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View Full Version : Greetings, JBL Friends!



Doc Mark
05-05-2008, 09:49 AM
Greetings, JBL Friends!

I found you all whilst searching for some info on an 18" JBL subwoofer that I bought yesterday, at a swap meet! Thought I'd drop in to say, "HI", and to introduce myself, if I may!

I am a former musician, who made his living playing music for almost 30 years. "Back in the day", I fell in love with JBL components, and to a somewhat lesser extent, Altec Lansing, too. I still have quite a few components, just "waiting" for me to do something with them, including the goodies to build myself a nice 4-way monitor system, with 2235's on the bottom. Time is at a premium for my wife and I, as we own our own very tiny business (we're the only employees!), and we have to spend some time on the road, now and then. So, I have yet to cobble up my dream speakers, and am "making do" with a nice pair of JBL 4408's that I bought many years ago, combined with a subwoofer that I built long ago. I love the sound of the 4408's, but have never been satisfied with my subwoofer.

To that end, I found a JBL 2242HPL, 18" subwoofer at a swap meet yesterday, and bought it for all of $30! It appears to have never been mounted in a cabinet, but it's dust cap is mashed in a bit. Now, I've spent a bit of time this morning, seeking info on that transducer, and some good tuning specs for it. I may have just found a subwoofer that will reproduce the bottom end I've been missing in my system!

In any case, I'm very happy to have found you Gentlemen, and look forward to much perusing of this site, as time permits. Downstairs, I've got K120's, 2130's, 2235's, a D130, and lots of other goodies, just waiting for me to come play with them! As I don't play music for a living anymore, those projects have been put on the back burner. Finding you Guys may have just lit the fires again, and I may have to dig into that stuff and do something fun with it! Great to meet you, and I'll see you all later! Work beckons! Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc Mark

Fred Sanford
05-05-2008, 10:33 AM
Glad to have you here, thanks for the post. Congrats on the sub, hope it works out for you.

je

boputnam
05-05-2008, 10:43 AM
To that end, I found a JBL 2242HPL, 18" subwoofer at a swap meet yesterday, and bought it for all of $30! $30! OMG... :banghead:

That woofer will really please you, if you stuff it into the properly tuned cabinet. What a price...

Doc Mark
05-05-2008, 11:15 AM
Greetings, JE and Bo!

Thanks, very much, for the warm welcome! I hope to stuff that 2242 in an 8-10 cubic foot box, and tune it properly, and we'll see how it goes. I don't have a ton of power on hand, but with an efficient transducer like that, I hope that it will work out very well. I'll check around the site for some enclosure plans, and tuning info, just to see how others have done it. Most of the time, I used to use JBL info, or some of the outstanding tuning info from the old Speakerlab, from Washington State. Thanks, again, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

P.S. Yes, I'm quite thrilled with the price of that JBL! Better to be lucky, than good, anyday, eh? 'Course, all blessings such as that are much appreciated, in all our lives!!

grumpy
05-05-2008, 03:02 PM
Here you go, for ideas:

http://www.jbl.com/home/products/product_detail.aspx?prod=S1S-EX&Language=ENG&Country=US&Region=USA&cat=SUB&ser=SYN

http://www.jblpro.com/pub/obsolete/4645b.pdf
http://www.jblpro.com/pub/cinema/4645c.pdf

$30 ... :screwy: 10x that would still be a crazy-good price.

Doc Mark
05-05-2008, 07:46 PM
Evening, Grumpy, and all,

Thanks, very much, for the information on the 18" subwoofers. Much appreciated!

My quandry is which system to actually build. My original intent, from many years ago, was to reproduce my own version of the JBL 4343B, and I spent quite a few years gathering components that would work for me. Now, I have the following, all ready to go:

2 - 2235H 15" woofers.

2 - LE10A 10" mid-bass drivers.

2 - 2420 drivers, with a pair of 2307 horns, and 2308 lense assemblies.

2 - 2405 slot tweeters.

So, all I really need to do is get off the dime, and actually build the cabinets, and make the proper crossovers. My plan has always been to bi-amp the system, with the 2235's being driven by an Harman Kardon 100 watt amp, and the "satellites" driven by an Harman Kardon receiver of similar wattage, if not a bit larger. I like the HK stuff quite a bit, and feel it's very conservatively rated. Also, the room in which this system will be housed, is not huge, though it has a very high ceiling, and is of fair size. What I am seeking is a combination that will reproduce the dynamic range, and depth of some movie soundtracks (including cannon fire!), good classical music, jazz, Latin jazz with all it's percussion and horns, funk, and the best of the old rock stuff.

But, I found a pair of JBL 4408's at a local garage sale, for (get this!) ONE DOLLAR!! :applaud::) This was for the pair of cabinets, but they were minus their woofers, but with their Titanium tweeters, and crossovers. I then found a pair of proper JBL 10" driver frames on FleaBay, and had them reconed at Orange County Sound, down South of LA. I fell in love with their wonderful Titanium tweeters, and think they are a very smooth, and accurate loudspeaker. I had already built a subwoofer for another system, using a lesser brand driver, and have been using that for many years, though the subwoofer has never been up to the quality of the 4408's, in my opinion.

I then gave thought to building the 4343B's as a sub/sat system, with the 2235's as separate subwoofers, and the upper end as a smaller, matched system, crossed over, electronically, to the subs at 90HZ. I also thought about using the 2235's with the 4408's, again crossed over at 90HZ, and calling it good.

Then, this past weekend, I found that huge 2242HPL, and, well, that really tossed a wrench in the works!! So, what do I do, now? Do I build a 4645B, or 4645C, to function as a single subwoofer for the 4408's? Or, should I go ahead with my two-piece 4343B system, and relegate the 18" woofer to the "I'll get around to doing something with it, once of these days" shelf?

I'd be very interested in your thoughts, suggestions, and opinions, JBL Friends!! One consideration is that, if I use the 2242HPL, I'll be building a single cabinet, and needing to sum the output of my Harman Kardon amp. Again, any thoughts, comments, suggestions, or opinions will be very gratefully received!! Thanks, very much, Friends, and I'll look forward to hearing from you, at your convenience! Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

grumpy
05-05-2008, 08:15 PM
my $.02:

sell the 2242, LE10A's and buy/refurb the right 10" drivers for your 4343B's.
search here for updated charge coupled crossover designs.
decide on/build cabinet(s).
get blue paint from John W.
get blue grille cloth from Zilch.

Have fun and ask questions along the way :)

Doc Mark
05-05-2008, 09:50 PM
my $.02:

sell the 2242, LE10A's and buy/refurb the right 10" drivers for your 4343B's.
search here for updated charge coupled crossover designs.
decide on/build cabinet(s).
get blue paint from John W.
get blue grille cloth from Zilch.

Have fun and ask questions along the way :)

Evening, Grumpy,

Interesting suggestion, and one well worth considering. One fly in the ointment is that I never sell ANY of my JBL, or Altec, components! I love them too much, even if I haven't used them for much over the years since I quit playing music for a living! ;)

I may well build a cabinet for the 2242HPL, just for grins! IF I can make the time to do so, it could be fun, if nothing else.

As for the 10" driver, if not the LE10A, which one would you suggest? I guess I had always thought that the LE10A was the proper driver, as it appears identical to the ones shown in some of my vintage JBL catalogs, circa 1980. As mentioned, I will probably keep the LE10A's, but would be open to finding something better, if such an item is available out there.

Thanks, tons for your thoughts, Grumpy! Much appreciated, and I can already see my Sweet Bride looking askance at me, as I haven't built a box in a very long time, and this would be yet another thing that takes time, money, and commitment, in an already stretched situation!! :eek::blink:;):) I'm excited about the possibilities, however, and that's always a good thing! Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

grumpy
05-05-2008, 10:32 PM
not selling? understand... If I could practice what I preach...:)

You might consider the 4344... 10" is 2122H.
The only odd man out would then be the 2420's
(vs. the ferrite/titanium 2425's used in the 4344)...
not necessarily a bad thing, but the optimum crossover
would probably not be a straight duplicate of the 4344's
network.

I've probably got other forum members eyes
rolling back in their heads by now, so I'll unplug for awhile.

I'm sure you'll get more good suggestions.

timc
05-06-2008, 01:06 AM
Welcome to our little community Doc :)


-Tim

Russellc
05-06-2008, 06:40 AM
$30! OMG... :banghead:

That woofer will really please you, if you stuff it into the properly tuned cabinet. What a price...
Great price and at least it was real...unlike the "new in the box" 2405 jbl drivers I saw listed on KC CL (#666349167) for the exact same price, 30 bucks! :banghead::blah:
No call back imagine that!
Russellc

Doc Mark
05-06-2008, 07:32 AM
not selling? understand... If I could practice what I preach...:)

You might consider the 4344... 10" is 2122H.
The only odd man out would then be the 2420's
(vs. the ferrite/titanium 2425's used in the 4344)...
not necessarily a bad thing, but the optimum crossover
would probably not be a straight duplicate of the 4344's
network.

I've probably got other forum members eyes
rolling back in their heads by now, so I'll unplug for awhile.

I'm sure you'll get more good suggestions.

Morning, Gumpy,

None of the info that I have from JBL mentions the 4344, so I'm not familiar with that one, nor the 10" 2122H transducers. But, it's been a good long while since I've played with such things, and I'm sure I've missed much in the interim!

As to the 2420's vs the 2425's, I doubt that my tired old ears could hear much of a difference between them, but maybe.... I have a huge hearing loss, right at 5KHZ, but it's very narrow, and pretty much has stayed where it is. Too much playing loud music as a kid, and shooting firearms without hearing protection!! Too soon old, too late smart, as they say!!:(:blink:

Thanks, again, for all the suggestions, Grumpy! Nothing is going to happen before the middle part of the Summer, due to a heavy work schedule. But, after that time, I'm hoping to begin making sawdust, and we'll see what becomes of it! I'm excited, nonetheless!! Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

Doc Mark
05-06-2008, 07:34 AM
Welcome to our little community Doc :)


-Tim

Morning, Tim,

Thanks, very much! It was complete serendipity that I found you guys, but I'm glad to have done so! I have several good friends in Norway, whom I met as part of a backpacking stove collector's group. You have a truly lovely Country, and Sweet Bride and I very much hope to visit, one day! Thanks, again, for the warm welcome! Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

Doc Mark
05-06-2008, 07:43 AM
Great price and at least it was real...unlike the "new in the box" 2405 jbl drivers I saw listed on KC CL (#666349167) for the exact same price, 30 bucks! :banghead::blah:
No call back imagine that!
Russellc

Good Morning, Russell,

Thanks, very much! Yes, it's always fun to find the deals, when they pop up. Over the years, I've found some fun ones, but until I stumbled upon that 18" JBL, I'd found nothing like that in many years. One of the sellers was named Russell, too! Fun!

Back in the day, I once found a nice K120 for $5; a 90° JBL horn for $10; and an old corner cabinet, loaded with a JBL D130, crossover, and a Universal horn, complete with a granite top piece, for just $10! But, I've been out of the loop for many years, so it was really fun to find that JBL! With the dust cap mashed in a bit, I'm hoping all will be well with it, when I get a chance to test it. But, it has clean, free movement around the voice coil, and I'm hoping it will be as good as it looks. Again, it has no mounting marks, at all, so I assume it's never been used for anything. The seller told me that he had bought it from another fellow, with the sole intent to resell it at the swap meet. He did hook it up and run some music through it, and said it worked just fine. The proof, however, is in the pudding, and when I can, I'll sweep it with my old HP tone generator, and we'll see how it really looks, then mount it into some sort of cabinet, and go from there. Fun, no matter how it turns out!

Regarding the 2405's, I used to not care much for the "spitty" sound that those tweeters could sometimes offer. Then, over the years, I realized that most of the time, 2405's that sounded that way, were crossed over WAY too low! Once I heard some crossed over around 10KHZ, I liked them better! In any case, it's nice to have a pair of them, to use in this project, no matter how it turns out. Thanks, again, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

P.S. I'll be away for a good bit this Summer, with work, but hope to be able to stop in and chat along the way! Thanks to all for a wonderful site!!

Rolf
05-06-2008, 01:35 PM
You are very welcome Doc on the forum. Hope to hear more from you in the future.

Doc Mark
05-06-2008, 02:06 PM
You are very welcome Doc on the forum. Hope to hear more from you in the future.

Hey, Rolf,

Thank you, very much, Sir! I can already see, as it is in stove collecting, there seems to be some strong interest in JBL over in Norway, which is outstanding!! :applaud: I hope to have many questions for you Gentlemen, and to visit whenever I can do so. I stumbled onto the stove collector's site to which I belong, in much the same way I found you Guys, while looking for something specific! I remember, back then, telling the Guys on the stove site that, due to lots of work, I wouldn't be visiting too much. Yeah, right!! Now, after a few years, I'm closing in on 6,000 posts!! Danged blabber-mouth, that's me!!:blah::blah: Most of it is pure :bs:, I have to admit!! :D In any case, I'm so very happy to have found this site, and I'm quite impressed by the quality of the membership I've seen so far! Very nice, indeed! Talk to you later, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

Doc Mark
05-06-2008, 03:08 PM
Greetings, Gentlemen,

Just a brief update. Today, I hooked the 2242HPL, propped up off it's vents, to one channel of my subwoofer amp, and ran some music through it. I picked a tune called "Africa", by Checkfield, two guys from San Diego, who did a few recordings "back in the day". Lots of good percussion, and some good bottom end. Since the 18" driver was not in a cabinet, I didn't crank the SPL, but I did turn it up a little, just for grins. For satellite speakers, I hooked up a little pair of JBL 2500's that I found at another swap meet, for $30. They sound nice, but are definitely not in the class of the earlier and better made JBL stuff. Still, for a small bookshelf speaker, I rather like them. In any case, the 2242HPL made a difference in the sound, and the depth of the subwoofer signal, and I could detect no rattle, buzz, or other anomoly, which had made me a Happy Camper, indeed, with my $30 18" subwoofer!! Now, how can I get a nice 8 cubic foot cabinet without having to take the time to build one???!! ;):D Nah, I'll wait until I have time to build a good solid cabinet for this big guy. But, I'm pretty sure I'll be happy with what he can add to my system, even after this small preliminary test. Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

P.S. Does anyone know when the Model 2500's were made? Any information about them will be appreciated, too. Thanks, very much!

grumpy
05-06-2008, 03:33 PM
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=4238

http://jbl.com/home/products/product_detail.aspx?prod=JBL2500&CheckProduct=Y

Doc Mark
05-06-2008, 06:43 PM
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=4238

http://jbl.com/home/products/product_detail.aspx?prod=JBL2500&CheckProduct=Y

Evening, Grumpy,

You are the man, Sir! Thanks, very much!! Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

boputnam
05-06-2008, 06:51 PM
...I remember, back then, telling the Guys on the stove site that, due to lots of work, I wouldn't be visiting too much. Yeah, right!! Now, after a few years, I'm closing in on 6,000 posts!! Uh, make that 5,821 posts as of today. That is 7.20% of the total posts on that Forum, at a rate of 4.69 posts per day.

Egads... :blink:

Dood! You need to find a bunch more hobbies!! :p

Doc Mark
05-06-2008, 10:03 PM
Uh, make that 5,821 posts as of today. That is 7.20% of the total posts on that Forum, at a rate of 4.69 posts per day.

Egads... :blink:

Dood! You need to find a bunch more hobbies!! :p

Hey, Bo,

Are you a stove collecter, too??? Are you a member of CCS? If so, what name do you use over there? I'm "Doc" for CCS, to many of my friends, and any other forums to which I belong. But, the stove site is the only one where I've really dug down deep! I've been collecting the little beggars for around 30 years, and have more than several of them! Please let me know how you found out about that site, Bo! I look forward to hearing about this! take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

P.S. Bo, actually, I have more hobbies than I have time for, unfortunately! But, stoves, is a big one, and speaker building, which came from the old musician days, used to be a big one, too. I look forward to dusting off some formulas and building a few boxes this Summer!

Doc Mark
05-07-2008, 07:34 AM
Good Morning, Gentlemen,

I was perusing my old JBL enclosure building information last night, and comparing it to the newer ways that JBL seems to be building cabinets, and a few questions have come into my rather feeble brain. Mostly, this has to do with bracing inside the cabinets.

My most successful systems, "back in the day", were all made using the tons of bracing and cleats that JBL used to recommend back then. These cabinets were rock-solid, never rattled, buzzed, or added anything to the sound of the music reproduced by the transducers mounted inside them. Now, I see that JBL is using very little in the way of bracing, when compared to the "old days", and I wonder what has changed since I was building all those large, heavily-braced cabinets back then? Is all that bracing now considered over-kill? Is not no longer needed, and if not, why not?

I won't be beginning my subwoofer projects until mid-Summer, but I'd very much like to hear what you all think about the reduced bracing inside modern JBL cabinets. Thanks, very much, for any comments or ideas you can send my way. Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc