A very good reason not to buy LSR32 or LSR6332 speakers

[yovoy]

JBL doesn't offer diaphragms for their tweeters!!! (053TI or 053TIS).... they cost around $125 for a replacement, and sometimes there is no stock...

count on them blowing AT LEAST twice per year. That adds $250 a year to the cost to maintain these speakers. I blow them about 3 times a year over the past 4 years. That means I spent over $1500 just to keep them working.
Over an 8 year period, i would've paid triple the purchase price.

Just not worth it... To many other box makers that offer replacement parts for a reasonable cost. Diaphragms cost under $10 to make for JBL. There's a difference between making money, and being pigs about it.

A real shame, JBL used to be such a good company...

[edgewound]

Maybe you should try to limit the input level to prevent amp clipping that fries the tweeters.

I'm not trying to be a smartass....just giving advice for prevention.

That will save you the $250/year maintenance cost.

[boputnam]

Maybe you should try to limit the input level to prevent amp clipping that fries the tweeters.Yea, I'm with edge.

Have not before heard of this problem. What are you driving them with, and how loud?

[mikebake]

JBL doesn't offer diaphragms for their tweeters!!! (053TI or 053TIS).... they cost around $125 for a replacement, and sometimes there is no stock...

count on them blowing AT LEAST twice per year. That adds $250 a year to the cost to maintain these speakers. I blow them about 3 times a year over the past 4 years. That means I spent over $1500 just to keep them working.
Over an 8 year period, i would've paid triple the purchase price.

Just not worth it... To many other box makers that offer replacement parts for a reasonable cost. Diaphragms cost under $10 to make for JBL. There's a difference between making money, and being pigs about it.

A real shame, JBL used to be such a good company...
Your problem, not JBL's.

[Robh3606]

If you are blowing tweeters at that rate blame yourself. You have a lot of gall to complain about what it's costing you when you obviously don't learn from your mistakes.

Rob:)

[BMWCCA]

One of my favorite reference papers pointed to from this site long ago:
http://www.jblpro.com/pub/technote/lowpower.pdf

I fried a JBL tweeter (075) maybe thirty-five years ago. Sent it back and JBL repaired it for free but warned me they suspected a high-frequency oscillation from my underpowered receiver may have caused the problem. I sold the receiver and bought my first power amp, (Fisher SA1000). Over the next thirty-five years I've used Crown amps exclusively, even powering lowly L20Ts with a PS-400——and playing them loud. Never damaged a tweeter since, and that includes 075, 044, 035ti, 052ti, and 035tiA. Clean power is usually the answer. Not enough power is often the problem.

I'm still waiting for the answer to the "what amp?" question. :)

[yovoy]

studios blow tweeters, it's just the way it is. A professional studio blowing a pair of tweeters a year is nothing. My speakers in my home setup, of course never get blown.

Point is, JBL could of course resell the diaphragms. They would probably make more money on the mark up. Do you know the industrial waste involved building a whole new driver, when a small replacement part would suffice? Environmental waste anyone?

Imagine if every company took that approach? The U.S, would be one big landfill. No wonder gas is at $4.00 a gallon.

For you people that are running a real studio, for which these speakers are designed for, think twice before buying them. You will blow the highs, and the speaker (bc of JBL's greed) will cost you about double the purchase price. Meaning a pair of LSR6332's will cost you around 4K over 5 years.

Lot's of other good studio speakers with reasonable rates for parts. Even high end speakers, like my 25K pair of Quested 412s have diaphragm replacements for the tweeters-- i paid about $7.00 for one last year.

[yovoy]

I use Bryston 14Bsst's and Krell 250a. I'm simply warning fellow studio owners, who are thinking of buying JBL LSR6332's that if they do happen to blow the highs, that it will cost them around $150 w/ shipping and taxes for replacement. I have 8 pairs of these, and they do blow once in a while (not frequently, once or twice a year), and it's costly to replace. I wish someone warned me, i may have considered purchasing different speakers for the rooms that i run.

Perhaps as well, if enough people complain (rant), perhaps JBL will change the policy, and allow their customers to purchase repl diaphragms for these tweeters. Everyone wins in that situation. Starting to get it yet? More blown tweeters = money out of your pocket. Nothing cool about that... never cared for your audience or asked for it, so move on pls.

[brutal]

Please stop feeding the trolls. :D

[Mr. Widget]

Perhaps as well, if enough people complain (rant), perhaps JBL will change the policy, and allow their customers to purchase repl diaphragms for these tweeters.I think you make a valid point, but I think this is a conversation to be taken up with JBL's Customer Service dept.

That said, I suspect that the reason that JBL doesn't offer replacement diaphragms is due to tight tolerances inherent in tweeters. It is likely that the design of that tweeter simply doesn't afford field replacement without a sacrifice in quality or making the tweeter even more expensive initially.

I agree with you that being able to inexpensively repair a loudspeaker is an excellent selling point... you should drive that point home to JBL by writing to them. ...and when you do, let me suggest you not call them pigs.


... never cared for your audience or asked for it, so move on pls.I realize you are catching it, but what would you expect. Let's try to remain civil here.


Widget

[edgewound]

. Starting to get it yet? .

Yes....You should buy different monitors, because obviously you're not happy with them and they're not for you.

Are they under warranty? Try a service center. If they're fried to a crisp, that hip-hop overdriven, bass-distorted headroom sapping shit ain't gonna cut it.....it'll burn them tweeter voice coils....cumulatively.

I bet the JBL's get the most use....don't they?

[yovoy]

It is likely that the design of that tweeter simply doesn't afford field replacement without a sacrifice in quality or making the tweeter even more expensive initially.

That could be valid... i already did write JBL. I've seen other posts from other people asking about replacement diapragms, so a thread could encourage more emails to jbl's service center. JBL should in the least offer a service to fix the tweeter via a mail in. It's a shame throwing away a perfectly good driver.... hate doing it, feels like such a waste. Like trashing a good car, because the transmission is busted.

What did i expect? A little civility for starters.

[Mr. Widget]

What did i expect? A little civility for starters.You did get a little civility for starters...

You must know that this site is for fans of Lansing... calling JBL pigs and talking about how your speakers aren't worth fixing while you go ahead and do it, and your tone in general is bound to piss off a few people.

If I went to the Harley Davidson forum and started posting about what shoddy bikes they are, don't you expect I'd be told where to go? Just use some common sense.

I'm sorry to hear that you keep blowing tweeters. If it happened to me I'd be on the people who sold the speakers to me and I'd get them repaired or replaced. If they continued to blow, then I'd realize that they were not appropriate for my application and I'd find something that was.


Widget

[BMWCCA]

If I went to the Harley Davidson forum and started posting about what shoddy bikes they are . . . Oh let's! :applaud:

[Ian Mackenzie]

Install a Poly switch in series with the tweeter . Yawn

I think they were invented so a punk teenager would not trash Dad's expensive loudspeakers while he was off having an affair with his secretary.

In the 70's punks would wire up 10 LE15 to the mains to get it on ..things have gotten a bit more sophisticated since then.

But joints still seem to get rolled behind the Desk while trying to impress the client.

They cost about $2.00 bucks

http://www.jaycar.com.au/products_uploaded/rn3460.pdf
http://www.jaycar.com.au/products_uploaded/rn3464.pdf


RXE075 PTC Fuses - Speaker Protection

Low cost speaker protection.More specifications ensure accurate choice for better protection. Polyswitches will protect against electrical (current) overload and will protect speakers in most situations. They are not foolproof and will not protect against mechanical overload. Select the device based on its trip (power rating W), eg. if you need to protect a tweeter that will handle 10 watts RMS and its rated at 8 ohms you would select an RXE075 device. If in doubt, be conservative. Some experimentation may be necessary since music signals can vary a great deal. Simply connect in series with the speakers you wish to protect.

How they work
Polyswitch protectors are based on conductive polymers and act like resettable solid state circuit breakers. When the operating current of the protector is exceeded the interior of the device partially melts, which suddenly increases the volume which increases the resistance drastically. This in turn reduces the current. The device stays in this state while the current is maintained because its temperature is elevated. Once the current is removed, the device re- establishes itself almost immediately, so that the low resistance value is restored.

Voltage ratings
RN3460/62 - 60 volts; the rest are 50 volts.
Part No - RXE075
Trip 4- Ohms - 5.1 watts
Trip 6- Ohms - 7.7 watts
Trip 8- Ohms - 10.2 watts
Trip Current - 1.13 amps

[Robh3606]

What did i expect? A little civility for starters.

For starters try some common sense. Turn it down

Rob:)

[JBL 4645]

Maybe you should try to limit the input level to prevent amp clipping that fries the tweeters.

I'm not trying to be a smartass....just giving advice for prevention.

That will save you the $250/year maintenance cost.

Here, here well said.

I think this is pucker looking JBL studio monitor. Have you ever tried running them with fast peak audio limiters to protect them from harmful peaks, that should reduce the risk of blowing the delicate drivers.

http://www.jblpro.com/pages/recording/lsr32.htm (http://www.jblpro.com/pages/recording/lsr32.htm)

Wouldn’t mind a set of these been looking at them for as few years and the drivers can be rotated and from reading the JBL link, they offer good timber balancing.

I have to say I’ve blow a few JBL HF tweeters on few my JBL control 5, I have x5 of them and only two boxes need newer drivers HF and yes, yikes foam edge surrounds for the busted ones.

Anyway since I’ve added the DCX2496 and wired the JBL control 5 so that the crossover filters can handle the kit and with the fast attack peak audio limiters I sleep at night knowing there protected, because blowing the drivers all the time is sign of carelessness.


For starters try some common sense. Turn it down

Rob:)

I know the limitations of my JBL control 5 and the JBL LSR must have an edge in technical tolerance levels over my JBL control 5 and 1 series.

So if you don’t have audio limiters for protection! Like Rob said just turn them down and give the JBL a break and your ears as well because its sounds like you’ve driven them beyond there technical tolerance level and that = BAD!

I also see there passive design isn’t there a way of getting inside and modifying them to run with active crossover and audio limiters for maximum protection and assurance all the time.

Some film soundtracks today are just getting so ridiculously loud and I use my JBL a lot for movie soundtracks and some of peaks are very high in dynamic range I’m surprised some of the control 5 and lasted long enough. Some music CD like Madonna or Jean Michel Jarre is also louder than some film soundtracks and so I reduce the level to around -15 to -20db too bright in the mid range and I’m not that hard of hearing.

I also fear that some of the extremely bright highs will burn the voice coils out with puff of grey smoke.

[4313B]

JBL doesn't offer diaphragms for their tweeters!!! (053TI or 053TIS).... they cost around $125 for a replacement, and sometimes there is no stock...

count on them blowing AT LEAST twice per year. That adds $250 a year to the cost to maintain these speakers. I blow them about 3 times a year over the past 4 years. That means I spent over $1500 just to keep them working.
Over an 8 year period, i would've paid triple the purchase price.

Just not worth it... To many other box makers that offer replacement parts for a reasonable cost. Diaphragms cost under $10 to make for JBL. There's a difference between making money, and being pigs about it.

A real shame, JBL used to be such a good company...There is something wrong with your particular environment/application.

It's possible that we are going to see more and more whole driver replacement from JBL in the future.

JBL used to be a different company when the world was different. It has changed with the times. And it has managed to survive.

The cost of doing business is just that and JBL is no different than any other company trying to survive in a highly competitive global economy.

Perhaps as well, if enough people complain (rant), perhaps JBL will change the policy, and allow their customers to purchase repl diaphragms for these tweeters.I don't think that is the direction JBL is headed. I would imagine that whole driver replacement is going to become even more common. There are significant changes happening with JBL and I don't believe that any member of this forum would find any of the changes positive or exciting.

[allen mueller]

Selling my lsr32's was one of the worst audio desicions I've ever made. So much that i recently went out and bough a new pair of LSR6332's.

These monitors can get more than loud enough for me, with no signs of distortion. Sounds like if one keeps blowing tweeters than user must be pushing them to hard or there is something else going on.

Allen

[edgewound]

What did i expect? A little civility for starters.

Let's see here...

I was the first to respond to your post, and I thought was pretty civil.

I could have ripped you a new one on the fact that a "professional" of your lofty standards should know how to treat a precision instrument....but I guess I should've realized that all you want to do is bitch, bitch, bitch.

Next time, I'll show you some NYC civility;).

