Array 1400 with Mcintosh MC402

[jasonyeo]

Hi , I am planning to get a mc402 to match with my Array1400 . I will be biwiring the speakers . May I know what ohms should I connect to on the Mcintosh ? Understand the Array1400 is rated at 8ohms but the Horn module is at 6ohms :confused:

[timc]

If you have not already bought it, I would advice against the MC402 for this speaker.

I lived with the MC402 for over a year, and it shows a lack of control when used with large woofers with lots of return current. The mids and highs are glorious, and with smaller speakers the bass is also great.

Anyways. Always go for the 8ohm outputs if it does not cause any trouble. Then you will have the least interference from the autoformer.

[jasonyeo]

How about MC252 ? I can only afford to get either a MC252 or MC402 but not 501...

[Luke]

quote:I lived with the MC402 for over a year, and it shows a lack of control when used with large woofers with lots of return current. The mids and highs are glorious, and with smaller speakers the bass is also great.


:confused::confused::confused:

[tom1040]

I currently have that setup. I enjoy the hell out of it. 8 ohm taps.

[jasonyeo]

Thanks . Maybe I will go with a 303 instead of 402 +202...

[Luke]

Thanks . Maybe I will go with a 303 instead of 402 +202...

Why? 402 is ok with that speakers:)

[tom1040]

I think you could bi wire them also. I have done that with my S2600 with great success. Try the bottom on the 4 ohm tap and the highs on the 8 ohm tap. Then reverse and pick what you liked the best.

No great love on this site for McIntosh it would seem.

[Luke]

I listen to this speakers with a less powerfull amp. Bass was excellent!!

[jasonyeo]

Why? 402 is ok with that speakers:)

My friend told me I will regret if buying the MC402 because not enough juice . He went directly to buy the 501s to pair his B&W802D after listened to MC402 .

I am now in the loss now :confused: Not sure to buy a MC402 for Array1400 and a MC202 for Array880 center or just buy the MC303 . Any suggestions ?

[jasonyeo]

I think you could bi wire them also. I have done that with my S2600 with great success. Try the bottom on the 4 ohm tap and the highs on the 8 ohm tap. Then reverse and pick what you liked the best.

No great love on this site for McIntosh it would seem.

Can connect in this way ? No issue with the poweramp?

[jasonyeo]

I think you could bi wire them also. I have done that with my S2600 with great success. Try the bottom on the 4 ohm tap and the highs on the 8 ohm tap. Then reverse and pick what you liked the best.

No great love on this site for McIntosh it would seem.



I listen to this speakers with a less powerfull amp. Bass was excellent!!

My Array1400 is on the way :D Still using the Array1000 and bass already good . My friend already bought my array1000 :D.

[tom1040]

Can connect in this way ? No issue with the poweramp?


I did with the S2600. If fact, on the AudioKarma site, the guys from Mac confirmed this was possible. I have yet to with the Arrays since I have not had the time, but they are set up for bi-wiring.

[Luke]

My friend told me I will regret if buying the MC402 because not enough juice . He went directly to buy the 501s to pair his B&W802D after listened to MC402 .

I am now in the loss now :confused: Not sure to buy a MC402 for Array1400 and a MC202 for Array880 center or just buy the MC303 . Any suggestions ?

Try to listen with 2 amps and don´t know which of the two is actually running. You will be surprised:D

[timc]

Hope people didnt misunderstand. I LOVE mcintosh amplifiers. I just don't think they have ultimate control over large woofer. The 1.2kw and 2kw is a different story ;D

I would buy a 402 over a 501 any day. The reason is that the cooling on the 501 is underdimensioned. Same with the 252. The 501 is just a balanced single channel 252.

If you can afford it i think 2x252 is the best bet, if you want to stick with Mcintosh.

For woofer control the 252,402, and 501 is easily bested by a "small" Crown XTi amplifier. But as stated. The mids/highs on these amps is close to the very top.

If it was my money, i would use the Greg Timbers workaround and make them active, with a cheap XTi for woofer duty, and a nice tubeamplifier for the horn. Did i hear someone say MC2102? ;)

[jasonyeo]

I did with the S2600. If fact, on the AudioKarma site, the guys from Mac confirmed this was possible. I have yet to with the Arrays since I have not had the time, but they are set up for bi-wiring.

That means I need 2 sets of speaker cables for this type of wiring . :)

[jasonyeo]

Hope people didnt misunderstand. I LOVE mcintosh amplifiers. I just don't think they have ultimate control over large woofer. The 1.2kw and 2kw is a different story ;D

I would buy a 402 over a 501 any day. The reason is that the cooling on the 501 is underdimensioned. Same with the 252. The 501 is just a balanced single channel 252.

If you can afford it i think 2x252 is the best bet, if you want to stick with Mcintosh.

For woofer control the 252,402, and 501 is easily bested by a "small" Crown XTi amplifier. But as stated. The mids/highs on these amps is close to the very top.

If it was my money, i would use the Greg Timbers workaround and make them active, with a cheap XTi for woofer duty, and a nice tubeamplifier for the horn. Did i hear someone say MC2102? ;)

I need a amp for center channel as well but only can get at most 2 amps . How does the MC303 perform compare to other combinations for ht duty?

[timc]

I'm sorry to say that i have no experience with the MC303.

What about finding a used 207?

Should be about the same as a new 402 i guess. Mabye less. Then you could biamp the whole shabang :)

[jasonyeo]

I'm sorry to say that i have no experience with the MC303.

What about finding a used 207?

Should be about the same as a new 402 i guess. Mabye less. Then you could biamp the whole shabang :)

I believe 207 does not have the autoformer? I think I have read someone experienced humming due to the lack of autoformer on 207 :confused: To play safe so I stay away from the 205 and 207 :o:

[tom1040]

That means I need 2 sets of speaker cables for this type of wiring . :)

That is correct.

[jasonyeo]

That is correct.

Do you think if using different characteristics cables(eg:copper for low ,silver for highs) to biwire a speaker will cause any side effect or must be same ?

[timc]

I believe 207 does not have the autoformer? I think I have read someone experienced humming due to the lack of autoformer on 207 :confused: To play safe so I stay away from the 205 and 207 :o:

Humming from a Mc? That just sounds wrong.

But you are correct. There is no autoformers on the 207, only an impedance switch as far as I can tell?

The best result I have heard with the big JBL's is with Audio Research. I hope to test them with the Marantz MA-9s someday.

[jasonyeo]

Humming from a Mc? That just sounds wrong.

But you are correct. There is no autoformers on the 207, only an impedance switch as far as I can tell?

The best result I have heard with the big JBL's is with Audio Research. I hope to test them with the Marantz MA-9s someday.

I just read it somewhere about the humming . Anyway , I think I made up my decision . Will be getting the MC303 as I am more a HT guy . If budget permits by end of year , will then get the 202 for surround . Surround back may just use back my current anthem statement amp :D

[tom1040]

Do you think if using different characteristics cables(eg:copper for low ,silver for highs) to biwire a speaker will cause any side effect or must be same ?

I have no idea. I would keep it all the same.

[jasonyeo]

Whar is the spade size to use n the mcintosh amps? Standard size(1/4"-5/16") or large(3/8")?

[natelabo]

I believe 207 does not have the autoformer? I think I have read someone experienced humming due to the lack of autoformer on 207 :confused: To play safe so I stay away from the 205 and 207 :o:


The MC207 has DPM (Dynamic Power Management) not an autoformer but which is able to drive a load from 4-8ohms at full rated power and distortion specs. This is an amazing, powerful amp and a relatively cheap (If that exists in higher end audio) way to get a ton of power to a ton of channels. I would know I am currently driving my JBL Performance (PS/PT/PC) theater with it. I would like to know what they are smoking to think it hums. Bad amp or more likely bad power? Humming no.... :)

[Audionutz]

Now up to amp No 4 on my 1400's. They seem to love power, agreed, but the quality of that power shines through loud and clear. Latest and greatest for me is a Krell KSA150. Just enough Class A "sweetness" for the hron mid, plus enough "balls" for the bass. All in all, a nice match. Now, if only I can find a Gryphon amp to borrow and try .....:D

For what it's worth, bi-wiring and bi-amping were both steps backwards when I tried them :blink:

Cheers

Scott

[Titanium Dome]

For what it's worth, bi-wiring and bi-amping were both steps backwards when I tried them :blink:

Cheers

Scott

In each of the high end JBLs, considerable thought went into matching the networks and the drivers and the cabinet, so it's unlikely that anything too far from stock is going to be beneficial unless you really know what you're doing.

I don't.

So I take the admonitions seriously:



IV. Bi-Amp Connection Method

The bi-amp connection method requires two amplifiers, one for the low-frequency unit and one for the high-frequency unit, and an external electronic crossover network. By removing the shorting straps, connections may be made in the following way. Wires from the high-frequency amplifier are connected to the upper terminals, and wires from the low-frequency amplifiers are connected to the lower terminals. The bi-amp switch must be set to the bi-amp position to disable the internal crossover function. Internal level adjustment and high- frequency equalization circuitry remain active.
The amplifiers are fed from the output of an electronic crossover unit (not included). This crossover must be configured to produce the electrical drive illustrated in Figure 8. These curves are very unusual and will be difficult for a commercially available crossover unit to properly emulate. It is for this reason that bi-amplification of the K2 S9900 is not recommended.

Is there similar language in the 1400 Array manual?

[Hoerninger]

Is there similar language in the 1400 Array manual?
Somewhere in this forum there is an active filter circuit from GT for biamping as far as I remember.
____________
Peter

[Titanium Dome]

Somewhere in this forum there is an active filter circuit from GT for biamping as far as I remember.
____________
Peter

You are correct, and it's not for guys like me. ;)

[scott fitlin]

Do you think if using different characteristics cables(eg:copper for low ,silver for highs) to biwire a speaker will cause any side effect or must be same ?You would have to experiment with various combinations of speaker wires until you get what you think is " THE SOUND "!

And while silver does have the highest conductivity and will give you the best signal transfer in the high frequencies, with using different types of wire for LF and HF it might be hard to get the two ranges to integrate seamlessly and inaudibly. If you can find two sets of speaker wire, each that does best for your intended uses and also get the ranges to blend together without hearing what sounds like having two different systems playing at the same time it can work.

That's the hard part.

So, IF you have speaker wire you already KNOW you really like, it is much easier using the same on both ranges, and seamless integration is much easier to achive.

Now, just to add more to the level of confusion, a few years back when I was researching fancy speaker wire I came across speaker wire made specifically for very high efficiency horn drivers and speakers. I, might look further into this, and find out what benefit this can offer for your HORN HF!

[jasonyeo]

You would have to experiment with various combinations of speaker wires until you get what you think is " THE SOUND "!

And while silver does have the highest conductivity and will give you the best signal transfer in the high frequencies, with using different types of wire for LF and HF it might be hard to get the two ranges to integrate seamlessly and inaudibly. If you can find two sets of speaker wire, each that does best for your intended uses and also get the ranges to blend together without hearing what sounds like having two different systems playing at the same time it can work.

That's the hard part.

So, IF you have speaker wire you already KNOW you really like, it is much easier using the same on both ranges, and seamless integration is much easier to achive.

Now, just to add more to the level of confusion, a few years back when I was researching fancy speaker wire I came across speaker wire made specifically for very high efficiency horn drivers and speakers. I, might look further into this, and find out what benefit this can offer for your HORN HF!

Thanks , appreciate that :p Currently I am still using Anthem statement amps and van den hul CS122 while waiting for my mcintosh amps .

Am looking at signal cables now . Anyone has experience with signal cables (www.signalcable.com (http://www.signalcable.com)) ?

[jasonyeo]

I am using a Mcintosh MC303 for L/C/R and a MC252 for surround now . Thinking of getting another MC252 and use 2 x MC252 (so called bi-amp) for L/R and MC303 for Center and surround . Is it better ?

Actually if given a choice , would you rather use 2 x MC252(bi-amp to L/R) or 2 X MC501(bi-wire) to L/R speakers?

[jasonyeo]

Humming from a Mc? That just sounds wrong.

But you are correct. There is no autoformers on the 207, only an impedance switch as far as I can tell?

The best result I have heard with the big JBL's is with Audio Research. I hope to test them with the Marantz MA-9s someday.

There is a slight buzz from the MC303 transformers and the dealer told me all MC303 has the same buzz due to 3 big power in a chasis. So I believe what I read on MC207 is what I heard now ... Try to avoid but still get it :o: