JBL Lancer 66 Re-Furb Questions

[herbman75]

Howdy Fellas!

I just picked up a pair of Lancer 66's today at the thrift for $20.

The cabs look decent, but need work. Only one real chip in the veneer. Some sand paper, stain, and oil should do them justice.

The grills look OK. A coupe of loose threads, but nothing to jump up and down about. However, I would like to replace them. Does anyone know of a source for this "burlap" type grille cloth? Both the grille badges are there too. The grills also have this gold plastic "frame" around them. Does this material have to stay? I would like to get rid of it personally.

The main problem is the woofer surrounds. I have done the thread search for lansaloy, and I am not sure if that is what I have. This material is black. It has tiny little cracks in the surround. It looks like hardened rubber.

Can this stuff be replaced with regular speaker foam kits? How do I remove this stuff?

Any and all assistance is greatly appreciated!

herbs

[herbman75]

Also, if anyone can direct me to some catalog pics, specs, ect. here it wold be appreciated. I can't find anything about Lancer 66. I found Lancer 44, 55, 77, 99, and 101 - but no 66.

Why so little info on these?

[speakerdave]

Also, if anyone can direct me to some catalog pics, specs, ect. here it wold be appreciated. I can't find anything about Lancer 66. I found Lancer 44, 55, 77, 99, and 101 - but no 66.

Why so little info on these?

It appears in the 1962 Catalogue. It seems to have been discontinued with the introduction of the L77 with its passive radiator to augment the bass.

David

[herbman75]

I did manage to find this from either the 64 or 62 catalog, I can't remember which.



http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b57/esiefkes/MISC/page22-23.jpg

What is up with this edging? I am removing that gold, plastic frame from the grille edge - it just loks cheezy to me.

[SUPERBEE]

Thats not Lansaloy. Perhaps something newer?



Howdy Fellas!

I just picked up a pair of Lancer 66's today at the thrift for $20.

The cabs look decent, but need work. Only one real chip in the veneer. Some sand paper, stain, and oil should do them justice.

The grills look OK. A coupe of loose threads, but nothing to jump up and down about. However, I would like to replace them. Does anyone know of a source for this "burlap" type grille cloth? Both the grille badges are there too. The grills also have this gold plastic "frame" around them. Does this material have to stay? I would like to get rid of it personally.

The main problem is the woofer surrounds. I have done the thread search for lansaloy, and I am not sure if that is what I have. This material is black. It has tiny little cracks in the surround. It looks like hardened rubber.

Can this stuff be replaced with regular speaker foam kits? How do I remove this stuff?

Any and all assistance is greatly appreciated!

herbs

[SUPERBEE]

DOH!!

I think it is those kinds of things that give these speakers that cool 60s MOD look.





What is up with this edging? I am removing that gold, plastic frame from the grille edge - it just loks cheezy to me.

[herbman75]

DOH!!

I think it is those kinds of things that give these speakers that cool 60s MOD look.

I may put them back on after I clean them up a little.

The woofer is edge is what has me worried. I am leaning toward plain rubber. I guess I am going to start looking for a kit.

Also, I have to wiggle the ground on the back of one of the speakers or it sounds weird. Something loose I guess?

Are these "Tube Speakers"? They sound pretty nuetral to me. I listened to Pink Floyd Meddle MFSL on them and it sounded really good - probably not the best for something like Van Halen though...

[Zilch]

http://manuals.harman.com/JBL/HOM/Technical%20Sheet/L66%20Lancer%20ts.pdf

Resurround those LE-10s with the proper foam.

I'd replace the LE20-1 tweeters with 035tiAs, too, unless you like not having any VHF....

[SUPERBEE]

They would probably sound good with tubes. My Lancer 77's sounded GREAT with the Fisher 500-C



I may put them back on after I clean them up a little.

The woofer is edge is what has me worried. I am leaning toward plain rubber. I guess I am going to start looking for a kit.

Also, I have to wiggle the ground on the back of one of the speakers or it sounds weird. Something loose I guess?

Are these "Tube Speakers"? They sound pretty nuetral to me. I listened to Pink Floyd Meddle MFSL on them and it sounded really good - probably not the best for something like Van Halen though...

[herbman75]

http://manuals.harman.com/JBL/HOM/Technical%20Sheet/L66%20Lancer%20ts.pdf

Resurround those LE-10s with the proper foam.

I'd replace the LE20-1 tweeters with 035tiAs, too, unless you like not having any VHF....

Are these tweeters notoriously bad? No Very High Frequency?

[herbman75]

Resurround those LE-10s with the proper foam.



What is the "proper" foam? Do I just need to use regular speaker foam? This stuff is like something I have never seen before. It is like really hard rubber or really soft plastic - I don't know which. You say it is not the lansalloy?

I will post some pics tomorrow. I really appreciate the advice guys.

This will make my 3rd JBL project going now, so far I have to -

*Re-foam, re-finish, and put orange grille cloth on a pair of L40's.
*Re-finish, apply the blue grille cloth (I got here), and replace a few drivers in a pair of L36's
*Re-foam, re-finish, and put new white "burlap" grille cloth on a pair of Lancer 66 - (and possibly replace tweeters)

I have had both the L40 and L36 projects up in the air for quite some time now. I am a lazy man...

I will be posting pics of everthing. Hope to meet some good folks over here!

herbs...

[herbman75]

Here are some pics.

First - The Strip Tease -

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b57/esiefkes/MISC/Lancer66top.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b57/esiefkes/MISC/Lancer66front.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b57/esiefkes/MISC/Lancer66nogrillX1.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b57/esiefkes/MISC/Lancer66nogrillX2.jpg

[herbman75]

I have GOT to get rid of this old adhesive. I am going to replace w/space-age velcro...

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b57/esiefkes/MISC/Lancer66adheshive.jpg

Here is some more around the LE20-1 tweeter -

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b57/esiefkes/MISC/LE20-1Tweeter.jpg

Here is the cracked woofer material -

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b57/esiefkes/MISC/LE10wooferfoamcracked.jpg

Grille badge -

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b57/esiefkes/MISC/Lancer66grillebadge.jpg

So..... Much..... Work to do.....

[peterepete]

i purchased a pair on epay recently and had the same surrounds that you have.
mine weren't all cracked like yours though. they were solid and severely stiff so i removed them and brought them to millersound in nearby montgomeryville,pa.bill put new foam surrounds on and they are very nice now.foam surrounds should be available on the net somewhere. that is all you need to make them listenable again.:applaud: :D :)

[peterepete]

i would go looking for sheer curtain fabric for your grilles.you should be able to get close to the color. ther has to be a giant fabric store in a city near you. i use this instead of the bugus speaker fabrics they try to sell you. they sound nice in the bedroom with my fisher x-101b .happy listenting:)

[glen]

Thats not Lansaloy.

I think that on several of their speakers about this vintage JBL would paint the silver frames AND the white Lansalloy BLACK so they were less visible through the grille cloth.

[herbman75]

I did a post on these in another forum and a fellow over there said he thought they had been painted as well.

This was done by the factory? I assume this has no effect on sound reproduction.

Here are some pics of a re-furbed set I found -

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b57/esiefkes/MISC/DSCN17430051.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b57/esiefkes/MISC/cc50dd49.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b57/esiefkes/MISC/DSCN1735.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b57/esiefkes/MISC/DSCN17290040.jpg

These look great, but I think I would have done away with that adhesive in favor of velcro.

Also, does anyone here know of a paint that will stick to these metal grille badges? I barely touched one and a big, black chunk of paint fell off! :banghead:

[grumpy]

funny... I like the look of the old grille material you have better than that shown
in the "restored" pics :D Perhaps make a new frame w/ velcro & whatever
material floats your boat and save the old ones (assuming you like how they sound
after getting the LE10's refurbished and want to spend more time on them).

-grumpy

[herbman75]

My buddy has a cabinet shop. I think I am going to get him to re-veneer the cabs.

I am then going to try and remove the adhesive from the outer edges of the front of the speakers. Whatever won't come off, it is getting painted over.

I would keep the grille cloth if the color was different. In person, it looks really yellow and dingy. I think the bright white against some new veneer and black front will look nice. I am having second thoghts about the velcro though. When the plastic pieces are on the edge of the grilles, it fits pretty snug into the front of the speakers without velcro or adhesive. After I saw that fellows pics, I thought velcro might "cheapen" the look.

Thanks for all the input everyone. More is welcomed!

:montyp: herbs

[herbman75]

It is definately paint. I guess I will just deal with it.

Also, I tried removing the tweeter from one cab. I had to stick it back in there because the wires are SOLDERED in! Is the woofer the same?

Also, I am worried removing this lansalloy will be difficult. It is so stiff and ridgid I think I may damage the VC alignment by tearing it off. It is not like other foam I have dealt with. The usual stuff I can tear right out with my finger and use alcohol to remove any left over. Is there any chemical that will dissolve or soften the lansalloy? Can I re-foam while the woofer is still in the cab? My soldering capabilities suck to say the least.

HELP!!!

[dat521gatherer]

damn nice score for $20, i would have paid that just for the cabinets. i too am lazy and have more than a few resto projects going on. l77's l88's l100's l44's c53's and l110's im waiting for edgewound to finish my woofers. you have a friend that reveneer's, your a lucky dog. i wonder what that would cost i'm tired of sanding. i too need to go to the fabric and look for some material for my c53 libra's. i haven't seen surrounds like that before but would assume that they would peel off easily if your careful. are those the le-20's i wonder if anyone can get those sticker rings or if they can be made. alot of people destroy those when removing them. if the tweet's are soldered then the woof's probably are too. try doing some practice soldering it's all in the flux that makes it stick. or use your solder gun to melt off the old soilder off then you can use wire connectors. i usually use velcro myself . great score!!!!:applaud:

[JohnK]

Don't replace the cloth! It's easily cleaned with a little laundry detergent. Just use a sponge & some warm water mixed with the detergent over the sink & rinse. You'll find all the nicotine & dirt will come right out & they will look great.
I saved an otherwise tragic pair of classic c-38 grills that way, the ones with the horse hairs woven in, and they look as good as new & would be IMPOSSIBLE to duplicate or replace/improve.

Those grill cloths are really special and unique, you'll never find anything now days that will come close to the weave & look.