Some great loudspeaker links

[Bladerunner]

This is what we would all love to do given the space and time .

http://www.royaldevice.com/custom.htm#10%20Hz%20FULL%20POWER

Enjoy .

Dave
:)

[jcrobso]

This is what we would all love to do given the space and time .

http://www.royaldevice.com/custom.htm#10%20Hz%20FULL%20POWER

Enjoy .

Dave
:)

And that small item is, Lots and lots of money!:blink:

[JBL 4645]

I’ve seen those links 5 years ago and no doubt most of the veteran members on this site.

I’m still impressed with the concrete and brick horn that’s located beneath the flooring in the Donna system, so simple to build if you happened to have cellar or maybe basement. :D

[Bladerunner]

Rex Baldock here in the UK once built a set of under floors horns in his barn conversion back in the 60's with LOWTHER drivers . My Father listened and said they were the lowest sounding loudspeakers he had ever witnessed . I can remember as a boy been taken along to Catherals around the country to hear a organ play just for the sub sonic diapasions to move the whole building .

[JBL 4645]

Oh, so the under the floor thing is not a new idea after-all. I see.

Well welcome bladerunner to the Lansing Heritage site, hope you stick around for many years on it.:)

[Bladerunner]

I visit your area 3 or 4 times a year you will have to send me a email and keep in touch . If you search for Rex Baldock in google you will find referance to his loudspeaker horns .

http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hug/messages/6/66572.html

David

[Mr. Widget]

My Father listened and said they were the lowest sounding loudspeakers he had ever witnessed . I can remember as a boy been taken along to Catherals around the country to hear a organ play just for the sub sonic diapasions to move the whole building .If you are a bass freak... sub bass really, there is new technology that while not as manly looking, will put these huge horn systems to shame... it can produce >110dB at 1Hz and above... I have heard it and it is truly insane.

http://www.eminent-tech.com/RWbrochure.htm


Widget

[JBL 4645]

If you are a bass freak... sub bass really, there is new technology that while not as manly looking, will put these huge horn systems to shame... it can produce >110dB at 1Hz and above... I have heard it and it is truly insane.

http://www.eminent-tech.com/RWbrochure.htm


Widget

How many musical fundamentals are you going to feel at 1Hz at 110db lol maybe its good enough for The Black Hole! :D

Are you sure, don’t you mean 10Hz 1Hz really. Most Dolby digital only goes down to 5Hz and that is rarely ever heard (I mean felt) since its in the infrasonic range, well outside our hearing range.

[JBL 4645]

I visit your area 3 or 4 times a year you will have to send me a email and keep in touch . If you search for Rex Baldock in google you will find referance to his loudspeaker horns .

http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hug/messages/6/66572.html

David

I think the best cheapest bass I’ve felt for £3.90 is the 5B bus number 417! It rattles hums buzzes like no other bus in Bournemouth and you seriously need ear plugs it’s that loud! Yes it makes me feel uncomfortable when travelling on it, but I don’t have choice.

I’d be interested to know what frequencies its generating. It sounds worse when its stopping for passengers getting on and off. The whole seat vibrates worse than want sensurround once was.

The lows tinkle up my spin, buzz my eyes and head. Yeah I can’t wait to get off it! :barf:

In fact I’m using the 5B, 417 to inspire my next JBL improvement! I’ll try and remember to take the SPL db with me when I go shopping tomorrow, but there is no guarantee that the 417 will come along there are several 5B on loop.


http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee15/Evolution3417/MWTMNcolumbo5.jpg
There is just one other thing thou. The gear shifts give different lows something sound engineers don’t bother with on most films, not enough put into the soundtrack if it happened to be on bus or car, as there is lot of vibration on the inside. The outside is the complete opposite.

[Mr. Widget]

Are you sure, don’t you mean 10Hz 1Hz really.Read the link.


Widget

[jcrobso]

I’ve seen those links 5 years ago and no doubt most of the veteran members on this site.

I’m still impressed with the concrete and brick horn that’s located beneath the flooring in the Donna system, so simple to build if you happened to have cellar or maybe basement. :D

Back in the late 1950s and early 1960s they had many home built horns. One was built into the side of a house, the mouth was the living room wall and the horn looked like a arched car port on the outside. Too bad my wife recycled all of those old issues of Audio away.

[Akira]

If you are a bass freak... sub bass really, there is new technology that while not as manly looking, will put these huge horn systems to shame... it can produce >110dB at 1Hz and above... I have heard it and it is truly insane.
http://www.eminent-tech.com/RWbrochure.htm
Widget
An interesting read.

I remember when I was young (post paleolithic period) the 'new' rage was servo drive woofers. Not sure of the science behind them except that they were mechanically assisted.
Does anyone remember them? There was a lot of hype surrounding them but they died out with the sudden increase in speaker/amp power.

[JBL 4645]

Back in the late 1950s and early 1960s they had many home built horns. One was built into the side of a house, the mouth was the living room wall and the horn looked like a arched car port on the outside. Too bad my wife recycled all of those old issues of Audio away.
Yeah I can visually picture that in my head and draw it out. Wow.

I guess there might be some library pictures of it on the internet maybe under different name or try using random keywords in (Google image) and you might see picture of it!

I have reprint of Audio that was sent with a whole lot of THX information around early middle to late 1990’s.

[baldrick]

If you are a bass freak... sub bass really, there is new technology that while not as manly looking, will put these huge horn systems to shame... it can produce >110dB at 1Hz and above... I have heard it and it is truly insane.

http://www.eminent-tech.com/RWbrochure.htm


Widget

This is really not that new, Phoenix Gold made this subwoofer 10 years ago for caraudio use:

http://www.audiojunkies.com/product_images/1365/phoenix-gold-cyclone.jpg

More info about both Eminent and PG here (http://www.soundimage.dk/Different-col/LinearMotor.htm)

[Tom Brennan]

This is really not that new, Phoenix Gold made this subwoofer 10 years ago for caraudio use:

http://www.audiojunkies.com/product_images/1365/phoenix-gold-cyclone.jpg

More info about both Eminent and PG here (http://www.soundimage.dk/Different-col/LinearMotor.htm)


That rotary sub was designed by Tom Danley, the same guy who designed the rotary electric motor driven ContraBass subs and whose tapped horns are a current rage among DIY fans of BIG bass. His Unity horns were another "head slapper" idea of his. I heard some planar speakers he made that worked like swinging saloon doors and saw a "blimp" he made to go over his head so he could mix live sound with headphones. Guy has an original mind.

Shown is the Unity-ContraBass system that Tom brought to a Chicago Horn Club meeting several years ago.

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh92/Irishtom29/hi%20fi/1642.jpg

[Eaulive]

If you are a bass freak... sub bass really, there is new technology that while not as manly looking, will put these huge horn systems to shame... it can produce >110dB at 1Hz and above... I have heard it and it is truly insane.

http://www.eminent-tech.com/RWbrochure.htm


Widget


while not as manly looking...Yes, this will probably be working against its popularity unfortunately, just like the switching power supply D-class amps don't feel as powerful because they are light, small and cool, and the neodymium drivers don't feel as good because they are light and funny looking.

My question however, how do they manage to keep the thing quiet? Motor noise, air blowing? Port noise is a problem in regular enclusures, it has to be even worse in this case, no?

[Mr. Widget]

My question however, how do they manage to keep the thing quiet? Motor noise, air blowing? Port noise is a problem in regular enclusures, it has to be even worse in this case, no?The fact of the matter is that it really isn't as simple as it appears. The device actually needs a fair amount of volume just as a big horn does and it requires considerable installation. In the demo I heard, they had built a false wall dividing a room and placed the fan in the other half of the room where the sound was allowed into the listening space through a large tunnel with acoustical absorbing material to silence the fan. This is required to silence the fan and was successful but was primarily necessary to avoid phase cancellation... just like having a woofer sitting on a table can't produce deep base due to cancellation.

The fact is though, if installed properly, this device will produce lower bass at higher levels than any conventional loudspeaker regardless of size or enclosure design... it was extremely accurate and stunningly powerful. During the more extreme parts of the demo the room visibly shuttered like something from a horror film. The door to the room contorted and flapped like a piece of paper and the ceiling mounted projector bounced around violently. You might wonder about the health effects of such an onslaught... after the demo, I felt rather nauseous for about a day. The two others at the demo didn't seem to be as effected by it. Because of that I don't feel compelled to ever experience another infrasonic experience like it. The experience was quite amazing, and I am sure there are those who would feel compelled to install one of these devices... but I spent enough time with it to satisfy any crazy bass needs I may have thought I had.



Widget

[4313B]

During the more extreme parts of the demo the room visibly shuttered like something from a horror film. The door to the room contorted and flapped like a piece of paper and the ceiling mounted projector bounced around violently.Oh golly gosh, I'm so impressed... :cool:
You might wonder about the health effects of such an onslaught... after the demo, I felt rather nauseous for about a day.Sounds about like the Synthesis Demo at Harman/JBL... :barf:

Rather than nauseous I just felt sorry for them for wasting so much effort and money. It was another one of those "Well, at least the carpet looked nice and the seats were confortable" deals. I seriously detest loud shit. :biting:

but I spent enough time with it to satisfy any crazy bass needs I may have thought I had.No doubt!

[Ducatista47]

Oh golly gosh, I'm so impressed... :cool:Sounds about like the Synthesis Demo at Harman/JBL... :barf:

Rather than nauseous I just felt sorry for them for wasting so much effort and money. It was another one of those "Well, at least the carpet looked nice and the seats were confortable" deals. I seriously detest loud shit. :biting:
No doubt!

Me too. I have found that visiting JBL owners can often be a very unpleasant listening experience. (Very nice socially though.) No wonder they need such big amps. There is nothing quite like forgetting your earplugs and being assaulted by bad recordings and players rendered by so-so solid state amps at high volume. Or even a great system at high volume. If I want to go deaf I will become a drunk and hang out at clubs. At least I might see some pretty women.

Unfortunately, to the public at large JBL high end is known, if at all, for playing god awful loud without sounding like crap. Refinement is not widely known. Smaller minds still use the epithet Junk But Loud.

I suppose demos like that one do not help things much... I guess JBL marketing is still uncertain about who would buy their speakers. And who to hire as salesmen. At this point in my life I consider anyone who reaches for the volume control to impress someone immature, to put it kindly.

Clark

[Eaulive]

The fact of the matter is that it really isn't as simple as it appears. The device actually needs a fair amount of volume just as a big horn does and it requires considerable installation. In the demo I heard, they had built a false wall dividing a room and placed the fan in the other half of the room where the sound was allowed into the listening space through a large tunnel with acoustical absorbing material to silence the fan. This is required to silence the fan and was successful but was primarily necessary to avoid phase cancellation... just like having a woofer sitting on a table can't produce deep base due to cancellation.

Widget

So if I get the thing right, it's just a more efficient driver for VLF than a regular cone speaker, but it still needs the enclosures or horns for proper loading wich sizes are dictated by the laws of physics and can not be changed.

Cool, I see how it can be efficient, changing the pitch of the fan blades according to the amplitude.
Simple, but you had to think about it!

[Mr. Widget]

So if I get the thing right, it's just a more efficient driver for VLF than a regular cone speaker, but it still needs the enclosures or horns for proper loading wich sizes are dictated by the laws of physics and can not be changed.

Cool, I see how it can be efficient, changing the pitch of the fan blades according to the amplitude.
Simple, but you had to think about it!Yes it is simple and very effective... I am unaware of any other "loudspeaker" that can actually play 1Hz at high SPLs... of course one can ask the question, should any device be capable of doing this?

The one practical application that I can think of and they have had some success with is in noise cancellation systems for ships and certain industrial settings.


Widget

[Ducatista47]

Widget, since "chest thumping bass" frequently gets a lot of love here, how did the experience differ? I am reminded by your account of a Tesla demonstration where a platform excited by a compressed air powered driver to low frequency vibration induced a strong laxative action in all who stood on it.

Doesn't sound pleasant to me. ;)

Clark

[Mr. Widget]

Widget, since "chest thumping bass" frequently gets a lot of love here, how did the experience differ?Chest thumping is 40-100Hz... the Eminent Technology woofer plays below the audible range. I don't remember exactly, but I believe it came in at 20Hz or so.

The experience? They played shot gun blasts and other sound effects that quite literally stunned you... think of fish in a lake with dynamite.



I am reminded by your account of a Tesla demonstration where a platform excited by a compressed air powered driver to low frequency vibration induced a strong laxative action in all who stood on it.

Doesn't sound pleasant to me. ;)
Ah yes, the infamous "brown tone". Apparently it is urban legend and myth.... I have heard numerous accounts of this sort of thing. The problem is that very few devices can actually play 4-7Hz loud enough to test the theory. This thing does, they played it for us and our eyeballs could feel the pressure... no brown tone action though. Thankfully!


Widget

[speakerdave]

Although most of my listening is at quite moderate levels:

--A lot of pop music is mixed at high sound levels, and I think that playing it at similar levels on similar speakers is the way to hear what the producer/ mastering tech had in mind, good or not so good.

--Dynamic range is part of the beauty/effect of music.

--Playing acoustic music at live or near-live levels, whether vocals, guitar, piano, chamber, acoustic jazz or symphonic, is the pay window for me with the big JBL's or any other speaker that plays loud, clean and full range.

--An occasional immersion in something like Joe Satriani Live in San Francisco is rather fun and cheaper, more to the point, with less damaging long term effects than other forms of shock therapy for cleansing the nervous system after a bullshit day. I'm just glad he doesn't talk very much.

--When demoing big JBL's or any other big speaker the elephant in the room is always, "Why are they so big?" Playing loud is a big part of the answer. I'm afraid I'm guilty of it too.

--High quality big amps are very expensive. People need to get biamped with decent amplification above.

--If all I ever wanted were a small, accurate representation of music, which I can also get with some big JBL's, I would use smaller, prettier, more domesticated speakers.