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Zilch
01-30-2008, 02:57 PM
O.K., who'd got 'em?

Toddalin, Skywave-Rider, Hamilton, Jackgiff, Infredible, Zilch. Who else?

[Gaseous discharge RULEZ! :p ]

johnaec
01-30-2008, 04:24 PM
That's the 1/6 octave display, right? (Only 1/3 octave RTA/display stuff here - DBX, Rane, Alesis), though I do have a 1/6 octave White digital EQ and a couple channels of JBL, (Rane), 1/6 octave LF graphic EQ...

John

Zilch
01-30-2008, 08:07 PM
Your White has higher resolution EQ than us, but we've got parametrics, as well. RTA is 1/6 octave, yes.

We WILL be accepting associate members.

[Once we start collecting dues.... :p ]

JohanR
01-31-2008, 02:19 AM
I got one just two days ago. So far I've only done some manual tinkering in the GEQ based on earlier in room measurements. Seems to do what I want it to do!

hjames
01-31-2008, 04:56 AM
O.K., who'd got 'em?

Toddalin, Skywave-Rider, Hamilton, Jackgiff, Infredible, Zilch. Who else?

[Gaseous discharge RULEZ! :p ]

Looks like the street price is around $250 -
is that a fair approximation?

JBL 4645
01-31-2008, 05:25 AM
£193.99p at Digital Village :bouncy:
http://www.dv247.com/invt/froogle/4629/ (http://www.dv247.com/invt/froogle/4629/)

hjames
01-31-2008, 05:28 AM
£193.99p at Digital Village :bouncy:
http://www.dv247.com/invt/froogle/4629/ (http://www.dv247.com/invt/froogle/4629/)

Ok - so the Exchange rate website http://www.xe.com/ucc/convert.cgi shows me

193.99 GBP = 385.976 USD


so NO, that doesn't seem to be the going US Street price.
Looks like I can buy one from a number of stores with eBay shops for around $250,
so $385 sounds like WAY too much money for it!

toddalin
01-31-2008, 09:29 AM
Paid $135 for mine on the 'Bay and it included the Behringer microphone and a case for the mic.

Typically they go for between $100-$150 on the 'Bay for "like new" ones. I let a lot go with a top bid price of $125 (that went just over that), but figured that $135 w/mic was a better deal.

I think that Grumpy (Dave) may also have one (or access to one).

grumpy
01-31-2008, 10:13 AM
I think that Grumpy (Dave) may also have one (or access to one).

Yep, I -did- have access to one... used it as part of an industrial noise simulator and
measurement system.

Some may find that funny. It worked well enough for the intended tests/application.
A computer-based GUI would have been helpful, but I can't complain much given
the price and the alternatives.

-grumpy

Harvey Gerst
01-31-2008, 10:32 PM
My DEQ2496 came today. Anxious to try it out. Does anyone know if the mic input is specifically compensated for their ECM8000 measurement mic? I have about 7 of the ECM8000's and a pair of Audix TR-40 measurement mics that I can use.

toddalin
02-01-2008, 09:29 AM
My DEQ2496 came today. Anxious to try it out. Does anyone know if the mic input is specifically compensated for their ECM8000 measurement mic? I have about 7 of the ECM8000's and a pair of Audix TR-40 measurement mics that I can use.

According to what Dave (Grumpy) told me, the ECM8000 (that I also use), shows a slightly exadurated upper region such that the highs are not quite what they appear. Dave said that this (along with its correction) has been documented here on the LH forum, but I've never searched for it.

To my ear, I like the highs rolled off slightly so I figure if I can get it flat, I actually have a slight roll-off.

BTW, you need to remember to set the voltage on the eq for the ECM8000. As I recall, I never did see that in the instructions (per se for the ECM8000 though there is mention of it) and scratched my head a couple times. Documentation with the eq and mic is poor at best.

grumpy
02-01-2008, 11:12 AM
What I can tell you with some certainty, is that the spec sheet:
http://www.behringerdownload.de/ECM8000/ECM8000_C_Specs.pdf
really doesn't give you much (e.g., tolerances) other than the overall
shape of a typical response curve. I made several measurements to
compare a calibrated Earthworks mic with one particular example of the
ECM8000, and found the resulting difference curve to match the shape
(if not the exact levels) of the plot in the mfg. spec sheet. The ECM I
tested had a slight rise, starting at 1KHz, broadly peaked at 10KHz (+3dB
from "flat"), and then dropped off (~0dB rel at 20KHz, with the drop off
continuing to at least 30KHz).

