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View Full Version : Performance of 2123H in 1 cubic foot enclosure non vented with 75% fill



Ken Pachkowsky
12-20-2003, 12:34 PM
Can one of you tech types run the numbers on the above and compare it to a Gauss 3184B?

Here are the Thiels for the Gauss

FS=37
QTS=0.1476
QMS=1.9
QES=0.16
Vas=30
Pe=150
Xmax=1.6
Re=6
Le=1.3
Sd=0.01415
Bl=36.006
Mms=148.71

Thanks

Ken

boputnam
12-20-2003, 12:49 PM
Hey, Ken...

What is diam? 0.254 m (10-in) like the 3184A?
What are units on Vas?
What are units on the Xmax?
What are units on Sd?

Ken Pachkowsky
12-20-2003, 12:52 PM
Originally posted by boputnam
Hey, Ken...

What is diam? 0.254 m (10-in) like the 3184A?
What are units on Vas?
What are units on the Xmax?
What are units on Sd?

Hi Bo

They are 10in drivers

Vas,Xmax,Sd for the gauss are listed in prev message. Do you want the Thieles for the 2123H?

Ken

boputnam
12-20-2003, 01:16 PM
OK on the 10in.

You gave quantities, but I need the units - either Imperial (in and in3) or Metric (m and l).

Thanks.

*****
Never mind - I found them in BBPro. But, there are some differences with those you posted. Here's what BBPro loads:

Fs = 33 Hz
Qts = 0.14 (dimensionless)
Qms = 1.9 (dimensionless)
Qes = 0.16 (dimensionless)
Vas = 31.15 liters
Pe = 150 watts
Xmax = 1.6 mm
Re = 6 ohms
Le = 1.3 mH
Sd = 346 sq. cm

boputnam
12-20-2003, 02:08 PM
Here's what WinISD produces. I printed it to a .pdf to retain the best resolution.

To my eyes, there will be no discernable audible difference between the Gauss 3184B and the 2123H. The Gauss 3184A, however, has sustained low-end, hitting -3 dB at 150 Hz. I don't know if that is or is not desireable, depending upon where you cross from the VLF (2235H?).

Ken Pachkowsky
12-20-2003, 02:23 PM
Yes, I am going to try the 2123H's in my Westlakes.

Will let you know how they sound.

Thanks for the help

Ken

boputnam
12-20-2003, 02:27 PM
Here's comparing the Gauss 3184B to the 2123H from BassBoxPro. Also in .pdf...

4313B
12-20-2003, 02:31 PM
I think the Gauss driver is more along the lines of the 2122H. Do you feel like running that one Bo?

Ken Pachkowsky
12-20-2003, 02:33 PM
I am not very good at understanding these plots but this does confirm why the amp driving the 3184B's runs so hot. The load is slightly over 2 ohms.

Ken Pachkowsky
12-20-2003, 02:34 PM
Originally posted by Giskard
I think the Gauss driver is more along the lines of the 2122H. Do you feel like running that one Bo?

If you don't mind that would be great Bo.

Ken

boputnam
12-20-2003, 02:50 PM
Originally posted by Ken Pachkowsky
I am not very good at understanding these plots but this does confirm why the amp driving the 3184B's runs so hot. The load is slightly over 2 ohms.

Here's the 3184B vs the 2122H (both 1997 and the 2001 vintages).

But I'm not certain these graphs "confirm" why your amp is running "hot" - maybe Giskard has more experience in this, than I do... :confused:

Ian Mackenzie
12-22-2003, 03:54 AM
Ken,

If you are looking for alternatives the Tad 11 inch carbon fibre composite is excellent and also the PHL hi sensitivity 10 inch mid cone, also the 2118, even paired is excellent and it can run down to 70- 100 hertz

Ian

Ken Pachkowsky
01-01-2004, 10:12 PM
Well, I must admit we had a difficult time picking the best sounding driver.

Both drivers sounded quite different. The 2123H sounded slightly cleaner and more dynamic when played on its own (all other drivers turned off and a-b ing mono source from left to right etc.)

My wife and I felt that in this initial trial the Gauss 3184 sounded slightly better over all. I have put the 3184 Gauss driver back in for now and will experiment more later.

Ken

Ken Pachkowsky
01-01-2004, 10:16 PM
The photo in the previous post is awfull. The flash on my digital camera sucks. The driver was baffle mounted on the plywood and then the plywood was bolted through the existing ma15 bolt holes. Here is a closeup of the Gauss 3184.

jandregg
01-02-2004, 06:59 AM
Ken

I have added the 2123 to my s7. It sounded real good in the .6 closed box, but when I added it to the existing speakers it never sounded quite right. I experimented with different crossover frequencys to no avail. Then the schematic of the 4344mkii was posted here (http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=751). I tried adding the coil and resister to the mix just before the 2123 terminals as shown in the schematic.. I was amazed at how much difference it made. Since I was using the J model I used a 12.4 resistor. Am now crossing 350 hz. Hope this helps.

John

GordonW
01-02-2004, 09:11 PM
The rising response of the 2123 will INDEED make it sound "clearer" by itself... but will screw up integration in a multi-way speaker, unless its dealt with by methods such as the "shelving circuit" of the L and R in parallel as was just discussed above.

My guess, is that in the end, the motor of the 2123 may be slightly lower distortion than the Gauss motor, but that's probably the only thing that will give an advantage, after everything else is tweaked out to give good frequency response and driver integration. Dunno if it'd be enough of a difference, to warrant the work... maybe, maybe not...

Regards,
Gordon.