L65 Jubal question.

[timc]

Hi.

Just wondering if i could replace the LE5-5 in this speaker with a newer LE5 driver, say like: http://cgi.ebay.com/JBL-1-PAIR-LE5-12-MID-RANGE-SPEAKERS-FOR-L112-CABINET_W0QQitemZ180157498068QQihZ008QQcategoryZ50 597QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Best regards Tim

[Fangio]

replacement recommendation is LE5-11.

L65 Jubal (http://manuals.harman.com/JBL/HOM/Technical%20Sheet/L65%20Jubal%20ts.pdf)
L65A Jubal (http://manuals.harman.com/JBL/HOM/Technical%20Sheet/L65A%20Jubal%20ts.pdf)
L65B (http://manuals.harman.com/JBL/HOM/Technical%20Sheet/L65B%20ts.pdf)

[timc]

Thanks :)

Do you think this will be an uppgrade of the speakers? The midrange is my only small complaint about this speaker. Its a bit thin sounding.

Best regards Tim

[markd51]

Thanks :)

Do you think this will be an uppgrade of the speakers? The midrange is my only small complaint about this speaker. Its a bit thin sounding.

Best regards Tim

Hello Tim, I'll leave others to comment whether it will be any type of an upgrade, as I've never done any speaker swapping with my own L-65's, so I myself cannot make any predictions on sound.

I once read (of course as for opinions, there's zillions of them) that the LE5-5 was considered the best Driver in the LE Driver Range.

If the Driver is an exact physical fit, then by all means install these drivers, and try it, you have basically nothing to lose, might like the difference in sound, and could always re-sell either sets of Drivers you don't like if you wish. If you have to take Axe to Cabinet in order to get a fit, then I would highly recommend not retrofitting, and trying other work-arounds.

I'm assuming your L-Pads work properly, and typically, I've found no shortage of midrange performance with mine, and I leave my L-Pads at basically the 12 oclock-neutral position to 1 oclock at most.

I've found cranking them much higher than this starts to give an unnatural presentation, and things begin to lose balance. (Same with the highs, they get too tizzy)

Other recommendations would be speaker placement, and perhaps slightly toeing in the Cabinets towards your listening position, bringing them out a bit from the back wall-getting them up off the floor (thus having the Mids closer, or at ear level) and lastly, all I can think of, is integrating perhaps a good EQ, with a SPL Meter?

What's before your speakers in your audio chain could very well be influencing what you hear.

Be careful with any L-Pad adjustments. After 34 years, these get sort of fragile. Turn them carefully if making any adjustments. Hope this helps.

[timc]

Hi.

The L pads work flawlessy. i have them at almost 12'o clock position.

So the LE5-5 is considered the best..hmm...... Any idea what a pair of LE5-11 would cost? They fit right into the same hole so no modifications has to be done.



Best regards Tim.

[johnaec]

Do you think this will be an uppgrade of the speakers? The midrange is my only small complaint about this speaker. Its a bit thin sounding.You linked to an LE5-12. The -6, -8, -10, and -12 are all 3 dB less efficient than the -5, -9, and -11.

You could also try one of the 104H-x series, though I don't know how different they'd sound. Maybe someday I'll do a test with my L65-A's... ('need to find some room to set them up).

John

[timc]

Great info.

The problem with the 3db less efficiency......is that a problem as long as i can boost the midrange 3db?

And is the LE5-12 a better midrange than the 5 and/or 11?

Best regards Tim

[johnaec]

Great info.

The problem with the 3db less efficiency......is that a problem as long as i can boost the midrange 3db?

And is the LE5-12 a better midrange than the 5 and/or 11?

Best regards TimSure, you could boost the level control. Are your -5's currently working? If so, why bother replacing them, and why not just work with the level controls instead?

I have no idea if the -12 is considered "better".

More info: http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=5706&highlight=matrix

John

[timc]

Hi. Thanks for lots of good info.

Yes my -5's are working perfectly. I just like the thought of experimenting :)

Best regards Tim

[speakerdave]

The midrange is my only small complaint about this speaker. Its a bit thin sounding.

I'm not sure what you mean by "a bit thin." I used L65A's for a year or more and thought the problem was in the upper midrange/tweeter margin, which I thought was harsh. The only way I could listen to them was to toe them inward so that the axes crossed well in front of the listening position. I moved on to other speakers before doing any experimentation with the L65's.

The improvement path for this model probably should begin with the crossovers. If I still had mine the first thing I would do is upgrade the crossovers by upgrading the capacitors or bypassing the capacitors (or both). The bypassing could be done on the existing boards. Upgrade capacitors may be significantly larger, and you may have problems fitting them onto the existing boards.

There is also the possibility of charge coupling, which would also require rebuilding on new boards. Since this crossover uses a tapped inductor which is no longer available you would have to take one from the original. If you want to keep the originals intact, and I could understand why you would, the L65 crossovers show up on ebay from time to time because this model JBL is often mined for the 077's. The crossovers for the three variations are different, so be sure to get the right ones. Information about bypassing and charge-coupling can be found by using the Search function in these forums.

As for swapping LE5 midranges: JBL does not regard the flat wire series and the round wire series as being acoustically equivalent. The domed and dished dustcovers would also be different. The 104 is definitely different. If any other midrange is in itself an improvement over the LE5-5 you would not realize that improvement unless the crossover were redesigned for the new driver. When I had mine I swapped in a pair of LE5-2's because I thought I needed the self-shielding Alnico magnet structure next to my TV. The LE5-5 certainly sounded better than the LE5-2 in that speaker with that crossover.

David

[timc]

Hi Dave.

Your experiences corrolate with mine :) I also use much toe-inn. Not quite as much as you suggest.

I have also thought that the harshness is a result of stretching the limits for the mid/high drivers.

I have already changed the capacitors in the crossover to Solen MKP and Multicap for the tweeter. This made a major improvement in the sound.

Do you think a Diaphgram change on the 077's would be worth it?

Best regards Tim

[speakerdave]

Hi Dave.

Your experiences corrolate with mine :) I also use much toe-inn. Not quite as much as you suggest.

I have also thought that the harshness is a result of stretching the limits for the mid/high drivers.

I have already changed the capacitors in the crossover to Solen MKP and Multicap for the tweeter. This made a major improvement in the sound.

Do you think a Diaphgram change on the 077's would be worth it?

Best regards Tim

Ah! You are way ahead of me!


Do you think a Diaphgram change on the 077's would be worth it?

It depends how they've been used, of course, but I really doubt the 077's need new diaphragms. They just should not be run down to 6500 Hz.

You also caught me in mid-edit: I pulled that sentence about the midrange and tweeter not really being able to reach each other. (In the 4315, the speaker I then considered getting next, the transition is moved up about 2000 Hz, and that is too high for the midrange). It's too bad really, because the L65 is a nice speaker in many ways. Very handsome, high WAF little cabinet, and the components themselves are quite good. It was a bit sad to part with them, but they went to a collector, a member of this forum, who really appreciates them the way they are.

David

[timc]

Hm....

My set of L65 is very little used at all.....the tweeter wasnt even broken inn when i got them, and it is one of very few pair who has the original foam surround on the woofer. Best of all is that it is stil soft and without any sign of cracking :D

Ill just leave them as they are for the moment then. I might try some Mundorf Supreme, silver in oil, for the mids and highs......

Yes the L65 is a very nice speaker. It easily outperforms most budget and middle class speakers today. I work at a hifi-store, so i have tested a few ;) The L65 has stood the test of time :bouncy: If only i had the cash for a set of 43xx........or a L100 Century gold....

Best regards Tim

[speakerdave]

Yes, they're a very nice little speaker and you have the right idea, I think, to use them in original form with improved crossovers.

So long,

David

[timc]

Hi.

Does anyone have the T/S parameters on the 126A woofer? I would like to do some simulations.


Best regards Tim