PDA

View Full Version : Yamaha Amps - looking for input



chilledspode
05-23-2008, 11:11 AM
I have been pondering purchasing one of these older amps like the M-65 and was wondering if anyone here could comment on them and if they are significantly inferior to the pro P series amps.

This amp would replace my NAD C370 which I would turn into a pre amp.

Cheers

Mark

SMKSoundPro
05-23-2008, 01:20 PM
I have the P series in my shop rig and love them.

I have a M-2 in my workshop office rig pushing my L110's and love it!


I have another M-2 that came to me as a freebie with shorted output transistors sitting in a box. Maybe time to get it out and either fix it or break it even further!

Scotty.

chilledspode
05-23-2008, 05:01 PM
Do you know the differenace between the M, MX and how the evolution of these amps took place?

I gather the MX is the last evolution of the consumer line but I know nothing about the pro line.

Cheers

Mark

SMKSoundPro
05-24-2008, 04:00 PM
No I don't have much experience with the home hifi line of Yamaha. I mainly have experience with the older pro amps, eq, xovers, spx90, and mixing consoles.

Now, I see where I need to learn more about their hifi line.

Scotty.

Chris Brown
05-24-2008, 10:33 PM
One thing about the Yamaha amps is that you have a lot of different designs. So you might find that you have a preference for a particular design. You have some models such as the B-2 which are famous for its V-Fet sound and others such as the M-70 which is known for its X-Power design. Models such as the M-2 are one of the few that used toroidal transformers. Models such as the M-80, M-85, MX-1000 are more conventional but powerhouses none the less. Seems like generally the pro amps tend to mimic one or more of the home designs (or vise versa). Iíve seen several pro designs such as the P-2200/P-2201 and the PC2002(M) that look unmistakably similar to the design of my M-2 inside and Iím sure the other pro designs could probably be matched up with the various consumer designs. Excellent amps all around.

chilledspode
05-25-2008, 08:11 AM
Thanks for the insight, Chris - I wasn't aware they were using so many different approaches.

I have line on a MX-600 - any strong thoughts on this particular unit one way or the other?

Cheers

Mark

Chris Brown
05-25-2008, 11:43 AM
The MX-600 was a lower-end version of the MX-1000, produced around 1988 or so. 135wpc into 8ohms. It used the HCA circuit design whereas the older M-series (such as the M-65, M-80, M-85, etc) had a switch to choose between class AB or ďrealĒ Class-A. HCA tries to give you the benefits of Class-A without the heat or other drawbacks. Some love it, some hate it. Iíve yet to hear an HCA amp in person so I canít comment any further but I believe HCA was Yamahaís last analog design until it moved to digital so it canít be too bad ;)

chilledspode
05-26-2008, 08:29 AM
The MX-600 was a lower-end version of the MX-1000, produced around 1988 or so. 135wpc into 8ohms. It used the HCA circuit design whereas the older M-series (such as the M-65, M-80, M-85, etc) had a switch to choose between class AB or ďrealĒ Class-A. HCA tries to give you the benefits of Class-A without the heat or other drawbacks. Some love it, some hate it. Iíve yet to hear an HCA amp in person so I canít comment any further but I believe HCA was Yamahaís last analog design until it moved to digital so it canít be too bad ;)

Keep the info coming, Chris! :D

Cheers

Mark

duaneage
11-13-2008, 09:29 PM
i've had a M-45 with 125/ch for over 20 years and I'm happy with it. I even bought 2 more.

FRAZIERHORN
11-14-2008, 07:34 PM
I had 1- m50 & 1 m60 that I got brand new in 1984-6 from J&R music NYC,I had them almost 20 years til they started having having problems. I had both in for service but was told they were not servicable.parts issues-I now have 2 mx 630 and they sound great.the only problem I see is when you need service,yamaha may not have the parts to repair them.

macaroonie
11-14-2008, 08:38 PM
On that note Accuphase were able to supply me a full service schedule and a component sent by post from Japan at no cost to me for a 27 YO amp. Cool and that was five years ago and the old dog runs to this day. :)

duaneage
01-06-2009, 09:25 PM
It's really not yamaha's fault that some parts are discontinued. Most of the output transistors made 25-30 years ago are either discontinued or too expensive to consider repairing an amp with. If you got 20 years out of them I'd say you got your money's worth.

brutal
01-08-2009, 05:43 PM
It depends on the product level as well. I just ordered a new faceplate for the MX-2000 (limited edition, 1987/1988) I picked up off CL that had a chip in the glass. They still had full driver boards, output trannies, side and top panels, etc. available at PartStore.com

I paid as much for the front assy as the whole amp. :D

I also ordered a dust cover for a 25 year old Technics table for $22 when the guys making/selling them on e-bay are getting $80. It pays to check around. The hardest part is sometimes just finding a service manual to get part numbers. On PartStore, the MX-2000 parts are lumped in with the MX-2. The Technics parts are under Panasonic. One of the crappier search engines around...

Alas, I contacted Yamaha Pro direct and couldn't get any cosmetic parts for a PC2002M.

Robbie4477
09-30-2011, 04:24 PM
one thing about the yamaha amps is that you have a lot of different designs. So you might find that you have a preference for a particular design. You have some models such as the b-2 which are famous for its v-fet sound and others such as the m-70 which is known for its x-power design. Models such as the m-2 are one of the few that used toroidal transformers. Models such as the m-80, m-85, mx-1000 are more conventional but powerhouses none the less. Seems like generally the pro amps tend to mimic one or more of the home designs (or vise versa). Iíve seen several pro designs such as the p-2200/p-2201 and the pc2002(m) that look unmistakably similar to the design of my m-2 inside and iím sure the other pro designs could probably be matched up with the various consumer designs. Excellent amps all around.

the yamaha m-2 its the same as the p2002m just the consumer version
i own both

brutal
09-30-2011, 09:59 PM
the yamaha m-2 its the same as the p2002m just the consumer version
i own both

I disagree.

I own and have repaired both. The PC2002M is loosely based on the M-2 design.

The M-2 has 3 pairs of outputs, the PC2002M has four pairs. There are also different driver cards in them, etc. That rumor that spreads with some people claiming they are the same is wrong. There are more differences than similarities.

The closest Pro=Consumer twins are the PC5002M and 101M. Only the cosmetics, panel, meters, etc are different. Internally they are identical.

Lee in Montreal
10-02-2011, 12:19 PM
The earlier generation P2200 had 3 pairs (push-pull) of output transistors per side, but indeed the next generation PC 2002 had four pairs.

I have four P2200, two PC2002 and one PC1002 and keep on buying them whenever I can. ;)

Lee in Montreal
10-02-2011, 02:58 PM
Alas, I contacted Yamaha Pro direct and couldn't get any cosmetic parts for a PC2002M.

Which is why you can buy non working amps for their components. I continuoulsy have an eye on local Kijiji ads for working and non working P2200/PC2002 ;)

mark214
10-08-2011, 10:15 AM
As far as older Yamaha amps go I still use my B2, solid, stable and sounds great.

53184

brutal
10-08-2011, 02:17 PM
As far as older Yamaha amps go I still use my B2, solid, stable and sounds great.

53184

As with most VFET amps, this one is VERY hard to top. Hope to add one to my collection some day.

If it's never been serviced, it's important for the life of the VFETs to have the power supply rebuilt by a competent tech that understands how to properly handle VFET outputs. Loss of pinch off voltage, or servicing without discharging the filter caps or otherwise sending any unintended voltage through them and the magic blue smoke comes out of the unobtanium VFET.

Uncle Paul
10-09-2011, 11:57 AM
Picked up a B-2 last week, and it's the best amp I've heard so far. Not saying that it's the best amp ever made, but it's damn fine to my ears. Listened to it in my office rig for a day, but now it's off line until I can go through the PS section as Brutal mentions below. There are also a few transistors that are recommended for replacement and I figure a recap is due on this 30+ year old amp. Fortunately, the seller also had the service manual.

After rejuvenation, it's going to drive the top half of my XPL-200A's. Can't wait to hear how that's going to sound :bouncy:

hitechluddite
01-06-2012, 07:31 AM
IMHO the M2 was the last of the really decent sounding Yamaha consumer seperates. I was in Japan when the M65, 85 series came out and side by side there was no comparison. The B2 was possibly even better than the M2 but I had limited exposure to it so I can't say for sure. When the B2 was out I had a Sansui B2000, which my M2 replaced.