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Feroce
02-24-2009, 05:37 AM
I bought a pair of JBL 4343 Studio Monitors speakers in 1979. But before I could do it I had to fight to get them. Now at this time the speakers I was looking at were the only pair in northern CA. and they were in Systems Wharehouse (store name) in Mt. View, CA. The total bill was $3600.00 including amp. I called my banker back in Michigan where I lived to get a loan to buy them and he told me no problem but I can’t believe you are going to spend that much for just speakers (he was joking) I have to see them when you get back. I said you know you are always welcome come on over grab a beer and enjoy what you will experience.

I went back to the store and I offered the salesman $500.00 cash and the rest in a cashier’s check when they are on my doorstep. If my plane fell out of the sky on the way back home he could keep the $500.00 I would not need it anyway. The salesman flat said no I can sell this anytime I want I don’t have to take that offer. I went back to my brother’s house and told him the story, he said nothing but got up and made a call and came back to the table and said let’s go. Come to find out he knew the owner of the chain of stores. So we went to San Francisco and talked to the owner. The owner told me what I offered was very fair and did not understand why the salesman did not take it. So he called the store and asked to talk to the salesman and asked him if this was true. He fired him over the phone and then asked to talk to the manager.

So now I own the speakers. When I get back home I hear on the news that the Teamsters were on strike and people were shooting at trucks from the over passes. I quick in a hurry called the owner and told him do not ship the speakers until this strike is over, I have waited 34 years to get them I can wait a little longer. He said he was just going to call me and wanted to do just that. I waited 6 or 8 weeks I don’t know until the strike was over and called to have the speakers shipped to me.

Just lately I tried to sell the speakers but it just never happened so I am:
The original owner.
With the original sales receipt.
The original warranty card that says; “The JBL warranty on loudspeaker products remains in effect for five years from the date of original purchase. Moreover, because we believe that a fine loudspeaker should never wear out, we may, at our option, choose to repair any JBL transducer free of charge after the five year period.”

I called JBL Pro 1 (818) 894-8850 and asked for the warranty department and was transferred to service repair and Jenny wants me to take my speakers to a JBL repair center for evaluation. I called that Dealer to tell him what was happing and I am going to take the speakers to them today Feb. 24, 2009.

More to come.

subwoof
02-24-2009, 05:50 AM
Does this mean that you are trying to sell them here for the third time?
Is there a question / observation here?

Maybe I missed it??

Too early. Need caffeine.

*or* :cheers:

Hoerninger
02-24-2009, 06:00 AM
More to come.
I recognize, the speakers.
____________
Peter

hjames
02-24-2009, 06:02 AM
Does this mean that you are trying to sell them here for the third time?
Is there a question / observation here?

Maybe I missed it??

Too early. Need caffeine.

*or* :cheers:

breakfast Beer!!

Dang - I MISS my breakfast beer ...
swore them off years ago when I stopped attending MARRS (MidAtlantic Roadrace Series) at Summit Point, WV ...

but that put me In The Mood ...

ah well - back to my coffee!

BMWCCA
02-24-2009, 06:22 AM
I recognize, the speakers.Apparently some new rules have caused the mods to cover the trail. Just one of many 43xx dead-ends I've chased here publicly over the past year. The others are still up. The two threads on this pair have been disappeared!

I think it would be kind of cool to see JBL actually honor their stated warranty to an original owner from thirty-years ago. :applaud: For-sale, or not . . .

I wish my Dad had kept his receipt for my 030 from fifty-years ago! To their credit, JBL did repair an 075 for free for me back in the late '60s without that receipt. It's still working fine today. I'll have to check and see if they replaced the red-wax seals. ;)

hjames
02-24-2009, 07:03 AM
Fixed under warranty - wow, what a great deal! (edit for grammar nazi)

Didn't even know about that when my original L-36s lost the foam years ago ... they've since been refoamed and later sold and long gone!

My 4341s are 3rd or 4th owner speakers - but your 4343s are gorgeous!

Gotta love that JBL blue

BMWCCA
02-24-2009, 07:31 AM
Feroce's post was a great description, but it had a one-sentence question "what is it worth?" The answer is unequivocally, "more with fresh factory re-cones". :D

http://s275.photobucket.com/albums/jj305/Feroce_photo/JBL/

BMWCCA
02-24-2009, 07:40 AM
Fixed under warrantee - wow, what a great deal!:banghead: Pet peeve from decades in the car biz:
Warrantee: the person to whom a warranty is made. :scold:

Guaranty and guarantee are the two interchangeable terms, sort of.

For Feroce's 4343s to be fixed "under warrantee", he'd have to be laying on top of them. That might prove an unusual challenge, at best, even for a pro like Edgewound. ;)

Feroce
02-24-2009, 12:35 PM
These speakers are NOT for sale.

