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boputnam
03-05-2004, 05:53 PM
Anybody know this brand of sound desk? I've got a show in a fortnight that has one built-in - they say it's much like a Soundcraft (which I know well...), and may be UK made.

I'd love a Link where I can read some manuals, or see the general layout.

Anybody know anything about these?

Always planning... ;)

Don McRitchie
03-05-2004, 06:05 PM
http://www.soundtracs.com/soundt/docs/front/front_3.htm

boputnam
03-05-2004, 06:22 PM
You da man... :coolness:

I tried every other spelling I thought of.

Humbled by your presents (sic). ;)

boputnam
03-05-2004, 06:24 PM
I can see me now...

Yikes! :eek:

boputnam
03-05-2004, 06:31 PM
Anyway, the FOH is one of their analogue desks - so, this ain't much help.

Typical. We headline, our soundcheck will be washed clean by the opening acts, and we go live, 24-channels, stereo, to full house. :banghead:

You ain't felt real anxiety 'til you done this...

:dancin:

Ian Mackenzie
03-05-2004, 07:31 PM
Yeah but Bo,

You should have your 4345's installed in a large OB Van out the back for the final mix and mastering on a Neve ..thats your place, not behind the chicken wire.

Seriously, there is always a risk with FOH, particularly with a new venue, PA and band first time round....I call it triple SHITS

Ian

Oldmics
03-05-2004, 07:54 PM
Hey Bo
My Soundtracs experience is that its just another desk.Make sure to spend some time to ascertain weather or not your aux sends are pre or post fader and pre or post EQ.They send em from the factory on the smaller boards as switchable on the fader but fixed as post only on the EQ section.Real wide fixed "Q" on everything on the strip.Not gonna zip in tight like on a XL-4. Still a pretty warm sounding console.The big desks were called "Megas",smaller guys are the "Solo" series which included "Solo MIDI".
In my opinion any console with "MIDI being used live is a ticket to hell.Hope you don"t end up on that or some of the other horrible creations that they built in the past.The two above mentioned consoles should make for a fun time.
Now if you want to talk about weird stuff-Quantec reverbs anyone?
Oh and remember the lead singers girlfriend is always right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Enjoy your gig-the season has started.
Oldmics

boputnam
03-05-2004, 09:58 PM
Ha! Oldmics, yer killin' me...

I prefer to run Aux sends pre-fader, pre-EQ (as it should be, right? ;) ), but thanks for the tips - ALWAYS appreciated! I'll watch for the Q band-width, but may not be able to know anything. I tend to run the strips flat-as-I-can, and deal with the Aux and Mains via the 1/3 octave EQ's. What else can a guy do...? :rotfl:

If you know anything about the strip EQ layout, I'd be indebted. Are there "sweep" mids (Lo and Hi mid)? How many Aux - 6? Phantom by strip or global? Lo-cut by strip? And, how many buses are these, typically?

Since I have your attention - I've been struggling with FX on vocals. Just can't seem to find the right compliment. I'm searching for a nice ambiance/presence (HF) impact w/o obvious reverb. Our road rack (which I inherited...) has a simple little Lexicon MPX-100, which I simply cannot make right. Clues?? I've been playing around with "Hall", but am not finding what I want...

Oh, and didn't you and I go 'round about mis-use of the SmaartLIVE? True enough, but it saved the show last weekend (similar circumstances), - I had an Earthworks mic on-stage and could RTA EQ the Mons from FOH - nice trick. After the first set it was moot, but that first 90-seconds was madness and the visibility of SmaartLIVE's RTA was so very valuable. During the show, the Transfer function is un-matched. Period.

Sorry to bother, but I prefer to arrive with a plan that works - at least for the most part! :spin:

Thanks, dude - you've been a GREAT help!

