Lansing Salon Iconic / 901B

[peahix]

hello

i just acquired a lansing salon iconic speaker in great condition, with its original slip cover. it has a 901b driver (serial 111), which i can't seem to find mentioned anywhere on this site or on the net. obviously it's related to the 801b. does anyone have any information about this?

thanks!
pea

[rs237]

pic´s please.

[Steve Schell]

Peahix, you have a very rare speaker, for several reasons. The Lansing Iconics are extremely rare these days as only perhaps 1,500 or so were built in the various forms. Few have survived, and fewer still intact in their original forms.

The Salon was a special furniture case model built in small numbers relative to the utility version. In ten years of collecting Lansing gear I have seen exactly two Salons in person, one early style (in the JBL collection) and one later style (short cabinet, vertical dowel grille bars) which is likely what you have.

The 901b driver is the permanent magnet equivalent of the 801b field coil driver. It is slightly larger in diameter than the 801b, and the outer pot structure is a cast Alnico ring magnet. This differs from the later 802 driver, which used an internal magnet. The permanent magnet components of the Iconic became available about 1940, and were made until the demise of the Iconic about 1945. I have seen permanent magnet Iconic drivers labeled as both Lansing (metal nameplate) and Altec Lansing (decal). The permanent magnet Iconic woofer is the 1565; I have seen these in both cast frame and stamped frame versions.

I'll second rs237's request for some pictures. If you include close ups of the nameplates or decals on the drivers I can probably nail down the date of manufacture to within a year or so. In any event, you have a very rare, very fine, very valuable speaker. Don't let anyone talk you out of it, including me!

The only literature we have up on the site that covers the permanent magnet Iconics is located here:

http://www.lansingheritage.org/html/altec/catalogs/1943.htm

[peahix]

thanks for the information! as requested, here's a few quick pics. i haven't opened the cabinet yet. the qc dates on the tags indicate summer of 1940. oh, and as far as i can tell, it's been stored for years and years with the slip cover on, so apart from a few minor chips off the finish here and there, it's in really nice condition.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1182/1426729041_019c1eb71f_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1416/1426728823_e0e143e707_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1087/1426729171_768ccd6d49_o.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1212/1427606876_38c4f769be_o.jpg

[spkrman57]

Not many that old in that great of shape!!!

Ron

[peahix]

oh, btw, i realize it's hard to see it in my photo, but the qc tag indicates the woofer to be a 1518, serial 441.

[hjames]

Gosh, its just gorgeous! So much easier to appreciate the how that classic speaker looks in your pictures than it did in this thread of Les Paul's garage/Studio (http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=17490&highlight=Iconic)

Thanks for taking the time to take these nice pictures and posting them here for us.

[rs237]

Thanks for the pictures. Very beautiful loudspeaker.

regards

juergen

[Steve Schell]

Wow, what a beauty. It is fortunate that it has survived in such fine condition. Maybe one thing that helped is that, being permanent magnet, it didn't have to survive through several decades of people thinking that it was nearly worthless, as was the fate of the field coil models.

I've never seen a 1518 woofer, though it is listed in that 1943 catalog. Now we can add one more reason for the rarity of your speaker.

Here is a picture of the Salon I saw several years ago. Tags indicated that it had been built in June 1942. It is field coil, and was in good working condition when I saw it. The enclosure reveals that it has had a harder life than your almost pristine example.

[peahix]

i think the main thing that helped this speaker survive was the habits of its previous owner. this came from the estate of a guy who worked for bell & howell, western electric, and some other companies during the golden era. his relatives were liquidating the house and wanted stuff gone FAST. let's just say this is not the only thing i scored at that estate sale! :) anyway, he obviously had acquired lots of items through his business that he did not personally have use for himself, and so there were a surprising amount of things new-in-box, or maybe he pulled it out once to inspect it, and then put it away, never touching it again. this speaker appears to have enjoyed such a fate- it looks as if it were never hooked up.

although it feels really silly for me to complain about items that someone else grabbed (i got most of the stuff, but missed a couple things), let's just say that i missed the new-in-box western electric 728B (for $20) and the new-in-box pair of jbl minigons ($20 for the pair)... :banghead: :)

btw, and i hope this is not off-topic, but among many mics i bought from this estate, there's one tube condenser with no markings on it at all, and i've tried in vain via google image search to identify it. all i can find are mics of a similar design, nothing exaclty like this one. i THINK it may be a western electric, given the overall context in which it was found. there was no power supply or anything else with it. here's a couple pics, if anyone has any ideas. it has a couple of rca 230 tubes in it.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1422/1424850515_fd3b6b625e.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1059/1425734954_e01100642c.jpg

[speakerdave]

If someone could post a straight-on photo of the front so we could see the proportions, that would be much appreciated.

David

[mrid88in]

'' this came from the estate of a guy who worked for bell & howell, western electric, ............. but missed a couple things), let's just say that i missed the new-in-box western electric 728B (for $20) and the new-in-box pair of jbl minigons ($20 for the pair)... "

Hi
The 728B is on Ebay.That was pretty fast.
I have no connection with the auction.
Regards
Rajiv

[mrid88in]

Hi
Sorry forgot to post the link.
Regards
Rajiv

ORIG GRAYBAR BOX~ESTATE OF BELL & HOWELL REP~BUY IT NOWItem number: 230174873194

[peahix]

yeah, and i'm the guy he refers to who got there earlier! ;)

[peahix]

here's a few more pics for those interested...

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1358/1432463564_9e65d06e17.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1372/1432463326_7b1aa9fc5f.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1043/1431586617_f7b2db0e74.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1419/1431586533_4d4fcc0005.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1359/1431586359_e9cd604471.jpg

[Steve Schell]

Holy cow, that's amazing. Never seen that woofer before. The Altec 1943 catalog indicates that the 1518 has a 17lb. ring type Alnico magnet, and has the characteristics of the 415 theatre woofer. So this was Lansing's no holds barred assault on a permanent magnet woofer that would have comparable performance to his powerful field coil units. At that point in time the energy density of available magnet materials was quite low, so a p.m. driver with comparable flux density to a heavy duty field coil speaker had to have an enormous magnet structure. The bulging magnet on the 1518 reminds me of the huge motors on the Cinaudagraph "Magic Magnet" speakers of the late 1930s.

Very nice pictures BTW... thanks.

[Earl K]

Absolutely Gorgeous .

- Stunning grill cloth, with a "Theatrical Curtain" motif . It has a "satin-like" sheen .

peahix,
( Since your pics are hosted offsite , I hope you'll understand that some of us wish you would upload them here, for the sake of archiving )

- What are the internal dimensions of the woofer section ? ( & the 2 port dimensions ) ?


Steve,

Did Altec morph these 415 ( 1518 ) variants into the 803 ( 416 ) sort of woofer, meant for Bass Reflex ?

:)

[peahix]

and i felt every pound of that magnet whilst wrestling this thing into and out of my car!! :)

[peahix]

i'd be happy to upload the pics here, not sure how to do that though...? i've consulted this site for a long time, but have never registered/posted before. also, from the same estate i got some altec/jbl things that may be of interest, ie some paper items and also a handful of 1962-era 8"x10" b&w prints of official in-house photos of various components from that era. my scanner's on the fritz right now, but i can upload those when i get that sorted out.

altec items i bought from the same estate include:

-m20 lipstik mic set (an early one, in box, almost like new)
-m11 mic set (circa 1952, in box, almost like new)
-639a mic (in box, looks unused)
-601a speaker (never removed from its original packaging)

pea

[Earl K]

btw, and i hope this is not off-topic, but among many mics i bought from this estate, there's one tube condenser with no markings on it at all, and i've tried in vain via google image search to identify it. all i can find are mics of a similar design, nothing exaclty like this one. i THINK it may be a western electric, given the overall context in which it was found. there was no power supply or anything else with it. here's a couple pics, if anyone has any ideas. it has a couple of rca 230 tubes in it.