If you would like to see more photos they can be seen at http://www.edstephens.com/jbl_speakers.htm You can also see the warranty card.

I do hope JBL will honor the warranty.
Ed

EDIT: These speakers will not be offered for sale in the future. I will own/enjoy them for the rest of my life and after that I really don't care.


Does this mean that you are trying to sell them here for the third time?
Is there a question / observation here?

Maybe I missed it??

Too early. Need caffeine.

*or* :cheers:

louped garouv
02-24-2009, 01:53 PM
that's an awesome story!

:)

boputnam
02-24-2009, 05:48 PM
I do hope JBL will honor the warranty.Ed, you raise an interesting question - I found myself thinking about this today.

"Warranty" relates to goods/material provided to spec, as described and working to spec. A warranty does not intend, I believe, to address wear-and-tear, that-is, fatigue or physical failure after/during normal use. An "extended service plan" would cover those conditions, as per those in the auto industry, but the buyer pays extra for that, offsetting at-least some of the future estimated cost(s).

I'll be curious how JBL replies. IMO, if they offer repair, it would be incredibly upstanding of them, but I would suspect creates a precedence of potentially open-ended liability.

Keep us posted, and good luck!

BMWCCA
02-24-2009, 06:25 PM
"Warranty" relates to goods/material provided to spec, as described and working to spec. A warranty does not intend, I believe, to address wear-and-tear, that-is, fatigue or physical failure after/during normal use.
A warranty is usually limited to defects in material and workmanship for the duration of the term. JBL's term was "five years". The exception is clearly stated as "at our option". I'm not sure anyone ever considered foam surrounds as "maintenance" since the part isn't offered like, say, an oil filter. Instead JBL makes available entire cones so it could easily be argued that when a foam surround fails, the cone is defective.

As Bo said, it will be interesting to see. In the end it all depends on how JBL interprets their warranty and their "option", and how much they value that this is one of their more expensive products and still in the hands of the original owner. FWIW, I was once told by a JBL dealer that if my D130 cones ever wore out they would be repaired free of charge, but that was when the entire warranty was "lifetime" without the "option" exception.

As late as 1962 the LH Library documents show a "lifetime" warranty (see below), but by 1967 if not sooner, that had changed to two-years and added that "at our option" exception. Of course this might beg the legal question of whether or not "James B. Lansing Sound, Inc." still exists.

Feroce
02-24-2009, 07:30 PM
When I bought these speakers one of the determining reasons for me to buy them for $1200.00 each $2400.00 for the two of them and no you did not get discounts (my 1974 Olds Delta 88 Royale Convertible loaded was $5472.75ws) was the salesman told me you are buying the Professional Series of JBL and showed me the warranty and said JBL warranties the “speakers” for life you will never have to buy another speaker.

When a company says “a fine loudspeaker should never wear out” to me that in simple language means it is not going to wear out, you might break it but is not going to fail by wearing out. Maybe I was stupid when I bought them to believe JBL was telling the truth. I believe them to be a reputable company.

If the speaker was to show misuse, run to loud and the coils show over heating or other ways the technician can tell, that would be their option. I would say that is why they want the speakers to be evulated by a service center. Were these speakers used under normal use. I don't like loud music I like big band, jazz.

Why jump to the gun give them a chance.
Ed

JeffW
02-24-2009, 07:38 PM
Why jump to the gun give them a chance.
Ed

Now there's a quote that a whole lot of posters here could do well to print out and tape to their computer monitors. Maybe covering a good portion of said monitor.

I'm glad to see you and your 4343's here, Ed. I enjoy your story as to how you came to own them, and how you still own them. I hope JBL does repair them under warranty. As for opening some floodgate of liability? How many people can produce a receipt after so many years? 1 in 100? Blah.

Welcome aboard, even if your arrival has been anything but welcoming.

Feroce
02-24-2009, 07:50 PM
BTW; I do know there are better JBL speakers out there than my little 4343s, the 4345, 4350 etc. but I have never heard them .......and I want to keep it that way because I am very happy with my speakers.:)

Ed
Ignorance is bliss

JeffW
02-24-2009, 08:07 PM
@Ed
Truth be told, I bet many here would be extremely pleased to own a super clean pair of 4343's. I would! :)

I still don't understand the hostility towards new posters that this site exhibits, and boy did you get a heaping helping of hospitality. Now just kick back and you'll hear a tale of why you should just Goodwill them 4343's and get you some Array 1400's to keep up :D

@BMWCCA

I guess I missed the warm welcome, sorry about that. All I got was the inquiry/yank/apology thing from the last couple of days. I get extremely confused around here, anyway. Sometimes I'll SEE a thread/post and next thing you know, it's gone. So me missing one off the bat just evens things out I reckon.

BMWCCA
02-24-2009, 08:13 PM
I still don't understand the hostility towards new posters that this site exhibits, and boy did you get a heaping helping of hospitality.There was no hostility. Ed was given some good advice, a contact for re-coning, recommendations for surround kits, and told to keep them himself and make them sing again. I think we all figured that's what he really wanted to do and everyone was supportive of that.

JeffW
02-24-2009, 08:36 PM
There was no hostility. Ed was given some good advice, a contact for re-coning, recommendations for surround kits, and told to keep them himself and make them sing again. I think we all figured that's what he really wanted to do and everyone was supportive of that.

Ed was luckier than many, then ;)

BMWCCA
02-24-2009, 08:44 PM
Ed was luckier than many, then ;)As I recall, he didn't ask what his 4343s were worth in his first post and he had a good story of being the original owner, not someone who just stole them off Craig's List. :)

Feroce
02-25-2009, 04:11 AM
Let me put this in a better perspective on what I paid for the speakers. :) What should they cost today?

I bought them in 1979 and my 1974 Olds Delta 88 Royale Convertible loaded was $5472.75ws and the speakers were $2400.00 that is 43.8%. I did take a loan out to buy them.

Today my 2003 Monte Carlo was $30,630.00ws and my 2008 Pontiac G8 GT was 32,295.00ws. That means using the Monte Carlo I would have to pay $13,415.94 for two JBL Studio Monitors today.

Why wouldn’t I expect them to be made very very good?:applaud:

Ed

hjames
02-25-2009, 04:47 AM
Let me put this in a better perspective on what I paid for the speakers. :) What should they cost today?

I bought them in 1979 and my 1974 Olds Delta 88 Royale Convertible loaded was $5472.75ws and the speakers were $2400.00 that is 43.8%. I did take a loan out to buy them.

Today my 2003 Monte Carlo was $30,630.00ws and my 2008 Pontiac G8 GT was 32,295.00ws. That means using the Monte Carlo I would have to pay $13,415.94 for two JBL Studio Monitors today.

Why wouldn’t I expect them to be made very very good?:applaud:

Ed

Just for friendly grins, to carry your example further -
lets say the speakers were half the price of your car, and you bought them both in '79 ...
How much maintenance did you spend keeping the Delta 88 in good shape from then 'til now.
How is that '79 Delta 88 working for you today?

Moving parts wear over 30 years - doesn't matter if its pistons or speakers.
I think we do REALLY well with these old speakers!
FWIW - my 4341s are from 1974-75 (http://www.jblpro.com/pub/obsolete/4340_4341.pdf) ... I'm sure happy with them!

4313B
02-25-2009, 05:56 AM
How many people can produce a receipt after so many years?That very well may be the deciding factor. JBL is aware of this thread. I do know that JBL stopped all warranty replacement of lansaloy surrounds (the surround material preceeding foam surrounds) around 1985. This whole scenario probably should have played out before any posts were made. I find it mildly irritating at best, just like its predecessor.

Feroce
02-25-2009, 07:35 AM
Well if JBL is aware of this thread we know the public is on JBL's side to NOT warranty the speakers. People on the forum have given JBL enough reason not to do it. They should have no problem turning it down. Good going:applaud:.


Ed


That very well may be the deciding factor. JBL is aware of this thread. I do know that JBL stopped all warranty replacement of lansaloy surrounds (the surround material preceeding foam surrounds) around 1985. This whole scenario probably should have played out before any posts were made. I find it mildly irritating at best, just like its predecessor.

grumpy
02-25-2009, 07:38 AM
...one would hope they'd weight all the smoke blowing appropriately.
I have faith that they do. Someone should close this thread.

hjames
02-25-2009, 07:40 AM
Well if JBL is aware of this thread we know the public is on JBL's side to NOT warranty the speakers. People on the forum have given JBL enough reason not to do it. They should have no problem turning it down. Good going:applaud:.
Ed

Like we have any real input into the JBL/Harman process ...!! get REAL.
Those folks are running a BUSINESS in tough economic times in a VERY competitive field - they don't have time to play games in forums with a bunch of vintage speaker owners who aren't putting any money on the table now ...

To refer to your example from before, they're certainly not like Oldsmobile, hey?

Oh WAIT - JBL is still in business - and Oldsmobile ... not so much.

boputnam
02-25-2009, 07:40 AM
People on the forum have given JBL enough reason not to do it. Nothing of the kind. JeffW reminds of the unique condition here, as also noted by 4313B, that you have the original bill of sale.

As I said, "...interesting."

Feroce
02-25-2009, 08:30 AM
Close this thread

I am really sorry that I came here.
Ed

boputnam
02-25-2009, 08:36 AM
Close this threadAs you wish. :wave: