JBL Blue - redux

[boputnam]

OK, sports fans...

After investing a total of 4-hours (and 4-tickets to an upcoming show of my Little Wheels Band...), it is with great pleasure I bring you...

JBL BLUE !!

Using Degussa "COLORTREND" pigments (should be readily available):

Neutral Base: 1 qt of Interior Latex Eggshell Enamel - "Bright Life" (or "Platinum") brand Martin Senour Paints

B 36
E 2Y24
F 1/2
KX 44
V 4

We made two qt's, to test (I am not going down that road again...) and it is a fantastic match. We used the front of the 4301B's as a palette, and other than the splatter texture, we nailed it.

That is my last useful task. Good bye, all... :smthsail:

[boputnam]

Hey - would somebody do me a favour? If you have a pair of studio monitors with the sought-after blue baffle, would you please go get a qt of this brew made, and see if it matches in your ZipCODE?

I'd gladly fund the exercise. There is nothing so important as objective tests...

[JuniorJBL]

I will be getting my 4301b's So I can try then. About march 17 or 18 ok?
Shane:D

[boputnam]

Originally posted by JuniorJBL
I will be getting my 4301b's... You - the SUB1500 Guru getting 4301B's!!?? :nutz:

Please don't frighten the little things by getting them too close to the SUB1500's. :eek: But, I'll be anxious to know the match - mine were both good, this time. And, Shane, let us know how you like the 4301B's, if this is your first trial of those.

[JuniorJBL]

I have had these for 23 years. They have been in SLC for 10 years and are in need of surrounds. But they still sound GREAT. These were my first REAL speaker. I am the original owner!
I think for thier time one of the best sounding 2 ways ever!
Shane:D

[boputnam]

Hellsbells... Cool! :coolness:

Are you going to resurround them, yourself? Those frames are not my favorite to work on - but the results are worth it. Lemme know if you need any help...

[JuniorJBL]

Yes

I did my LE14H-1's myself which I found a little tough but once its done... HA!

Also I did do them on the back of the cone NOT THE FRONT like some I have seen. I made a jig to hold the speaker by the edge of the mounting holes and WALA! 2 days later when the glue was dry BOOM BOOM! I have pretty much restored my 250's from the ground up. What I have not found is one of the foam pieces to the 108/2118 edge. Also I am in the process of changing them to black lacquer finish. But here in denver the temperature verys to much this time of year....
I do have pics and I plan on posting them this spring so as to have a sort of DIY 250 thread. It will encompass moving to a 250ti as well w/crossover and custom level settings for hf/uhf. I also will show the new brace (as per greg timbers) in the old 250 cab.

I found the speakers in a pawn shop for $950.00. Most of the crossover was blown 1 044-1 blown and LE14's surrounds mostly gone.here is a pic of the new crossover.

[boputnam]

Originally posted by JuniorJBL
...I did do them on the back of the cone NOT THE FRONT like some I have seen. Not to worry - there are two versions of the LE14(A) - one was factory with the surround glued to the front edge of the cone. When I redo them, I just do 'em like I found 'em.

Nice looking crossover. Must be pretty special - get's its own chair and everything... How does it differ from factory (if at all...)?

[JuniorJBL]

Originally posted by boputnam
How does it differ from factory (if at all...)?

Most values were not available to me so there are more sand cast resitors and most of the others are Eagle metal film. A little higher end poly caps 1 hovland on the UHF and a larger guage coil on the lows and of course new wire (OFC Mogami)!!:D
It was a very fun project and when I was done WOW. They came alive. I did not change crossover points!!
I have wanted a pair of these since well 1980. My friend and I would go to listen to them almost every weekend and then come home and tear it up with the 4301's we were using a bose 1801 for power (remember the meters?). That was a big amp at the time.
Ah the good old days.....
Shane:D

[boputnam]

Originally posted by boputnam
Using Degussa "COLORTREND" pigments (should be readily available):

Neutral Base: 1 qt of Interior Latex Eggshell Enamel - "Bright Life" (or "Platinum") brand Martin Senour Paints

B 36
E 2Y24
F 1/2
KX 44
V 4
To a query from another Thread - HansPeter, the codes are Degussa codes on the pigment cans.

The letters relate to colour. I believe B = black, E = Blue, etc.

The numbers are quantities of each pigment, in fractions (1/48th) of fluid ounces.

"B 36" = 36/48 of Lamp Black
"E 2Y24" = 2 ounces ("Y") + 24/48 of Phthalo Blue
"F 1/2" = 1/2 of 1/48 (a teeny bit) of Red Oxide
"KX 44" = 44/48 of Titanium White
"V 4" = 4/48 of Magenta

I have no clue why 48th's, but there it is.

[boputnam]

Here's the pigment cans...

[boputnam]

Close-up of the rear label...

[boputnam]

The mystical pigment machine...

[boputnam]

And, the base...

[Hofmannhp]

Originally posted by boputnam
....The numbers are quantities of each pigment, in fractions (1/48th) of fluid ounces.
.....

Hi Bo,

thanks a lot for your help for the colors. I will try to find out how it can work to mix the "Bo-JBL blue" based on European available colors.

In the meantime I will count the pigments :banghead:
Maybe I'm ready in 10 years:rotfl: First I go to get a microscope.

HP

[John]

Are those listed amounts of pigment for one QT. or two QT.s final product.???:confused:

[boputnam]

Sorry John, I thought that was clear:


Originally posted by boputnam
Neutral Base: 1 qt of Interior Latex Eggshell Enamel - "Bright Life" (or "Platinum") brand Martin Senour Paints.My abbreviations may be presumptive.

qt = US Quart (one, uno, een, un, ein, ένας, um, واحد, etc).

We sure don't want baby blue!!

[John]

OK I got it. By the way even thought canada is on the metric system when it comes to paint it is all in U.S. measurements.
I have a buddy that is in the painting bussiness and i think he told me once that most of the paint codes are common to all manufacturers of pigments but i will find out. Althought i have nothing to compare it to i will never the less get a Qt. mixed up and see whats up. I was going to wood veneer the front of my 4350 clones but hey maybe if i fall in love with JBL Blue i might go for it. By the way i have still to find some construction and porting specs for the 4350-55 clones. Have spoke to a half dozen members that claim they have a pair in there collection and have got promises of them getting back to me, but am still waiting???:(

[boputnam]

There is a problem with this blue. Do not use.

It lacks some tweaking of white that was added at the last, which the Paint Guy omitted from the recipe. I have, over the past 5-sessions with this guy, determined he lacks a bit of the attention to extreme detail this match requires. Only the first tin of this was good - follow-on batches revealed the error.

I apologize for the mistake - I should have caught it in some QA/QC testing. Quite embarrasing... :o

I will try and go remedy this particular formula next week - when more base is in-stock - but for now, defer using this formula.

:banghead:

[Ian Mackenzie]

At risk of being a serious pain in the arse can you re state the correct fomulae.

I'm confused.

Ian

[boputnam]

Not at all - at least in this one case... :rotfl:

The painter that got it done, was a known alcoholic, but he assured me he was taking proper notes. Problem was, he nearly titrated each pigment addition over the course of an hour each time, and kept getting distracted. He only once got the notations correct, below. He has since been separated from his job... :(

Here's the corrected formula:

Sherwin Williams pigments and using a Martin Senour "Bright Life" Latex Eggshell Enamel, Neutral Base (Qt.):

Black: 22/32
Blue: 1 oz + 16/32
Violet: 16/32
Red Oxide: 1/64
White: 21/32

I have not tried to convert this to metric - the problem is, you don't know the actual volume in the starter base Qt. That is, it is somewhat less than a Qt to allow for the addition of pigments. Dunno what that volume is, exactly, and not knowing it will confuse your dilution(s)...

[Ian Mackenzie]

I realise it is not the purist approach but next opportunity might you please send in the post a swatch on cardboard of the right stuff.

For what I am doing it will be more than adequate.

regards

Ian

[pentictonklaus]

Hello you folks in Europe. Try a good local automotive paint shop, they should be able to decipher the paint code. By the way my bathroom is a simple L1.
( off white ). Tell them you want to got a Caddi from Elvis, that should get them going. Don't forget to have a JBL system installed first.

[R Beardsley]

Latex? Is there a reason you are not using a catalized finish other than the obvious health hazard? (without proper equipment - respirator, etc.) Maybe I am thinking about the "rubbery" stuff I used to get 30 years ago and stuck with alkyd enamel ever since.

[Hofmannhp]

Hello you folks in Europe. Try a good local automotive paint shop, they should be able to decipher the paint code.

Hi Klaus,

the folks in Europe can simply buy a european standard color with the no. RAL 5007. It's very near (99%) the real color. But also the real color differs after some years using the speakers without grille.
(The "Bo" blue is our standard color here):D

HP

[Ian Mackenzie]

Hi Klaus,

the folks in Europe can simply buy a european standard color with the no. RAL 5007. It's very near (99%) the real color. But also the real color differs after some years using the speakers without grille.
(The "Bo" blue is our standard color here):D

HP

Hi Klaus,

After some hunting down I was able to obtain the RAL 5007 forumulae from a Dulux Trade Depot here at home.

Below is the comparison of cans open and lid (wet) to compare Bo's previous batch and the RAL 5005 Brilliant Blue. From what Bo was saying the difference in the tint could be the touch of white oxide missing from this batch.

What was interesting was there system via the online data base. The Dulux guy simply searched their global data base, found RAL 5007 and then hit the decode forumula key. The machine then squirted the precise quantities including a tiny little drop of Red Oxide into the base..no human error here!

At any rate provided all your JBL's are painted with the same batch I don't suppose it really matters.

Ian

[JuniorJBL]

I am looking to get that paint for the 4301b's (finally)!!




Here's the corrected formula:





Sherwin Williams pigments and using a Martin Senour "Bright Life" Latex Eggshell Enamel, Neutral Base (Qt.):
Black: 22/32


Blue: 1 oz + 16/32
Violet: 16/32
Red Oxide: 1/64
White: 21/32


I have not tried to convert this to metric - the problem is, you don't know the actual volume in the starter base Qt. That is, it is somewhat less than a Qt to allow for the addition of pigments. Dunno what that volume is, exactly, and not knowing it will confuse your dilution(s)...

[Ian Mackenzie]

Special thanks to Bo for mailing me a painted wood sample.

I went you my paint shop a got a mix/match done today.

The resulting formulae using Wattle color coding was B38 1/4, E/Y23 1/2, V4, KX 30 1/2 (I m not sure about the last fraction as it was scribbled on the can lid)

It looks about right...even wet but this particular color does vary according to light conditions.

To others I tried black and various other colors, black was too dark for my room.

JBL blue has won the approval of all visitors.

Ian

[hapy._.face]

THANKS IAN/BO!!! I couldn't find this anywhere. Again, thanks!!

[frank23]

Hi Ian,

A little confused, as I read it you have now tried 4 different blue samples? A quick comparison with a picture of my once 4333B's looks like RAL5007 might be the best bet?

What do you consider the best match rated 1,2,3,4?

I am thinking of painting my 2235 cabinet baffle JBL blue as a JBL tribute.

thanks, Frank

[Hofmannhp]

Hi Ian,

A little confused, as I read it you have now tried 4 different blue samples? A quick comparison with a picture of my once 4333B's looks like RAL5007 might be the best bet?

What do you consider the best match rated 1,2,3,4?

I am thinking of painting my 2235 cabinet baffle JBL blue as a JBL tribute.

thanks, Frank

Hi Frank23,

that's also what my test result was. But take a look to Ian's post no. 26.
His test shows a relative big difference.
I tried it with Bo's Blue mix and RAL 5007 and never had this difference.
Maybe that Aussie- RAL is different :banghead: (not to talk about how they wrote "Deutsches Institute" on the can)

HP

[frank23]

I found this, I know monitor colors are not real, so you should be comparing with color charts, but is gives a nice overview:

http://www.themeter.net/ral_e.htm

[glen]

Found JBL blue in a Yahoo japan auction:

http://page14.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/s17745543

10 @ it is JBL/4343/4344/custom-made designated baffle color. アレスコ/Kansai Paint (Inc.) it is something which the feature is done. Of course, it is, the custom-made item "cellulose nitrate lacquer - the enamel" is. 1 L can entering (brand-new not yet opening) is. Please melt with the second kind organic solvent. The original with the same completion in case of paint "foundation processing doing," please be sure to use. Water similar モノオ - you happen to see with クション, but "our professional materials are different. Rice cake remaining overnight price it is high, is, but the one where the value understands please uses. As for dispatch, as for Kyushu it is Fukuoka city. We expect your bid from heart. It becomes same successful bid. HP smell of this corporation please be "http: //www.auduo-1.com "is. The "Fukuoka prefecture public peace commission approved proper antique commercial law person" is. The "tax obligation person" is in reason. Separate 5% consumer tax being added and being approved "with store code. In case of cancellation 3% of successful bid commission you bear. . The "Fukuoka prefecture public peace commission approved proper antique commercial law person" is. The "tax obligation person" is in reason. Separate 5% consumer tax being added and being approved "with store code. In case of cancellation 3% of successful bid commission you bear.

http://bag01pr000.ac.yahoo.co.jp/users/5/7/5/0/apkame2-imgbatch_1142256491/369x460-2006021300001-4.jpg http://bag01pr000.ac.yahoo.co.jp/users/5/7/5/0/apkame2-imgbatch_1142256491/600x450-2006021300002-4.jpg

[lfh]

By chance I just came across one such auction - grabbed the pic for future reference:

[lfh]

What about 4331-gray:

[LowPhreak]

Found this old thread and wanted to resurrect it. Who here has some mixed batches of this blue paint for sale?

Oh wait...that would be too easy!