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jimd
12-14-2007, 09:25 AM
I must say that I have never been a big fan of 18" woofers. they have always sounded tubby to me. Perhaps some of you think differently, what is yor take on this? JIM

mikebake
12-14-2007, 09:47 AM
I think differently.
You need to listen to something like a properly implemented JBL 2245. I'm assuming you haven't.

jimd
12-14-2007, 10:02 AM
Actually, I have heard the 2445, but like you said, it might not have been inplemented properly. In your opinion (s) what is the best enclosure for the unit? Is ther not another JBL that some people like? JIM

scott fitlin
12-14-2007, 10:04 AM
If properly set up, you shouldnt really hear the subwoofer, just feel it, your main full range speakers provide the good audible bass.

For sure, its tricky to get it right. This is where gain in my crossovers comes into play. My 3 way full range is the main sound you hear, the subs and super tweeters are augmentation. My full range is actually running hotter than subs and super tweets.

Rusnzha
12-14-2007, 02:35 PM
2241H in 12 cubic foot ported box lined with acoustistuff, sitting on spikes! Bass from this is very pleasing.

Zilch
12-14-2007, 03:36 PM
http://www.lansingheritage.org/html/jbl/reference/technical/1983-subs.htm

See also:

http://www.jblpro.com/pub/cinema/4645c.pdf

2242H in 8 cuft.

Use "Search" to find the details elsewhere in these forums.... :yes:

johnaec
12-14-2007, 04:51 PM
I'd still like to check out JBL's 2269H - quote:

"The new Ultra Long Excursion 18” transducer features dual neodymium magnets, JBL’s exclusive Vented Gap Cooling™, and robust suspension elements for high excursion and extra long life. The new woofer is capable of a peak-to-peak maximum excursion of 89 mm (3.5”)."

With differential drive and that kind of excursion capability, I imagine cone control at more normal listening levels must be pretty good.

John

boputnam
12-14-2007, 07:53 PM
I think differently.
You need to listen to something like a properly implemented JBL 2245. I'm assuming you haven't.Yea, or the 2242H in a higher-powered application. Done right, subs do it right... :)

Dave Zan
01-10-2008, 09:29 PM
Yea, or the 2242H in a higher-powered application. Done right, subs do it right... :)

I have a theory that the 2245 is better for home use.
The 2242 is a latter development and presumably a better pro driver - more robust.
But the optimization for robustness has sacrificed some of the qualities of the 2245. That's OK in pro use where they are typically used in multiples and they couple to restore the lost bass - but the 2245 looks better to me if there are only 1 or 2. I hope to find out soon as I expect a pair in a few weeks - finally !
At the risk of heresy the Aura NRT18 is the only speaker I know that specs even better. Haven't heard one yet.

Dave Zan

KCCT82
01-11-2008, 09:47 AM
At the risk of heresy the Aura NRT18 is the only speaker I know that specs even better


Hello all, been learning here for a couple of years, just registered though... :D

anyway, what do you think of the Audio Pulse LMS Ultra 18"? Spec looks pretty darn good, it weighs 80lbs :blink:

pangea
01-22-2008, 01:23 PM
First of all, this is a forum where the discussions are about JBL, Urei and to some extent Altec speakers/drivers.

That said, I would like to add the W15GTi to the list of very capable subwoofers. I know they're coming from the automotive section, but that didn't discurridge me from trying it and boy do they rock. :bouncy:

AWESOME is the word!!!

BR
Roland

PS: Sorry, it seems I was too fast on the trigger, since the thread was about 18" drivers, but if only the performance counts, the W15GTi fits in just perfect. DS.

mikebake
01-22-2008, 05:11 PM
I have a theory that the 2245 is better for home use.
The 2242 is a latter development and presumably a better pro driver - more robust.
But the optimization for robustness has sacrificed some of the qualities of the 2245. That's OK in pro use where they are typically used in multiples and they couple to restore the lost bass - but the 2245 looks better to me if there are only 1 or 2. I hope to find out soon as I expect a pair in a few weeks - finally !

Dave Zan
Apparently some truth to that. The 2242H is "from another planet" but for home use, the 2245H may be the better sounding driver. I have heard them both but not in the same application. Either one is excellent, but since you have 2245's coming, you're set, in my book. They do need cabinet real estate, and benefit from a larger listening room.

toddalin
01-22-2008, 05:38 PM
First of all, this is a forum where the discussions are about JBL, Urei and to some extent Altec speakers/drivers.

That said, I would like to add the W15GTi to the list of very capable subwoofers. I know they're coming from the automotive section, but that didn't discurridge me from trying it and boy do they rock. :bouncy:

AWESOME is the word!!!