[subwoof]

Apparently you are asking a small format monitor to do a large format's job. The power issue is somewhat moot if these are running at 99% of their handling all the time.

Do you load a family van with cinderblocks for a construction job?? Nope - you use a truck. But they both have 4 wheels and headlights right?..

Do you use a 20" push lawnmower to mow a golf course? Nope - you use a fleet of riding mowers. But they both have a throttle and use gas right?..

Would you use a pair of these small monitors for mains at a rock club? Nope - you use SR speakers with horns and plenty of power. But they both have the same response and are JBL right?..

Look at these diaphrams - one is the size used on the small monitors and the other is on the big boys. NOTE the quarter - it will just fit inside the smaller's coil.

Which one do you think will survive a hip-hop mixdown?? And let's not visit the distortion / fatigue issue...if my ears were listening to those abused tweeters day in / day out my career would be pretty short.

sub

[brutal]

Let's see here...

I was the first to respond to your post, and I thought was pretty civil.

I could have ripped you a new one on the fact that a "professional" of your lofty standards should know how to treat a precision instrument....but I guess I should've realized that all you want to do is bitch, bitch, bitch.

Next time, I'll show you some NYC civility;).

LOL. Reminds me of a joke.

Do you know how a New Yorker does CPR?



Looking down and yelling in my worst NY accent >> "GET UP BEFORE YOU F**KING DIE!"

[JBLnsince1959]

yovoy

to every situation, there is always a simple solution.. no matter how impossible or dark it may seem at time..

Sell me your "shitty" speakers for a dirt cheap price and everyone will be happy, and please don't be affended by the "dirt cheap price". Look how much I'll be saving you over the long run

That will let you move on to some speakers that are worth you having

God.. I love a win, win solution

PM me

[louped garouv]

hell, i figure he should pay you to take the money pits off of his hands....

they are running $250 annually just to keep them going...

:D

[JBLnsince1959]

hell, i figure he should pay you to take the money pits off of his hands....

they are running $250 annually just to keep them going...

:D


OH HELL YES!!!:bouncy::banana::banana:

please, please do

[Allanvh5150]

I think the point will have been taken by now.:)

[cooky1257]

Is it just me or is this thread taking on a mean school playground groove?;-(

[hjames]

I think Yovoy has left the building ...

[timc]

Just for reference. There was one guy at a Danish forum who tested the LSR32 against a B&W 802.


One of the things he prefered about the JBL was that it could play louder with less compression in the midrange.


The 802's can play quite loud, so you would have to play at VERY high lvls to blow a LSR.


My LSR 4328P plays much louder then needed for nearfield monitoring, and they are small by comparison.



-Tim

[Maron Horonzakz]

AND THE REGULAR GUYS ON THIS FORUM USED TO CALL ME MEAN..;)

[hjames]

AND THE REGULAR GUYS ON THIS FORUM USED TO CALL ME MEAN..;)

You WERE mean ... but you've mellowed out real nice! :applaud:

[Maron Horonzakz]

Old age will do that.... But it seems this gent YO YO.. Should take a lesson on how to use a volume control... The LSR series is a fine monitoring instrument and not a audio toy.

[boputnam]

I use Bryston 14Bsst's and Krell 250a...You haven't been real specific on the failure conditions - both amps are causing this?

The Bryston might be a bit heavy handed. The 14B sst advertises 600w. Both the LSR32 and LSR6332 spec 200w continuous, 800w peak.

Anyway, I think subwoof is on the right track - you are using these LSR's in the wrong application. These are for near-field mastering. You should have larger format speakers for louder playback.

Just picture any proper recording studio* - near-fields rest almost right on the meter bridge of the console; louder playback monitors are typically mounted in the wall, above, and are materially larger format transducers.

Used properly, you'd be of a different opinion about these, and all things JBL.

-----

* - Falcon Studio A, Portland OR, shown. Note the near-fields, mid-field Tannoys and large format Urei's.

[yovoy]

i don't blow speaker often... these tweeters got blown by producers who have used my studio. All on the Bryston 14bst but maybe once on a 4bst. Definitely should drive these things this hard.

point of my thread is that i think it a bit odd that this is one of the most common tweeters used by JBL for their studio line- yet it's one of the few tweeters that doesn't offer a diapragm replacement. If Ford, didn't offer replacement parts for their carborators in their more popular line of cars, but offered carb parts for all of their other lines- id think that the owners of those cars may call that into question.

Especially when you know they have the parts, they just refuse to sell them-- screw you, buy a brand new carb from us.

Now you can talk all day about how to maintain a carborator, and why it should never break, but it's not really the point. There is a factory in mexico that makes the diaphragms for the LSR32's. They cost pennies to make.

If I'm a good customer of JBL (which i am), and i'm not happy with this policy, i have a right to call it into question. I know i'm not the only one, because i've seen people on the net asking for the same diaphragms.

Now you can say i should write the company directly, but if a few people read this post, and a few people ask the same questions, who knows.

[grumpy]

reading only the last post (above), it seems a reasonable request... and you should probably
write directly.

I would -guess- that the logic is that it's nearly as cheap and faster to
replace/install ($136 list price for entire unit vs. , say, $92 for a 035Ti,
when they were still available), and fewer items to stock/maintain.

I'd like some 066 domes for pennies too, but ...

[4313B]

If I'm a good customer of JBL (which i am), and i'm not happy with this policy, i have a right to call it into question. I know i'm not the only one, because i've seen people on the net asking for the same diaphragms.

Now you can say i should write the company directly, but if a few people read this post, and a few people ask the same questions, who knows.
Rumor has it that JBL is leaving the transducer manufacturing business. Perhaps when they begin sourcing their transducers from other manufacturers they can keep your plight in mind.

I'd like some 066 domes for pennies too, but ...I just checked the other day because I needed one for a 4313B; No longer available. Ever. Bye bye 4313B. :wave:

One thing is definite, it was sure fun while it lasted. :yes:

[grumpy]

:(

[cooky1257]

Rumor has it that JBL is leaving the transducer manufacturing business. Perhaps when they begin sourcing their transducers from other manufacturers they can keep your plight in mind.

One thing is definite, it was sure fun while it lasted. :yes:

Sadly It appears the way of the world these days although some speaker manufacturers who've outsourced(exported jobs) overseas have been smart enough to keep their top 'prestige' lines home grown-Tannoy for one does this.
Some seem to recognise there's more to Brand value than absolute financial turnover.
.:biting:

[Krunchy]

I just checked the other day because I needed one for a 4313B; No longer available. Ever. Bye bye 4313B. :wave:

nooooOOH!!!! DONT SAY THAT! I LOVE THE 4313B's :( (ditto Grumpy)

I got pair of 066's, I wonder if I could get $700.00 for them ala the 077 tweets :hmm: :hmm: :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

Let us discuss a happy subject now (slipping into deep deppresion) I'll be in The Blues thread :(

[cooky1257]

[B]

Let us discuss a happy subject now, slipping into deep deppresion, I'll be in The Blues thread :(

:rotfl:

[BMWCCA]

nooooOOH!!!! DONT SAY THAT! I LOVE THE 4313B'S :( (ditto Grumpy)

I got pair of 066's, I wonder if I could get $700.00 for them Good ones do seem to be increasing in value recently: http://ebayitem.com/110241280625 (http://ebayitem.com/110241280625)

[johnaec]

I just checked the other day because I needed one for a 4313B; No longer available. Ever. Bye bye 4313B. :wave:Heck - you can't even get newer/current stuff - replacement tweeters for Performance series - NLA... :(

John

[oznob]

Looks like it's becomming a throw away industry, just like most everything else I guess. If it breaks, throw it away and buy a new one! Very sad really.:(

[BMWCCA]

It's free electronics-recycling-week at Crutchfield in honor of Earth Week. I'm loading up the truck.

[Mr. Widget]

Rumor has it that JBL is leaving the transducer manufacturing business. Perhaps when they begin sourcing their transducers from other manufacturers they can keep your plight in mind.
I just checked the other day because I needed one for a 4313B; No longer available. Ever. Bye bye 4313B. :wave:

Heck - you can't even get newer/current stuff - replacement tweeters for Performance series - NLA... :(Ah, America!

So we have a few disappointed fans... this form of corporate thinking keeps the shareholders happy! :bouncy:

Joy oh joy, happy shareholders. Makers me feel all warm and fuzzy. :barf:


Widget

[Krunchy]

Its a sad day my friends, a sad day!

