JBL 240Ti value

[MyLittleViking]

I have an opportunity to purchase a pair of JBL 240Ti speakers from the original owner. The cabinets are in exceptional shape with no nicks or scratches anywhere. All the driver's are original. The only repair ever done was the replacement of the woofer surrounds at a licensed JBL dealer at a cost of $287. I know the market is down now, but he is asking $1000. I am hoping to get them for $800, what do you guys think about acquiring these speakers at this price?

Scott

[HCSGuy]

If you have heard them and fallen in love with them, go for it. If you're thinking of an investment in future collectability, take a pass. I paid $600 for a perfect pair about 8yrs ago, didn't like the sound (they don't compare to 250Ti's, despite the driver similarity), but I still have them as they're hard to sell - to big to ship, not worth enough to make the effort to crate them, and my pair is too clean to part out.

Unfortunately, 240Ti's just aren't that desirable, so they don't sell at any premium over the drivers' raw values. I haven't seen a no-reserve Ebay auction on them, but several sellers keep putting clean sets up at $899 or a thousand and they don't sell. A year or two ago TiDome was offering his clean pair to LH members for $600 and I don't think he sold them. They have a great woofer (LE14H-1) that's worth $175-200 each if pristine. The 044Ti tweeters are also rare, you may be able to get $150 for a perfect pair. The 104H midranges are probably worth $80/pr. Crossovers and cabinets have little or no value, so you get $630 in parts value. Normally, perfect pairs would be worth much more to collectors, but this model seems to be collector proof and is desired mainly for its parts. Good luck, and let us know if you get them!

[Titanium Dome]

Yes, not a nibble at $600, not even at $550.

[4313B]

Unfortunately, 240Ti's just aren't that desirable, so they don't sell at any premium over the drivers' raw values.Have any of you considered Zilching the 104H and 044Ti in those things with a waveguide and 2452H-SL?

While I liked the 240Ti well enough I can also see why it was the model guys settled for at the time because they just couldn't swing the extra cash for the 250Ti. It's a better system than the L100T or L100t3, which people seem to like for some reason.

[macaroonie]

Should work.

49085

[HCSGuy]

I haven't listened to mine in probably 3yrs, but my memory was that the bass definition did not compare to my 250TiLe's - I blamed the resonant enclosure, though it could also be tuning or size. I didn't pursue it any further. I would scavenge the woofer for a project in a new enclosure before I modified the stock one. Opinions anyone?

[4313B]

Should work.:applaud:

I haven't listened to mine in probably 3yrs, but my memory was that the bass definition did not compare to my 250TiLe's - I blamed the resonant enclosure, though it could also be tuning or size. I didn't pursue it any further. I would scavenge the woofer for a project in a new enclosure before I modified the stock one. Opinions anyone?A narrower box with some actual bracing inside and that waveguide on top for a modern L200T or "quick and dirty" 1400 Array. :p Sell the 104H's and 044Ti's to guys who need spares for their 18Ti's, 120Ti's and 240Ti's.

Seriously, if you guys don't like these things then make them into something you do like...

[MyLittleViking]

I wouldn't have the heart to part them as they are all original and in MINT condition. The cabinets are simply gorgeous. The only concern is that one of the woofers was re-foamed incorrectly with an aftermarket kit even though it cost $257 at a high end shop. Apparently they could not order the factory surrounds. Can this be corrected? If not, how much does this affect the value?

I am enamored with vintage JBL andd Altec sound, however these sound more like the contemporary JBL designs and have a more subdued and warm sound to them, not like the monitor sound of the 70's. I imagine its because of the networks and "could" sound like vintage JBL with some crossover mods or active crossovers.

[JeffW]

I wouldn't have the heart to part them as they are all original and in MINT condition. The cabinets are simply gorgeous. The only concern is that one of the woofers was re-foamed incorrectly with an aftermarket kit even though it cost $257 at a high end shop. Apparently they could not order the factory surrounds. Can this be corrected? If not, how much does this affect the value?

JBL never issued "factory surrounds", only re-cone kits from what I gather. So anybody doing a re-surround job is using an aftermarket foam kit. But there are good foam kits out there, like those from Rick Cobb.

If they were mine (and I wanted to either keep OR sell them), I'd have both woofers re-foamed with kits from Rick Cobb. Being a high-end shop doesn't strictly translate into a shop that knows shit from shinola. There are some really top notch guys out there that do superior work, that's what you want. Edgewound is a good example, I have some of his work and it's exemplary.

[DavidF]

...The only concern is that one of the woofers was re-foamed incorrectly with an aftermarket kit even though it cost $257 at a high end shop. Apparently they could not order the factory surrounds. Can this be corrected? If not, how much does this affect the value? ...

I am enamored with vintage JBL andd Altec sound, however these sound more like the contemporary JBL designs and have a more subdued and warm sound to them, not like the monitor sound of the 70's. I imagine its because of the networks and "could" sound like vintage JBL with some crossover mods or active crossovers.

a) $257 could be a fair price for a full recone by an authorized tech. $257 for one refoam? That's what the Pentagon would pay.

b) your preference for the vintage JBL/Altec sound will likely make this a poor investment for you.

c) the 240ti model was a later evolution of JBL sound. You could make a retro sound model out of it but you would have to swap the mid and perhaps the tweeter, completely revise the crossover, and change the tuning of the enclosure.

Thinking you should pass on these.

[brett_s]

Before I picked up a set of XPL200 earlier this year, I was looking for quite some time for a really nice set of 240ti's. Let me tell you, there is a price difference depending where you are. In the midwest, a nice clean set will run you around $700 to maybe $750, and they are hard to find. On the coasts, they seem much more availabe, and probably $150 or more cheaper. I don't know why that is, but it was what I found, and I was looking for a long time.

I could have had them shipped from the coasts for the same total cost as pickup in the midwest, but I couldn't bring myself to do it.

Clean one are also harder to find. Basket cases yes, pristine samples are far and few between.

I'm not sure why there was a price difference, but the coasts were cheaper, especially west.


Just my two cents.
Brett

[MyLittleViking]

It was done well and performs perfectly. The surround just wasn't attached on the underside of the cone as it was originally. The other surround is original as still in perfect condition. I just don't know how much this would affect the value, I can't imagine it would affect the performance any? And no it was not a re-cone, just new surrounds were installed.

I agree about the sound not suiting my tastes, but I am really impressed with the driver compliment and cabinets, they are gorgeous!

I already know I will have to do some cabinet tuning and crossover finessing to get them to perform like I would like. I am thinking active crossovers will be the way to go.

[MyLittleViking]

I will be meeting him on Thursday to hopefully make a deal, I'll let you guys know how things go.

[macaroonie]

:applaud:
A narrower box with some actual bracing inside and that waveguide on top for a modern L200T or "quick and dirty" 1400 Array. :p Sell the 104H's and 044Ti's to guys who need spares for their 18Ti's, 120Ti's and 240Ti's.

Seriously, if you guys don't like these things then make them into something you do like...


The box aint so bad as I remember and you could winkle effective bracing in there through the bass driver hole. Use gorilla glue to stick em in. Crude but effective The cab has a nice roundover on the front edges so diffraction will be reduced. Not a bad start. . It looks as if the PT-H 1010 will cover the mid and tweet cutouts so you get a nice cosmetic job and as far as I recall Zilch has the x/o done and dusted. Given that the bass driver is one of the best they made ( of its time ) you have the beginnings of something potentially very very good indeed.
It might seem like a long path but then rome was not built in a day !

[HCSGuy]

If the woofer was refoamed on the the front side, it does not really affect performance - it's there to keep the front of the cone centered on the frame while the spider places the voicecoil in the gap. The foam is pliant enough that I really don't think it would make a difference. However, once you've glued it to the front it cannot be removed placed on the back. If you want to correct it, you're out a recone ($275 or so) or you can buy a used (maybe NOS:)) woofer to replace it for $175-200 if you're patient. I've got three Le14H-1's that are refoamed incorrectly, but I can't bring myself to recone them - I found beautiful used ones for cheaper.

I appreciate that you've decided you have to have these speakers, but between the premium price, the bad foam, and the fact you don't love the sound, I think this may be a deal you'll wish you had passed on after the newness wears off. Myself, I'd keep saving for a pair of 250Ti's...

[4313B]

If the woofer was refoamed on the the front side, it does not really affect performance - it's there to keep the front of the cone centered on the frame while the spider places the voicecoil in the gap.Surrounds get no respect...


Hey, what do you guys think about Jerry's new 1501FE with the cloth surround? I might just have to pick up a few of them even if they are Made In <Anywhere but U.S.A.> :rotfl:

[grumpy]

An idea who's time has come around (again).