- Might be a W.E. condensor / though it also resembles the Westinghouse model 47A ( not really my area of expertise ) .

<> Earl
- I've rotated the pic of your mic, for others to peruse .

[Steve Schell]

Earl, during the 1940-1945 period there were (as it turns out) two basic 15" permanent magnet motors. The 1565 type used the field coil U type yoke, and used a thick rod of p.m. material as the center pole. Bob Stephens built his first p.m. woofers the same way.

Now we know there was this maximum efficiency 1518 series with the enormous motor. It likely used soft iron front plate, back plate and center pole, all sized to accomodate this thick cross section outer ring magnet. That magnet looks very much like the Cinaudagraph magnets. Perhaps Jim Lansing sourced this magnet from them or their supplier and built the rest of the driver himself.

[peahix]

concerning the mic, i'm pretty sure, now that i've re-assembled it and had some other correspondence, that it's a one-off. possibly a w.e. proto? maybe a homebrew, but since the guy was a sales rep for w.e., it would seem more likely that it's a proto. anyway, when i put it back together, it became apparent that the screw holes only aligned properly in one position, a clue that it's a one-off.

[speakerdave]

The new photos are very helpful. Thank you so much.

David

[RKLee]

peahix (http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/member.php?u=8836): Did you score 1 or 2 of these puppies? Man your speaker belongs in a museum.

[peahix]

hi, unfortunately there was only one of these, but i got lots of other goodies at the same estate sale.

[RKLee]

peahix (http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/member.php?u=8836): Would make sense, back then everything was monaural.



.
.
Why does the above brochure lower left corner say, "Cinaudagraph speakers are sold with or without transformers?"What is the purpose of the transformer?

[hjames]

peahix (http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/member.php?u=8836): Would make sense, back then everything was monaural.

What is the purpose of the transformer?

This is pretty early sound design stuff - the transformer was used to "match" the speaker to the impedence of your amplifier. Depending on your tubes used in your amplifier, you might have need for different values to match the amp to your speaker.

[Woofer]

I know it's been a while since this thread was last active, but did anyone or does anyone still have the pics originally posted here please? (all the links are deceased.)
There's a possibility that a PAIR of these may have surfaced, and I'd like to get a better idea of what these are all about and help to guarantee their authenticity.
Anyone? Please? :blink:

[Steve Schell]

Woofer I have attached all the pictures I have of the speaker in question. I can try to answer any question you have, especially if accompanied by pics of the speakers of which you have knowledge. We celebrate the surfacing of any of these rarities!

[Steve Schell]

Woofer there was also an early version of the "Salon" furniture cabinet version of the Lansing Iconic, circa approximately 1937- 1938, as seen in this bulletin page:

http://www.lansingheritage.org/images/lmco/bulletins/4d.jpg

[Woofer]

Woofer I have attached all the pictures I have from the speaker in question. I can try to answer any question you have, especially if accompanied by pics of the speakers of which you have knowledge. We celebrate the surfacing of any of these rarities!

Thank you most heaps Steve. :D
Trying to arrange pics, but may be a while yet. :o:
Believe me, when I can get the pics organised, they'll get posted here.
As you'd know, can't rush this sort of thing. :(


Woofer there was also an early version of the "Salon" furniture cabinet version of the Lansing Iconic, circa approximately 1937- 1938, as seen in this bulletin page:

Yep, saw that one... ;)

G.

[theophile]

I get goosebumps looking at those photos.Makes me realise what a heritage my Valencias have.

[Robh3606]

I dropped the auction pictures for that speaker into an album so we wouldn't loose them.

http://www.audioheritage.org/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=527

Rob:)