JBL quality control could use some improvement

[wu6fiend]

Less than two years ago, I purchased just about the entire JBL Studio L Series (L890, L820, L830, L8400P, LC1 and LC2). Because JBL has virtually no presence up here in Canada (particularly in B.C.), I purchased the speakers from a couple of different retailers on eBay. All were brand new, in unopened boxes.

I own two LC2 speakers. The first one was defective, right out of the box. No sign of any damage, just the sound was strangely muffled. I took it to a trusted, very experienced speaker repair shop, and he found a problem with the internal wiring. Looked like it had that way from the production line. He fixed it, and it is fine now.

Last week, one of my two L8400P subs quit suddenly. The standby light would briefly illuminate when I cycled the on/off button, the back was warm to touch, but it was dead. All connections were checked, and were fine. I plugged in the other L8400P, and was back in business.

Now the sub has to be taken in for repairs. No warranty, as it would have to be returned to the U.S., and shipping etc. would be at my cost. Hopefully the local shop can repair this sub.

To say that I am disappointed, and somewhat irritated would be accurate. I have owned several pairs of vintage JBL speakers since new (the mid 1980s), and have never had any trouble with them.

I am starting to question my loyalty to this brand.

[dcolak]

Less than two years ago, I purchased just about the entire JBL Studio L Series (L890, L820, L830, L8400P, LC1 and LC2). Because JBL has virtually no presence up here in Canada (particularly in B.C.), I purchased the speakers from a couple of different retailers on eBay. All were brand new, in unopened boxes.

I own two LC2 speakers. The first one was defective, right out of the box. No sign of any damage, just the sound was strangely muffled. I took it to a trusted, very experienced speaker repair shop, and he found a problem with the internal wiring. Looked like it had that way from the production line. He fixed it, and it is fine now.

Last week, one of my two L8400P subs quit suddenly. The standby light would briefly illuminate when I cycled the on/off button, the back was warm to touch, but it was dead. All connections were checked, and were fine. I plugged in the other L8400P, and was back in business.

Now the sub has to be taken in for repairs. No warranty, as it would have to be returned to the U.S., and shipping etc. would be at my cost. Hopefully the local shop can repair this sub.

To say that I am disappointed, and somewhat irritated would be accurate. I have owned several pairs of vintage JBL speakers since new (the mid 1980s), and have never had any trouble with them.

I am starting to question my loyalty to this brand.

I suggest you not to look inside the speakers. The way they "threw" the damping material into my JBL S38II was really lame. Half of it not even glued, hanging... :crying:

[hjames]

I suggest you not to look inside the speakers. The way they "threw" the damping material into my JBL S38II was really lame. Half of it not even glued, hanging... :crying:

I had 2 different pairs of S38 II speakers - both were fine inside ...
My LC2 plays well, but the 4-way rear jacks don't always hold the banana plugs in well - it has dropped out from that.

[jhal]

JBL is not what it used to be. Way back when, even the entry level speakers were built with the same high regard to quality as their hi-end stuff.

That is not the case anymore. Since the CEO of Harman International's main concern is profit, expect more of the same, or worse since everything is either made in China or Mexico now.

James is rolling in his grave right now.

[badman]

JBL is not what it used to be. Way back when, even the entry level speakers were built with the same high regard to quality as their hi-end stuff.

That is not the case anymore. Since the CEO of Harman International's main concern is profit, expect more of the same, or worse since everything is either made in China or Mexico now.

James is rolling in his grave right now.


Yup. A shameful end to a great man's heritage.

[wu6fiend]

Took the sub in to the JBL-authorized repair shop today. He said the replacement amp (if that is indeed the issue) is around $170, and it will be 2-4 weeks for the parts to arrive from the supplier (which is in Quebec).

I found it interesting that the owner of the shop commented that he is seeing a lot of subs from many different manufacturers coming in for repairs. He said that they all use poor quality amps. He said that Polk and JBL are just two of the offenders.

Oh well, its only money.:banghead:

[Allanvh5150]

Took the sub in to the JBL-authorized repair shop today. He said the replacement amp (if that is indeed the issue) is around $170, and it will be 2-4 weeks for the parts to arrive from the supplier (which is in Quebec).

I found it interesting that the owner of the shop commented that he is seeing a lot of subs from many different manufacturers coming in for repairs. He said that they all use poor quality amps. He said that Polk and JBL are just two of the offenders.

Oh well, its only money.:banghead:

Yup, as with most things today, the more you spend, the less time the product spends in the repair shop. Many of the failures today are caused by "chip" companents on surface mount PCB's. I am fixing this sort of thing all the time. Nice and quick to manufacture and great in our throw away society......

[rlsound]

JBL home products used to have a MUCH larger presence here in BC until the late 1990s or very early 2000's when A&B Sound went tits up. A&B was a large stocking JBL dealer as was Beamriders and Future Shop.

The later JBL powered subs were infamous for blowing up frequently. It was one of the reasons I switched to Paradigm Reference in 2003.

Who is the JBL repair guy in BC?

[wu6fiend]

IT Electronics in Burnaby.

Just spoke to him today. The cost to fix the sub will be around $450 plus tax. Amp has to be replaced. No, it can't be fixed. And amp is back ordered for 5 weeks, minimum. Less than $100 of that price is labor. Part is expensive.

Pretty frustrating. There would be no warranty, regardless of whether I'd bought it locally, or via eBay (which I did). Warranty on the amps is only 1 year, and the sub is about 2 years old.

I thought long & hard, then told him to fix it. It would cost me about $600 plus shipping to replace it over the net, and a lot more than that if I bought it locally.

If I thought it would produce results, I would write to JBL, and tell them how displeased I am. Years ago, I had a very expensive Sony VCR go belly up on me. I wrote to Sony, and they decided, even though it was long out of warranty, they would sell me the parts for cost, and give me a break on the labor. Saved me a sizeable sum, when I got it fixed. I very much doubt Harman would care about my dead sub.

:banghead:

ps. rlsound, I miss A&B Sound, I spent a good chunk of my teenage years hanging out there!

[hjames]

Wow - I had a similar dead amp on a Volkswoofer and I wound up using an external amp bridged to mono to feed it. Why repair an unstable design when better amps are available for less. ...?

The again, after the fiasco I went through with that crappy Harman Kardon AVR 7300 - I am NOT impressed with their capabilities.


IT Electronics in Burnaby.

Just spoke to him today. The cost to fix the sub will be around $450 plus tax. Amp has to be replaced. No, it can't be fixed. And amp is back ordered for 5 weeks, minimum. Less than $100 of that price is labor. Part is expensive.

Pretty frustrating. There would be no warranty, regardless of whether I'd bought it locally, or via eBay (which I did). Warranty on the amps is only 1 year, and the sub is about 2 years old.

I thought long & hard, then told him to fix it. It would cost me about $600 plus shipping to replace it over the net, and a lot more than that if I bought it locally.

If I thought it would produce results, I would write to JBL, and tell them how displeased I am. Years ago, I had a very expensive Sony VCR go belly up on me. I wrote to Sony, and they decided, even though it was long out of warranty, they would sell me the parts for cost, and give me a break on the labor. Saved me a sizeable sum, when I got it fixed. I very much doubt Harman would care about my dead sub.

:banghead:

ps. rlsound, I miss A&B Sound, I spent a good chunk of my teenage years hanging out there!

[SEAWOLF97]

Wow - I had a similar dead amp on a Volkswoofer and I wound up using an external amp bridged to mono to feed it. Why repair an unstable design when better amps are available for less. ...?.

I too have a M&K subs with weak amps ... had an old NAD receiver whose FM didnt work, but the amp section does ..so it runs the 2 subs (one on each channel) ...just set the NAD to mono and dialed down the treble ...works great. :bouncy:

[RKLee]

IT Electronics in Burnaby.
.
.
If I thought it would produce results, I would write to JBL, and tell them how displeased I am. Years ago, I had a very expensive Sony VCR go belly up on me. I wrote to Sony, and they decided, even though it was long out of warranty, they would sell me the parts for cost, and give me a break on the labor. Saved me a sizeable sum, when I got it fixed. I very much doubt Harman would care about my dead sub.

:banghead:

ps. rlsound, I miss A&B Sound, I spent a good chunk of my teenage years hanging out there!In the days of yore, JBL would probably fix it for free; today with all of the emphasizes on quarter-to-quarter profits, probably not. Beside most JBL electronics is made in China, they probably don't have the in-house expertise to repair, the only choice is to replace.

[rlsound]

Is the synthesis all chinese built as well?


I too spent too much time at A&B. I think I've visited them all, at least the ones in the lower mainland. Just the perfect mix of different classes of electronics, sales guys that were there for years. The service was bar none. Then they were bought out, over expanded and struggled until Future Shop was purchased by Best Buy. Then it was game over for A&B. They died a horrible, slow death.

Anyways, back to the issue at hand :)

[Allanvh5150]

Is the synthesis all chinese built as well?


I too spent too much time at A&B. I think I've visited them all, at least the ones in the lower mainland. Just the perfect mix of different classes of electronics, sales guys that were there for years. The service was bar none. Then they were bought out, over expanded and struggled until Future Shop was purchased by Best Buy. Then it was game over for A&B. They died a horrible, slow death.

Anyways, back to the issue at hand :)

The cool thing about buying Synthesis gear in NZ is the fact that it caries a 10 year minimum warranty!! :)

[Ed Kreamer]

I have to wonder if the pro division is having the QC problems that I'm hearing about in the consumer division. Does any one know; Are the pro products also going to be built out of country also?

[rlsound]

The Pro gear is being made in Mexico. Cinema guys were waiting MONTHS to get a 4675C. They sourced one locally.

[wu6fiend]

Picked up the sub, ended up costing about $500 tax incl for a brand new amp, 90 day warranty on parts & labor. I decided that, as I only paid about $300 for it new, I might as well get it fixed.

Got it home, and (surprise!), it works, but the stand by/ in use lights on top don't work.

After driving about an hour there, and an hour back, to get it, I'm not particularly happy.

Stay tuned...

:banghead:

[dcolak]

Picked up the sub, ended up costing about $500 tax incl for a brand new amp, 90 day warranty on parts & labor. I decided that, as I only paid about $300 for it new, I might as well get it fixed.

Got it home, and (surprise!), it works, but the stand by/ in use lights on top don't work.

After driving about an hour there, and an hour back, to get it, I'm not particularly happy.

Stay tuned...

:banghead:

Hey, you paid $500. I paid $11.000 for my Array 1400's and these were the problems I detected when I took them out of the box (brand new):

1. One horn had imprinted fingers on one side (can't remove them). I guess a Mexican worker wasn't too careful.

2. One horn had no damping gasket at the bottom. I didn't notice it at first and connected it to the enclosure anyway. Now I have scratched enclosure too.

3. One woofer had something spilled on it or someone scratched it with a finger.

4. One mid driver was scratched on its back side.

5. Another horn has scratch marks on it.

Now I am waiting for JBL to see when/if they are going to get the replacement parts.

I'm starting to fear they already ran out of replacement parts, although they still sell the product.

Imagine buying a brand new car for which there are no replacement parts. That's how I feel at the moment.

What kind of product support is that? :dont-know:

[SEAWOLF97]

You know I never heard of any QC problems on NEW L100's, L26's, L19's etc..etc..
(and they were the lower end of consumer JBLs)

progress ? :dont-know:

[grumpy]

Internet. It's impossible to take care of most things quietly now.

[LowPhreak]

I found it interesting that the owner of the shop commented that he is seeing a lot of subs from many different manufacturers coming in for repairs. He said that they all use poor quality amps. He said that Polk and JBL are just two of the offenders.

If you want a powered sub that does still come with a decent amp, get a REL (http://rel.net/). I can tell you from owning a Stentor III for several years, they're overbuilt, sound excellent, and integrate with most satellites and rooms extremely well. Never a hint of a problem and I have pounded this thing unmercifully, (generally mated with B&W Nautilus 803s X-Oed at 34Hz).

Might cost a bit more than the L8400P though. ;)

[SEAWOLF97]

saw a pair of JBL E??? towers in a thrift yesterday ....the plastic baffles were warped , drivers looked super cheesy and I wouldn't take them home even if they were FREE ....if this was
my only exposure to JBL , welll ...my opinion of the brand would be very low....hope they
sounded great, but somehow I doubt it..:crying:

[Wagner]

The Old Gray Mare,
she ain't what she used to be,
many long years ago.

[Eaulive]

saw a pair of JBL E??? towers in a thrift yesterday ....the plastic baffles were warped , drivers looked super cheesy and I wouldn't take them home even if they were FREE ....if this was
my only exposure to JBL , welll ...my opinion of the brand would be very low....hope they
sounded great, but somehow I doubt it..:crying:

Actually the Nothridge E series is not as bad as it may seem.

[Allanvh5150]

Actually the Nothridge E series is not as bad as it may seem.

Would have to agree there.....

Allan.

[Altec Best]

I found it interesting that the owner of the shop commented that he is seeing a lot of subs from many different manufacturers coming in for repairs. He said that they all use poor quality amps. He said that Polk and JBL are just two of the offenders.


That's why I live and die with McIntosh amps still proudly made in the USA.The day they have to be made in China,Mexico,etc... Is the day they will close shop permanently! :applaud:

Granted they cost more but what doesn't for quality ? Personally I'm disgusted with the state of electronics today.Good quality electronics gear used to be affordable for everyone.Now you have to spend a lot of cash to get top quality gear.Or you get into the cycle of having to buy new cheap stuff every year because it just doesn't last before repairs are needed.I'm not saying every single item but in general.

[SEAWOLF97]

Imagine buying a brand new car for which there are no replacement parts. That's how I feel at the moment.
What kind of product support is that? :dont-know:

when I worked at Intel, we found a bunch of older NEC laptops in storage...when talking to NEC , I discovered that they were valuable to NEC..they explained that current US law requires replacement parts to be available for 7 years after a products life...and they did not have parts for those computers ....we/I sold them back to NEC to cover their a$$es for parts availability.


Actually the Nothridge E series is not as bad as it may seem.


Would have to agree there.....

Allan.

thank for your post E (and the "me too") ...I was responding to the thread topic ....
the only worse QC speaker that I've seen was a pair of UK built Missions...the Chinese would be embarrassed to put their COO on those (tho they sound fine)

[LowPhreak]

That's too bad, because Mission used to be a half decent speaker. Had a pair of the little Model 70 in the late 80s that served me well.

[Eaulive]

Good quality electronics gear used to be affordable for everyone.Now you have to spend a lot of cash to get top quality gear.

I tend to disagree with this. 20 years ago you could not find a brand new professional Crown amplifier or JBL loudspeaker at 300 bucks.
Today anybody can get PRO gear for a ridiculous price, the problem is not that the quality is going down, it's that the lower cost of electronics and production has spawned a new range of products that could not be produced 20 years ago.

[SEAWOLF97]

Today anybody can get PRO gear for a ridiculous price, the problem is not that the quality is going down, it's that the lower cost of electronics and production has spawned a new range of products that could not be produced 20 years ago.

agree...used Pro gear (my experience is with BGW) is cheap, reliable and MUCH better than the equivalent cost 2011 stuff ...but the equivalent quality new gear is out of my price range. My BGW203 preamp was 3k new.

thats why we, as a group, tend to go for vintage 43xx/44xx monitors, Crown , BGW , Nak , Yam etc..type gear.

The amps I'm using are meant for the road or 24/7 usage , are field replaceable on the components and built like MILSPEC and aren't made in Ch1na..


Good quality electronics gear used to be affordable for everyone.Now you have to spend a lot of cash to get top quality gear.

I lusted after L100's in 1972 ....they were $273 each ...that was a princely sum back then , took a number of years to finally afford them ...seems like a joke now.

[Eaulive]

I lusted after L100's in 1972 ....they were $273 each ...that was a princely sum back then , took a number of years to finally afford them ...seems like a joke now.

$1474.21 in adjusted 2011 dollars, according to them: http://www.coinnews.net/tools/cpi-inflation-calculator/