Real value given the current surround materials science state?
or a nostalgic nod to the past for those that feel no foam is good foam?
(I'll confess there is a certain appeal for me)

I'd sure like to hear the system based on them (4365).

All I want for Christmas :D:

49089

[svollmer]

For comparison, there's another pair of 240Ti's on CL in DC for $725. No affiliation.

http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/ele/2135266965.html

[opimax]

As someone who once wanted a set and in no way trying to be a downer, I note that they are not moving at that price

Mark

[edgewound]

The 240ti is a gorgeous speaker system....especially if not abused.

The teak cabinetry is very unique in the JBL legacy line-up and has "class" written all over it. The richness of the wood develops over the years with proper care and feeding with teak oil.

The LE14H-1 must be repaired/refoamed properly as a recone kit seems to not be available nowadays. Placing the surround on anywhere but on the back of the cone is just a shortcut and ruins the cone for any future repairs done right. Since the cone and voice coil are so industrial grade on this driver, and rarely are they fried, replacing the spider and surround can result in a nearly recone equivalent. It just takes patience....like anything else....to do it right and with care.

240ti is beautiful and has it's place in the family of floor standers.

[Titanium Dome]

They are very nice to look at, 'tis true. They really sound pretty good, just not 250Ti good.

I had an open house here last summer and played my "beater" pair in the garage for the guests, and they were pretty impressed. Of course, many of them are sat/sub owners, so any full-range speaker will be enlightening.

There's still another pair virtually NIB in my garage, too, that I should set up. They are gorgeous, really, and I doubt anyone will ever pay me what I think they're worth. I might as well use them... but, where? :dont-know:

[svollmer]

The 240ti is a gorgeous speaker system....especially if not abused.

The teak cabinetry is very unique in the JBL legacy line-up and has "class" written all over it. The richness of the wood develops over the years with proper care and feeding with teak oil.

240ti is beautiful and has it's place in the family of floor standers.


Agreed! Below are a few pictures of mine before I sold them to a LH member. When oiling, DON'T :scold:get the oil on the driver frames, or they'll be all shiney and yucky!

:49162
49161
49160

[spkrman57]

Hey, what do you guys think about Jerry's new 1501FE with the cloth surround? I might just have to pick up a few of them even if they are Made In <Anywhere but U.S.A.> :rotfl:

I wonder what they would cost us?

Ron

[Regis]

They are very nice to look at, 'tis true. They really sound pretty good, just not 250Ti good.

I had an open house here last summer and played my "beater" pair in the garage for the guests, and they were pretty impressed. Of course, many of them are sat/sub owners, so any full-range speaker will be enlightening.

There's still another pair virtually NIB in my garage, too, that I should set up. They are gorgeous, really, and I doubt anyone will ever pay me what I think they're worth. I might as well use them... but, where? :dont-know:

I remember them well. They didn't sound bad and then you turned on the XPL-160's and the little XPL's blew them away! Better definition, punchier, more midrange output, it was no contest for me (IMHO). If I had to choose between the two, I'd know which one I'd be looking for. Ditto on the 250Ti comments as well.

[jblnut]

I'm not quite sure why the 240Ti doesn't get the love and respect of the 250Ti. I bought a pair for $275 about 5 years back that needed refoaming. I sold them to a friend (at cost) to get him into the JBL family. He's a single guy with lots of disposable income, he's a musician, and he eats, sleeps and breathes music. The fact that he still has them (and LOVES them) speaks volumes. I visit his place frequently (and vice versa) and frankly, they sound a lot more like the 250Ti than this thread would lead you to believe. They only lack a little quickness/impact in the snare drum area as they don't have the 108h 8" lower mid driver.

They're a f'ing steal at anything under $750 imho and you'd frankly be very hard pressed to equal them new for less than $2k, maybe more. And yes the XPL160 might have been more of a "wow" speaker for demos and parties (I know, I had the 140) but for something to live with long term, it's very hard to beat the larger Ti's.

jblnut

[Don C]

Remember that the 044ti tweeter is going to have less output over time as the foam rubber behind the dome rots away. There are no more new diaphragm kits available for these tweeters, so it's going to be rare to hear these speakers sounding as good as they should. I love the sound of these speakers when they're working well, but I'd invest elsewhere.

[jblnut]

I'm curious how to assess/quanitfy this reduction in output over time. Mine certainly do not seem to have lost anything in the upper registers. Is is possible for this "foam rot" to cause no harm, or perhaps an insignifigant amount ? If this foam was used for dampening, is it also possible that it might actually damp less and therefore cause some spikes/peaks in response instead?

I'm certainly not ready to run from the Ti's without a fight at least:). How bad is this really and how likely is it to affect every single 044Ti over time? And how much time at that ?

There's pages and pages of tweeters in the PE catalog, as well as some other JBL units that would fit with some work. I reckon if/when the time comes I'll bite the bullet and swap something else in there rather than scrap 2 250Ti's.

jblnut

[SEAWOLF97]

Remember that the 044ti tweeter is going to have less output over time as the foam rubber behind the dome rots away. .

why shud we remember that ? just a supposition, not a known fact :confused:


I'm curious how to assess/quanitfy this reduction in output over time. Mine certainly do not seem to have lost anything in the upper registers. Is is possible for this "foam rot" to cause no harm, or perhaps an insignifigant amount ? If this foam was used for dampening, is it also possible that it might actually damp less and therefore cause some spikes/peaks in response instead?

jblnut

we kinda hashed that out ...

HERE ==>> http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?29325-044Ti-questions-Help-needed

and IF you are really worried, the foam isnt that hard to replace

[jblnut]

I'm not worried and mine ain't broke...(yet anyway)

It certainly wouldn't deter me from buying a nice set of 240TI's *if* I could hear them first and they sounded good. But I can see how others might see the end of the line with no more new parts available. It's something we're all going to have to get used to in the legacy JBL world. We've been spared a fate that many other speakers of a similar vintage have suffered long ago - no more factory parts.

I've got a new 044TI in the box (thanks Giskard) and a pair of 120's standing by as donors. My "end of the line" is quite a ways out on the horizon. I hope my kids and grandkids will be rocking the house with 250's long into the future!

:-)

jblnut

[Don C]

I can only speak from my own experience, and I'm going by memory. The tweeters that I worked on had gooey rotted foam residue inside. The treble sounded rolled off compared to other speakers that I had for comparison. I measured the output at only one frequency, 5Khz if I recall correctly, then rebuilt them with new diaphragms and re-measured. They were 6db higher after the rebuild. And the speakers sounded much better. I don't see why any other of the same tweeters would have lasted much longer, the environment was not much a factor since the rotted foam is on the inside of the tweeter. I'd think that most of the tweeters have the same or similar problems as mine did by now. We all know that foam rubber doesn't last forever.

[mike]

The Ti series were really purist speakers that can be a little boring sounding until you get used to them and or appreciate what they do. I think the 240Ti would be a little more user friendly than the 250Ti which can really require the right room and placement.

Mike

[SEAWOLF97]

I think the 240Ti would be a little more user friendly than the 250Ti which can really require the right room and placement.

Mike

as a 250Ti owner , I have not found that to be the case...they are much easier to place than an L7.

[svollmer]

I'd think that most of the tweeters have the same or similar problems as mine did by now. We all know that foam rubber doesn't last forever.


The whole Ti series is so nice (mechanically and physically) that it's just a shame JBL didn't use another material such as felt.

[4313B]

The whole Ti series is so nice (mechanically and physically) that it's just a shame JBL didn't use another material such as felt.Agreed.

[SEAWOLF97]

The whole Ti series is so nice (mechanically and physically)

The speaker that I'd like to audition is the little discussed 120Ti ...they seem to get no "ink time" .....really enjoyed the L-166 and hope the 120 might be a good extension of that model ?? :confused:

nice family

[4313B]

The 120Ti was very nice for a twelve-inch three-way bookshelf loudspeaker. I have alot of time logged in front of the whole series. I thought they were all quite good. The tweeter issue is, well, an issue. The foam is a problem with ANY JBL loudspeaker that uses it. Even the foam in the recone kits goes to hell after a certain number of years. While it is certainly better than Lans-A-Loy from a longevity standpoint it still breaks down eventually. Lans-A-Loy was arguably the best surround material ever invented from a purely functional diaphragm termination perspective. Too bad it couldn't survive on this planet. :rotfl:

[jblnut]

I bought a pair of 120's from a forum member a few years back. They are my "daily drivers" as they are on in my office all day while I work. They replaced - and sound very similar to - the 4410's I used to have up here. I originally lent them to a friend who was considering leaving the Klipsch fold. We spent a lot of time comparing them to his Forte's and while the 120's produced far superior bass, the mids and highs just did not have that transparency he had become accustomed to. Of course they aren't horn-loaded with 98db efficiency so it surely wasn't an apples/apples comparison. His wife loved them ("the Klipsches are always SHOUTING at me and are JUST TOO LOUD") but he decided to keep the Forte's. So much for WAF :D.

The 120's might be the best of the legacy JBL 12" 3-ways, but may not compare to a more modern design like the LSR32. If you like the sound of an L100T/t3, 4410, 4412, etc, you might want to check out a pair while they are still undervalued.

Or you might wish to pass knowing the 044Ti's in them may be living on borrowed time...depends on how you view this whole foam damper busniess.

jblnut

[SEAWOLF97]

I bought a pair of 120's from a forum member a few years back. They are my "daily drivers" as they are on in my office all day while I work. They replaced - and sound very similar to - the 4410's I used to have up here. I originally lent them to a friend who was considering leaving the Klipsch fold. We spent a lot of time comparing them to his Forte's and while the 120's produced far superior bass, the mids and highs just did not have that transparency he had become accustomed to. Of course they aren't horn-loaded with 98db efficiency so it surely wasn't an apples/apples comparison. His wife loved them ("the Klipsches are always SHOUTING at me and are JUST TOO LOUD") but he decided to keep the Forte's. So much for WAF :D.

The 120's might be the best of the legacy JBL 12" 3-ways, but may not compare to a more modern design like the LSR32. If you like the sound of an L100T/t3, 4410, 4412, etc, you might want to check out a pair while they are still undervalued.

Or you might wish to pass knowing the 044Ti's in them may be living on borrowed time...depends on how you view this whole foam damper busniess.

jblnut

thanx for your perspective on the 120Ti ..tho I find it unusual to compare them to 4410's (which I enjoyed) and 4412's (not so much)

in actuality , I dont need more speakers. there is already a que of them waiting for something in use to develop a problem..so that they can get their moment in the spotlight.

Grumpy & I kinda hashed out that 044Ti foam thang here ....http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?29325-044Ti-questions-Help-needed ...and I took pictures.

and

(..sometimes making a coherent forum post is harder than swapping out that foam) :eek:

[BMWCCA]

Interesting to review this thread so many years later. And great to revisit Seawolf's commentary (may he RIP) and others who no longer contribute as frequently.

Now that I am a 240ti owner for over a week, I find these a very pleasant speaker to listen to. I got my wife to enter the Speaker Dungeon to hear them and she liked them enough to ask if she could have them in her room. I hesitated to ask what "her room" was, but . . .

I'll be doing the re-surround as soon as Rick's kits arrive. I ordered four since I've still not done my 250ti that are still stored in the boxes at my old house. This may be just the ticket to get me going on both.

When I got these, one tweeter wasn't working (long story described elsewhere here), so I had no fear in taking it apart to check it out and look at the dreaded foam issue. For my first time, it was really not much of a problem to disassemble them. I've been in nearly every variant of the 044 so taking out the o-ring, screen, and magnet assembly is simple. I found a heat gun, a stainless "spudger" set I bought for iPod battery replacement, and ultimately a very thin putty knife was all I needed. Emphasis on the heat-gun. Even with the applied heat, the foam plug was supple and not sticky even at over 35-years. That was encouraging and maybe I'll concoct a felt replacement now that I have no fear of opening these up for periodic maintenance.

Visuals, just for the heck of it:

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52732779120_76ccbbea41_k.jpg

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52742145222_0f161244ff_k.jpg

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49221985343_125909f886_c.jpg

[BMWCCA]

All done and breaking in the surrounds—in case they need it. Sound pretty good right now.
It's a little late to be blasting them! :no_wag:


https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52794459976_02f12fe92a_k.jpg

[DerekTheGreat]

Awesome speakers, I've always liked the look of both.

Good ole Seawolf, his commentary is missed.

[BMWCCA]

I was "allowed" some loud listening time this evening after work and I have to say these are quite impressive.

Like most upper-level JBLs, you have to feed them good recordings or they'll drive you batshit crazy. I started with what was in the CD player all night working the surrounds—Michael Hedges Live on the Double Planet. I could have listened for hours. Next up was Daft Punk but even as much as I love Nathan East, I just tire of the electronic vocals very quickly. From there I jumped to Bill Evans Quintessence which starts out with "Sweet Dulcinea Blue" and that fantastic interplay between Harold Land on tenor sax and Kenny Burrell on guitar. I know it probably sounded even better on my 4345s but it was pretty sublime with the 240ti and the Crown Studio Reference-II. From there I moved to Dire Straits' On Every Street which seemed perfectly matched to the voicing of the 240ti with both attenuators at -2dB. I tried some of my favorite Lizz Wright whose voice and range I love, but here the poor quality of the recording made it no fun to listen to for more than a short moment. No such problem with any CD from the late Chris Whitley I tried.

Easy to get lost in the music and this was the first time I even lit the signal lamps on the Studio Reference-II. These are now keepers and I can't wait to do the re-surround on my 250ti next!

[Mr. Widget]

Very cool...

They look great and I bet they do sound nice. Are you listening down in the dungeon, or were you able to take them upstairs where I assume the acoustics are more forgiving?


Widget

[BMWCCA]

Very cool...

They look great and I bet they do sound nice. Are you listening down in the dungeon, or were you able to take them upstairs where I assume the acoustics are more forgiving?Acoustics are surprisingly good in the basement speaker dungeon. Rock wool insulation packed into the ceiling with Tyvek covering, waiting for an acoustic tile ceiling at some point. The second-floor "bonus" room is the eventual target but I'll have to finish that one before I'm no longer capable of hauling some of these heavy boxes up the stairs. :rolleyes:

[DerekTheGreat]

I was "allowed" some loud listening time this evening after work and I have to say these are quite impressive...

...it was pretty sublime with the 240ti and the Crown Studio Reference-II... ...Easy to get lost in the music and this was the first time I even lit the signal lamps on the Studio Reference-II...

:thmbsup:

"Allowed." LoL.

Glad to hear that about the SR-II's, getting me all geeked up to receive mine. What can you say about the way it sounds compared to other amps or other Crown amps you've listened to? Is there anything it does fabulously well? Is there something you wish it did better or not at all? Which preamp did you use with it?

[BMWCCA]

What can you say about the way it sounds compared to other amps or other Crown amps you've listened to? Is there anything it does fabulously well? Is there something you wish it did better or not at all? Which preamp did you use with it?Those types of evaluations have always been tough for me since I bought my first Crown over 50-years ago to replace a Fisher SA-1000. The McIntosh dealer I used for the Mac Clinics on my C20 had recommended Crown to me and gave me three to take home and try, D60, D150, and DC300. Back then my mind told me each increase in power gave me a "fuller" sound on the JBL 030 system which were my only speakers back then. My decision was based on cost as I was in high-school working summer jobs at a show warehouse, double-carrying golf bags back when they were leather and heavy on one of the hilliest golf courses I've ever seen to pay for my hi-fi and BMW. habit. 36-holes per day where on some holes there was a rope-tow to pull you from one green to the next tee. I still own the D150 and the C20—and the 030 in C35 cabinets. That's a preface in saying most of my experience has been with Crown amps.

Where my test setup is now I had everything running off a Crown Power Line Three and Crown SL2 preamp. The pre-amp developed an imbalance for which it will eventually go to AE Techron for a check-up and I replaced it with a spare Soundcraftsmen Pro-Control-Four, same as what I use in my main bi-amped 4345 system. (I also use a Crown PSL-2 and a JBL/Urei 6260 with L5s in our "Library" room. Both pre-amps do what a pre-amp is supposed to do in offering control over inputs without adding anything downstream, hence the Crown "straight-line" name.

Just like 50-years ago, what I heard when I first hooked up the SR-II was an increase in the fullness of the sound. I can't call it voicing and it has been rare for me to say power-amps that I've owned have any voice at all with the exception of my pair of Soundcraftsmen Pro-Power-Fours which to my ears have a bass-boost built in. I also own Adcom, Carver, and power amps, but the SC is really the only one that seems to color the sound. So I just don't use them. Probably perfect for subs, but I don't use those, either. I acquired the SR-II after I got my 250ti because I knew those really benefitted from more power. I have yet to try that combination but these 240ti are likely a similar situation. And they thrive on the SR-II, though I've never heard the 240ti before and this is the only amp I've tried them on so far.

I don't really see what I could want the amp to "do better". But every speaker system I've hooked it to sounds more "full" and I figured there might be some nuance lost with a big amp and some "sterility" based on those who have commented on the SR-II. The reality is there are nuances and subtleties heard through good speakers with this amp that make the music even more transparent, like looking past the veil into the individual instruments. The presentation, to me, is one of a more "live" sound, which is the point of High Fidelity. Even the lowly Pro-III Plus gain increased clarity with the SR-II. Now, of course, the amp loves to be played loud and increasing volume can alter your perception in any comparison, but it just sucks you in.

What would I want it to do better? I can't imagine what that would be. But given the limits of my amp experience over the years, I may just be ignorant of what I expect from any power amp. It will be interesting to hear what someone else experiences with the Studio Reference-II. And I may not have the audiophile jargon down enough to play this game. But I know what I like and so far this is the one.

Hi-ho, hi-ho, it's off to work I go. Let us know what you think.

[DerekTheGreat]

I appreciate the detailed response. :)

My SL-1 is off at AE Techron now for a dead channel, eager to get that back in the system. I also cannot accurately use all those audiophilic terms. But when I moved to the SL-1 from the Adcom GFP-555, I noticed the mids and highs were clearer? More accurate? The instruments were more discernable, if that makes sense. Percussion kits really stand out now, cymbal/high hat crashes and it's like I can hear the "kiss" of the drum stick on a cymbal when the musician is play softly and if it is a good recording. The SL-1 made the GFP-555 seem fuzzy by comparison, and I really liked the GFP-555 before the SL-1 dropped in.

I think I've read the same reviews you have about the SR-II being dry or sterile. Then again, I've come across thread after thread where people claim all pro amps are garbage and should never be considered or used for home hi-fi. Experience has proven that to be rubbish. Definitely anxious to see how the SR-II compares against my GFA-555 II on bass duties and then my PS-200 for highs on the 813C's. If I had to say anything about the PS-200, it seems a little bass shy, but great everywhere beyond, upper bass (is that thing?) is nice and tight, gives percussion that added thwack and I'd say the highs are airy and accurate, some of the best, if not the best I've heard so far. The GFA-555 II seems bass heavy and a tad dark/relaxed with the upper registers. I enjoy it powering my B460 clones, but the K series amps I had were noticeably tighter.

[BMWCCA]

When I got these, one tweeter wasn't working (long story described elsewhere here), so I had no fear in taking it apart to check it out and look at the dreaded foam issue. For my first time, it was really not much of a problem to disassemble them. I've been in nearly every variant of the 044 so taking out the o-ring, screen, and magnet assembly is simple. I found a heat gun, a stainless "spudger" set I bought for iPod battery replacement, and ultimately a very thin putty knife was all I needed. Emphasis on the heat-gun. Even with the applied heat, the foam plug was supple and not sticky even at over 35-years. That was encouraging and maybe I'll concoct a felt replacement now that I have no fear of opening these up for periodic maintenance.
As noted elsewhere, that tweeter "repair" only lasted a couple of days, so I have two u$ed ones coming from California. I also just received four diaphragms I ordered off AliExpress from China. Figured I may as well make the non-working one a project and an experiment!

Any words of advice before I screw up a classic JBL tweeter? :banghead:

[macaroonie]

Should work.

49085

Hi guys hope you are all well.

Click the attachment above pls.

I cant believe I posted this in 2010 , thanks to Giskard for the tech suggestion.
Given that 240's are trading in the US for $750 or less I would have no hesitation in doing a Zilch mod and DSP ing the snot out of them.
Funny how the M2 came along some years later with much the same form / concept.
In light of some of the crazy prices asked for audiofool mini's I think this pathway is a no brainer.

Funny how the 250Ti attracted all the attention , yes they were TOTL , I found them to be slightly disconnected sonically un the HF. I put that down to the height which would generally be somewhat above ear level.

These days I'd be looking at replacing the 044 tweets with the small Aurum Cantus ribbon tweet. .

Cheers for now folks . M

[Dagfinn]

Hey mac, all, greetings! Here's how I will say goodbye to mine, and how I think they play best. The reason is of course the high crossover from the woofer; 900Hz. Vocals will for a large part come from the woofer, yet not all - specially higher female voices. To me, this improves coherence of vocals, as does some other tonality issues. If they were staying I'd lift them another 10cm... The reason they are leaving is of course new speakers arriving: 250Ti LTD BQ :D. Happy Christmas, everyone :). Regards, Dagfinn