I would be -very- surprised if they made any attempt to compensate
for the ECM8000 in the DEQ2496.

-grumpy

JBL 4645
02-02-2008, 03:59 AM
Paid $135 for mine on the 'Bay and it included the Behringer microphone and a case for the mic.

Typically they go for between $100-$150 on the 'Bay for "like new" ones. I let a lot go with a top bid price of $125 (that went just over that), but figured that $135 w/mic was a better deal.

I think that Grumpy (Dave) may also have one (or access to one).


Mate, thatís a good bit of bargain hunting, Iíd say you got yourself a deal there.
:applaud:


Ok - so the Exchange rate website http://www.xe.com/ucc/convert.cgi shows me

193.99 GBP = 385.976 USD


so NO, that doesn't seem to be the going US Street price.
Looks like I can buy one from a number of stores with eBay shops for around $250,
so $385 sounds like WAY too much money for it!

LOL I donít put a lot of stock in it. :D Letís no spilt hairs over it, thatís the lowest UK price, havenít used Google product to track down the lowest prices in the US?

Chas
02-03-2008, 08:47 AM
O.K., who'd got 'em?

]

Yes. :bouncy:

Useful as a DAC too.

Skywave-Rider
02-04-2008, 12:26 AM
I now have 2.
And they both work. :blink:
Do I get 2 votes when the DEQ Crew convenes?

I think I like it now.

pentictonklaus
02-04-2008, 09:26 AM
I got one since 2 years. I am very happy with it. Running 2344 active with it .

No issues at all.

Loffen
02-14-2008, 07:29 AM
Hei

Would it be possible to use two of the DEQ2496,one for the front speakers and one for the subwoofers ?
And if so,how would they work together ?

Espen

Zilch
02-14-2008, 09:45 AM
Why?

Whatever you do with it in VLF, like assist and/or subsonic filter, is not going to affect the mains, assuming they've got a separate highpass filter on them.

If you're talking about separate channels in a multi-channel system, then you could use a separate one on the subs, but it seems like overkill for sub EQ.... :dont-know

SMKSoundPro
02-14-2008, 12:50 PM
Are you saying that I am not part of "the" club because I don't have a 2496?

What happened to "Ban the Behringer" movement in pro sound?

Every piece of Behr gear I have ever come across is crap!

I have read the posts about your 2496s, and question, at times, what kool-aid are you guys drinking?

If it is THAT great a tool, than please convince me.

Respectfully Submitted,

Scotty.

Zilch
02-15-2008, 01:43 AM
If it is THAT great a tool, than please convince me.Minimum admission to working with speakers.

First and foremost, a semii-portable (but not road worthy) stand alone RTA with good accuracy and 1/6-octave resolution at an economical price, the familiar orange images posted in these forums. Used properly (I don't always do that, ;) ) an invaluable tool for balancing, getting driver phase and alignment right, knowing and working with the response characteristics of drivers, horns, and full systems. It doesn't lie; makes you face the facts head on.

Then the fun stuff, much of which I have STILL not explored. 1/3-octave graphic EQ, and multiple parametics. Rob showed me how to set up a subsonic filter in the feedback destroyer. The Q=2 assist for B-380 is in one of the parametrics. Giskard showed me how to do that. 64 memories to store different settings in. Infredible sets up sound fields for different music genres in there.

Want to know how it would sound if you fixed that dip in the response there? Push AutoEQ to make any curve you want, and then A/B with what you've got without it. Swap in a different driver. Still the same?

Dynamics, width, other stuff. Rotate the soundfield, yada, yada.

Allegedly a high-quality A/D converter front end, which I know nothing about what to use for.... :p

SMKSoundPro
02-15-2008, 03:11 AM
okay. I understand. tired and out of money. will look for one soon.

Are there printed up 2496 club cards? Lapel pins? Bowling shirts?

If I am going to buy one to be part of the club.....

hjames
02-15-2008, 04:08 AM
Okay, so to detail the specifics a bit more -
1. the RTA - would that be a laptop and clio? Or is that a function of the Behr 2496 (perhaps fed to a laptop)

2. 1/3-octave graphic EQ, and multiple parametics - lots of ways to get here I guess ... cheap approach is the Behringer, but perhaps noisy for home use (? for the folks with really good amps; Hafler, Pass and similar)

Am I on the right wavelength?


Minimum admission to working with speakers.

First and foremost, a semii-portable (but not road worthy) stand alone RTA with good accuracy and 1/6-octave resolution at an economical price, the familiar orange images posted in these forums. Used properly (I don't always do that, ;) ) an invaluable tool for balancing, getting driver phase and alignment right, knowing and working with the response characteristics of drivers, horns, and full systems. It doesn't lie; makes you face the facts head on.

Then the fun stuff, much of which I have STILL not explored. 1/3-octave graphic EQ, and multiple parametics. Rob showed me how to set up a subsonic filter in the feedback destroyer. The Q=2 assist for B-380 is in one of the parametrics. Giskard showed me how to do that. 64 memories to store different settings in. Infredible sets up sound fields for different music genres in there.

Want to know how it would sound if you fixed that dip in the response there? Push AutoEQ to make any curve you want, and then A/B with what you've got without it. Swap in a different driver. Still the same?

Dynamics, width, other stuff. Rotate the soundfield, yada, yada.

Allegedly a high-quality A/D converter front end, which I know nothing about what to use for.... :p

Chas
02-15-2008, 06:49 AM
Allegedly a high-quality A/D converter front end, which I know nothing about what to use for.... :p

Yeah, it's not too shabby. Useful for D/A conversion with an older CD player - or what I do, is use it for conversion off my digital cable box. I would think it could be useful for satellite audio as well.

That way, it's not just another piece of test gear sitting on the shelf getting dusty when not in use.

Skywave-Rider
02-15-2008, 07:07 AM
Okay, so to detail the specifics a bit more -
1. the RTA - would that be a laptop and clio? Or is that a function of the Behr 2496 (perhaps fed to a laptop)

2. 1/3-octave graphic EQ, and multiple parametics - lots of ways to get here I guess ... cheap approach is the Behringer, but perhaps noisy for home use (? for the folks with really good amps; Hafler, Pass and similar)

Am I on the right wavelength?

Hi,
The RTA function is built in, provide a measurement mic, that's all. (I bought the cheap Behringer one, and I can't vouch for its flatness. In researching posts and reviews, it seems to be fairly flat.)

There is no computer interface, though there is MIDI, presumably you could do a system exclusive data dump to a pc to archive settings. Also for program (setting) changes via a MIDI sequencer for automation of parameters -- like if you're a sequenced performer and want to change an EQ for one song.

The unit is very quiet, you won't hear noise.

It has very flexible routing capabilities, so you can send the pink noise to one output, have the other output bypassing the EQ, etc..

I have wanted to get into RTA for a long time but could not afford to. This has made it possible.

As far as the sound goes, you have to make that call for yourself. Frankly, I don't think the converter is all that, and even with great converters, I hear the difference comparing a source to the inserted digital device. So that's to be expected. Consider the price, though.

As far as using "auto eq" it can be great. But I found, as Zilch has stated elsewhere, that careful positioning is important, and if you are using horn speakers with beamy power response, your off axis sound will get funny. It's not a miracle machine.

And the meter is great, but I wish the VU emulation could be calibrated. Say if I want 0VU to be at -18 or -20, as is common.
http://www.rogernichols.com/EQ/EQ_2000_06.html
As it is, I think they show 0VU at digital 0, so it's kind of useless. Maybe somebody out there knows how to change that.

JBL 4645
02-15-2008, 07:34 AM
I now have 2.
And they both work. :blink:
Do I get 2 votes when the DEQ Crew convenes?

I think I like it now.

You suck :D I, sure can do with four DCX2496 to adjust the response between the front and the seating area.

DCX2496 left and right front
DCX2496 centre front centre back surround
DCX2496 side wall surrounds left and right
DCX2496 sub bass extension and LFE.1

Iíll have to wait like the rest. :p

Chas
02-15-2008, 07:45 AM
Hi,
As far as the sound goes, you have to make that call for yourself. Frankly, I don't think the converter is all that, and even with great converters, I hear the difference comparing a source to the inserted digital device. So that's to be expected. Consider the price, though.

Agreed, I don't leave it in the main audio signal line. It is definitely audible.

Skywave-Rider
02-15-2008, 08:32 AM
Yes Chas, you are right. But maybe I did not write too clearly. It's, in my opinion, a judgement call. The benefit of the room EQ could outweigh the sound of the converters. Depends. In my case in my apartment, where I use EV Sentrys for a Pro Tools workstation, some EQ is essential to tune the room and help those speakers. So the sound is better with it in line in this application. That could be true for others reading this post.

And I will also say that anytime you are using an EQ, you are changing, indeed distorting the sound, no matter how high end or professional the equipment.

I do wish it had better build quality/made in the USA/nicer converters/computer interface/calibrate-able VU meter/etc..

But then the price would be much higher. And I would not be enjoying listening through one right now. And I would not be able to upgrade my 9844s.

toddalin
02-15-2008, 09:49 AM
I paid less for this, (with the mic) ($135 on the 'bay),

http://zeneszmagazin.hu/uploads/DEQ2496_1.jpg

Than I did for this (~$150 at DAK) with its mic close to 20 years ago. And 20 years ago $150 was a lot of $$$.

http://www.largescaleonline.com/eimages/lsolpics/Team_Member_Pics/toddalin/LEFTAFTER.jpg

You tell me where the value lies. ;)

JBL 4645
02-15-2008, 11:42 AM
Mate The DEQ2496 image didnít load up, only with a red X.






http://zeneszmagazin.hu/uploads/DEQ2496_1.jpg

I also found this link in Google Image which raised my eyebrows even higher than Roger Mooreís.:D

An Introductory Guide to Subwoofers
http://home.comcast.net/~thomasw-2/SubwooferSetupandEQpageDEQ2496.html (http://home.comcast.net/~thomasw-2/SubwooferSetupandEQpageDEQ2496.html)

JBL 4645
02-15-2008, 11:53 AM
Wow sifted though that and I like the features even more than the first time around.

The DEQ2496 is labelled with features, and I’m sure each and every one of them will be extremely useful.

This would give me a break from those mismatched GEQ that I’ve been tinkering around with these past years, time I stepped up my priorities.

There is only one way this goes around its DEQ2496 then onto the DCX2496 otherwise I’d need at least x3 DEQ2496 one for each channel LCR LF HF though channels 1 2 3 4 5 and 6.

I’m surprised there isn’t any additional barograph display that indicates output level after EQ has been done, because there be a slight difference in the level, due to one or many frequency bands being altered, no matter, that’s why the DCX2496 is the last link in the audio chain before passing off to the amplifies, so any overloading will be indicated on the DCX2496 loudspeaker management system.

Zilch
02-15-2008, 04:42 PM
Agreed, I don't leave it in the main audio signal line. It is definitely audible.Mine's in the main audio signal line. When powered off, the internal relays bypass it entirely.

I power it up for use, is all, and don't have to mess with the cable connections.

Chas
02-15-2008, 06:57 PM
Mine's in the main audio signal line. When powered off, the internal relays bypass it entirely.



I didn't know that, thanks. Won't work for me 'cause I use the D/A.

hjames
02-15-2008, 07:01 PM
Guess I'm still confused by all the acronym soup -
You all are talking about the Behr DEQ2496 here - is that something different than the DECX or DEQX that Bo and Richluvsound have been chatting up?

JBL 4645
02-16-2008, 07:59 AM
Found this link on youtube showing te Behringer DEQ2496 in action.

Behringer DEQ2496 Restarts
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1TY-mU8vhE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1TY-mU8vhE)

richluvsound
02-16-2008, 08:17 AM
Hi Heather,

www.deqx.com There are few of use using this machine.

Deqx is pronounced "DECKS" I find it a real challenge being very new to this.

But , as always with the forum members , there is an answer here amongst us.

sorry no Video.

Rich

JBL 4645
02-16-2008, 08:42 AM
What no video there has to be a video of some type out there.

hjames
02-16-2008, 10:57 AM
Hi Heather,

www.deqx.com (http://www.deqx.com) There are few of use using this machine.

Deqx is pronounced "DECKS" I find it a real challenge being very new to this.

But , as always with the forum members , there is an answer here amongst us.

Rich

Ah, great thanks! Which model is it?
Looks like they make a lot of varied products - I gather its a bit more uprange then the B-ringers ...

JBL 4645
02-16-2008, 11:00 AM
I bet they cost an arm and leg you know a lot of bread.

richluvsound
02-16-2008, 11:14 AM
It has a lot off useful fucntions. It is a bit pricey,but when you consider what you get its very good value indeed. There is a new model coming out .PDC 3

It will sell in the UK for around £3500:blink:

Rich

JBL 4645
02-16-2008, 11:39 AM
It has a lot off useful fucntions. It is a bit pricey,but when you consider what you get its very good value indeed. There is a new model coming out .PDC 3

It will sell in the UK for around £3500:blink:

Rich

Whoa! Now that the kiss to kill your lover! :D The wife would have a Benny http://s174.photobucket.com/albums/w118/Brainstorm3417/th_straitjacket.jpg if she knew you spent 3.5K on EQ. :blink:

richluvsound
02-16-2008, 01:35 PM
I always sneak it in the back door. Then when she sees it I tell her what a brilliant deal I got and by saving so much money I would like to take her shopping for" SHOES" :bs:

More than a EQ..... Pre with anologue volume control, Para EQ ,2 or 3 way stereo Active crossover with 4 different settings at the touch of a button . Time alignment, Room correction, Driver caliberation and so on and so forth. Oh yeah ! a pretty good DAC too.

JBL 4645
02-16-2008, 01:44 PM
I always sneak it in the back door. Then when she sees it I tell her what a brilliant deal I got and by saving so much money I would like to take her shopping for" SHOES" :bs:

More than a EQ..... Pre with anologue volume control, Para EQ ,2 or 3 way stereo Active crossover with 4 different settings at the touch of a button . Time alignment, Room correction, Driver caliberation and so on and so forth. Oh yeah ! a pretty good DAC too.

You creep in, so do you also creep around at night-time? Youíre a secret lemonade drinker, RWhites.:D
http://www.classictvads.co.uk/images/rwhites.jpg

Skywave-Rider
02-21-2008, 12:41 PM
How do you orient placement of your measurement mic -- specifically, the Behringer ECM 8000?

Just read this review someone linked to previously:
http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/0705/behringerultracurve2496.htm

He suggests using the mic oriented 90 degrees to the source. Yes it's omnidirectional, but in reality, nothing really has an omnidirectional polar response throughout the frequency range. So do you agree with what he does? How do you do it? And generally, how far away do you measure from?

Thanks!

Zilch
02-21-2008, 12:56 PM
I use it on-axis on a mini-boom.

1M, typical, and 1/4" for nearfield, because those are standard.

~2M if I'm doing AutoEQ of both channels simultaneously, to get better integration of the two sources....

Skywave-Rider
03-19-2008, 11:11 AM
Anybody know how to delete a user preset?
Duh!

Zilch
03-19-2008, 09:19 PM
In memory?

Gotta be a way, but I've never discovered it. There's tech services at the US location as last resort. They told me once how to clear the whole deal to factory presets.

Did I write it down?


Nope.... :D

boputnam
03-20-2008, 01:20 PM
Anybody know how to delete a user preset?Do you need to delete it? Could it just be overwritten with the "new"...?

Skywave-Rider
03-20-2008, 01:34 PM
Hi Bo,
Yes, you can overwrite and rename. Which I've been doing. But it leaves a clutter of old presets. And I'm easily confused.:o:
:banghead:

grumpy
03-20-2008, 02:09 PM
load preset #0, store it where you want cleared (to default values).

Skywave-Rider
03-20-2008, 09:00 PM
Good deal Grumpy. Just tried it. After saving the initialized patch (#"0") to your target erasure, push in and hold the lower right rotary knob to clear your text in one shot.

It's convoluted, but works.
Thanks again.

Zilch
03-20-2008, 11:47 PM
There is a pupose to #0 after all. ;)

[Grumpy smarty.... :yes: ]

grumpy
03-21-2008, 07:00 AM
No..., grumpy R'd TFM. ;)

KCCT82
03-24-2008, 04:12 AM
Hello,

A few years ago, my first "hi-fi" system consisted of both the DEQ and DCX. It was a good way to get the most out of my cheap drivers... (less than $200 for a pair of dome tweeters, cone mids, dual 12") ;)

I'm not sure anyone here knows, but on the "utility" page, you can seperate the left and right channels (change stereo-link to dual-mono), meaning you can adjust the L and R channels individually on graphic eq. This feature helps a lot if your room is not symetrical. What I did was auto EQ one channel at a time by muting the other on DCX. When the screen is showing the graphic curve, the "A" button switches between L and R. Left channel is solid dots, right channel is hollow dots. :p

regards

Skywave-Rider
03-24-2008, 06:09 AM
I'm not sure anyone here knows, but on the "utility" page, you can seperate the left and right channels (change stereo-link to dual-mono), meaning you can adjust the L and R channels individually on graphic eq. This feature helps a lot if your room is not symetrical. What I did was auto EQ one channel at a time by muting the other on DCX. When the screen is showing the graphic curve, the "A" button switches between L and R. Left channel is solid dots, right channel is hollow dots. :p

regards


Thanks, Keith, good tip.

That's what I am doing in my home setup. I find the results are much better, and it avoids a high end boost from AutoEq when VHF cancellations at the microphone occur from doing both sides at once.

I believe the cancellations are from phase differences at the single point of the microphone coming from both monitors , whereas you don't get that at your ears, given the distance between both ears.

jblbgw_man
08-09-2008, 10:26 PM
O.K., who'd got 'em?

Toddalin, Skywave-Rider, Hamilton, Jackgiff, Infredible, Zilch. Who else?

[Gaseous discharge RULEZ! :p ]
I got one too, can I join your club :bouncy:

JBL 4645
08-10-2008, 10:25 PM
Thereís been an update to the Digital Village site with a brief promotional video look for (play video) yes I like it and I want two start off with and yet Iím still strapped for cash!:banghead:

http://www.dv247.com/invt/froogle/4629/# (http://www.dv247.com/invt/froogle/4629/)

grumpy
08-11-2008, 03:25 PM
Normal price/description:

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product?sku=182484V

One day price $169.99:

(URL deleted)
(http://www.musiciansfriend.com/stupid)

JBobL
08-11-2008, 04:12 PM
grumpy, you ROCK!:)
Saved enough to get the ECM-8000 and free shipping too!
Thanks man:)

JBL 4645
08-11-2008, 04:28 PM
Normal price/description:

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product?sku=182484V

One day price $169.99:

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/stupid


Funny enough I got my free subscription magazine of (StudioSpears) this morning or rather yesterday morning.

While looking though I noticed the DEQ2496 going for £168.40p WOW now all I need to do is knock off a few post offices for a few grand. Just kidding.:D

DEQ2496 at StudioSpears now £168.40p plus VAT
http://www.studiospares.com/Equalisers/Behringer-Ultracurve-Pro-Deq2496/invt/370230

JBobL
08-11-2008, 04:34 PM
The DEQ2496 @ MusiciansFriend is B-stock but still...It will look worse after I get it installed in the cabinet ha ha.:)

grumpy
08-11-2008, 06:46 PM
Hope it works out for you. :)

If you're looking for accurate measurements above ~4KHz
with the ECM8000, I've compared a few with an Earthworks
cal mic and they all had a few dB bump above 4KHz then back
down (and falloff) at 20KHz. The manufacturer typical curve
published shows the general shape, the peak amplitude just
seems to vary a bit, some more than others.

The ECM's can still be quite useful, just understand that it will
read a bit higher than "truth" in the highs.

JBobL
08-11-2008, 10:12 PM
Thanks grumpy,
I've been reading up all nite on the ECM800, REW and the DEQ at Home Theater Shack. Plan to use it for sub duty.
The confirmation email from MusiciansFriend listed the DEQ2496 as REFURB. Hope it's not too old. To me there is a distinct difference between B-stock and REFURB! Probably some discussion with them in the AM. Going out for the Persiod shower now.
Later

Zilch
08-13-2008, 12:10 PM
I got one too, can I join your club :bouncy:Yup.

We're nothing but easy around here. :)

[You gotta behave, tho.... :p ]

jblbgw_man
08-14-2008, 02:59 AM
Yup.

We're nothing but easy around here. :)

[You gotta behave, tho.... :p ]
aaaahhh ... I knew there would be a catch :blink:, has anyone re-written the user manual yet :D

I haven't connected mine up to my system yet, I wanted to run it for a week or so just powered up :hmm: just to be sure it is'nt going to go "POP" or "BANG" ;)

JBobL
08-14-2008, 01:53 PM
Anyone know how to read the date code on these? 0703 is what they shipped me. For a "refurb" it doesn't have a mark on it. Looks more like old stock.

Edit: Discovered the software is version 1.4
The latest software is version 2.3 but that is only available for v2x hardware So I'm guessing the deq they shipped me was manufactured in july 2003.

JBobL
08-16-2008, 10:18 AM
Well, this thing didn't last 10 minutes.:(
No wonder I've never seen one in clubs.

Zilch
08-16-2008, 10:33 AM
Tell 'em you want a NEW one.... :yes:

JBobL
08-16-2008, 01:52 PM
I have a standing rule, usually only repeated when someone tries to sell me an extended warranty, which is "If I have any trouble with this product I am never shopping here again!"
I learned my lesson from Fry's Electronics. Well known for selling defective, recalled merchandise and passing refurbs as new. I watched them put a new price tag on a recalled graphics card I just returned.
Never again.

Zilch
08-16-2008, 03:26 PM
Skywave went through three of them before he got one that worked right, as I recall.... :yes:

grumpy
08-16-2008, 03:36 PM
Sorry to hear of your trouble. Hope the vendor covers a replacement
and their customer service treats you as well as has been my experience.

JBobL
08-16-2008, 07:24 PM
Thanks, already have the RA.:) Without going into details let me just say that returning, exchanging anything is an enormous PITA for me no matter the supplier. Guitar Center had the same deal just harder to find on their website. At least they showed it as refurb. But how does a refurb fail the first time you plug it in? :banghead:
On a good note, I won two tickets to Patty Griffin on the radio!:)

Allanvh5150
08-16-2008, 09:20 PM
The importers in New Zealand had major problems with reliability. Now they dont bring them in anymore. The ones that are still going though work pretty well.

jblbgw_man
08-17-2008, 01:10 AM
Well ... mine has not failed yet in the week that I have had it powered up, however :hmm: I think I will leave it powered up for another week before I connect it up to my system ...... just to be sure....... I can't remember ever having done this before for ANY piece of audio gear. Is it just the DEQ2496 that seems to have a high failure rate or is it all of Bangringer's equipment ??:D

Robh3606
08-17-2008, 07:32 AM
What happens when they fail?? Do they just quietly stop working or do they bring other gear into the mix and damage stuff??

Rob:)

boputnam
08-18-2008, 11:10 AM
Is it just the DEQ2496 that seems to have a high failure rate or is it all of Bangringer's equipment ??:DTheir outboard dynamics gear is sonically inferior. Innards are cheap-o. They don't fail, so much, as just suck. I wish they would fail more often - then all the low-end clubs that deploy them would have to get something else, hopefully better!

I have seen many reports of this particular unit being failure prone. What it is trying to do is very complicated stuff, and I guess they slapped it together fast to get it to market, but missed some Q/A Q/C...

:barf:

Zilch
08-20-2008, 11:01 AM
Nobody's saying use them in clubs here, or even as system EQ at home. They're NOT DEQX.

What they ARE is an affordable turnkey window into what it's all about, and well worth working through any early failures to get there.... :yes:

jblbgw_man
08-21-2008, 04:16 AM
Nobody's saying use them in clubs here, or even as system EQ at home. They're NOT DEQX.

What they ARE is an affordable turnkey window into what it's all about, and well worth working through any early failures to get there.... :yes:
Well put Mr. Zilch !!:applaud:

I only intend to use mine as a RTA at this stage, however I will also give the auto eq and other "tricks" a go but will probably not use it unless it is transparent, however given it's reputation I doubt weather it will satisfy me in this respect. Since it has'nt died yet I will play with it this weekend and connect it "in circuit" and see what happens .... you never know I could be back here next week eating my words and completley satisfied :o: ... shall we take bets :D

Skywave-Rider
08-22-2008, 07:59 AM
Skywave went through three of them before he got one that worked right, as I recall.... :yes:

Yep.
I determined the date codes or serial numbers were significantly older than the ones I eventually kept. Forget about refurbs.

The bad ones, as I remember, died at power up.

I "burned in" the current ones for a week or two powered on 24-7.

In retrospect, I think power on/off cycles are probably more stressful and might provoke a predestined failure earlier.

Mine work as advertised and I already got my money's worth out of them. I don't expect the EQ to be what the best analog EQs are.

Got the good ones from Musician's Friend on line.
Got the bad ones from BSW and B&H.
:)

JBobL
08-22-2008, 12:50 PM
My "bad" one came from Musicians Friend. Advertised as B Stock. What they shipped was "new OLD stock".

Skywave-Rider
08-22-2008, 01:32 PM
My "bad" one came from Musicians Friend. Advertised as B Stock. What they shipped was "new OLD stock".

Oh man. It's caveat emptor out there!
Argh.

JBobL
08-22-2008, 02:04 PM
Caveat Venditor:)

readswift
08-24-2008, 09:15 PM
I'd wait a little and pick up a Zetex DDFA (http://www.zetex.com/literature/pdf/SCCLZBR2.pdf) amp with that builtin crossover, incredible, terrific specs. I'd bet it comes with HDMI too plus the usual digital interfaces. The feedback loop at the filter resembles Hypex UCD, or the art you see in Halcro patents. I'm using 100W ICEpower class-d amps right now, imagine 150g amp (thats it with builtin switchin powersupply) driving 1.5 kg crossover of 4430, funny sight for sure:blink:

ps: forget to mention, the builtin asynchronous samplerate converter means that it's supposed to eliminate the digital culprit known as jitter, does it in the same manner like benchmark dac-1 , or the smaller lavry dac. I'd also bet its better than anything you can come up with while struggling with DEQX ;) There s also an increasing trend now in china - they are selling DAC with builtin hard disk drive (IDE port) , that gives adequate digital interconnect, you can even compute room correction process offline on PC - save wave files then put those onto that hard disk, or just use Squeezebox with PC.

Skywave-Rider
08-25-2008, 10:04 AM
That looks great. I could not find any pricing on their site. Have any idea?

Looks like the technology used in some of the better active DSP equipped studio monitors. Dunno.


I'd wait a little and pick up a Zetex DDFA (http://www.zetex.com/literature/pdf/SCCLZBR2.pdf) amp with that builtin crossover, incredible, terrific specs. I'd bet it comes with HDMI too plus the usual digital interfaces. The feedback loop at the filter resembles Hypex UCD, or the art you see in Halcro patents. I'm using 100W ICEpower class-d amps right now, imagine 150g amp (thats it with builtin switchin powersupply) driving 1.5 kg crossover of 4430, funny sight for sure:blink:

ps: forget to mention, the builtin asynchronous samplerate converter means that it's supposed to eliminate the digital culprit known as jitter, does it in the same manner like benchmark dac-1 , or the smaller lavry dac. I'd also bet its better than anything you can come up with while struggling with DEQX ;) There s also an increasing trend now in china - they are selling DAC with builtin hard disk drive (IDE port) , that gives adequate digital interconnect, you can even compute room correction process offline on PC - save wave files then put those onto that hard disk, or just use Squeezebox with PC.

readswift
08-25-2008, 06:57 PM
mass production with big name OEM's starts this year , as it was hinted several months ago. I think this means that those OEM's already completed their evaluation process and ready to sell stuff.

frank23
09-23-2009, 12:54 PM
I know, the last post before this one was about a year ago, so I am probably running a little late with the Ultracurve, but I finally got one including the ecm8000 mic and micstand!

First observations are that it seems to have allmost unlimited capabilities, and that after two days I am only using the EQ and RTA. And parametric EQ seems more intuitive than graphic EQ. Luckily it can do both.

I am running it fully digital as I find that my normal dac sounds better. So it is cd player > optical in > doing its stuff > optical out to dac > amp > speakers.

The auto EQ seems to work nicely, I just find you have to crank up the pink noise quite loud to not have the "too soft to measure" message. I wont be doing this too often with my kids asleep. On point is that the pink noise is only on the main analog outputs and not on the optical digital out, but that is a minor point.

For manually adjusting the parametric EQ using pink noise, I'd better get myself some earplugs first...

I think it is going to take me a few weeks to master EQ-ing my fully active 3-way system as the interdependencies between drivers, EQ and M553 crossover settings are to big for a 5 minute setup.

JBL 4645
09-23-2009, 01:01 PM
You suck. :D Have fun with it I’m sure its full of lots of surprises. How much did it set you back?

The dynamic EQ should be fun in taming extreme high brittle frequencies with a kinder of relaxing listening pleasure without the need to turning down the volume.

I was thinking and this has been on my mind for weeks now. Three-way what about active crossover for all three bands with dynamic EQ so that mid to high has its own dynamic EQ with little bit of dynamic EQ on the lows. It’s all about experimentation.

frank23
09-24-2009, 01:34 PM
it set me back 300 euro for the ultracurve and then another 75 euro for the mic, stand and cable, all in all not bad

tonight I spent 2 hours calibrating my active 3-way, it turned out ok, but the pink noise volume gets tiresome after 2 hours!

and moving the mic further back (say 1.5 to 2 meters) for more integrated measurements needs even higher levels

but I have got it flat enough

JBL 4645
09-25-2009, 05:09 AM
it set me back 300 euro for the ultracurve and then another 75 euro for the mic, stand and cable, all in all not bad

tonight I spent 2 hours calibrating my active 3-way, it turned out ok, but the pink noise volume gets tiresome after 2 hours!

and moving the mic further back (say 1.5 to 2 meters) for more integrated measurements needs even higher levels

but I have got it flat enough

Use (ear plugs) and you’ll have many wonderful hours with Pink Noise The Wall.:D

Flat enough but never perfectly flat through-out as that is impossible but flat enough in the listening area (sweet spot) as that is where you’d be!

The only thing that is flat is headphones! You can stand in corner and the sound is still flat! Sit in the bath and the sound is still flat!

Then again the real world has the same problems! You could be standing outside in the street and bus passes by and stops at bus stop! The humming deep noise/sound from the engine hums away. Now stand in narrow doorway it’s totally different! Its bommy! So the real world has the same issues as rooms do.

That’s just a statement of observation that is.

frank23
09-29-2009, 12:58 PM
I wondered if anyone has tried to configure the ultracurve to measure impedance?

This might seem strange to you, but all you'd need is a voltage divider to measure voltage over a certain resistor and the speaker and then run a sweep.

If the speaker impedance rises, so does the voltage over the speaker whereas the voltage of the fixed resistor falls by the same amount. And vice versa.