "grommet" thats sits in holes drilled into the face of the baffle - 6 per cabinet if memory serves. A couple had gotten rammed down into the hole under the previous owner by the grill pins.
I managed to pull them back out with needle-nose pliers, but if I had to replace some of them, and I suspect they are unavailable now, I'd spread the good ones around between the two cabinets to support the outer pins, and worst case I'd cut some rubber tubing and slip it into the hole to hold the grill pins ... something like auto vacuum hose should work just fine ...
I'm suprised there are not some type of generics out there for a .500 / 1/2" hole? Thanks for the feedback,I've just started looking i'm sure something will pop up...It usually does ;)

[gdwrench]

Chances are good that the VCs are already damaged if the speakers were being used in this condition. The 115-1 is pretty easy to find on eBay. Replacement might be the path of least resistance.

http://cgi.ebay.com/JBl-115H-1-6-5-Mid-Bass-drivers-L20T-L20T3-4406-XLP200-/130557739797?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item1e65d90315
Well we did hook them up,but only at time of purchase and they did sound just fine.Not all the surrounds are detached,I'd say only about 30% on each driver is not touching.
My best guess is that these were stored in a very hot enviroment which caused this to happen.Even some of the veneer has seperated from the cab a bit,but that does'nt matter these are getting a full blown resto and change in appearence.

Thanks for the link,maybe I will look for drivers if the need arises but not at those prices....I dont have that into the purchase of the units but in the meantime I will be on the search engine !!!



GD

[rdgrimes]

If you think those drivers are expensive, look at the cost of a re-cone. $45 per driver is more in line with the cost of a re-foam.

[gdwrench]

If you think those drivers are expensive, look at the cost of a re-cone. $45 per driver is more in line with the cost of a re-foam.
True,if I was desperate for drivers I would be looking that direction.But now that I've had a little time to clean these up i see that they have been re-coned in their rescent past and the surrounds were not attached to the baskets with the correct adhesive.They used something that never totally cured and stayed gooey pliable (like thick maple syrup)allowing the surrounds to walk off the basket in a few spots while warping from heat/time exposure.This crap cleaned off the baskets rather easily.

I will get new surrounds and install them. For 15 bucks I'll give her a go ;)

[hjames]

True,if I was desperate for drivers I would be looking that direction.But now that I've had a little time to clean these up i see that they have been re-coned in their rescent past and the surrounds were not attached to the baskets with the correct adhesive.They used something that never totally cured and stayed gooey pliable (like thick maple syrup)allowing the surrounds to walk off the basket in a few spots while warping from heat/time exposure.This crap cleaned off the baskets rather easily.

I will get new surrounds and install them. For 15 bucks I'll give her a go ;)

Most of the folks here have had good luck with refoam kits from Rick Cobb
[email protected]

First off, JBL doesn't really support "refoam kits" - they say the right way is to have your driver reconed - but that said, a number of us HAVE replaced the failed surrounds on our drivers ourselves, and Rick really provides a good kit with good adhesive, good instructions, and an audio test CD to play while the glue sets up to help keep everything centered.

I've done a number of different drivers with his kits and he cares about getting the right fit for your driver. Write him and see what he has to say.

[rdgrimes]

I would not replace the rubber compliance with foam, you will change the way the driver behaves.


I have to agree with this advice. Foam will not perform the same. It may loosen up over time and do OK, but it's not the original suspension.

If I'm not mistaken this driver should have a hard foam one-piece gasket holding the surround in place. It sounds like this was left off, which calls into question the whole re-cone job.

[gdwrench]

I have to agree with this advice. Foam will not perform the same. It may loosen up over time and do OK, but it's not the original suspension.

If I'm not mistaken this driver should have a hard foam one-piece gasket holding the surround in place. It sounds like this was left off, which calls into question the whole re-cone job.
If you mean the trinm that goes around the inside of the basket edge,I do have those,they were ther just not in their proper location.Those had moved also with the unstable adhesive.
When I put the new surrounds on I will face them at each other and play some 'Gangsta Rap' through them at a high volume :eek: and walk away for a while. That should break the surrounds in :p :D. Hey I got nuthin' too lose trying the cheap fix first.


GD

[Wagner]

I'd go with the 115H-1s previously suggested and get a very good little system working as designed.

That woofer is what makes this little mini so spacial and the over achiever that it is.

You can experiment and practice with the old questionable drivers while you listen to and enjoy the new ones.

If you are able to successfully repair them you can sell them and recoup a substantial part of your cash outlay.

Otherwise, you just may wind up with a couple of veneered door stops and a lot of frustration, not to mention money and time down the drain.

[gdwrench]

I'd go with the 115H-1s previously suggested and get a very good little system working as designed.

That woofer is what makes this little mini so spacial and the over achiever that it is.

You can experiment and practice with the old questionable drivers while you listen to and enjoy the new ones.

If you are able to successfully repair them you can sell them and recoup a substantial part of your cash outlay.

Otherwise, you just may wind up with a couple of veneered door stops and a lot of frustration, not to mention money and time down the drain.

Well I'll tell ya what,if for some reason these kickass baskets,voicecoils,cones,& magnets can't get these surrounds too work and sound good then i will find a way too put the old ones back on.I stll have those and cleaned the gue off them and they are in one peice albeit the shape they are in.

[gdwrench]

Well I did give into temptation and went ahead and allready have one new driver and the 2nd is on the way.. Iu have re-foamed the original 115's and they are a thing of beauty ;) I would install and listen too them but the cabinets are under restoration and isn't possible at this time.If I could figure out how to upload pics to this site I would,other websites make this task very simple and I'm sure this one is once you have it down.....