(ps - to Ken Pachalphabet - that AudioControl SA-3050A is a wonder. Second only to the SmaartLIVE. Nice piece of hardware, and plenty roadworthy... :yes: )

Oldmics
03-06-2004, 07:31 AM
Hi Bo
The aux send determination routing is up to you.If mons are sent from F.O.H.,you would certainly want the auxs set as pre fader and pre E.Q.This way any of your moves at F.O.H. do not change what the musos are hearing onstage.I am sure that I am not telling you anything new here.
Personally I sometimes use post fader and post E.Q. for effects sends.This depends on if I want the equalised tone as part of the effected sound.Sometimes this is a help to get more bottom in the reverb of something like a piccolo snare drum.
The strips on the Megas are pretty standard.It is NOT a fully parametric strip.From the top,
phantom 48 switch on each strip
line switch button
attn (gain) pot
phase switch
hi pass switch fixed at 100 hz-rolloff at 12 db per octave
hi freq level pot-fixed at 12K, + or - 15 db
hi mid level pot,+ or - 15 db
hi mid freq point sweepable 350 hz to 8K
low mid level pot,+ or - 15 db
low mid freq point sweepable 50 hz to 1K
low level pot-fixed at 80 hz,= or - 15 db
aux 1
aux 2
aux 3
aux 4
aux 5
aux 6
Above on auxs (from factory as standard)-ALWAYS CHECK EM AND THERE RELATED GAIN STRUCTURE, BOB!
1 and 2 are pre fader,3 and 4 switchable pre or post,5 and 6 post
No VCAs,4 or 8 subgroups.
Solo Consoles
The same E.Q strip EXCEPT FOR global phantom power.Both consoles use 100 mm faders (cheap "o"s not P+G)
As I said,just another desk.

Vocal stuff-always a challenge.Some guys like the SPX chorus or tremelo sound(I personally do not).
Its tough to make a suggestion here since the material that the band plays suggests what effects should be used.I personally like plate verbs.You have to adjust them down real small for a usable vocal trick.Perhaps try that.
When I get to mix what I like (pop bands)The stuff that I use on vocals is pretty intense.Always availiable on the vocal effects in varing amounts, for short delay PCM 42,two verbs PCM80 and a Quantec and an Eventide Harmonizer.
For the rest of the mix on drums two PCM 70s one for snare and one for the toms and a dedicated long delay for specials on vocals or guitars.Sounds like a lot of junk and goo but used in the right amounts and right places its the iceing on the cake and since I carry it all its really an easy setup.Add to that a pile of Antares pitch correction units and a BSS 901 parametric compresser for each vocal input and you get killer vocals every time.Thats pretty much the rig I used with SR71.
I also like the SA units from Audio Control.I have an Iasys and a SA3055 (with the blue L.E.D.s) mounted in a rack.Thise are both great tools.Different applications than Smarrt live,but all very valuable.
I guess the only other thing that I could recomend is to get the musos happy fast onstage so that once they are out of your hair you can create what it should be out front without distractions(except perhps for some obvious cleavage).Its worth holding the show from going on until you feel confident that they are happy.
Only then can you rock!
Oldmics

boputnam
03-06-2004, 10:53 AM
Dood! Thanks for that - all of it. Especially nice to know the strip EQ layout before I wear it. Much like the Soundcraft, overall.

Mon are FOH, so pre and pre, for sure. I also use post and post for re-routing the FX - maybe that's pretty standard. Works great.

Too bad on the 100mm faders - but, since it ain't Soundcraft I guessed as much.


...add to that a pile of Antares pitch correction units ... :rotfl:

The only difference - minor - is, I note the basic Mon settings from sound check, and then when we take the stage, I set each channel there, and back-off the Send gains a bit - no need to start with a standing wave! :wave:. I then get a workable FOH set fast as I can (the hell with the band...) w/o FX, and then start working the Mons, one-by-one. If the first few songs are long enough, I can get it by the time they would otherwise be ready to bitch. ;) Hell, I only have 5 mixes to get right - what's the big deal? :spin:

Thanks again for all the FX tips - I've got some things to try. In particular, re-trying the plate verb - had poor results in the past, but maybe it was not subtle enough.

Big help, man. Thanks. :thmbsup:

boputnam
03-21-2004, 08:03 PM
Hey, oldmics...

Got through the dreaded gig - thanks for the strip tips.

That desk is not that much fun. A great deal of similarities with Soundcraft, but in the end, it is not one. The input preamps don't have near the headroom, and the badboy I sat behind was VU's only. Whoa - old school. There was some pretty good flexibility, but I did not get a good feel for the Q width - but we were the fourth act so by the time I took the wheel, there was heaps of "repair" to do - i.e., get the levels down to appropriate levels, and not much time for real craft. Shit it was loud at the start...

The AUX solo (PFL) were worthless - there was insufficient gain to hear what the monitors were doing. A huge handicap. Same-same on the busses. So, it was seat of the pants, but there were no complaints and plenty :dancin:

Thanks again...

Ken Pachkowsky
03-25-2004, 06:00 PM
Originally posted by boputnam
Ha! Oldmics, yer killin' me...


Thanks, dude - you've been a GREAT help!

(ps - to Ken Pachalphabet - that AudioControl SA-3050A is a wonder. Second only to the SmaartLIVE. Nice piece of hardware, and plenty roadworthy... :yes: )

Are you telling me you got one?

A little more accurate than that GOLDLAME 30xx you had right?

Ken

boputnam
03-25-2004, 06:54 PM
Dood!

Yea, I snagged a SA-3050A and it literally saved our butt at a show where we had no sound check and started LIVE to a full house. The "house" sound guy was a dope, and knew nothing about everything. I was 'sposed to play harp - my debut with this band - but I tore off my Nudie Suit and swung into action. Been behind the FOH ever since. Luckily, I dragged the SA-3050A along, huh??!! So, thanks for the push on the SA-3050A.

And no, it turns-out there's nothing wrong with that GoldLine 30A - only a few worn batteries, is all. Matches the SA-3050A, nicely.

But, the cat's meow is SmaartLIVE in Transfer mode. Sure, it's got the best RTA around - period - but that Transfer mode is incredible power at the FOH desk. :yes:

Hey, Ian - you better study-up on this badboy. Maybe download the manual, hey? You'll be on FOH so I can play some harp, dammit!!

Oldmics
03-25-2004, 07:19 PM
Or perhaps a visual display of someones hearing curve?

Don"t pick on the Goldlines,got a coupla them lying around also.

While SmaartLive is great tool,for componet analysis I prefer Praxis.Also allows me to use my laptop as a digital scope.

Oldmics

boputnam
03-25-2004, 07:24 PM
Originally posted by Oldmics
...I prefer Praxis. Also allows me to use my laptop as a digital scope. OLDMICS!! Dang it! Now I'm gonna need one of them, too... :banghead:

:rotfl:

Ken Pachkowsky
03-25-2004, 07:25 PM
I have only tried Goldlines twice. Both times the RTA was faulty. Sort of developed a negative attitude about them. I have used an Ivie and really liked it. The 3051A is a great tool though.

Ken

Ken Pachkowsky
03-25-2004, 07:28 PM
Bo

Should mention that AB has offered to build me some custom 4 channel amps for the Westlakes. Will keep you informed.

Ken

boputnam
03-25-2004, 09:11 PM
Whoa...

We are in dire need of a "humbled bowing smilie"... ;)

Ian Mackenzie
03-25-2004, 09:24 PM
Bo,

I have a very good friend who runs a Pro Hire Firm,

He has a Spirit desk I am sure: I will take some lessons if not out on the road perhaps mixing some live dat master down.


http://www.hbaudio.com/home.htm

Ian

mikebake
03-26-2004, 07:50 AM
Huh, sound I see we have the live-sound contingent here. I should have know that was in the background of some of y'all.
I hire rigs about 35-40 days/nights a year (mostly Meyer, Turbosound, JBL, and EV), and have sat for hours at FOH ( I also read the LAB forum now and then to get the flavor of things), loaded and unloaded many trucks, put up roof/lights, and gone through every scenario that a promoter can go through, including running home once to grab my "D" rig to supplement a rig that the kid sent for the job couldn't get to work right (believe we later found it was a console problem?!). This was for an outdoor show, 1000+ people, and the main boxes I grabbed were my old pair of 4560's...........they acquitted themselves quite nicely, and all the components were new in them anyway...............no time to assemble a multibox 2-3 way rig and integrate it all, so I went simple. We were getting bass from the subs, anyway, so we just needed the mid/hi. It was a JBL rig, and when I came flying up in the truck, the kid smiled at the old beater cabs, and we both enjoyed hearing them back in a working environment..............

boputnam
04-03-2004, 11:45 AM
Hey, oldmics...

Sum'thin we never discussed: What Gate / Expander are you using? :confused:

I've been using the Behringer MDX4400 comp/limiters - fine for peak limiting and controlling gain, but I've got to get better control on the noise. Simply way too many open mics on stage... :nutz: , most particularly the Kit.

I'm thinking of swapping for the MDX4600 - do you know this? Pretty sweet unit, and sure saves the ever-at-a-premium RU's...

Oldmics
04-03-2004, 12:13 PM
Howdy Bo
Well,here is where we separate the real gear from crap.To upfront answer your question there is no combination gate /expander that I use.For gating applications I have two favorites.If I am doing the same act over and over I would use the BSS units model # DPR 504.These units allow for frequency keying.Great when you have the time to dial them in (as in use with the same act nite after nite).These units allow you to taper the sound of the cans thru the frequency keying mode-great for eliminating that cymbal next to the floor tom mic and creating a unique drum sound.As I said they take too long to dial in for a one off.
The standby workhorse gate for me is the Gatex which was then taken over by Valley People and then put to death by corporate America.The Gatex and the Valley People Gatex have the fastest signal thruput time (10ms) allowing for tight clamping.You will still get gate noise if the voltage threshhold is set too hi (as in a cymbal opening the gate).That is where the BSS unit shines.But for fast on the fly work thats the ticket.The Gatexs are still up for grabs on the bay for around $100.00 for a single rack unit containing 4 gates.
The only thing that I expand is on vocals and that is done thru the BSS 901 units.
Now as for the "B" word. Mom ,always said if you can"t say something nice!!!! Then don"t say anything.

"B"eringer leaves me speachless.

Oldmics

boputnam
04-03-2004, 12:20 PM
Hey, oldmics...

Thanks. I agree on the "B" word, and have limited my use to the comp/limiters and there only on bass and kick, and once on a floozy vocalist with pathetic mic etiquette. Did the trick, er, so to speak... :rotfl:

But, I'm struggling with noise coming off the Kit mic ensemble. I'll look into those units, but as you correctly note, time is never too abundant FOH, so I may be forced into the Gatex.
Going researching... :scoot:

boputnam
04-03-2004, 12:37 PM
On second thought, that BSS-504 looks tops. Can't be that hard to dial-in, hey?

Especially if you were feeling charitable like you'd wanna share some settings you've found that work...? :yes:

boputnam
04-06-2004, 05:25 PM
OK, I know oldmics - for you, this is a coffee table - but it's a nice upgrade from the Spirit Live 4x2...

Any knob farmers out there...?

Boy-howdy!

boputnam
04-06-2004, 05:26 PM
I'm posting so I can look at this at work... :rotfl:

johnaec
04-06-2004, 06:49 PM
Oooohh...that looks like fun! I really want to see you guys at a gig sometime! Rumor has it there might be some Sub1500s in the mix sometime?

John

Ian Mackenzie
04-07-2004, 04:47 AM
Bo,

Looks the part,

I will refer your situation to John Harvey tomorrow night over a few beers while knob farming.

Ian:)

boputnam
04-07-2004, 08:41 PM
Hey, oldmics...

Since I'm not qualified (nor solicited... :( ) to speak on things ParaMiniGonnerGon, maybe you could share your thoughts on active DI's...?

I've been using Radials, but wonder if you've got other experiences :yes: that would benefit my listening audience...?

Oh - and worked one of them Drawmer Surround SixPack units last night - not certain if I'm in-love, or not... :hmm:

pangea
04-18-2004, 01:38 AM
Hi all!

Thanks for sharing your knowledge and insights like this.
I have always been interested in the recording dimension of Hi-Fi and love to read this kind of stuff.

I really can't add anything here, I only know that I prefer voices to be near and un-curtailed.
I want to be able to look down the singer's throat to see what they had for breakfast, so to speak. :D And isn't it so that some amount of compression on the voice will add to that nearness and airiness on the voice?

BR
Roland

boputnam
04-18-2004, 04:38 PM
Originally posted by pangea
...isn't it so that some amount of compression on the voice will add to that nearness and airiness on the voice?... Hey, Roland...

Not if I've understood your question. Comp/limiters are used to reduce the dynamic range of the signal. Compressors in-particular, in simplistic sense, raise the quiet pasages and reduce the loud passages. This can be useful for singers with either poor mic etiquette (they wander out of the pattern) or with weak vocal support. You can boost their weak parts, but then, when they "get it right" and are both breathing properly AND are on-axis, their suddenly increased signal is constrained to avoid clipping. Doing this without a compressor (and not "riding the faders"...) you might have boosted the fader to catch the faint parts and then gotten blasted (with feedback) when they "got it right".

A limiter can be used alone, to merely cap the extreme output of say, a bass guitar (which often clip in hard-driven passages, but are otherwise not needing support for the soft passages).

Make sense?

What you may be referring to are effects - or signal processors such as reverb, delay, echo etc., which add presence or the perception the singer is in a large public bath somewhere... ;)

Oldmics
04-19-2004, 09:12 AM
Howdy Gang
I was surprised to see this thread revived.Kinda unusual to see a discussion about live sound still kicking.
To Bo,I did not realise that you had asked another question about D.I. preferences.Sorry for not answering sooner.
The Radials are some of the nicest sounding boxs out there.I prefer the passive unit (the JDI).
It is ironic to me that a Jensen transformer from Califorinia is sent to Canada where it is repackaged into the Radial box and then sold in the US (and worldwide),could"nt somebody from the US figure that one out years ago?
My company is invested into the Countryman D.I. s.There are used as wheel chocks on the trucks when they expire due to there nice heavy metal cases.

Now to the current thread about compressers.

The function of a compresser is to reduce the amount of voltage thruout the signal path.This reduction of voltage is done at varying ratios selected by the technician using the compresser.The tech would also specifie the threshold at which the compresser would become active.

Compression ratios are selected for the amount of current allowed to be induced back into the circuit after compression.Ratios such as 2 to 1, 3 to1 ,and 4 to1 are commonly used on vocals to remove the peak voltages.When used in recording applications,removal of these peak voltages constrain the dynamics.This will allow the vocals to fit into the program material and sound louder than if they were not compressed.

One thing to remember is that most compressers are broad band voltage seeking devices.If the compresser picks up a voltage peak that is being generated at 1K,it will begin to reduce all voltages.This means that not only is the frequency of 1K is reduced but so is the rest of the bandwidth.That is why frequency dependent compresssers are so valuable.You can compress the particular frequency that is problamatic and not mess with anything else.

Compressers alone do not raise the levels of program material.
This is a common misconception.

Compressers will reduce the dynamic range.With the dynamic range reduced in the program material a small amount of level can be added to the average program material.This is where the gain stage happens and it is usually only a small amount.This is probably where the misconception of compressers raising the gain levels comes from.
Compression ratios of infinity to 1 are considered limiting.

I think what Bo is searching for is an expander device.

Expanders in conjunction with compressers existed on some early film audio devices that are long forgotten.They also exist on the BSS 901 units of which I reley on.The BSS 901 are a 4 band parametric compresser, limiters with expansion capeabilitys.This allows problamatic frequencys to be compressed and other frequencys to be expanded.These are great tools.
A newcomer into that market is being built by XTA.It is a great sounding device but is limited on the equalisation capacity when compared to the BSS 901.
Ok,I"m done.
Oldmics

boputnam
04-19-2004, 01:42 PM
Originally posted by Oldmics
With the dynamic range reduced in the program material a small amount of level can be added to the average program material. This is where the gain stage happens and it is usually only a small amount. This is probably where the misconception of compressers raising the gain levels comes from.

I think what Bo is searching for is an expander device. Hey, Oldmics...

Glad you re-found this Thread! Keep your mouse pointed here, occaisionally - I'll watch for your tips! :)

Your description on how using a compressor allows effective gain increase is a better explaination than mine. Ha! I would expect no less from a pro... I still don't think Roland was asking about compressors - I thought maybe he was describing FX?? Maybe not...

I've got a few expanders in the rack, and enjoy 'em. No de essers, though... :(

Hey - if you're still here, did you catch my questions a few posts back on gates? Maybe, via pm (again... ;) ) you could help me "tune" the toms mics to stay closed when the snare, kick and hihat related "noise" is overwhelming the open mics? Not asking too much, here :rotfl: just maybe what your side chain parameters are...? If you ever have the time between load-in and load-out... :slink:

pangea
04-20-2004, 02:08 AM
Hi all!

In general I'm no big fan of compressors, especially not by the over use in broadcasting, where much of the dynamics are lost when the music reaches the listeners. :mad:

But other than that I liked the idea of using compressors/expanders as a way to get noise reduction in the seventies and eighties. I still have quite a few DBX encoded records and one or two DBX 222/224's stashed away somewhere in the drawers. I also had the Boom box and the encoder way back then.
Why didn't that catch on BTW? Was it that CD's took over and made them redundant, or was it the slight pumping effects that killed them?

Now I'm looking for something that can be all and do all, like being a crossover, EQ, phase/room correction, compressor/limiter/gain and from what ive come up with thus far, it seems I will have to take a closer look to the Behringer Ultradrive PRO DCX2496.
Does anyone of you, have any experience with this one and who could recommend it, or perhaps something else that I have over looked in that price range?

And again, thanks for being there with all your enormous knowledge and humor. It's such a pleasure reading all your posts. :smthsail:

BR
Roland

johnaec
04-20-2004, 06:54 AM
Now I'm looking for something that can be all and do all, like being a crossover, EQ, phase/room correction, compressor/limiter/gain and from what ive come up with thus far, it seems I will have to take a closer look to the Behringer Ultradrive PRO DCX2496.I purchased a JBL DSC260A on eBay that's supposed to do all this stuff, but haven't been able to try it yet. It will take some learning, though, as the interface is less than intuitive - you have to cycle through all the menus, etc., with buttons on the front panel. I also just picked up a DBX Driverack 260, which has all the same functions plus more, including a built in RTA. I just got it last Friday, so I also haven't used it yet. It appears to be much easier to use than the DSC 260A, since it has buttons to go directly to each function and a graphical display on the front. DBX also has the Driverack PA and Driverack Studio, which are similar to the 260, but with somewhat less functionality, (the 260 can be controlled via computer hookup, and includes PEQ on the outputs, in addition to the inputs). All the DBX models give you the choice of 1/3 octave or PEQ on the inputs.

I hope to spend some time with the DBX this week.

John

pangea
04-20-2004, 08:02 AM
Thanks John for jour suggestions!
I will definitely take a closer look at those.

The Behringer Ultradrive, seems to be very intuitive though, from what I could see in their manual.

After having googled the dbx and JBL, I can see that they seem to be quite a bit pricier over here, the dbx costing twice as much as the Behringer, not to mention the JBL, which cost even twice as much as the dbx.

I will probably wait and see if a used and reasonably priced dbx comes along in the near future, since it has ALL the features I want.

BR
Roland

boputnam
04-20-2004, 08:13 AM
Originally posted by pangea
... the dbx costing twice as much as the Behringer, not to mention the JBL, which cost even twice as much as the dbx. I too am hearing good things on the "Driverack", but have not worked with one, nor am likely too - not my cup of tea.

On cost - don't confuse quality with cost, in this area. Behringer has lately done some surprising reverse-engineering using top-shelf components and is maintaining very low pricing. I understand, however, they spend a great deal of time in courts on Patent chellenges... :eek:

pangea
04-20-2004, 09:10 AM
Originally posted by boputnam
I too am hearing good things on the "Driverack", but have not worked with one, nor am likely too - not my cup of tea.

On cost - don't confuse quality with cost, in this area. Behringer has lately done some surprising reverse-engineering using top-shelf components and is maintaining very low pricing. I understand, however, they spend a great deal of time in courts on Patent chellenges... :eek:

Hi Bo!

What's the snag? Why isn't it your cup of tea? Does the sound deteriorate too much in your opinion?
I thought it wouldn't be all that critical when used only at the low end. On the mids and highs, I still would use a minimalistic passive x-over, I think.

Also, you don't think the difference is that big, between the Behringer and dbx, sound-/quality wise?

They seem to have most functions in common apart from the dbx having RTA as well, which I really could appreciate.

BR
Roland

Ian Mackenzie
05-09-2004, 11:08 AM
Well Dudes,

The Gig at Apple Jacks, La Honda went off very well last night from both artistic and production values.

The Little Wheels Band played superbly and Bo the Harp artisian/FOH engineer was just so Cool, talk about multi skilling..wow.

The new Sprirt desk worked flawlessly, Bo set it up with four independant Foldback mixes, something not that common but having a snake with I think 24 sends and 16 returns kinda makes it happen.

From the sound angle it was NICE, very clean, crisp and dynamic.

The whole crowd loved it, they even danced during the sound check.

Ian



:band: :dancin: :cheers:

boputnam
05-09-2004, 04:58 PM
Originally posted by Ian Mackenzie
...they even danced during the sound check... Then there was the inimitable Macka, lured by the oh-so-sultry barmaid onto the dance floor during the last set. Nice...

Nuff said! :nutz:

Ken Pachkowsky
05-09-2004, 05:06 PM
Then there was the inimitable Macka, lured by the oh-so-sultry barmaid onto the dance floor during the last set. Nice...

Nuff said!


Me thinks NOT!

Lets hear all the sorted details....prolly liked that silly accent!

:D

boputnam
05-24-2004, 07:59 PM
Me thinks they were trying to escape notoriety, but it's the cause of the Forum to track the progress of our intrepid traveller! :yes:

This's Robh, Ian, some greenbacks and pints (fresh water glasses - or GIN!!?? - for show...) - where the heck were we? My ears were burning... Ian's got his work face on - obviously deep in study... :hmm:

Sacked...? You're busted! :rotfl:

boputnam
05-24-2004, 08:02 PM
Me thinks this is a cardboard cutout of the lad - because if that was a real, live babe to his right, he'd be much busier than he poses to be... :shock:

Robh3606
05-24-2004, 08:33 PM
LOL

Hey Bo you busted us. That was in the Typhon Brewery in NYC after a day long pub crawl with the Stereophile Show for halftime entertainment. Yeah that's water. Damn knob farmer!

Rob:)

Ian Mackenzie
05-28-2004, 09:02 PM
You'd be forgiven for thinkng I was crawling up 5th Ave by the look of those jeans, but that did no stop me or the Babs from having a rub. So what is it with these American Gals Bo?

Rob, Just how many pints did we have by the time we got to Times Square? Must have been a dozen at least.

By the way the Sacking was Rob's brilliant idea.

Hey Rob should be show the boys that other shot near the fountain?

Ian

Robh3606
05-28-2004, 09:53 PM
You meen this one

Robh3606
05-28-2004, 09:54 PM
Or this one?? 12 is about right. What a night:D

Rob:)

Ian Mackenzie
05-29-2004, 04:28 AM
Just what was she thinking? Then there is that Bab at the show! And you reckon that fountain was wet.

Ian

boputnam
08-19-2004, 05:54 PM
Hey, Oldmics...

I wondered if you've tried these at FOH? I finally buckled and got a pair, and debuted them last night at the desk.

A pricy but superb option for improving isolation FOH. I could solo more effectively, both individual inputs and any of the eight busses, too, with much better understanding of what was going on. I think it resulted in an improved mix, and thereby recording, as well.

What do you use?

Oldmics
08-19-2004, 08:43 PM
Hey Bo

I have not used the newer version.

I did have an opportunity to use the predecessors (Quiet Comfort) when on a few single engine small plane rides about a year ago.They were cool in the fact that the noise cancelling function did work pretty well.

On the ground before takeoff with no ambient sound being produced I had a sensation of pressure being applied to the eardrum along with white noise hiss.I assume part of the process to reintroduce the sound into the cups.This was an annoying feature to put up with.The audio that I listened to on the flights were mostly dialogue and conversation with only a small amount of music listened to.So I really can not comment about the audio quality produced for music.

While mixing I really do not spend much time in the cans. Just in and out fast, mostly for troubleshooting or to ascertain sounds in key patchs or acoustic guitar tones and of course to listen for open mic situations.

I have a boatload of Sony MDR 7506 headphones.They travel well and are the LOUDEST devices (very hi sensitivity) that I am aware of.Some consoles that I have run across have very low output capabilitys from the headphone out so its wise to have hi-sens cans.

Maybe BOSE is a better product for making you NOT hear sounds than they are at reproducing sound.

(Insert favorite BOSE slam here!!!)


Oldmics

boputnam
08-19-2004, 08:48 PM
Originally posted by Oldmics
While mixing I really do not spend much time in the cans. Just in and out fast, mostly for troubleshooting or to ascertain sounds in key patchs or acoustic guitar tones and of course to listen for open mic situations. Hey...

Me neither - only quick snapshots. That's why these seemed such an improvement. They have a gain setting (lo/hi) and offered a much more clear presentation of the source, than my Sony's do. I was skeptical they could isolate the house, but they worked fine. Lemme know if you ever trial yours FOH - I'd be interested in your observations.

Thanks, Oldmics...

johnaec
08-19-2004, 09:00 PM
On the note of headphones - what do you guys think the best set is in the $100-$150 range? I used to have a set of Koss, (model #?), that I absolutely loved. One thing I really liked about them is that they were single drivers, so no crossover artifacts, etc. I'd like to get a good set again, but haven't listened to any in years...

John

andresohc
08-19-2004, 10:56 PM
I have had a pair of Koss Pro 4AA for over twenty years. They have great sound if you can take how heavy they are. I see they are making them again and can be bought for under $60. Thats a lot of bang for the buck.
I have to figure out what to do about the ear pads which have deflated or dripped out over the years. Any one have any ideas. I cant find any replacement parts, but have read it just had water in it. I thought about using a really fine syringe and injuecting water back into it and trying to seal it up with a small improvised patch.

johnaec
08-20-2004, 06:08 AM
Yep - it was the Pro 4AA that I had. I didn't know they had re-released them - I'll have to look into this. Thanks for the info.

'Anyone else have any other recommendations? If technology has come up with something better, I'm all ears... :hyp:

John

Infredible
08-20-2004, 10:58 AM
I would highly recommend the Grado RS serie.
Not on the cheap side but incredible low and clear bass extention and to die for smooth high end. I had many headphones in the past (read prick neighbors) and the Grado is simply the best.
http://www.gradolabs.com/frameset_main.htm

Fred.

johnaec
09-14-2004, 08:52 AM
I see Bo is using a Soundcraft board, so since he seems happy with it I went ahead and picked up this little JBL version of the Soundcraft Spirit Folio1, (they call it the MusicMix 16, but it's identical to the Soundcraft) - NOS on eBay for $219. I guess you could get them with the Eon systems or something. Hopefully, it'll work pretty good for the little PA my band is using, (4628B each side, etc.). Obviously, nothing near what Bo's using, but at least the same family...

http://mark8.org/users/johnaec/Folio1.jpg

For $219, what's to lose...? :) The guy has a bunch more if anyone's interested.

Edit: 'Didn't realize it was one of the forum regulars selling these. Thanks!

John

boputnam
09-14-2004, 04:04 PM
Originally posted by johnaec
Obviously, nothing near what Bo's using, but at least the same family... Am I'm lusting for a SeriesTwo... But we're nowhere near what Oldmics lives with. :(

Looks sweet, John! If it's got the Ultra mic preamps, that's a wonderful value. So, 8 mono, 2 stereo, 3 Aux sends? Tell about the EQ section...?

johnaec
09-14-2004, 06:00 PM
Originally posted by boputnam
If it's got the Ultra mic preamps, that's a wonderful value. So, 8 mono, 2 stereo, 3 Aux sends? Tell about the EQ section...? Well, it won't get here for a few days, so I haven't been able to play with it yet, but each channel has 3-band EQ with parametric frequency for the mids, plus a low-cut button and L-R pan for each channel, plus some other stuff. It does have the "UltraMic" preamps, and also 48V phantom supply. The manual is here (http://www.jblpro.com/pages/mi/mi_pdf/EON15_G2_System.pdf) , (I haven't really gone through it yet...). 'Still beats anything else I've seen at that price...here's the eBay link. (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=3748407113&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT)

John

Oldmics
09-14-2004, 10:01 PM
Hi johnaec

Just want to make a comment about your statement regarding the EQ section on your new console,

" but each channel has 3-band EQ with parametric frequency for the mids, "


Parametric frequency equalisation is a three way function consisting of a selectable frequency point,amplitude adjustment of selected frequency and bell curve shape of selected frequency.


The frequency system used on the mid range section on your new console uses two of those features.Frequency point selection and amplitude adjustment.This equalisation is referred to as a sweep center section.

Definately better than using a fixed point EQ but not quite as sophisticated as parametric.


Good choice for a new desk!!

Oldmics

scott fitlin
09-14-2004, 10:34 PM
have you ever used the Massenburg GML-8200? If you have, what did you think of it? I have an opportunity to buy a used one, great condition, at a good price!

johnaec
09-15-2004, 05:38 AM
Originally posted by Oldmics
The frequency system used on the mid range section on your new console uses two of those features. Frequency point selection and amplitude adjustment. This equalisation is referred to as a sweep center section.Yeah - I was completely aware of the limited parametric functionality of the mids control but struggled for the correct term - "sweep". Thanks for clearing that up. I do have a couple full parametrics here as outboard equipment, that do have the Q or "bell" adjustments.

John

boputnam
09-15-2004, 08:38 AM
Oh I see - it's part of the integrated EON system.

At least you didn't get the "mains"... :duck:

Oldmics
09-15-2004, 09:32 AM
Hi Scott

I have not had the luxury of this experience.

I think of these tools as mostly studio oriented equipment,although I did see one being used live by a studio engineer on one occasion.I could not attest to its sonic embellishments during its use at this particular show.

If you have a use for it and its a great deal-buy it!!!!!!



eBay can always use more stuff

Oldmics