BR
Roland

PS: Sorry, it seems I was too fast on the trigger, since the thread was about 18" drivers, but if only the performance counts, the W15GTi fits in just perfect. DS.

I hear you there!!! Mine kicks butt over the 2235 mounted in the same cabinet configuration (4 cu ft each) and I've presented the data here in the past to confirm it. Would not suprise me in the least if it were to kick butt over a 2245. :p

http://www.largescaleonline.com/eimages/lsolpics/Team_Member_Pics/toddalin/center-2235-w15gti.jpg

But they are power hungry! No problem here.

http://www.largescaleonline.com/eimages/lsolpics/Team_Member_Pics/toddalin/Crown_Face.jpg

http://www.largescaleonline.com/eimages/lsolpics/Team_Member_Pics/toddalin/Crown_Back.jpg

And, they need not be limited to subs either. They go out past 1K Hz fairly flat. (Again, I posted these data in the past.)

In fact, I think highly enough of them and their capabilities that I'm using the 10s with 2425s to replace my four surround speakers.

http://www.largescaleonline.com/eimages/lsolpics/Team_Member_Pics/toddalin/index_011.jpg

http://www.largescaleonline.com/eimages/lsolpics/Team_Member_Pics/toddalin/index_009.jpg

BTW, the surround W10GTI with 2425J on P.Audio PH-230 horns give up 11 dB to the 2235/LE175/HL91/2402 in L200 cabinets. I hope my surround channels don't run out of steam (170 watts RMS each). Expect the 15" to give up about 9 dB.

mikebake
01-22-2008, 05:49 PM
I hear you there!!! Mine kicks butt over the 2235 mounted in the same cabinet configuration (4 cu ft each) and I've presented the data here in the past to confirm it. Would not suprise me in the least if it were to kick butt over a 2245. :p

And, they need not be limited to subs either. They go out past 1K Hz fairly flat. (Again, I posted these data in the past.)


It would not surprise me if they are decent, but measured freq. response and sound quality are not the same thing............
Two drivers obviously can have very similar graphs and sound drastically different.............

toddalin
01-22-2008, 06:00 PM
It would not surprise me if they are decent, but measured freq. response and sound quality are not the same thing............
Two drivers obviously can have very similar graphs and sound drastically different.............

OK, for the past 2-3 weeks we have been listening to the "mini-monitor" on the left channel and the L200 cabinet on the right.

I first made each as flat as I could with the crossover controls using the Behringer 61 band analyzer, then let the Yamaha RX-Z9 auto-equalize each to the room, and set its volume level. There ain't all that much difference in sound, though the 2402s have a little more top end (mostly above what I can hear).

The other night I asked my wife if she could hear a diference in the two speakers. She didn't even realize the mini-monitor had been playing all that time and said she couldn't.

I said that was a good thing because the surrounds will sound similar to the mains (certainly not exactly the same though.)

BTW, the mini-monitors are smoother than the mains, especially in the lower midrange and through the crossover areas. ;)

mikebake
01-22-2008, 06:28 PM
There ain't all that much difference in sound, though the 2402s have a little more top end (mostly above what I can hear).

BTW, the mini-monitors are smoother than the mains, especially in the lower midrange and through the crossover areas. ;)
Which is it?

They can't be smoother; they show the same equalized response/volume as the L200. Seems to make the point.................
Also, you're wife did not notice (probably not trying to) but you can tell which is which. The mini is smoother.

toddalin
01-23-2008, 09:52 AM
Which is it?

They can't be smoother; they show the same equalized response/volume as the L200. Seems to make the point.................
Also, you're wife did not notice (probably not trying to) but you can tell which is which. The mini is smoother.

Sure they can be smoother! When the Yamaha finishes doing its auto-eq, it displays the results. The corrections made to the mini-monitors are not as severe (especailly in the noted areas) as the corrections that the Yamaha makes to the L200 cabinets.

Furthermore, all eq is with limitations and the Yamaha can only do so much with what it has to work with. The smoother the speaker, the less it has to do and the better the resultant corrections.

Obviously, you can't really know of which you speak without actually hearing the two speakers, so I would suggest that you pony up $1K and build yourself a pair so you can see (hear) these for yourself. ;)

mikebake
01-23-2008, 10:19 AM
.

Obviously, you can't really know of which you speak without actually hearing the two speakers, so I would suggest that you pony up $1K and build yourself a pair so you can see (hear) these for yourself. ;)
I'll go with the pros, who tell me theres a better way to spend the grand.....................;)