[Mr. Widget]

You know, the fact that JBL has become a lot more like every other brand out there isn't the end of the world... it sucks to be sure, but it is what it is. We can still appreciate what they were and occasionally still are.

As for the focus of this thread... I am not sure that having to shell out some cash for a blown tweeter is a good reason not to buy a speaker. If I were a JBL dealer and I had several complaints from customers I'd be hesitant to suggest them, but I doubt that is the case. Over the years we've seen a handful of botched subwoofers and now anecdotally a single user who is having trouble with his LSRs, but by and large JBL still seems to be producing a product of adequate to superior quality (depending on the model).

I am afraid that the truly outstanding products like the Everest II may not be forthcoming in the future, and JBL may very well disappoint us and decide to discontinue supporting the vast catalog of vintage drivers that they still support, but even if that occurs we'll always have the heritage.


Widget

[Skywave-Rider]

LOL. Reminds me of a joke.

Do you know how a New Yorker does CPR?



Looking down and yelling in my worst NY accent >> "GET UP BEFORE YOU F**KING DIE!"

You guys made me laugh. You probably don't know that there aren't many New Yorkers left in New York.
Excluding myself.:D

Someone mentioned Harley Davidson a number of posts ago.
A few years back I built - maybe re-built - a 1946 Harley Flathead from a basket case. Almost all parts were obsolete,(!almost!), but I was able to source missing items from the wonderfully helpful, strong brotherhood of Harley people around the US. There is also a cottage industry of parts re-manufacturing; both domestic and overseas, for obsolete HD parts. Great Plains Audio reminds me of the best of them.

Let's hope that if JBL goes as the trends indicate, and the posts I've read here, a brotherhood/sisterhood of tattooed JBL freaks keeps the marque alive.

It's been done before.

[richluvsound]

What if it had been a 1500 al he'd blown . :(

Rich

[4313B]

What if it had been a 1500 al he'd blown . :(

RichHe'd have to buy a new one if it was blown due to abuse. To my knowledge there are no recone kits available.

[yovoy]

So we have a few disappointed fans... this form of corporate thinking keeps the shareholders happy! :bouncy:Widget

Disappointing your die hard customer base, shouldn't make anyone at the company happy. And considering where their stock has gone this year (down 60%), i doubt any shareholders are very happy about anything.

I understand a company not supporting vintage parts. Sucks big time, i'm sure. But to not offer parts for current line of speakers, come on now.

I sent a letter requesting an explanation to here:

http://www.jblproservice.com/forms/us_cust_serv.html

Thanks, BTW for all the advice on how to save your tweeters. Much appreciated.

[demon]

duuh, its the system!
its the system forcing good companies like jbl to do bad things like not supporting titanium diaphragms to austria (as an example).

funk the sytem!!
;)

cheers,
mikey

[Ian Mackenzie]

He'd have to buy a new one if it was blown due to abuse. To my knowledge there are no recone kits available.


Over here we tends to provide insurance Home Contents for flood in certain areas and accidental damage, burgulary, fire, acts of god.

Pending the acceptance of the claim and policy to replace old for new where does JBL fit in GIVEN WHAT YOU HAVE STATED IN RECENT POSTS?

Not meaning t be Negative BUT ""Its suggests to me that buying anying "new" JBL branded, particularly a "new buy" may in the end be a replacement of equivalent value in terms of replacement be it or ..god forbid...... Bose or other. ""

The point being paying the premium for specified items its worthless if your prefered brand is not going to be around for the long haul.

It suggests a very high risk on investing in the branded drivers outside the United Sates in terms of warranty and insurance which very unfortunate............

[Krunchy]

You know, the fact that JBL has become a lot more like every other brand out there isn't the end of the world... it sucks to be sure, but it is what it is. We can still appreciate what they were and occasionally still are. JBL may very well disappoint us and decide to discontinue supporting the vast catalog of vintage drivers that they still support, but even if that occurs we'll always have the heritage.


I know Widget, just having a little fun, to be honest I did not know that they still offered the 066 untill recently, I find that pretty incredible. With the exception of a couple of sets of speakers here at home most of them do not have new anything available but that did not keep me or anyone else from pursuing them.

The 4313B's that I have were abused (at least the cabs were) and they still sound amazing, with a little TLC they'll last another 20 years easy. God forbid someone treated them well, they'd last forever (lets also remember to thank Rick Cobb here). Plus a lot of JBL's heritage is in large part due to the fact that these speakers were built with remarkable quality both construction-wise and of course sound-wise.
I'm not worried, JBLs will be around for a very long time, and to a large extent all of us here in this forum will be in a way (large or small) responsible for that, and that should put a smile on everyones face. ;)

Going back to The Blues thread, to quote Bleeding Gums Murphy "the Blues aint about feeling sad, its about making others feel worse! :D

[doodlebug]

After reading the whole thread, it seems to me we've not addressed one other aspect of the OP's complaint: The use/abuse of the systems in question.

In this case, the studio owner/OP was complaining about having to replace tweeters that cost too much and how they are vended as replacement devices. This, to me, is a symptom - not the problem.

Later we learn that the failures are due to guest producers running the systems too hard and blowing tweeters.

It seems to me that this is why old-school monitor producers like UREI used light bulbs in their monitors. My 813s, when driven hard enough, will light up like a Christmas tree but also tells me that things are getting out of hand. I've done a couple of stoopid things like pulling patch cables with the system on and have blown tweeter bulbs in them but they saved me the pain and $$ to replace the diaphrams in the Altec 604s. Nice. Come to think about it, its pretty clear there's still a place for large-format monitors for some folks.

So, I think the OP needs to rethink how he is managing his gear to protect himself from those who clearly don't think about such things when using it.

Cheers,

David

[johnaec]

Later we learn that the failures are due to guest producers running the systems too hard and blowing tweeters.This seems a perfect circumstance for putting some limiters in the system. Decent ones are available that are very unobtrusive sonically, especially to the type of people that would tend to overdrive speakers.


I understand a company not supporting vintage parts.It'd be nice to think JBL would let someone supply NLA parts, the way Great Plains Audio supports Altec. But while this might work for higher-demand parts, there probably wouldn't be enough demand for things like 066 diaphragms to support those... :(

John

[Baron030]

Posted by: doodlebug

After reading the whole thread, it seems to me we've not addressed one other aspect of the OP's complaint: The use/abuse of the systems in question.

In this case, the studio owner/OP was complaining about having to replace tweeters that cost too much and how they are vended as replacement devices. This, to me, is a symptom - not the problem.

Later we learn that the failures are due to guest producers running the systems too hard and blowing tweeters.

It seems to me that this is why old-school monitor producers like UREI used light bulbs in their monitors. My 813s, when driven hard enough, will light up like a Christmas tree but also tells me that things are getting out of hand. I've done a couple of stupid things like pulling patch cables with the system on and have blown tweeter bulbs in them but they saved me the pain and $$ to replace the diaphragms in the Altec 604s. Nice. Come to think about it, it’s pretty clear there's still a place for large-format monitors for some folks.

So, I think the OP needs to rethink how he is managing his gear to protect himself from those who clearly don't think about such things when using it.

Cheers,
David


David is bringing up a very good point. If these speakers are going to be over-driven by some stupid guest producers, then limiters are a real possible solution. If these were my speakers, then I would install some JBL SK3 Crossover Fuse Limiter Bulbs on the tweeters. And it would be best to physically mount them on the back wall of the enclosure directly behind the bass reflex port. In that way, the maximum amount of light would be projected out the bass reflex port. And at the very least, it would entertain these idiots with a light show.

Here is a link to a parts source, and at less the $10.00 a pop, it sure would be worth a try.

http://www.speakerrepair.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=55-001&Category_Code=

Baron030 :)

[boputnam]

Rumor has it that JBL is leaving the transducer manufacturing business. Perhaps when they begin sourcing their transducers from other manufacturers they can keep your plight in mind. I just checked the other day because I needed one for a 4313B; No longer available. Ever. Bye bye 4313B. :wave:
One thing is definite, it was sure fun while it lasted. :yes:Wow. Really bad news. Sad. Impossible to hear.

That is the best of their "bookshelf" cabinets, period.

:(

[edgewound]

According to Pro...that's not the case for the foreseeable future, especially with the Pro Series transducers and parts to repair them.
Small speakers such as LSR 4300's, Control Contractor, etc. are outsourced to tight spec.

Yes, I imagine that low demand parts will be NLA and that's a purely economics and corporate decision. Parts on the shelf are taxed as income...hence "JIT" or "just in time" inventory supply. Nothing remains idle for long, if at all. Sometimes parts have been revived by placing an order large enough to justify an economies of scale order quantity...or EOQ. Geez...I can still recall operations mgmt terms from college.

There's lots of high falutin' MBA business management science language floating around such as, "combining departmental synergies", "recentralization", ad nauseum...that simply means, "business sucks all over and we need to cut everywhere"...and the first place is payroll.:(

This phenomenon seems to take place about every ten years in our US economic cycle as the train runs out of fuel on the uphill side and needs to coast downhill to cools its burners. When the load is gone, we can motor up hill again.....with a new kind of fuel...hopefully:o:.

[4313B]

Wow. Really bad news. Sad. Impossible to hear.

That is the best of their "bookshelf" cabinets, period.

:(Yeah but we've been seeing alot of systems become non-serviceable for quite awhile now. This should push up prices on functional transducers in the coming years. I would imagine "parting out" will become even more popular.

Parts on the shelf are taxed as income...hence "JIT" or "just in time" inventory supply. Nothing remains idle for long, if at all.Yep, as various members have discovered JBL has had parts sitting on the shelf for us JBL fans for over 20 years now. I'm not sure why they never followed Harman's example and just tossed all the spare parts in the trash. It's very nice of them to foot that bill all this time for us to keep our JBL's in service for as long as possible.

[subwoof]

Well to the forum members who also enjoy the restoration of old cars this is a similar plight but not always fatal. Getting parts for a 1968 ambassador is going to be hard since it was a "dog" and only a movie set provider would have a need / want. But how many sources are there for a 1968 mustang??? right...

Small companies are now producing entire body panel packages for an ever-increasing group of classic cars. Why spend all that time / effort on weekend warrior fiberglas and bondo parties when you can buy + bolt.

And do you think for one minute that your neighbor's 1968 challenger with the 6pack is still sporting a set of points and condenser?? Nope - it's all electronic ignition now and while it's not absolutely pure, it IS usable, enjoyable and doesn't pollute as much...and has the added benefit of STARTING when cold. The 8mpg sucks but with that amount of Gforce, who cares...

How about the tires??? 4ply polyester bias anyone?? nope - super sleek tuned rims and specialized steel radials that even indy didn't have back then...you can't get the same paint, muffler, brakepads ( asbestos anyone?? ) and a host of misc items but so what.

And don't even start me on those LED tailight bulbs....just not cool...:)

So while certain tweeters have been eclipsed by newer technology and therefore have become obsolete, I am SURE that some entrepreneur's mission of recreating the old JBL transducer parts will become a reality just as soon as JBL doesn't sell the parts anymore.

The 1939 JBL 4" coil compression driver is STILL around albeit with better parts + materials so they should be safe for a very long time. Same for the basic items that make up the mainstream large format monitors.

However I for one would like to see JBL dust off the designs ( I just know they have them ) for Nd magnet, Rubber surround, high temp versions of the standard foam-surround woofers for the monitor line. THEY WOULD SELL and would rekindle a host of DIY / KIT firms to offer them....

I did my homework for the wife's MBA / marketing and there is a substantial area that is not defined in every market that can be exploited with the right effort. Suppose JBL made a vintage division and rehired some old transducer engineers and cabinetmakers???

Hmmmm....

[3dbdown]

Well, y'all got me to thinkin' !!

I've recently scored a pair of brand new D8R2425 diaphragms, a super clean set of 123A-1's, and am currently running down a number of different LE5-xx components, and some 077 diaphragms.............should keep my collection in good order for years to come.....

Funny thing is, I don't need a single one of those components.............YET!!

I did have to choose, however, between following this thread or shopping....OOPPS!.... They just called my number!!

Long Live JBL!!!!! And, if my systems outlive me, then I haven't done too badly....AND....All my kids love 'em too!!

You can't keep a good product down, try though you might!!

Rick :applaud: :barf::bouncy: